My parent's are telling me to sell my beloved python

[Shahista]

Hey everyone

I am truly heartbroken as I have to let go of my 9 month old Jungle Carpet Python (hatchling). I got him about a month ago when the opportunity came, without telling my parent's as I have been wanting one for YEARS. I truly thought they would end up accepting it. I had visitors coming into my house, mentioning how evil snakes are and it'll end up 'eating' me. So many people I know have a misconception about snakes, it makes me FUME.

Now my parents are telling me to get rid of it asap (even though they did say from the start). My dad even spoke to a couple of his friends & one of them wants to buy it. It honestly breaks my heart as I love my snake very much, heightened by the fact that it was my very first. He really makes me happy and look forward to something everyday.

I'm at the point where I'll give my snake to a friend & get it back once I move out. I would've even provided the food & pretty much everything.

I'M AN ADULT BTW lol 19. I do understand that it's my parent's house so it is what it is. Anyways, no one wants to keep it for me so I have to let it go sadly. I'm an unemployed university student so I can't move out.

Has anyone else had this problem or changed your parents mind ?

VENOM
​

 

[Herpetology]

I’ve heard that if you talk to your parents about the research you’ve done and prove you will be a committed owner can sometimes sway their mind
Explaining how at that size he will only be eating adult mice/small rats and pose no threat to you or your parents

 

[-Adam-]

I'm sorry to hear this.

Just a quick question first - do you have any limits in NSW when you can acquire and dispose of your animals? (Here in Vic once we buy we can't sell or dispose of for at least 6 months). I'd check that out first because you wouldn't want to do anything illegal by selling it or giving it away too soon.

But apart from that in regards to convincing your parents I fear you've gone about it the wrong way, but there may still be some hope. I know the saying that it's easier to ask for forgiveness than permission - but in reality I think trust plays a bigger part.

Your parents are misguided - but they most likely have your best interest at heart - even though it's from misinformation and fear of the unknown.

Don't let your passion for a snake drive a wedge between you and your parents. Your relationship with them is far more important than any pet. (I'll probably get blasted for saying that from some people - but I sincerely believe it). More so - allowing this to drive a wedge or get you offside with each other will only prove your visitors statements that snakes are evil..... because they will see this as snakes being the cause of this problem.

Try to be the bigger of the two parties - and try to make allowances for your parents weakness in this. Your original post comes across as you being very mature about this anyway - so I'll give it to you straight if that's OK.

Doing your best to be patient, and understanding their concerns will go a long way. (Notice I said understand their concerns... this doesn't mean you need to agree with them - but to get a genuine and deeper understanding of why they think the way they do). It's probably not the snake - it'll be something deeper that they're concerned about. Do they really think snakes are 'Spiritually Evil'. Or are they concerned about it attacking you? Or do they have fear themselves of it escaping?

Really take time to listen to them - and not just on one occasion. Don't just give them time to talk but really show that you're taking in their concerns and want to understand deeper - that you take an interest in what they think and that you're not just going to dismiss their 'wisdom'.

Show them that if they have a genuine concern - you want to get an understanding of what it is - incase you are missing something. That you want to learn from them.

And be genuine too - you may learn something yourself. But if it's genuine maybe understanding their viewpoint and fears it will help you to see some opportunities for dealing with those fears in a way they will understand.

Or - you may have a chance of saying "OK - I get where you're coming from. I think I understand your side. Would you oblige me to do the same with me and take the time to understand mine as well". But not straight away. It cant be like a "I gave you time, now you give me time", or they'll just listen to save face without wanting to understand.

Make this about you and your parents getting closer to each other and understanding eacah other instead of about who gets to get their own way - and it'll be easier (if it's possible) to win them over because you have the high ground on facts - but they have the high ground on authority. Conversely - make this about you and your parents getting further apart and arguing getting offside with each other and they'll only dig their heels in.

Your desire to understand them needs to be genuine, as well as unconditional - regardless of whether they give the same opportunity back. Show love.

If it is genuine, and they see this - it may open up doors - but keep in mind that the level that they'll be willing to go to maybe limited by the level that you show them to start with - so be sincere about wanting to really understand all their concerns, and not only that - be compassionate and considerate about it.

