# possible dangers of heatlamp and fake rock walls



## Defective (Jun 25, 2012)

ok so mum is being really naggy about me doing my ''creation'' because she seems to think that the heat from a heat light and styrofoam or the acrylic render and sealer will give off fumes or get to hot and that will kill my snake!

i'm making sure everything i use is non toxic and that the heatlamp is not in direct ways of the background and it also has a cage around it (the light) 

i can't think of anything and will post a photo tomorrow but is there anything i or mum need to worry about?


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## BigWillieStyles (Jun 26, 2012)

I have also worried a little about this. I have my MVB about 10cm above my main basking area and the backwall is close to the spot. However, I try to keep the direct light beam focus away from it. Plus I think that the grout I used should really seal the polystyrene and protect it. I havent had any issues but it may be something to consider when your planning your enclosure.


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## McFly (Jun 26, 2012)

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polystyrene

It says about 100*C so it should be ok but if your mum is still worried turn the heat lamp on and check how hot it is on and around the bulb if then still worried try making your styro wall then use a layer or 5 of fiberglass then take the foam out and use a coat of oil inside it then expanda foam it pull it out and paint it 

Bit longer process but should look good still 

Good luck convincing mummy I had to move out to get pet snakes :-/


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## mudgudgeon (Jun 26, 2012)

Polystyrene melts at approx 60-70*C
Render or grout will shield it from direct heat, set your heat lamp up and check the temp on the surface of your rock feature.
If you're using non toxic stuff it should be fine, let it all dry thoroughly and run your heat lamp for a few days before putting your reptile in there.
If it doesn't smell inside a closed up enclosure it should be fine.


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## GeckoJosh (Jun 26, 2012)

mudgudgeon said:


> Polystyrene melts at approx 60-70*C
> Render or grout will shield it from direct heat, set your heat lamp up and check the temp on the surface of your rock feature.
> If you're using non toxic stuff it should be fine, let it all dry thoroughly and run your heat lamp for a few days before putting your reptile in there.
> If it doesn't smell inside a closed up enclosure it should be fine.



If that is true how come it can hold boiled water?


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## mudgudgeon (Jun 26, 2012)

GeckoJosh said:


> If that is true how come it can hold boiled water?



Why can you boil an egg in a plastic supermarket shopping bag over a naked flame?


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## Manda1032 (Jun 26, 2012)

that's easy silly, it's not good for the egg Der! LOL


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## GeckoJosh (Jun 26, 2012)

mudgudgeon said:


> Why can you boil an egg in a plastic supermarket shopping bag over a naked flame?



Because the water keeps the plastic below melting temp
That still doesnt answer my question if you say the melting temp of polystyrene is 60-70 degrees, if that is true it should not be able to hold ANYTHING over that temp, even water


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## McFly (Jun 26, 2012)

Because it melts at 100C as I said before there is a link up there


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## mudgudgeon (Jun 26, 2012)

Polystyrene transitions to glass (ie melts and turns to liquid) at 
100*C

Expanded Polystyrene has a serviceable temperature of anything from 50*C to 85*C depending on the density of the foam.
This means it can begin to melt and lose its shape/structure well before it transitions to glass.

I did a lot of searching on this prior to starting my current enclosure project. I have embedded heat cords into a Polystyrene background and have rendered over it to create basking spots in my EWDs enclosure. I wanted to be sure I wasn't going to burn the house down.


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## Ramsayi (Jun 26, 2012)

mudgudgeon said:


> I did a lot of searching on this prior to starting my current enclosure project. I have embedded heat cords into a Polystyrene background and have rendered over it to create basking spots in my EWDs enclosure. I wanted to be sure I wasn't going to burn the house down.



Embedding heat cords or heat mats in anything that insulates is dangerous.Heat from the cord/mat could continue to build up until it melts.


