# Fake Rock Background V2



## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 7, 2013)

Last few days i have been building a test rock wall just for aesthetics ( texture color detail etc ). I basically threw together some polystyrene and a few ledges, each with different support sides on them to test for strength. Here is a mid progress picture of it ( added sand, different paint and sealed but scuffed the shine since this pic ).


Anyways here is my real project ( keep in mind I already know it is not going to be anywhere near Universal Rock standard haha )

1) I got cut my base piece to fit snugly in the enclosure ( 89 cm x 89 cm ) for a new gilleni enclosure.




2)I then proceeded to cut up pieces of foam which I grabbed for free from the industrial site in the next suburb ( I got mine off insulation workers, they are off cuts ) and glued some pieces down using liquid nails




Glued some together as well for more depth




I have finished gluing down all foam and will take a photo as soon as the sun goes down.

To be continued....


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 7, 2013)

3) Bought a $3 craft knife set from home depot and will begin carving once Liquid Nails are 100% dried


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## Dutchy88 (Feb 7, 2013)

It's gunna look good mate can already tell


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## justin91 (Feb 7, 2013)

Thats going to look amazing


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 7, 2013)

Well didn't carve as much because I realize it's best to do more carving into the render itself as you lose most detail. View attachment 280970


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## J-A-X (Feb 7, 2013)

Looking like the beginnings of some awesome work ! Just make sure you don't end up with the crevices being so narrow that you can't get in to clean it..
Here's another couple of tips:
Before the render cures totally run a stiff brush along the front edge of the ledges to simulate the natural lines you would see, a cheap hair comb works if you want a bit deeper lines but don't push too hard- drag rather than dig in.

When scuffing: do it in the direction of the ledge. That way any scratches will follow the natural lines you would see in the rock.
Don't scuff the top of the ledges. Only scuff what the eye will see (Cleaning will be easier.)


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 7, 2013)

JaxRtfm said:


> Looking like the beginnings of some awesome work ! Just make sure you don't end up with the crevices being so narrow that you can't get in to clean it..
> Here's another couple of tips:
> Before the render cures totally run a stiff brush along the front edge of the ledges to simulate the natural lines you would see, a cheap hair comb works if you want a bit deeper lines but don't push too hard- drag rather than dig in.
> 
> ...



Thanks will take some of these tips to the project, ( the one I can as I just did first coat of render haha ).


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 7, 2013)

4) Applied first coat of Dunlop acrylic render ( bunnings ) in a very soupy form to get all nooks and crannies. Here is a picture of it just after finishing last section ( I found a few patches after ). I find that I just splodge it on thicker in some places for better effect.

View attachment 280976


View attachment 280977


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## J-A-X (Feb 7, 2013)

Monitor_Keeper said:


> Thanks will take some of these tips to the project, ( the one I can as I just did first coat of render haha ).



Do the brush/comb on the last layer of render, then paint then seal


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## Pilbarensis (Feb 7, 2013)

Looking good mate, can't to see some gilleni playing around on it.


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 7, 2013)

JaxRtfm said:


> Do the brush/comb on the last layer of render, then paint then seal



Yeah will do, i am going to do heaps of layers, so then at the end I can grind into parts and make them more rounded.


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## justin91 (Feb 7, 2013)

Monitor_Keeper said:


> 4) Applied first coat of Dunlop acrylic render ( bunnings ) in a very soupy form to get all nooks and crannies. Here is a picture of it just after finishing last section ( I found a few patches after ). I find that I just splodge it on thicker in some places for better effect.
> View attachment 280976
> 
> 
> View attachment 280977



I got some of that render today, how thick did you make it? I did my first coat and I think I might need to go thicker. Went about 2 cups render - 1/3 cup concrete coloring - 1/2 cup water. Covered quiet a lot of surface. My backgrounds rather small though. I'm doing a desert theme (obvious from the photo lol..) I take the trees out when I render, just wanted to make the holes and see what it look like.

Also, Jax might be able to answer this, maybe not, but I'm doing this enclosure (top of my TV cabinet, bottom half is for a spotted python) for a bearded dragon. It'll only be a baby one but just wondering, (actually, not even sure if I can keep a snake and lizard on top of each other....) how many coats of render do you reckon I'd need to do to stop it ripping it apart with its claws when it decides to climb it..?


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## J-A-X (Feb 7, 2013)

Not trying to sound rude Justin but can you start a separate thread if you haven't already  I think it's kinda cool that we keep one enclosure per thread, 

not know anything about lizards I'd say the more layers the better. Don't go super thick all at once, it takes forever to dry. First layer is reasonably thin so it fills in all the little gaps. Each layer gets a little thicker in texture, not igreatly thicker in depth. I do 3 layers for snakes. First bucket of render is like thickened cream, the last like mud pies. The one in the middle is somewhere around the soft serve ice cream texture. 

Maybe do two soft serve layers and two mud pie layers for the lizard.... Someone with lizards that has done one of these walls is probably better to advise what works. 

I can stress enough the importance of letting each layer thoroughly dry ( naturally, not with a heat gun) you run the risk of damp render which isn't as strong, so if you move it too soon it will fracture.

by the way. In my first layer, I mix water and pva glue (about 50/50) , then the render (and oxide in the last coat). The pva helps "stick" the render to the foam. 