Keep in mind that while their actions may be misguided - their fear or concern is real. (Regardless of how badly conceived it is. A kid who's afraid of the boogey man still has real fear even though the boogey man isn't real).

With what I've said above - I'm not talking about manipulation. The goal here needs to be genuine - to bring you closer together so that you can all get a better understanding of each others side - not to manipulate them.

Obviously there's no guarantee's - but I'm guessing the reason they're doing this is most likely out of their concern because they love you. As I said before - misguided - but never the less genuine love. And if that is the case - I think the best option you have is the softly-softly approach - to show love and understanding back and hope that there is some middle ground you may be able to meet on in the end.

That's just my own personal opinion - I'm sorry for the great wall of text. I hope it's encouraging and of some help.
[doublepost=1570697567,1570697157][/doublepost]PS - If they are willing after you do this - maybe sit down together and watch a few episodes of 'Snake Discovery' on youtube. (Pre-select them first ). Emma on that channel has a brilliant way of relating to people and bringing across factual information about snakes whilst being entertaining and putting them in a good light.

 

[Mick666]

My kids get to play with snakes all the time, my son even gets a bite now and then. It's no big deal, once you get to know what snakes are like it's not much different than coming home to any other pet.

 

[Chumana]

To answer Adam’s first question.I am in NSW & yes, we also have a 6 month rule....

 

[MattPat]

To answer Adam’s first question.I am in NSW & yes, we also have a 6 month rule..

Is that enforceable though? If so, how?

 

[Shahista]

To answer Adam’s first question.I am in NSW & yes, we also have a 6 month rule....View attachment 327844

Oh wow I didn’t know. Can you please send the link to this information

 

[-Adam-]

Oh wow I didn’t know. Can you please send the link to this information

https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/resources/wildlifelicences/animalkeeperssampleconditions.pdf
https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/resources/wildlifelicences/animalkeeperssampleconditions.pdf
Section 10.

Is that enforceable though? If so, how?

That is the question. The above is the only place I found it with that wording. I'd prefer to actually see the parliament act itself - because this would change it from being a condition to an actual act - being a lot weightier - meaning a possible criminal conviction if not adhered to - but I haven't been able to find it so far. Thus I don't know if it's an actual act that's enforceable by law, or whether it's a general condition meaning that they have the right to cancel your license/permit if not adhered to.

Either way - I wouldn't use it as the sticking point to keeping it - I'd use it as a buffer to assist with some grace in time - and try and work out things as mentioned above.

 

[Shahista]

in reply
[doublepost=1570843790,1570843424][/doublepost]

I'm sorry to hear this.

Just a quick question first - do you have any limits in NSW when you can acquire and dispose of your animals? (Here in Vic once we buy we can't sell or dispose of for at least 6 months). I'd check that out first because you wouldn't want to do anything illegal by selling it or giving it away too soon.

But apart from that in regards to convincing your parents I fear you've gone about it the wrong way, but there may still be some hope. I know the saying that it's easier to ask for forgiveness than permission - but in reality I think trust plays a bigger part.

Your parents are misguided - but they most likely have your best interest at heart - even though it's from misinformation and fear of the unknown.

Don't let your passion for a snake drive a wedge between you and your parents. Your relationship with them is far more important than any pet. (I'll probably get blasted for saying that from some people - but I sincerely believe it). More so - allowing this to drive a wedge or get you offside with each other will only prove your visitors statements that snakes are evil..... because they will see this as snakes being the cause of this problem.

Try to be the bigger of the two parties - and try to make allowances for your parents weakness in this. Your original post comes across as you being very mature about this anyway - so I'll give it to you straight if that's OK.

Doing your best to be patient, and understanding their concerns will go a long way. (Notice I said understand their concerns... this doesn't mean you need to agree with them - but to get a genuine and deeper understanding of why they think the way they do). It's probably not the snake - it'll be something deeper that they're concerned about. Do they really think snakes are 'Spiritually Evil'. Or are they concerned about it attacking you? Or do they have fear themselves of it escaping?

Really take time to listen to them - and not just on one occasion. Don't just give them time to talk but really show that you're taking in their concerns and want to understand deeper - that you take an interest in what they think and that you're not just going to dismiss their 'wisdom'.

