# petition to stop live animal skinning



## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

Hi everyone, We are all aware that other countries dont have the same rules as us regarding animal welfare but this is horrific and needs to stop!!! I would love for as many people as possable to sign the petition and maybe make a tiny bit of difference. I would warn how ever that you dont watch the video - I could not hold down my breakfast after watching it!! and could no longer see through the tears that poured down my face
Thank you so much for your time
Nat

http://www.animalsaviors.org/index.html
Plz go to the petition tab and sign


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## Jewly (Sep 20, 2008)

Hi Nat,

Someone posted the same thing a couple of weeks back and a lot of us went and signed the petition.

I didn't watch the video but I can imagine how horrific it is. People who are cruel to animals have no soul.


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

Jewly said:


> Hi Nat,
> 
> Someone posted the same thing a couple of weeks back and a lot of us went and signed the petition.
> 
> I didn't watch the video but I can imagine how horrific it is. People who are cruel to animals have no soul.


 
Thanks I should have checked that first - the video was something I never want to see again!!


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## wiz-fiz (Sep 20, 2008)

yeah, I already signed it.

MAJOR RECOGMENDATION TO ANY1 OUT THERE!

DO NOT WATCH THE VIDEO, WHATEVER YOU DO DO NOT WATCH THE VIDEO.

will


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## jaysnakes3 (Sep 20, 2008)

*video is sick*

i watched it and its sick,,,,, some countries just dont get it and come on people we know what countries they are ,,,,,,some countries would eat anything they can get they hands no ,,,i thing people should get shot for some of the things they do ,,,,,,,,im with u its sick....arent we glad we live in a good country...


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## Jewly (Sep 20, 2008)

Shooting them would be way too quick in my opinion. They should be skinned alive so they know what it feels like.


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## wiz-fiz (Sep 20, 2008)

yep, skinned alive should be the punishment.


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

I work with a lot of backpackers and its funny when you speak to the chinese, they dont see animals as pets and cant fathom our mentality of doing it, but most of them dissagree with how their counrty kills animals and they gain a new appreciation for how we live over here.


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## KaaTom (Sep 20, 2008)

OMG I couldnt even finish watching it... that poor animal


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## RedEyeGirl (Sep 20, 2008)

Signed.I watched the video last time and i bawled my eyes out.I am gonna pick their skin off really slow so their flesh is exposed and put them in a barrel off salt. See how they feel.Stupid people.


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## Rocky (Sep 20, 2008)

oh dear


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## mrmikk (Sep 20, 2008)

Signed.

You can do more than simply sign the petition, as someone said, we know which countries do this, well in that case boycott everything to do with that country and tell your friends why you are doing. Personally, I refuse to eat Chinese food or at a Chinese restaurant ever again in my life because of their disgusting lack of animal rights.


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## xycom (Sep 20, 2008)

OMG.... That really does make your stomach turn.....


Signed and emailed to others...


Per


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## Fiona74 (Sep 20, 2008)

Are these people for real! (I watched like 2 seconds of the video). The filthy ignorant bastards. :evil: Makes me so cranky.
Thank god we live in a (mostly) civilised country where this sort of thing is not tolerated. How behind the times are these jerks. I'm getting so cranky I'm going to have to stop typing before I say something rude.


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## Christopher (Sep 20, 2008)

I really do not understand how someones mindset can can be altered to the point of thinking this is ok. Culture is a powerful thing if it can instill these supremist values in humans who then have the ability to carry out these senseless acts without remorse.. 

I think its important however not to generalise to certain nationalities as I'm sure there are members of such nations that despise what is going on in their country and it is these people that really need to bring about change. Future generations really need to understand that we're not that different to, or better than, other animals, and just because we can exert our power over other species doesnt mean we need to use this power for our own selfish gain. 

Thanks for letting us know Nat.

Chris


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## Earthling (Sep 20, 2008)

What a cruel, thoughtless, arrogant, unatural race we can be.


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## bundybear (Sep 20, 2008)

signed it, totally agree with all here..........................
but we still legally allow halal slaughtering of domestic livestock??????


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## monkeyboy (Sep 20, 2008)

Ive been to china twice in the last couple of years, and this doesnt suprise me at all. They have zero regard for life, animal or human. Zero. Three people died right in front of me on one trip, all hit by cars,and all were picked up and put on the footpath so the traffic could keep moving till I guess someone came to collect them. 
The guide I had was a well educated uni student whos mother worked for National Geographic and his dad was a scientist, and he was trying to become a cop, so he had a much better insight as to what was going on than most over there. Having said that he was still very much in the dark about the rest of the world. He was the only, and I mean the only male I saw over there that didnt smoke, when I mentioned that to him he said because his parents he knew of the the dangers, and that the government kept this info from the people, they rely on smoking and road fatalities to cull the numbers a bit. 
I grilled him on everything, and he was very gaurded, but eventually he told me stuff he knew could get him in trouble.
At the factory I was visiting, they had a 4 year old little girl who was dumped on the doorstep as a newborn, the owner of the factory kept her and looked after her, which is very rare. She is one of the lucky ones. They could have literally put her in the rubbish, (which is the side of the road) This is very common, and trust me, if little girls skins were worth anything, we would be talking about a very different video.
respect, steve.


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## snakelvr (Sep 20, 2008)

Just signed the petition. Read the info on what it was about - that was enough. Couldn't watch the video (didn't try), the pick where the link was nausiated me. Feel really sick now. Just opened a bottle of wine - I need it!!


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## HoffOff (Sep 20, 2008)

bundybear said:


> signed it, totally agree with all here..........................
> but we still legally allow halal slaughtering of domestic livestock??????



I like beef tho..


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## Wednesday (Sep 20, 2008)

That is sick......
I knew that China had little regard for rights and what not... but I had no idea that it had been pushed to that extent... I signed the petition and then made the rest of my family do it...not that they protested....


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## mrillusion (Sep 20, 2008)

yea this is just sick and must stop i signed the petition and if want to be able to make your own petitions please support my idea for APS at http://www.aussiepythons.com/forum/feature-requests/my-new-idea-91065/page-2
thanks.


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## bundybear (Sep 20, 2008)

snakeman112 said:


> I like beef tho..


 
yeh so do i, just finished a big hangover cure of bacon, chops, eggs and fried tomato!, even worked in a slaughter house and butcher shops too, so i'm not disagreeing with the humane killing of animals for meat.
google Halal, it is a particular style of slaughter that with out a doubt prolonges the process and causes considerable pain to the animal.
basically the jugulars in the animals throats are cut/pierced and the animal is alllowed to bleed out whilst it is still concious. one of the key components of a halal slaughter is the animal can not be rendered uncoucious.
in a domestic slaughtehouse, animal are stunned and renedered unconcious before being bled out.


