# Rat substrate



## Murtletheturle (May 29, 2013)

Hello
Can rats live on sand?
Cheers


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## solar 17 (May 29, 2013)




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## Murtletheturle (May 29, 2013)

yes?


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## BIGBANG (May 29, 2013)

Why would you use sand for substrate?????


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## Stuart (May 30, 2013)

Murtletheturle said:


> Can rats live on sand?
> Cheers



No, sand is not a suitable substrate.


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## Emilie (May 30, 2013)

Rats can live on anything, but they thrive better on more suitable substrate like breeders choice, wood shavings or sugar cane mulch. We used all if these, they breed the best on sugar cane. It's quit dusty so some people will say its not good for them and some will say its good


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## sharky (May 30, 2013)

I'd say no to sugar cane. To dusty and causes to much Respritory problems. Try a chaff. I prefer Lucerne Chaff the most! The rats love it and it hides the ammonia smell so you don't have to do daily cleans. I now only do weekly cleans instead of everyday cleans on newspaper (After a week Lucerne starts getting smelly ) Also I had rats with respritory issues before and when I switched to chaff I saw a BIG improvement! You can buy it from fodder stores  It think it is about 20kg for $20 where I go


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## Fuscus (May 30, 2013)

sharkyy1o5 said:


> I'd say no to sugar cane.


I disagree and use SC exclusively. Since the Hisorb shortage forced me to find alternatives I started on SC and haven't gone back. Also there is no sneezing in the rat cave anymore, this was a constant sound during my Hysorb days. Note that there is SC and there is SC, Big cane country brand is coarser and almost dust free.


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## sharky (May 30, 2013)

Fuscus said:


> I disagree and use SC exclusively. Since the Hisorb shortage forced me to find alternatives I started on SC and haven't gone back. Also there is no sneezing in the rat cave anymore, this was a constant sound during my Hysorb days. Note that there is SC and there is SC, Big cane country brand is coarser and almost dust free.



The SC I bought was extremely dusty. It was terrible. Gave nearly all my rats Respritory or eye problems  That's the only reason I didn't recommend it but it must have just been supplier >.< I find chaff works for me...that just my opinion.


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## Fuscus (May 30, 2013)

sharkyy1o5 said:


> The SC I bought was extremely dusty.


One of the first bags I brought was ridiculously dusty so I can understand your point of view. I prefer the big cane as ( so far ) it has had very little dust.



sharkyy1o5 said:


> I find chaff works for me...that just my opinion.


If it works for you, then it works for you. End of story! I might price Lucerne Chaff and give it a try. It will get bonus points if it is cheaper.


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## ingie (May 30, 2013)

I now use lucerne chaff and am cleaning my rats out only one third as often as I was before, and there is no ammonia build up. Everyone on the rat forum is swapping over to it and raving about it, including me. I'm even using it for kitty litter now!

Dust and ammonia build up are the enemy of rat respiratory systems. The chaff is superior at keeping these to a minimum. 
Sugar cane mulch was OK, but just got gross with the rat pee build up. It really stinks compared to the lucerne chaff, over time.


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## ArcticMonkey (May 30, 2013)

I find that sugarcane mulch is not very absorbent and the brand I have used is quite dusty.

Where do you buy Lucerne chaff?


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## Fuscus (May 30, 2013)

ingie said:


> It really stinks compared to the lucerne chaff, over time.


OK - I'm giving Lucerne chaff a shot.
BTW - anyone remember what this thread was about?


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## ArcticMonkey (May 30, 2013)

Is chaff just that green hay?


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## jacorin (May 30, 2013)

no murtle,don't use sand......use lucerne lololol....... is this ok for mice too???? i use wood shavings for them


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## ingie (May 30, 2013)

Yeah just give it a go and see how you like it, for rats, mice, and kitty litter


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## BIGBANG (May 30, 2013)

I use wood shavings, straight from a furniture maker that only uses solid timber costs me noting and have no problems with rats breeding.


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## MrThumper (May 30, 2013)

Shredded newspaper here


Implanted Since Oct 2012


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## ingie (May 30, 2013)

It isn't really an issue of whether they breed or not  Just how stinky they get and how often I have to clean them out! Having several hundred of them living in my garage, which is inside my house, I want something really good and not too time consuming.