Show them that if they have a genuine concern - you want to get an understanding of what it is - incase you are missing something. That you want to learn from them.

And be genuine too - you may learn something yourself. But if it's genuine maybe understanding their viewpoint and fears it will help you to see some opportunities for dealing with those fears in a way they will understand.

Or - you may have a chance of saying "OK - I get where you're coming from. I think I understand your side. Would you oblige me to do the same with me and take the time to understand mine as well". But not straight away. It cant be like a "I gave you time, now you give me time", or they'll just listen to save face without wanting to understand.

Make this about you and your parents getting closer to each other and understanding eacah other instead of about who gets to get their own way - and it'll be easier (if it's possible) to win them over because you have the high ground on facts - but they have the high ground on authority. Conversely - make this about you and your parents getting further apart and arguing getting offside with each other and they'll only dig their heels in.

Your desire to understand them needs to be genuine, as well as unconditional - regardless of whether they give the same opportunity back. Show love.

If it is genuine, and they see this - it may open up doors - but keep in mind that the level that they'll be willing to go to maybe limited by the level that you show them to start with - so be sincere about wanting to really understand all their concerns, and not only that - be compassionate and considerate about it.

Keep in mind that while their actions may be misguided - their fear or concern is real. (Regardless of how badly conceived it is. A kid who's afraid of the boogey man still has real fear even though the boogey man isn't real).

With what I've said above - I'm not talking about manipulation. The goal here needs to be genuine - to bring you closer together so that you can all get a better understanding of each others side - not to manipulate them.

Obviously there's no guarantee's - but I'm guessing the reason they're doing this is most likely out of their concern because they love you. As I said before - misguided - but never the less genuine love. And if that is the case - I think the best option you have is the softly-softly approach - to show love and understanding back and hope that there is some middle ground you may be able to meet on in the end.

That's just my own personal opinion - I'm sorry for the great wall of text. I hope it's encouraging and of some help.
[doublepost=1570697567,1570697157][/doublepost]PS - If they are willing after you do this - maybe sit down together and watch a few episodes of 'Snake Discovery' on youtube. (Pre-select them first ). Emma on that channel has a brilliant way of relating to people and bringing across factual information about snakes whilst being entertaining and putting them in a good light.

Thank you so much for taking the time to write this, I really appreciate it. I didn't know about the 6 month rule, I got real happy when I heard about it. At least I have an excuse to keep it for a bit longer

As for my parents, it is really my dad who doesn't want it here. I saw him research about Jungle Carpets & read about how big they get. I think he really is just concerned about it constricting me or attacking me one day just like how you mentioned. As for my mum, she has always been terrified of snakes & reptiles in general but she is cool with it being here whereas my dad isn't one bit afraid... he actually doesn't dislike snakes too. The visitors who came & mentioned how 'evil' they are... well their opinions don't matter anyways. People would say anything to something they don't like even if they know it's not true.

I guess I bought the snake all of a sudden was because I was afraid my passion for snakes would drive away as I get older. I truly didn't want that & really didn't have the patience to wait any longer to get one too.

I also forgot to mention that as I was showing my dad my python (when I first got it) it bit me many times which is normal since he is a baby Jungle Carpet. Maybe my dad thought this behaviour would continue even when it'll get mature.

I'll try talking to my dad. If I were to be honest, I really didn't have a proper talk with him since he is a little strict and not open-minded so it's no use as I know him very well. I love my parents very much & I really do get where they are coming from, in their perspective. In the end, they are just concerned about me.

I guess there is always tomorrow. I will never get rid of my passion for snakes & will definitely have several in the future lol.

Thanks for the comment & encouragement once again !

 

[Chumana]

Oh wow I didn’t know. Can you please send the link to this information

https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/...ces/native-animals-as-pets/maintain-a-licence

If you scroll down to conditions for keeping more than 1 animal you will find it in that section. Although it seems the regulations are slightly different if you have a companion licence (only 1 animal etc).
[doublepost=1570846234,1570845497][/doublepost]

Is that enforceable though? If so, how?