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## Carpetcleaner (Sep 20, 2008)

I didn't watch the video, but I did sign the petition. The picture on the bottom of the screen was bad enough.
What on earth would they skin them alive for? Could they not humanely kill them first? Is there a reason for doing it while they are still alive?
I ahve heard that people that work as slaughterers in abbatoirs can't do it for more than a couple of years because depression kicks in and messes with their heads, killing all those animals for the meat trade, so what does it do to these people? Do they not suffer long term psychological effects from it? Maybe they are not human?!?!?!


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## bundybear (Sep 20, 2008)

Carpetcleaner said:


> I ahve heard that people that work as slaughterers in abbatoirs can't do it for more than a couple of years because depression kicks in and messes with their heads, killing all those animals for the meat trade, so what does it do to these people? Do they not suffer long term psychological effects from it? Maybe they are not human?!?!?!


 
nothing (twitch, cough, stumble) wrong me (twitch, twitch):lol:
dunno about that, i know fellas who are now in their late 30's and have worked in slaughterhouses since they were sixteen. guess it depends on the individual personalties.


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## Shannon (Sep 20, 2008)

Thanks for posting Nat. I saw this video quite a while ago and had it on my Myspace page until I left. It disturbed me for a very long time. Obviously I signed the petition and others like it. I'm glad you are helping to bring this cruelty to public knowledge - a change in perception of animals and their apparent 'role' in life needs to change for future generations.

Seeing this video is one of the reasons I so proudly wear my 'MEAN PEOPLE WEAR FUR' t-shirt on my profile page. They're available on the PETA website along with many others.

While I would never condemn others for their choices I personally am vegetarian. Ignorance is bliss and I know many Australians would like to think our livestock endure humane killing in the production of meat but this simply is not the case. Often it's not the killing that is the worst part but the torturous life they endure in the lead-up. There are many farmers/products who take pride in caring for their animals and disregard the 'factory farming' approach that is so inhumane. If you're a meat eater I encourage you to support these farmers instead.

Once I became educated on the subject - that was that. I know many people would rather not know, however if you do want to understand the reality of how such products are produced then learn the facts and base your decisions on that rather than wishful thinking. Even us 'civilized' countries still have a long way to go with animals rights.


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## Carpetcleaner (Sep 20, 2008)

I totally appreciate what you are saying Shannon, but I still can't bring myself to watch the video.


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## jessb (Sep 20, 2008)

mrmikk said:


> Personally, I refuse to eat Chinese food or at a Chinese restaurant ever again in my life because of their disgusting lack of animal rights.


 
You're not serious are you? This bit _is_ a joke right? :?



I agree with the fact that animal cruelty is horrific, but everyone needs to take a step back and realise that most Chinese (particularly rural) live in very poor conditions themselves - an animal represents food in a country where famines which killed millions aren't in the distant past but are in living memory. When human life is reasonably cheap, then animal life is even cheaper. 

It is easy to be high and mighty when we have plenty of food, good education, a strong welfare system and a reliable, democratic government, but try to just condemn the action rather than making racist comments about a culture that is a polar opposite to our own. By claiming that every culture that is different to our own is 'barbaric' or 'uncivilised' we are just buying into the American rhetoric that whatever isn't Western democracy is inherently 'evil'. And look where that has got us so far!!!


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## jasontini (Sep 20, 2008)

Something i found in the web abt halal slaughtering..
http://www.geocities.com/mutmainaa/food/halal_slaughter.html


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## Christopher (Sep 20, 2008)

Well said Jessb


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

jessb said:


> You're not serious are you? This bit _is_ a joke right? :?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
I agree with you in some respects, but even educated chinese dont think animals are worth anything! And if we just always say "ahh its there culture there is nothing wrong with them keeping to their traditions" then we are by far worse than they are! They are a country that live in fear, are treated like dirt by their rulers and have a ****ty existance - that is why it is important for the rest of the world to say ENOUGH!! and try to help change their ways.
Do you think their cculture is not barbaric?
Deep fried(live) turtles?
Baby chickens boiled in the shell just before they hatch
Snakes slit open enough for the heart to be queezed out(alive) still pumping
why the need to do things so cruel?


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

Shannon said:


> Thanks for posting Nat. I saw this video quite a while ago and had it on my Myspace page until I left. It disturbed me for a very long time. Obviously I signed the petition and others like it. I'm glad you are helping to bring this cruelty to public knowledge - a change in perception of animals and their apparent 'role' in life needs to change for future generations.
> 
> Seeing this video is one of the reasons I so proudly wear my 'MEAN PEOPLE WEAR FUR' t-shirt on my profile page. They're available on the PETA website along with many others.
> 
> ...


 
Good on you Shannon!!!, if we all change just a few things it will change the big picture(even if it is slowly). I am a meat eater - but purchase free range eggs & farm produce(chicken is all I eat). I am guilty of supporting things I shouldnt have but atleats I am trying
Thanks you to everyone who signed!!
Nat


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## xycom (Sep 20, 2008)

The practices viewed in the video are not necesary, some cultures use barbaric ways because they need too; To some degree. I've read about the locals in PNG going on a long trip (in a canoe) with a pig brought along for food. The pig had hot coals rubbed in it's eyes so it can't run away and then along the way limbs are cut off to eat. The pig was kept alive so the meat didn't go off in the tropical heat. I don't agree with these practices either but they do this for a reason. I've skinned small animals like rabbits and it's not a difficult task when they are dead and gutted. I have also watched a friend skin goats and it's not really that difficult.

These barbaric cultures need to be educated about the ethics of what they are doing. 


The book mentioned was "Throwim way leg" by Tim Flannery. Highly recomended


Per


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## Boney (Sep 20, 2008)

that video is horrific , but this is happening in australia to some extent on slaughter floors accross australia ive worked on one floor in the past . where they have to kill a cow every 30 seconds so there is no gap in the chain . one day a rep from maccers came in to check on the whole humainly killed thing and see what was going on . as maccers say they will only buy humainly killed animals . i can tell you there was that many gaps in the chain when they had to do it properly for a hour gaps up to 6 minutes, there was gaps in the chain after nearly everyone . . ive seen cows getting skinned by a hide puller still mooing . . cows stabbed in the eyes going up the race . my point is it happens in australia , what do you do if you want to eat and you need a job ?


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## ryanharvey1993 (Sep 20, 2008)

I have no problem with them killing cats and dogs at all, but skinning them alive is horrible and no animal deserves that. signing a petition isn't gonna stop this from happening either


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## christo (Sep 20, 2008)

mrmikk said:


> Signed.
> 
> You can do more than simply sign the petition, as someone said, we know which countries do this, well in that case boycott everything to do with that country and tell your friends why you are doing. Personally, I refuse to eat Chinese food or at a Chinese restaurant ever again in my life because of their disgusting lack of animal rights.