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## GeckoJosh (Jun 26, 2012)

mudgudgeon said:


> Polystyrene transitions to glass (ie melts and turns to liquid) at
> 100*C
> 
> Expanded Polystyrene has a serviceable temperature of anything from 50*C to 85*C depending on the density of the foam.
> ...





mudgudgeon said:


> Polystyrene melts at approx 60-70*C



I think you will find its glass transition temperature of about 100 °C and the melting point is 240 °C


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## mudgudgeon (Jun 26, 2012)

Ok. I'll take your word for it. :?

The time a Styrofoam coffee cup melted in my hands was obviously due to an urn boiling water to a temperature in excess of 240degreesC, not sure why pure steam didn't come out of the urn :?

And my $15 heat gun from bunnings must be turbo charged, it melts Styrofoam within seconds of being switched on 0 to 240degrees in seconds, Mr ozito would be impressed!


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## dangles (Jun 26, 2012)

Recommended Maximum Use Temperature: 165oF (75oC)
Melting Point: As a thermoplastic, polystyrene does not exhibit a true melting point. It will beginto soften at about 212oF (100oC) and, as more heat is applied, melting occurs.
Flash Ignition Temperature*: The lowest initial
temperature of air passing around a molded sample
of expanded polystyrene at which a sufficient amount of combustible gas
is evolved to be ignited (ASTM D 1929). 698oF (370oC)
Self Ignition Temperature*: The lowest initial temperature of
air passing around the specimen at which, in the absence
of an ignition source, the self-heating properties of polystyrene lead
to ignition or ignition occurs of itself. (ASTM D1929) 752oF (400oC)


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## TheCheshireCat (Jun 26, 2012)

Wouldn't it depend on the grade/density of foam?
I would assume that styro cups would be made of a density that was greater than say a "disposable" styro box due to their intended uses?

I have always heard and read that styrofoam can leech chemicals with extended use.


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## thomasssss (Jun 26, 2012)

why the debate over styro foam  i mean after you put render or grout on it the foam would totally covered up and its not like your going to want temps in the enclosure anything around what you guys are suggesting you would cook your snake 

what i would be wondering is how the very last coat of what ever it is on the background , in most case pondtite or similar , is going to cope with the maximum temperature that your heating device is capable of ( of coarse done with the inhabitant out of the enclosure ) 

happy debating people


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## GeckoJosh (Jun 27, 2012)

mudgudgeon said:


> Ok. I'll take your word for it. :?
> 
> The time a Styrofoam coffee cup melted in my hands was obviously due to an urn boiling water to a temperature in excess of 240degreesC, not sure why pure steam didn't come out of the urn :?
> 
> And my $15 heat gun from bunnings must be turbo charged, it melts Styrofoam within seconds of being switched on 0 to 240degrees in seconds, Mr ozito would be impressed!



Don't take my word for it, a quick google search will result in many sources displaying the same info.

Im not sure what type of cup you were using but polystyrene "teacups" are quite capable of taking water from a boiling urn without melting, after all isn't that one of the main things they are used for?


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## Defective (Jun 27, 2012)

hey guys it was a simple question...there's no need to get narky with each other! i have taken this all on board and relyed the info to mum and she's happy i'm not going to kill either the house or my nakey......


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## mudgudgeon (Jun 27, 2012)

Defective said:


> hey guys it was a simple question...there's no need to get narky with each other! i have taken this all on board and relyed the info to mum and she's happy i'm not going to kill either the house or my nakey......



Agreed. 
Good luck with finishing you background. Whatever temp the stuff melts at, you won't have any trouble with it if you use some common sense, sounds like you have that covered ;-)


@ Thomasss

Even the last coat will be helped by the layers directly below that. Grout or render will absorb a lot of heat away from the outer coating, just like boiling an egg in a shopping bag.


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## boxhead1990 (Jul 3, 2012)

heat lamp wont get hot enough to affect it my lamp is right next to mine and i used concrete for the rendering part on mine and its been in use for months now with no ill effects


Sent from my iPhone


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