I may be wrong but I believe it is enforceable as it would be a breach of the quarantine regulations stated in the NSW code of practice for the private keeping of reptiles.
I have no idea what the penalty is but assume there would be one.Maybe it is found in the biodiversity conservation act?
(Happy to stand corrected if anyone else has more information)

 

[-Adam-]

I may be wrong but I believe it is enforceable as it would be a breach of the quarantine regulations stated in the NSW code of practice for the private keeping of reptiles.
I have no idea what the penalty is but assume there would be one.Maybe it is found in the biodiversity conservation act?
(Happy to stand corrected if anyone else has more information)

Aaah - is that why the 6 month rule. I always wondered why that would be in force - It's about quarantine.

 

[Chumana]

Aaah - is that why the 6 month rule. I always wondered why that would be in force - It's about quarantine.

I believe so but again-I could be wrong.....(although it does make sense).

 

[-Adam-]

in reply
[doublepost=1570843790,1570843424][/doublepost]

Thank you so much for taking the time to write this, I really appreciate it. I didn't know about the 6 month rule, I got real happy when I heard about it. At least I have an excuse to keep it for a bit longer

As for my parents, it is really my dad who doesn't want it here. I saw him research about Jungle Carpets & read about how big they get. I think he really is just concerned about it constricting me or attacking me one day just like how you mentioned. As for my mum, she has always been terrified of snakes & reptiles in general but she is cool with it being here whereas my dad isn't one bit afraid... he actually doesn't dislike snakes too. The visitors who came & mentioned how 'evil' they are... well their opinions don't matter anyways. People would say anything to something they don't like even if they know it's not true.

I guess I bought the snake all of a sudden was because I was afraid my passion for snakes would drive away as I get older. I truly didn't want that & really didn't have the patience to wait any longer to get one too.

I also forgot to mention that as I was showing my dad my python (when I first got it) it bit me many times which is normal since he is a baby Jungle Carpet. Maybe my dad thought this behaviour would continue even when it'll get mature.

I'll try talking to my dad. If I were to be honest, I really didn't have a proper talk with him since he is a little strict and not open-minded so it's no use as I know him very well. I love my parents very much & I really do get where they are coming from, in their perspective. In the end, they are just concerned about me.

I guess there is always tomorrow. I will never get rid of my passion for snakes & will definitely have several in the future lol.

Thanks for the comment & encouragement once again !

Hi @Shahista

Thanks for replying. It's encouraging to know my ramblings are helpful.

Also knowing why your dad is concerned is a great insight as well.

If you haven't guessed already - I'm a dad and I have a daughter. I am strict with her as well (well... compared to other kids fathers) so I'm hoping I can offer some insights from 'the other side'.

I'm not strict because I want to put rules in place or ruin her life. (Although I know many teenagers think that's what their parents are there for ). I'm strict because I want to protect her. She's much younger than you but she does have less 'freedom' than some other kids her age. It's not that I don't trust her - I don't trust the world around her.

Although in saying this - I do balance this with allowing her more responsibilities and freedom in other areas that I know she's capable of. I'm also known by some to be stubborn - but this is not because my mind can't be changed - but because I research things. My mind can be changed - I just need the evidence and not someone's 'say so'.

There's something about a dad-daughter relationship and whether they show it or not - Dads have a real soft spot for their daughters. It can be hard to see especially if the dad has grown up in a different culture, environment or beliefs where they feel it's wrong or that they shouldn't show their emotions as much - but show it or not.... there is more often than not a very special bond that dad's have for their daughters.

My guess is that this isn't about him being selfish but about him doing what he feels is the right thing to do... protecting his daughter. With that in mind there are a few things that may be able to assist.

I'll list a few ideas in point form - but again I can't stress enough - a softly softly approach to these, and these aren't for manipulation purposes but for you to maybe get a different perspective from his side so you can better understand his concerns and how you may be able to address them. Warm, with love will break down barriers. Also don't use any of the below if it's not true - be honest. But if some of the below does ring true - please consider them:


Make dad your protector

Let him know that you are planning on having one of these one day - whether it be now or later. Not in a rebellious way - but in a soft honest way. Tell him that you would much prefer it to be now, when you're still living under his roof because you find comfort in him being there to talk to and there for a different perspective.