I would think that 99% of Chinese restaurants in Australia would be owned by Australians who happen to have been born in China. Punishing them for what is happening in the country of their birth makes no sense at all.


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## cockney red (Sep 20, 2008)

ANTARESIA1 said:


> that video is horrific , but this is happening in australia to some extent on slaughter floors accross australia ive worked on one floor in the past . where they have to kill a cow every 30 seconds so there is no gap in the chain . one day a rep from maccers came in to check on the whole humainly killed thing and see what was going on . as maccers say they will only buy humainly killed animals . i can tell you there was that many gaps in the chain when they had to do it properly for a hour gaps up to 6 minutes, there was gaps in the chain after nearly everyone . . ive seen cows getting skinned by a hide puller still mooing . . cows stabbed in the eyes going up the race . my point is it happens in australia , what do you do if you want to eat and you need a job ?


Well, for sanitys sake, you dont do "THAT"..........................


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## Pythonking (Sep 20, 2008)

saw this thread when it started finally watched the video and yea what can I say.... they have no decency at all..


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## Boney (Sep 20, 2008)

cockney red said:


> Well, for sanitys sake, you dont do "THAT"..........................


 mate if you can give me a job in a plant nursery or something i would rather do that for $1000 a week . but yeah i got out of there and the things i cut up these days are well and truely dead . thank god !!


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## ryanharvey1993 (Sep 20, 2008)

is everyone angry because they cruelly killed the cats and dogs or is it because they are killing cats and dogs. there is nothing wrong with killing a cat or dog, its the same as us killing cows and chickens and sheep and kangaroos for food.


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

ANTARESIA1 said:


> that video is horrific , but this is happening in australia to some extent on slaughter floors accross australia ive worked on one floor in the past . where they have to kill a cow every 30 seconds so there is no gap in the chain . one day a rep from maccers came in to check on the whole humainly killed thing and see what was ame as going on . as maccers say they will only buy humainly killed animals . i can tell you there was that many gaps in the chain when they had to do it properly for a hour gaps up to 6 minutes, there was gaps in the chain after nearly everyone . . ive seen cows getting skinned by a hide puller still mooing . . cows stabbed in the eyes going up the race . my point is it happens in australia , what do you do if you want to eat and you need a job ?


 
Yes it does happen in Australia - in every counrty of the world! but that doesnt say it is right. We at least try to have animal rights in australia, things may still slip through the net but at least there is a net there! We wont ever stop it - the same as we wont stop killing each other. Personaly if people are doing it here in our counrty and know better then they are scum!! because there is always another job or even the doll is better! if they dont have the workers they dont have production! Just imagine if the got rid of animal rights here and said that its okay to do what you want - god what a horrid place it would turn in to
I like the fact that if I see someone doing something wrong to an animal I can call the RSPCA and have something done about it!


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

ryanharvey1993 said:


> is everyone angry because they cruelly killed the cats and dogs or is it because they are killing cats and dogs. there is nothing wrong with killing a cat or dog, its the same as us killing cows and chickens and sheep and kangaroos for food.


 
They can kill what they want so long as it is as humain as possable and is not nearly extinct


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## Boney (Sep 20, 2008)

RYAN, its more than that mate!!! its in the way they do it . if it was me and the animal had to be killed i would shoot it in the head first . not just start skinning it alive . that messes up your head seeing that stuff . for them to do that sort of stuff daily they would have to be twisted . . :evil:


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## Boney (Sep 20, 2008)

bundy_zigg said:


> Yes it does happen in Australia - in every counrty of the world! but that doesnt say it is right. We at least try to have animal rights in australia, things may still slip through the net but at least there is a net there! We wont ever stop it - the same as we wont stop killing each other. Personaly if people are doing it here in our counrty and know better then they are scum!! because there is always another job or even the doll is better! if they dont have the workers they dont have production! Just imagine if the got rid of animal rights here and said that its okay to do what you want - god what a horrid place it would turn in to
> I like the fact that if I see someone doing something wrong to an animal I can call the RSPCA and have something done about it!


 
so what you think im scum ?, and i would of been better off on the dole . im trying to pay off a house . and i want to work . i think dole bludgers are scum . ok ive just told you what is going on in australia . so if you go to maccers or any takeaway shop , butcher ever again you know whats going on now ,and if you do your just as bad, you are supporting the trade! so i hope you like your vegies!!!!!!


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Sep 20, 2008)

bundybear said:


> signed it, totally agree with all here..........................
> but we still legally allow halal slaughtering of domestic livestock??????


 Please do not compare the halal process to what you see in this video.
The priest who is in charge of the halal kill, as well as the rabbi who does the kosher kill generally these very religious men have the utmost respect for animals and try to make the kill as quick and painless as possible.
I have worked in many different abbatoirs for many years and the cruelty ive witnessed is perpetrated by western style slaughterers and gut runners ect only


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## jasontini (Sep 20, 2008)

ssssnakeman said:


> Please do not compare the halal process to what you see in this video.
> The priest who is in charge of the halal kill, as well as the rabbi who does the kosher kill generally these very religious men have the utmost respect for animals and try to make the kill as quick and painless as possible.
> I have worked in many different abbatoirs for many years and the cruelty ive witnessed is perpetrated by western style slaughterers and gut runners ect only


 
Agreed with sssnakeman...
Thank you for voicing out...


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## mrmikk (Sep 20, 2008)

jessb said:


> You're not serious are you? This bit _is_ a joke right? :?


 
No joke, I am deadly bloody serious, why not?

You can sign all the petitions you like, post all the posts you like saying how disgusted you are. Make a stand, do something different, imagine if everyone did this, you would make a huge difference. But for me personally, I can't condone that kind of cruel, uneccasary behaviour, if you can, good for you.

It's got nothing to do with being high and mighty and living the good life. The Aborigines survived in this country for thousands of years with respect for nature and all it provided them, not like these cruel filthy things.


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## xycom (Sep 20, 2008)

Well said ssssnakeman.

There's nothing cruel about having a religious leader present.

Per


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## mrmikk (Sep 20, 2008)

christo said:


> I would think that 99% of Chinese restaurants in Australia would be owned by Australians who happen to have been born in China. Punishing them for what is happening in the country of their birth makes no sense at all.


 
OK, your criticise my propostition to this problem, now give me a valid and effective alternative. Criticism means nothing without a valid alternative or suggestion. Anyone can criticise.


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## mrmikk (Sep 20, 2008)

ssssnakeman said:


> Please do not compare the halal process to what you see in this video.
> The priest who is in charge of the halal kill, as well as the rabbi who does the kosher kill generally these very religious men have the utmost respect for animals and try to make the kill as quick and painless as possible.
> I have worked in many different abbatoirs for many years and the cruelty ive witnessed is perpetrated by western style slaughterers and gut runners ect only


 
I agree! Inshallah.