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## Marzzy (May 30, 2013)

They seem to of ate all the paper ? Do yours do the same thing ?


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## Grunter023 (Jun 1, 2013)

ingie said:


> I now use lucerne chaff and am cleaning my rats out only one third as often as I was before, and there is no ammonia build up. Everyone on the rat forum is swapping over to it and raving about it, including me. I'm even using it for kitty litter now!
> 
> Dust and ammonia build up are the enemy of rat respiratory systems. The chaff is superior at keeping these to a minimum.
> Sugar cane mulch was OK, but just got gross with the rat pee build up. It really stinks compared to the lucerne chaff, over time.



Does it have to be lucerne chaff? My only reason for asking being the cost, as I am not sure if lucerne chaff is the most expensive out of all the chaffs or if all the types of chaffs are the same price?


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## andynic07 (Jun 1, 2013)

Grunter023 said:


> Does it have to be lucerne chaff? My only reason for asking being the cost, as I am not sure if lucerne chaff is the most expensive out of all the chaffs or if all the types of chaffs are the same price?


Lucerne chaff is the more expensive chaff around but at about $15 a bale it is cheaper than wood shavings.


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## solar 17 (Jun 2, 2013)

This is virtually a pet forum, and l can't believe anybody would entertain the idea of keeping rats on sand but love the way the thread has turned out, like a previous post l use wood shavings from a furniture maker but put several thicknesses of newspaper in 1st as it does help a bit with dryness but the females love to shred it for nest material even though they have very light wood shavings the other thing l swear by is 3 litre pineapple/beetroot tins for nesting sites although my tubs are 220 litre in size ( approx.900x700x600)....solar 17 (Baden)


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## ingie (Jun 3, 2013)

Grunter023 said:


> Does it have to be lucerne chaff? My only reason for asking being the cost, as I am not sure if lucerne chaff is the most expensive out of all the chaffs or if all the types of chaffs are the same price?



I have tried oaten and wheaten chaff a long time ago and found it terrible. Whatever it is that makes the lucerne chaff good, the other chaff's do not possess the same qualities. I also sprinkle a generous amount of bi carb soda on the bottom of my tubs before I put the chaff in, and it works wonders. You can buy it in bulk at produce stores, significantly cheaper than at the supermarket. If anyone is having issues with the smell of their breeding rats if you keep them inside, bi carb would be really great for you to try, regardless of the substrate you want to use. 

Also if you shop around with chaff, you may find a good deal. Usually 1.5 bales goes into a big hessian bag of it, and so far one bag has lasted me nearly a month, and I still have more than half left, with around 30 tubs. The big bales of shavings work out cheaper, depending on how often you clean (I was cleaning really often so using a lot), but I like that I have to do less work, and I value my time more than the extra bit of money.

I was thinking of trialling a bit of shavings and lucerne chaff mixed together, as the shavings are superior for absorbing, while the lucerne is great for breaking down odour.


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## ingie (Jun 3, 2013)

solar 17 said:


> This is virtually a pet forum, and l can't believe anybody would entertain the idea of keeping rats on sand but love the way the thread has turned out, like a previous post l use wood shavings from a furniture maker but put several thicknesses of newspaper in 1st as it does help a bit with dryness but the females love to shred it for nest material even though they have very light wood shavings the other thing l swear by is 3 litre pineapple/beetroot tins for nesting sites although my tubs are 220 litre in size ( approx.900x700x600)....solar 17 (Baden)



That is great because you get to eat the pineapple as well as getting a free hiding spot for the rats  I put short lengths of PVC pipe in all my tubs in the rack, for rats to sleep in and mums to have babies in. It gives them something to climb on as well, to make the most of the space they have. In my giant tubs like yours Baden, I put 70cent buckets from Bunnings, and they love piling in there on top of each other, and climbing all over them.


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## Grunter023 (Jun 3, 2013)

Thanks for clearing that up about the Lucerne Chaff.


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## Wild~Touch (Jun 3, 2013)

Lucerne pellets = Natty Cat = $27.50 per bag it keeps odours at bay


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