If you're 'miss something' or don't see some danger - you'd be more comfortable with a 3rd perspective to help you - and that you want him to be that 3rd perspective. So that you can learn as it grows while you're still around with your dad so he cankeep you accountable with it. That you prefer this than trying to learning solo in a couple of years time when you leave home. Let him know you appreciate him looking out for him and that you want to work with him on this.

So many teenagers and older girls hide things from their dad and want to share less of their lives with their parents, breaking away. Make this a good opportunity for him to share part of your life - and he may love it. It maybe a great opportunity for you and him to grow closer again too.


Consider a Compromise

Find out if there is a way of compromising. Again - as mentioned with Dad being your protector above - maybe have it that when your dad indicates that it's grown to a certain size you wont take it out of it's cage or handle it without him being around. It may be not having it in your room where you sleep but somewhere else. See what compromises you can make that address his concerns but allow the snake to stay.

Don't be afraid to ask him "Is there any rules or policies we can put in place - regardless of how restrictive that will allow me to keep 'juniour' if I follow what you set in place".

Often the questions "Can I", or "Why cant I" are straight yes/no responses. Questions such as "What changes can I make that will make you reconsider" opens up opportunities to find some new middle ground not considered before.

Show that you are willing to make compromises and that you are open to their guidance. Make it clear that you and he see things from a different perspective but that you want to try and learn each others perspective together.



Try and get them to watch some of those snake discovery video's.

I know I've said it before - but if possible I think this would help. I don't know if you have a smart TV that can play youtube or not - but if so - get a few episodes that you think would answer some questions and play them while they're around. (Even better if they will sit down with you to watch -but that might be asking too much ) As I mentioned Emily is brilliant at explaining how and why snakes react the way they do. She doesn't deny that snakes can be 'aggressive' - but she put's it in perspective and makes them a much more approachable animal. If somehow you can get your dad to see a few of these it may help him to not be as fearful for your safety.


Be prepared for a No answer anyway

Even if he says no in the end - show him that the love and soft approach you have for him isn't going to change. More than once I've said no to my daughter to have her respond in such a beautiful way and accepted it - that I've gone away and then reflected - second guessing myself later and considered whether I've been to hard. On some of those occasions I have reversed and changed my mind. That doesn't happen when she gets upset, throws a tantrum or yells at me though.

You mentioned your dad has already read up a bit - so it sounds like he's taking an interest in learning about these animals which is really encouraging.


If anything else comes to mind I'll add it, but for now I think that pretty much exhausts my ideas. I hope they're of help.

 

[dragonlover1]

Is that enforceable though? If so, how?

As far as I know, it isn't enforced very often; it's simply too much work for the officers to keep track of all transactions. The guy my son bought his first snake from bought and sold several reptiles in the year after without any repercussions. We discovered later he hadn't owned this 1 for 6 months either.

 

[Sdaji]

Good luck talking your father around. Hopefully you can use the 6 month period as leverage for a grace period and change his mind during that time. If he is genuinely not anti snake and is only concerned about your safety it should be possible to show him the snake poses you no danger. Fathers are often very protective of their daughters and seeing his daughter being repeatedly bitten by a snake likely was quite confronting for him. If you have the opportunity, show him other people, especially small/young people who keep snakes, especially ones larger than Carpet Pythons, in a way which makes him comfortable that it is safe. To my knowledge, the only person to ever be killed by a pet Australian python (it was actually a friend of mine) was killed by a very large and very difficult to wrangle Scrub Python, but even in that case he'd have been fine if another person had been present, and while in the cage he posed no risk (I actually slept on the floor right next to that snake's cage). ...don't tell your father about that story! We're not talking about you keeping a particularly large Scrub Python and your father doesn't need that inappropriate association!

I've sold plenty of young kids Carpet Pythons as their first snakes (always with their parents present and understanding the situation mind you ).

Oh, and the 6 month rule has nothing to do with quarantine. It has been around since before people were talking about quarantine and wouldn't make any sense in relation to quarantine anyway. It is a commercial thing. Previous to the 6 month rule being introduced in Victoria some people were buying and selling much like backyard shops/dealers, and they introduced a commercial license for shops and the 6 month rule to keep hobbyists behaving like hobbyists and only buying reptiles they intended to keep, not to sell on. It's a rule generally not enforced, especially if it's just done as a once off. If you contact them letting them know of some circumstance requiring you to move it on such as circumstances beyond your control changing and making it unrealistic to keep it, they'll always let you sell. Again, this isn't necessarily something you need to mention to dad

Best of luck!