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## Boney (Sep 20, 2008)

ssssnakeman said:


> Please do not compare the halal process to what you see in this video.
> The priest who is in charge of the halal kill, as well as the rabbi who does the kosher kill generally these very religious men have the utmost respect for animals and try to make the kill as quick and painless as possible.
> I have worked in many different abbatoirs for many years and the cruelty ive witnessed is perpetrated by western style slaughterers and gut runners ect only


 
when they do halal slaughter in australia it is a hell of alot more humain ,then without the mozzie .but how come what i dont get is when it is done in there own moslem countrys it is the opposite ? they treat there cattle bad going into slaughter, they cut there tendons on there anklers going up the race stab their eyes and legs and that withs there knives . ive seen the vids . whats the go with that?


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Sep 20, 2008)

i only know what ive seen with my own eyes, and here in victoria, at least, they dont cut tendons or stab eyes..
Have you seen how the lamb and beef are treated by our own western slaughterers?


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## Pythonking (Sep 20, 2008)

I have no problem with killing an animal, the issue here weither religious or not is the video footage is horrible, I would have been a lot happier to see the guy in the video cut the animals throat instead of banging its head against the ground and then skinning it while it was going in and out of shock.


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## Boney (Sep 20, 2008)

ssssnakeman said:


> i only know what ive seen with my own eyes, and here in victoria, at least, they dont cut tendons or stab eyes..
> Have you seen how the lamb and beef are treated by our own western slaughterers?


 

yeh man im with you mate 100% done the slaughter floor for 6 years messed me up real bad , got a transfer to the boning room done that for 6 years . i can tell you i wished i stuck to being a pastry cook . but the boning room pays $1300 a week and i got a house to pay off . and my town has know other work and im not one for the dole ! so what do you do?


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## BlindSnake (Sep 20, 2008)

mrmikk said:


> Signed.
> Personally, I refuse to eat Chinese food or at a Chinese restaurant ever again in my life because of their disgusting lack of animal rights.


 
Well if you feel that stong about China and it people, shouldn't you go all the way and boycot everything made in China?...Good luck being naked..

It's funny when walking the dog (boxer) or doing a herp display, the Asian people cant get further away from us and squirm at the sight of them...But if they were cut into chunks topped with sweet n' sour sauce and served with rice, they couldn't get close enough and hook right in..


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## tooninoz (Sep 20, 2008)

Vegos reading this thread must be grinning away...


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## alex_c (Sep 20, 2008)

signed. ive seen thing's like this before. but its a very widespread problem. then you also have the horrible treatment of dog's in the Middle east for example being stoned to death for offending it's owner which is due to religious belief's as far as i know. So stopping all cruelty may be quite difficult in a lot of countries unfortunately


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## ryanharvey1993 (Sep 20, 2008)

anyway before we have a winge about what everyone else is doing why dont we deal with our problems first, animals are tortured all the time here, its not just happening over there. once the problems are solved here maybe then you can worry about what happens there, it isnt really any of our business anyway, they have different beliefs/religions/cultures and you arnt gonna be able to change them that is how they have been for a long time


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## jessb (Sep 20, 2008)

mrmikk said:


> No joke, I am deadly bloody serious, why not?
> 
> You can sign all the petitions you like, post all the posts you like saying how disgusted you are. Make a stand, do something different, imagine if everyone did this, you would make a huge difference. But for me personally, I can't condone that kind of cruel, uneccasary behaviour, if you can, good for you.
> 
> It's got nothing to do with being high and mighty and living the good life. The Aborigines survived in this country for thousands of years with respect for nature and all it provided them, not like these cruel filthy things.


 
I'm not sure how boycotting an Australian business run by Australian residents (or quite possibly Aussie citizens) will teach the perpretators of these acts a lesson? I don't understand how by eating Kylie Kwong's food, the Chinese Government will be encouraged to change their actions. :lol: What about cooking fried rice or stir-fry at home? Is that out too???  

Boycotting Chinese-made products is a good move - it will affect industry and encourage people to take notice. It is a really effective form of protest and I fully support it. However you are really missing the point by suggesting that people stop purchasing anything that is culturally Chinese.


And your last comment is disgusting, ignorant, racist and offensive. It reflects far more on you than on the culture you are insulting.

NB anyone who criticises various cultures for eating dog/snake etc, note that Hindus would consider us disgusting for eating beef, Muslims and Jews would be appaled at our consumption of pork and Buddhists would think we were cruel and barbaric for eating meat of any kind!


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

ANTARESIA1 said:


> so what you think im scum ?, and i would of been better off on the dole . im trying to pay off a house . and i want to work . i think dole bludgers are scum . ok ive just told you what is going on in australia . so if you go to maccers or any takeaway shop , butcher ever again you know whats going on now ,and if you do your just as bad, you are supporting the trade! so i hope you like your vegies!!!!!!


 you said it not me!!, Im paying of a house and their is no way I would stoop to that level! and my diet is mainly veg, fruit and nuts! the chicken I have I know how it is killed! I dont eat maccas(crappy food and bad for you!). The people over there are just trying to make money but what they do is unexceptable as it is here they just have more of an excuse than we do!


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## Ishah (Sep 20, 2008)

That video is really really sick and disturbing! The thing that got to me the most was how it was still alive and trying to move after the rough removal of its skin! It is the most horrible thing I think I have seen in a very long time! Why did they just leave it there instead of putting it out of its misery? ARGH!


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## Kathryn_ (Sep 20, 2008)

> Just imagine if the got rid of animal rights here and said that its okay to do what you want - god what a horrid place it would turn in to
> I like the fact that if I see someone doing something wrong to an animal I can call the RSPCA and have something done about it!



We have very little in way of animal rights in this country, actually; only native animals and pets are protected in any meaningful way - food animals are buggered. The RSPCA can only operate under the limits of the law, which allow factory farming of pigs and chickens, which includes de-beaking the chooks, and castration of male pigs without anaesthetic. Read Peter Singer and see what you think of animal welfare in Australia. I'm sorry mate, but we're just as bad anyone else when it comes down to it. Pigs are smarter than dogs, and we torture thousands and thousands of them for food. It's not necessary, it's just legal and cheap.


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## xycom (Sep 20, 2008)

There are many problems in the world today, some of those are in our own country. If some one wants to fight for a specific cause or outcome to change one of those problems and I agrea with them, then I will support them. Especially if all i need to do is sign their petition. 

There's no point complaining about all the other problems in the world when someone has addressed one of these problems and wants to make a change. I hear a lot of people complain about the problems we face today but very few actually get off the couch and do something about it. 

If you think there are more important issues that need addressing then do something about it.

I must say though if people could see where our meat comes from and how it is prepared there would be a lot more veges. 



Per


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## Rainbow-Serpent (Sep 20, 2008)

Sure! 

I signed, theres too many idiots these days that are cruel to animals, by the way, (too much graphics on the homepage). I cant get that picture outa my head.


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## Boney (Sep 20, 2008)

bundy_zigg said:


> you said it not me!!, Im paying of a house and their is no way I would stoop to that level! and my diet is mainly veg, fruit and nuts! the chicken I have I know how it is killed! I dont eat maccas(crappy food and bad for you!). The people over there are just trying to make money but what they do is unexceptable as it is here they just have more of an excuse than we do!


 
no you said it ! but thats o.k. and if you have all the answers to solving the problems of the world . good for you .. hope you come up with a better idea then a petition . but really good luck with it im not for animal mistreatment but you need a reality check and the world you seem to live in. is not the same as mine and others.


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

ANTARESIA1 said:


> no you said it ! but thats o.k. and if you have all the answers to solving the problems of the world . good for you .. hope you come up with a better idea then a petition . but really good luck with it im not for animal mistreatment but you need a reality check and the world you seem to live in. is not the same as mine and others.


 
Reality check?, dude I know what kind of a world we live in but I want to at least make an effort! if I had all the awnsers do you think it would still be bad? At least I dont just put it in the Too Hard Basket!. Im sure you had your reasons for killing animals unhumainly - all I am saying is that I think there is no reason to do it NO MATTER WHAT THE EXCUSE but every one has different morals and if the needs bad enough I guess people do all kind of things


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## Pythonking (Sep 20, 2008)

ANTARESIA1 said:


> no you said it ! but thats o.k. and if you have all the answers to solving the problems of the world . good for you .. hope you come up with a better idea then a petition . but really good luck with it im not for animal mistreatment but you need a reality check and the world you seem to live in. is not the same as mine and others.


 
Atleast shes posted this thread mate, doing something no matter how small is better than doing nothing.


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## Glidergirl (Sep 20, 2008)

I am a memeber of WSPA I see things like this all the time in thier newsletters, in some countries they hang dogs upside down and beat it before they kill it saying that the meat is more tender.
What about the bears they milk for bile, thats completely inhumane, yes they say it part of the culture but it only started to be pratciced a few generations ago, there are plenty of herbal remedies etc that do what they say bile does.
Our society is very unaware tho of the things we do, do you know we send cats and dogs over to asian countries by the thousand under title of pets (knowing full well what they are really going over for- the food industry)
It disgusts me the way they treat animals in certain counties when there is a more humane way of doing things.


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## Glidergirl (Sep 20, 2008)

OMG I just watched some of the video, oh geez I have typed and deleted about five times, I dont have any words that can express just how sick that video made me.


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## missllama (Sep 20, 2008)

is it that bad rach? im too scared to watch it


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 20, 2008)

missllamathuen said:


> is it that bad rach? im too scared to watch it


 It is horrid beyond words - I have never cried so much in my life and had such a hollow heartache pain in my life! thoses little eyes!


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## Glidergirl (Sep 20, 2008)

ITS HORRIFIC
I make myself look at these thing so I dont forget just what human nature is capable of.


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## missllama (Sep 20, 2008)

the photo with the persons foot on the dog made me cry i couldnt cope watching it but im emailing it out to everyone and posting it now on some other forums

thanks bundy zigg


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## thepythonpit (Sep 20, 2008)

i think you need to remove that link , its very inapropreate for this site , there are lots of kids on here .
try to save the world if you must, but noone needs to have animals skined live rammed down there necks on a reptile site .go and tell PETA your probs and thay will tell you were no better here in aus


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## missllama (Sep 20, 2008)

thepythonpit

its an animal site, bundy and others are just trying to get help with the petition

its not just a reptile site afterall theres sections for other animals

.... and.... she isnt giving the link to the video itself its a link to the site that the video is on


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## Boney (Sep 20, 2008)

your right python king . hope all goes well . i know myself things can just seem hopless sometimes and you do just give up as there is just so many issues that are of concern . and if you worry about them all you will do your head in . . 

and for the record bundy zigg im ashamed of having worked on a slaughter floor but felt i had no other choice for many reasons . and for the record i personaly tried to do whatever i could do as humainly as possible but yes ive been apart of it and for that im truely sorry .

















-


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## thepythonpit (Sep 20, 2008)

are you serious , 
no this is the very wrong place for crap like that .
and only people like you think its fine.
i havent been for a while but it doesnt look like you have change at all


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Sep 20, 2008)

thepythonpit said:


> i think you need to remove that link , its very inapropreate for this site , there are lots of kids on here .
> try to save the world if you must, but noone needs to have animals skined live rammed down there necks on a reptile site .go and tell PETA your probs and thay will tell you were no better here in aus


Cant really agree with that.This is the internet and this footage and worse is accessable to all.
Censuring it here is not going to stop kids from seeing it and i dont think this thread is ramming images down anyones neck.
It's just another petition for ppl to sign which may or may not have any affect.
Personally, i prefer to support protests that are closer to my home.
If you can clean up your own backyard then hopefully other places will follow suit.


> Think globally, act locally


David Suzuki


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## xycom (Sep 21, 2008)

Again, well said Baz. 
I was told about the video clip by a 12 year old kid before I came across the clip here.
My young nephew didn't mention petition. If the petition wasn't mentioned on this forum I would never taken any further interest in the issue. 


Per


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 21, 2008)

Im very sorry if I have upsat anyone regarding this, Maybe the site should have the ability to have an age cap on somethings so we dont have to miss out on an important topic like this because of kids who shouldnt see it. That is why I gave the link to the web site not the video because the video is there so show people who may not know that this is happeneing! it was the petition that was my main goal
so once again Im truly sorry for upsetting anyone!
Nat


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## shane14 (Sep 21, 2008)

This video nearly made me cry, I hope those men rote in HELL!!!!!
So depressing.....


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## monkeyboy (Sep 21, 2008)

No need to apologise Nat, you have made a lot of people aware of an appauling situation, thats half the battle. I dont know how you win the battle but censoring information certainly wont do it. Boycotting chinese food I dont think has the animal skinners running for the hills either. More likely it will be someone out there seeing the video, whos uncle Mort from America happens to own a toy company that buys millions worth of toys made with this stuff from the Chinese, and because his little neice calls him in tears after seeing it, he cancels his orders or even better, demands they stop what they are doing. Then you would have a chance to stop it. 
Companies like Microsoft have gone into China and demanded better conditions for the workers in their suppliers factories, or made them operate in a more enviromentaly friendly way or whatever, even though it has raised their costs and eventually made their products more expensive. 
The chinese government rely upon censorship to control the people, they know just what the government want them to know, and the internet is a big threat to them because people are learning stuff never before possible. The internet over there is censored but not real well, I think its just too big now to stop it all. So seeing stuff like that video, whilst it is hard to watch, is important so that change can occur.
Respect, Steve.