 

[nuttylizardguy]

Do as you are told kid.

 

[Sdaji]

Do as you are told kid.

Haha, I admire people with more spirit and strength of character than you have! She's not outright disobeying her parents and if push comes to shove she'll respect their words, but she's doing her best to talk them around. That's a pretty healthy and admirable way to handle the situation.

 

[-Adam-]

She's not outright disobeying her parents and if push comes to shove she'll respect their words, but she's doing her best to talk them around. That's a pretty healthy and admirable way to handle the situation.

+ 1

I know if I tell my daughter to do something - and she's very much opposed to it because she believes I am short sighted or otherwise - I want her to have the freedom to feel that she can respectfully talk to me about it and share her concerns - instead of just bottling it up and blindly following every action. Otherwise - once she leaves home she will have no experience other than learning to follow without question which sets her up for bad experiences in the big world. Plus I know that I'm not always right or don't see everything first time round either.

The difference is being respectful and still willing to be obedient - whilst being able to still share.

 

[Shahista]

Haha, I admire people with more spirit and strength of character than you have! She's not outright disobeying her parents and if push comes to shove she'll respect their words, but she's doing her best to talk them around. That's a pretty healthy and admirable way to handle the situation.

Exactly, If I was disobeying my parents then I wouldn't have put the ad up for my reptile or even contacted the wildlife department to see if I could sell my snake, regarding the whole 6 month rule & my situation. If anything, I am just tryna see what's the main issue my parent has with snakes lol I love straightforward people.

 

[Chumana]

Good luck talking your father around. Hopefully you can use the 6 month period as leverage for a grace period and change his mind during that time. If he is genuinely not anti snake and is only concerned about your safety it should be possible to show him the snake poses you no danger. Fathers are often very protective of their daughters and seeing his daughter being repeatedly bitten by a snake likely was quite confronting for him. If you have the opportunity, show him other people, especially small/young people who keep snakes, especially ones larger than Carpet Pythons, in a way which makes him comfortable that it is safe. To my knowledge, the only person to ever be killed by a pet Australian python (it was actually a friend of mine) was killed by a very large and very difficult to wrangle Scrub Python, but even in that case he'd have been fine if another person had been present, and while in the cage he posed no risk (I actually slept on the floor right next to that snake's cage). ...don't tell your father about that story! We're not talking about you keeping a particularly large Scrub Python and your father doesn't need that inappropriate association!

I've sold plenty of young kids Carpet Pythons as their first snakes (always with their parents present and understanding the situation mind you ).

Oh, and the 6 month rule has nothing to do with quarantine. It has been around since before people were talking about quarantine and wouldn't make any sense in relation to quarantine anyway. It is a commercial thing. Previous to the 6 month rule being introduced in Victoria some people were buying and selling much like backyard shops/dealers, and they introduced a commercial license for shops and the 6 month rule to keep hobbyists behaving like hobbyists and only buying reptiles they intended to keep, not to sell on. It's a rule generally not enforced, especially if it's just done as a once off. If you contact them letting them know of some circumstance requiring you to move it on such as circumstances beyond your control changing and making it unrealistic to keep it, they'll always let you sell. Again, this isn't necessarily something you need to mention to dad

Best of luck!

& here I stand.....corrected.
You are a fountain of knowledge Sdaji.
I always thought it was to do with quarantine as I am sure it was referred as that by national parks when I adopted some lizards a few years ago via ballot.
Plus, coincidentally the code of practice quarantine guidelines state that we should keep newly acquired (snakes more so) away from existing reptiles for atleast 6-12mth due to the high risk of disease transmission etc.
That’s why I kind of though it made sense that it was for that reason.
Unfortunately there are still alot of people that buy & sell quite frequently just to make money.I have heard of people being fined for doing so.......but this is only here-say. I do not know anyone personally that it has happened to so who knows.Would be good to find out if anyone has experienced a fine or warning atleast.