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## shiregirl (Sep 21, 2008)

Yes, it's cruel, yes it's barbaric, but have we looked in our own backyard first?
Australia has one of the highest extinction rates in the world. Granted we might not kill them the ways depicted in the video, but we are still killing them and they don't neccesarly die and quick death either.A life is a life.

Interesting to see that some of the people that posted in this thread saying how cruel it is offered some pretty cruel suggestions for killing cane toads in another thread.

(not having a dig at anyone, just thinking out loud.  )


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## Carpetcleaner (Sep 21, 2008)

There was more than enough warning saying NOT to watch the video. I didn't watch it but I did sign the petition and I then forwarded the link on to everyone I know to sign the petition a well. I sent it to friends in Melbourne, Adelaide, Northern Territory just about everyone I know. I can only hope that something is done. One day.
If this isn't the public forum to distribute information like this, then where exactly is?
It is confronting.
It is gruesome.
It isn't going to change unless many many people take a stand.
Thank you Nat.


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## cooper123 (Sep 21, 2008)

i think this is a good place to post it. 
Do all of you care about animals 
even tho the video is of a dog or somthing (i dident watch it) any1 ever seen a snake skin walet???


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## Carpetcleaner (Sep 21, 2008)

well said cooper123, I was waiting for that one.


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 21, 2008)

My sister got a pair of snake skin shoes and i was horrified! - angry and spent many hours telling her how wrong it was, she now will never buy anything like that again!, so many people are ignorant to what is happening(in Australia as well as other countries). I wish it could all be fixed quick and simple but the reality is that it may never change and things may infact get worse but like I have said all along one small thing is better than putting it in the too hard basket - getting an RSPCA animal rather than buying one - buying free range eggs - getting australian made and owned products - rescuing at least one animal a year(more if your able) - donations to welfare organisations - and one of the biggest I can think of is try to change the oppinion of at least 1 person a week on animals(snake haters etc).


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## Super (Sep 21, 2008)

The Type A personality can be hard to endure. They are often impatient, hostile, aggressive, constantly worrying about time, workaholics, perfectionists, demanding button pushers. They tend to thrive off of stress and are driven to set deadlines for themselves. 

It has been said by psychologists that Type A personalities often suffer from low self-esteem which is considered to be the root of the problem. 

Type A personalities being the button pushers that they are, tend to feel as if other people are against them. They feel an overwhelming desire to defend whatever it is that needs defending. 

Because Type A personalities need things to be done a certain way they are very good at paying close attention to detail. They are often able to spot what they perceive to be as a weakness and use that to their full advantage. They know exactly what part of a person to pick at until they achieve browbeating someone into submission. 

The Type A personality will use a variety of techniques to push your buttons. Here's how you can tell if you are a button pusher. 

*Use Sarcasm.* Do you find you that when you need to get your point across to someone who isn't convinced of what you are saying, your tone of voice drips with sarcasm so the other person feels as if they are wrong or their opinion isn't worthwhile? If so then you could very well be someone who likes to push buttons. 

*Taunting Others.* Are you someone who feels the need to taunt others into debating with you on silly, pretentious, petty topics? Do you feel you have nothing to say unless it's about something other people are offended by? Taunting or goading others into an argument is a sure sign of being a Type A button pusher.

I can spot several in this thread.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Sep 21, 2008)

Eh anyway, 
I watched the vid and it is the same one that has been doing the rounds for 
a while now.
Signed the petition to, for what its worth.
The animals being tortured are not dogs but some sort of racoon like animal.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raccoon_Dog
check the link
Looks like your a type A then super huh..


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## Divan (Sep 21, 2008)

I recon this is REALY WRONG and the people who do this diserves the death scentence, Or they should be skinned alive


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## Carpetcleaner (Sep 21, 2008)

*I also found this on Wikipedia relating to the "raccoon dogs". Cats/Dogs/Raccoon Dogs, Snakes/Lizards....it wouldn't matter what the animal, it is still horrifying. I will never even buy "faux fur" ever again on my childrens clothing no matter how fashionable!!!!!*

*Use for fur*

An investigation by three animal protection groups into the Chinese fur trade in 2004 and part of 2005 asserts that approximately 1.5 million raccoon dogs are being raised for fur in China.[8] The Raccoon Dog comprises 11% of all animals hunted in Japan.[9] Twenty percent of domestically produced fur in Russia is from the Raccoon Dog.[10]
In late 2006, MSNBC reported that Macy's had pulled from its shelves and its Web site two styles of Sean John hooded jackets, originally advertised as featuring faux fur, after an investigation by the nation's largest animal protection organization concluded that the garments were actually made from raccoon dog.[11] Combs said he had been unaware of the material, but as soon as he knew about it, he had his clothing line stop using the material.
On April 24, 2008, The Humane Society of the United States (HSUS) filed a false advertising complaint with the US Federal Trade Commission alleging that at least 20 retailers in the US have been mislabeling Raccoon Dog fur. According to HSUS, 70% of fur garments they tested were Raccoon Dog but were mislabeled as faux fur, coyote, rabbit or other animals.[12]


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## $NaKe PiMp (Sep 21, 2008)

damn thats vids nasty,they really go out of there way to make sure those critters suffer


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## nikay11 (Sep 21, 2008)

Being that we are omnivores I don't mind that we kill animals....but being that we have the technology/ability to kill them quickly (as opposed to the days years ago when for the big game spear them twenty times until they die. Excluding the instances where it would be an instant kill...) why not? I know that here in the US and eveywhere in the world this happens where we choose not to kill quickly but our point is coming across, such as the air compressed bullets to the head. It instantly kills and its air no waste of bullets(so its cheaper for all of those slaughter house people who say its to expensive to kill humanely) Anyway I will watch out for fur and not buy it if its from china or anywhere really, was never a fur wearer.....Anyway we can't get rid of all the bad stuff in our backyards no matter how hard you try. It goes for everything murder drugs stealing. But the point is that its illegal and you can get in big trouble for it. If we can get that across to china then thats all we can hope for. We are by far an imperfect species. So yes our backyards will always need cleaning but chinas backyard needs a team of landscapers!! (its never been touched)


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 21, 2008)

Super said:


> The Type A personality can be hard to endure. They are often impatient, hostile, aggressive, constantly worrying about time, workaholics, perfectionists, demanding button pushers. They tend to thrive off of stress and are driven to set deadlines for themselves.
> 
> It has been said by psychologists that Type A personalities often suffer from low self-esteem which is considered to be the root of the problem.
> 
> ...


 
I think that describes nearly all of human kind! very insitive and a good think for us all - it would explain why the world always runs on a scedual
Just remember people who live in glass houses should never throw stones
Thanks for the insite


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## Glidergirl (Sep 21, 2008)

I cant get that horrid image out of my head, it has to be one of the worst I have seen.


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## BlindSnake (Sep 21, 2008)

Glidergirl said:


> I cant get that horrid image out of my head, it has to be one of the worst I have seen.


 
That's why im not watching it Rach.
I end up thinking about it for ages.


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## Gecko :) (Sep 21, 2008)

I dont know what to say,..!

I couldnt watch all of the video, but what I watched I will never forget!!.
I watched a little bit of the clip earlier today and have not been able to get the images out of my head ever since. the worst I have ever seen! 
Those poor innocent animals!, . :cry:
I am shocked that this treatment is allowed,. what is wrong with some people!!!???

I am disgusted! & scarred for life!:shock:

I mean I obviously knew fur was used for clothes & accessories etc which is bad enough, but I had no idea that was how it was done!,. it needs to be stopped,. but unfortunately it never will.

I Never have & never ever will own anything made from any dead animal!!! 

if you are tossing up on watching the video but cant decide, I dont recommend watching it, I cried before I even watched it just from looking at the front page , so I dont know why I bothered watching it,. I havnt cried for a while, but even the thought of it makes me feel like tearing up again.

Obviously I have signed the petition , & I have searched for this on good old facebook & joined the group & sent it to my facebook friends,.. not that it will prob stop this crap from happening, but it is worth a try..

TOTAL HEARTLESS SCUM OF THE EARTH:evil::evil:!.. thats all I can say without earninng myself another suspension !!


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## stripe (Sep 21, 2008)

think i saw the video a while back, not going to see if it's the same one.. couldn't watch the whole thing, it was THE WORST thing i had seen. 
don't understand people.
signed.


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## chloethepython (Sep 21, 2008)

thats disgusting, how can people do that to an animal?


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## bnalbino (Sep 22, 2008)

thanks nat i signed it thats just sick


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## Dipcdame (Sep 22, 2008)

jessb said:


> You're not serious are you? This bit _is_ a joke right? :?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ummmmm...... even if they are killing for food (which they are NOt IN THIS CASE), there is no need to use torture to do it.


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## cris (Sep 22, 2008)

chloethepython said:


> thats disgusting, how can people do that to an animal?



They have differant ethical and cultural backgrounds and are desensitised to it, i doubt they see it as wrong, its a bit like catch and release fishing or cruel methods of slaughter allowed under native title and other exemptions for cultural reasons in Australia.


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## Gecko :) (Sep 23, 2008)

Dipcdame said:


> Ummmmm...... even if they are killing for food (which they are NOt IN THIS CASE), there is no need to use torture to do it.



I agree,. 
JessB, I definately dont agree with your post.
Unless I have misread it?,. but I dont think so,.
Are you saying it is ok?


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## Tatelina (Sep 23, 2008)

willia6 said:


> DO NOT WATCH THE VIDEO, WHATEVER YOU DO DO NOT WATCH THE VIDEO.


Yuck. 

Yuck.

Yuck.


I couldn't watch it.


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## jessb (Sep 23, 2008)

Gecko :) said:


> I agree,.
> JessB, I definately dont agree with your post.
> Unless I have misread it?,. but I dont think so,.
> Are you saying it is ok?


 
Gecko, you obviously _have_ misread my post pretty fundamentally. I state quite clearly that this is a horrific thing to do, and by our Western standards it is completely unacceptable.

But I get the feeling that most people who come out with a blanket statement to the effect "this is unequivocally wrong and anyone who does this is barbaric and uncivilised" is pretty narrow minded, and I would guess have never been to a developing country and seen the living conditions of most of the world's population.

I think we need to accept that we have been brought up in a nation where a certain degree of cruelty to animals is unacceptable. However as I pointed out in another post, many Buddhists would think we were barbaric for slaughtering animals to eat, and many PETA advocates would think we were terrible for keeping animals as pets. Hell, most Chinese would think we were inhuman for putting our elderly in nursing homes! It all comes down to what we are brought up with. We can't claim to be unarguably "right" - we need to accept that what we do is right for _us_, within _our_ cultural upbringing and social system. I don't believe that it is constructive to impose our belief system on a nation that has a culture so different that we can't even compare it. 

Sure, sign a petition and use economic protests to discourage groups from doing things you disagree with - that's what democracy is all about. But don't make statements like "how can these barbaric, cruel Chinese do this?" it is divisive, unhelpful and assumes that we have a moral right to dictate to the rest of the world how things should be done.

And I think the claim that we should stop eating at Chinese restaurants to teach these heathens a lesson is pretty comical really...


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## Chris1 (Sep 23, 2008)

i got about 2 seconds into the video and decided i already hate people enough,..

after reading other people comments i'm really grateful i havent watched it,...



signed it, people make me sick.


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## Chris1 (Sep 23, 2008)

why the hell cant they kill hte poor critters first, i really hope they get it all back,...!!

i managed about 10 seconds that time, i feel sick.


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## Emzie (Sep 23, 2008)

i signed it, wish i read the thread first cause i whatched the movie  got about 5 secs had to turn it off otherwise ild be crying all over my desk


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## Dipcdame (Sep 23, 2008)

jessb said:


> I don't believe that it is constructive to impose our belief system on a nation that has a culture so different that we can't even compare it.
> 
> Sure, sign a petition and use economic protests to discourage groups from doing things you disagree with - that's what democracy is all about. But don't make statements like "how can these barbaric, cruel Chinese do this?" it is divisive, unhelpful and assumes that we have a moral right to dictate to the rest of the world how things should be done.
> 
> And I think the claim that we should stop eating at Chinese restaurants to teach these heathens a lesson is pretty comical really...



Jess B, you are obviously out of touch with animals....... how can you see, or be aware that animals are suffering, hideously so, and not want to do anything about it. Sure, it's not right to dictate to others how they should live, but it's certainly not right to put ANYTHING living through such an ordeal and decide that's how they should die. At least kill the poor thing humanely first. (no, still not seen the vidoe, but going on what others have said)


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## jessb (Sep 23, 2008)

Dipcdame said:


> Jess B, you are obviously out of touch with animals....... how can you see, or be aware that animals are suffering, hideously so, and not want to do anything about it. Sure, it's not right to dictate to others how they should live, but it's certainly not right to put ANYTHING living through such an ordeal and decide that's how they should die. At least kill the poor thing humanely first. (no, still not seen the vidoe, but going on what others have said)


 
You have missed my point completely.


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## nikay11 (Sep 24, 2008)

Whether you are in a developed or developing with poor living conditions doesn't mean they are justified in the way the animals are treated. living conditions and morals/ethics/and the ability to use a brain doesn't go hand in hand. Cultures are different but doesn't mean they can't change or we have no right to. We should be looking out for the ones that are below us on the food chain.(which is everything) We have laws Australia has laws but they didn't use to be there, meaning we can change as a culture which is what our protesting is hoping will do. Whether it takes the whole world to do it or not.


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## Chris1 (Sep 24, 2008)

did anyone manage to watch teh video? i wanted to know if that poor animal was killed or just thrown skinless onto a pile to die,..?

the 10 seconds i managed to watch ran thru my head every time i woke up last night,..so i cant find that out fro myself.

i do remember reading an article on skinning live snakes a while ago, they use a hose to fill them with water, (stretch them) , pull the skin off then just throw the skin less snake on a pile which takes around 48 hours to die,..

i cant get my head around how anyone can do that to an animal, i found myself praying (not that i'm religious, maybe i should join a church) fro natural disasters to wipe out the whole of china last night, and any other country that feels this is an acceptable practice,...


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## jasontini (Sep 24, 2008)

..not me... im gona have nitemares....


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 24, 2008)

it is left to die to much effort to kill it when you have another couple of hundered to do before home time!


Chris1 said:


> did anyone manage to watch teh video? i wanted to know if that poor animal was killed or just thrown skinless onto a pile to die,..?
> 
> the 10 seconds i managed to watch ran thru my head every time i woke up last night,..so i cant find that out fro myself.
> 
> ...


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## tommygun295 (Sep 24, 2008)

i watched the video +o( ( means sick)

i dnt think i want that experience eva again


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 24, 2008)

jessb said:


> You have missed my point completely.


 
I dont think she did, you are saying that we should not get in to their business as they are raised different to us!, and that we have no right to dictate to them how to live so in saying that you are infact justifiying it. A heroin addicts child is raised with herrioin - so we dont tell them its bad?, a sons father kills his mum - we dont tell him its not good to follow in his dads footsteps?. Every country has different cultures we all know that, but in my oppinion it is BARBARIC to kill like that and it is UNCIVILISED to not want to better your self and strive for more!. 
It is you oppionion and this thread is not of the same so pleases just dont come here, just allow others to gain an oppinion for them selves. 
It take a great person to care for things that are beneath him! it take a weak person to watch on.


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## bundy_zigg (Sep 24, 2008)

nikay11 said:


> Whether you are in a developed or developing with poor living conditions doesn't mean they are justified in the way the animals are treated. living conditions and morals/ethics/and the ability to use a brain doesn't go hand in hand. Cultures are different but doesn't mean they can't change or we have no right to. We should be looking out for the ones that are below us on the food chain.(which is everything) We have laws Australia has laws but they didn't use to be there, meaning we can change as a culture which is what our protesting is hoping will do. Whether it takes the whole world to do it or not.


 
spot on!!!!!
Aztecs use to rip out virgins hearts as a sacrefice to their gods - should we allow this to still happen?
it has not just been animals, we have been even crueler to our selves and still are - some parts of africa women are still captured and used as sex slaves - you know what im not going to get started or my post will be endless!!


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## Chris1 (Sep 24, 2008)

surely cutting its jugular of stabbing it in the heart wouldnt take too much time.

damn i wish i didnt know that, i hate humanity more than ever now. 

but thanks for the answer,...


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## Jackrabbit (Sep 24, 2008)

I couldn't watch once I saw what the petition was for.

Some time ago someone posted a video of an animal being skinned alive that I did watch and and I cried. It disturbed me fro the rest of the day. Now I am crying just thinking about might be on that website and the animals that have been killed in this way.


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## Dipcdame (Sep 25, 2008)

Jackrabbit said:


> I couldn't watch once I saw what the petition was for.
> 
> Some time ago someone posted a video of an animal being skinned alive that I did watch and and I cried. It disturbed me fro the rest of the day. Now I am crying just thinking about might be on that website and the animals that have been killed in this way.



Jackrabbit, it is the very same video, the link leads to the animalsaviors site, where there is a separate link to the petition to sign. (look along the black bar to the top of the screen, one of the tabs there is to go straight to the petition).
If this affected you so strongly, I urge you to please sign the petition, the more that sign, the more we show how unacceptable their activity is.


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## Vat69 (Sep 25, 2008)

Just remember kids: http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/petition/internet.asp


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## Ian83 (Sep 25, 2008)

i'm not against fur products ,i would buy fur products but the least the fur industry can do is make sure the animals are killed humanly or of natral causes there is just no need for such barbaric ways such as in that video i have watched some pretty nasty things and that video had me turning away at scenes after watching that video i was proud to sign there petition if my name helps in same way to end this barbaric practise then i have acheived something to be proud of in my life, come on china wake up and take a good look at your self and see what everyone else sees,think of somethink other than your wallet !


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## christo (Oct 6, 2008)

mrmikk said:


> OK, your criticise my propostition to this problem, now give me a valid and effective alternative. Criticism means nothing without a valid alternative or suggestion. Anyone can criticise.



Well firstly, your stand is pointless because you are refusing to eat at an establishment due to the race/ethnicity of the owners. That will do nothing as they are not the people who are skinning dogs alive and you are therefore not changing or effectively working against the practice/s you are concerned about. The ethnic Chinese owning and working in food establishments in Australia are not in any way responsible for the practices you condemn. 

An effective and valid alternative would be to write a letter to the Chinese government (citing actual practices that you can confirm are taking place in China) registering your disgust and maybe telling them that you refuse to visit China if you feel that strongly about it.

Criticism without offering alternatives is valid when you are pointing out the flaw in a viewpoint. Do you mean to say that saying something like "Hitler was evil and misguided" is not valid because no alternatives to his actions are offered? My point was simply don't blame Australian Chinese for what is happening in China - they are Australian like you (I assume) and I, and as such are no more responsible for what China does than you or I.


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## Gavin (Oct 6, 2008)

WHOA THE VIDEO WAS **ked UP!!! bloody hel sign the petition right now -___-


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## ClareB (Oct 6, 2008)

I signed it and took everyones advice and did not watch the video.


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## mrmikk (Oct 19, 2008)

jessb said:


> And your last comment is disgusting, ignorant, racist and offensive. It reflects far more on you than on the culture you are insulting.


 
What are you talking about? Ignorant, racist and offensive? I think you're a touch sensitive!


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## zimbo (Oct 19, 2008)

*** thats really wrong and makes me so angry:evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil:
i mean if they want to skin them kill the poor animal first you sick people:cry:


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## SCam (Oct 19, 2008)

i could say alot of thing but thts wat got me in a little trouble last time but this is not fare and something REALLY REALLY NEEDS TO BE DONE BOUT THIS!!! sign the petition!!! for the animals sake:cry::cry::cry:


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## xScarlettex (Oct 19, 2008)

signed =)


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## Lukey47 (Oct 19, 2008)

SIGNED
those guys should be stabbed multiple times n beaten over head to see how it feels, sick bastards


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## Mick87 (Nov 20, 2008)

JEEEEESSSUSS CHRISTTTTT !!!! 

my oldies tan goat ,dingo hides and the odd fox (killed with a 223) but the way thoes guys are doing it is bullshit poor little buggers.
nothing should have to go through that weather its for food or fur


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