Sealer goes on LAST. I've seen some put the sealer on the foam..... No benefit, foam won't absorb fluids, render will! 
Anyone care to explain the smell from urine soaked render after a few years ? 

Hope that answers some of your questions.... 
Now go and start a new thread (I've got plans for all these threads ! )


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## justin91 (Feb 7, 2013)

JaxRtfm said:


> Not trying to sound rude Justin but can you start a separate thread if you haven't already  I think it's kinda cool that we keep one enclosure per thread,
> 
> not know anything about lizards I'd say the more layers the better. Don't go super thick all at once, it takes forever to dry. First layer is reasonably thin so it fills in all the little gaps. Each layer gets a little thicker in texture, not igreatly thicker in depth. I do 3 layers for snakes. First bucket of render is like thickened cream, the last like mud pies. The one in the middle is somewhere around the soft serve ice cream texture.
> 
> ...



Oh, sorry, didn't think to start a new thread as was a bit relevant to this one but all good, I'll go start one on the weekend after I'm done rendering.

But yeah, you answered all my questions and omg, I forgot to put the PVA glue in my render mix. Damn it. =/


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 7, 2013)

I didn't either, I do not think it makes too much of a difference ( I hope ).


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## Gruni (Feb 7, 2013)

+1... :lol:


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 10, 2013)

Well I added a few more layers of grout and realized I was not liking the uniformity and evenness of the polystyrene blocks down the bottom so decided to add some more realness to it using expanda foam. I then rendered it more and looks 10 x better to it is getting there, I will grab some updated pictures tonight but here is a few of the steps.View attachment 281369

View attachment 281370
View attachment 281371


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 10, 2013)

Ok well fully rendered again ( so many different layers of it now haha ), I may go over it in one light full coat of antique white non sanded grout just go painting and better carving but we shall see. Here is some pictures as of tonight.

View attachment 281421
View attachment 281422
View attachment 281423
View attachment 281424


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## dragonlover1 (Feb 10, 2013)

while I like all these DYI threads I think most people miss the point that dragons have big claws and will rip these things to shreds very quickly and leave bits of foam everywhere which could lead to impaction.They would definitely be fine for snakes who have no claws but it should be pointed out for lizard lovers they are no no's


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## Gruni (Feb 10, 2013)

Looks heaps better now. Nice last minute remodel. 

Dragonlover, a lot of the DIY walls (most if I'm not mistaken) are for use with snakes, even so the whole point of using the layers of render as I understand it is to stop them ripping through the background. It's not as if they are using straight styrene. They should also be suitable for geckos and some other varieties of lizard. Are you basing your post on personal experience of impaction due to backgrounds falling apart?


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## justin91 (Feb 10, 2013)

I agree with gruni. I just finished my rock wall which will house a bearded dragon. That dragon won't be tearing apart anything anytime soon. Got plenty of layers of render in it. I got a mate who bought a second hand tank with a rock wall in it that by looks of it was either painted red or has a very thin layer of render in it and his bearded hasn't torn it apart. 

Back OP, your wall is coming along good. Gonna look amazing


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## J-A-X (Feb 10, 2013)

Looking great MK.

There are no design rules with these walls, if it feels right go for it 

@dragon lover, you've had your answer, and if you check a few of the threads that mention the larger lizards, there is normally mention made that the render should consist of several more lavers than for a snake. Once render is fully cured its as hard as concrete and will be of benefit to lizards by helping keep their nails trim !


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## Gruni (Feb 11, 2013)

Thanks Jax I was careful about my post as I have no _personal_ experience with lizards on these backgrounds although I was fairly sure some dragon owners had them. Good point about the nature of the render's tensile strength once cured and the abrassive effect it will have, it's also one of the benefits for snakes and I guess lizards as it assists them to shed.


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## J-A-X (Feb 11, 2013)

monitors can be the exception. The larger ones should have access to real rocks. Or a background with as much render as you can throw at it an still have your enclosure cope with the weight! 
Most large monitors appear to be kept in outdoor pits, probably with good reason !


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 12, 2013)

Ok guys here it is just before sculpting in some detail / painting procedure, thought I would do a vid to capture how much the depth in it varies.


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## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 12, 2013)

[video=youtube;E_5aGpxY5tM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_5aGpxY5tM[/video]

View attachment 281662


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## Gruni (Feb 12, 2013)

Looking great buddy.


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## oOLaurenOo (Feb 12, 2013)

I made four fake rock walls for my beardies and ridge tailed monitors. As stated above, a couple of extra layers of grout has it hard as a rock. I accidentally dropped a hammer onto mine from a bit over waist height and it didn't leave a mark... Much to my relief! I have had no problems what so ever. They climb all over the walls and it hasn't even scratched the pondtite. Now I am making a submersible one for turtles..... don't even get me started on that disaster!! lol. Good job it is looking fantastic!!! We need a ton more pictures! Can't wait to see it when its finished.


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## BD1B2G (Feb 17, 2013)

it looks really good


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## BDkeeper (Jul 19, 2013)

oOLaurenOo said:


> I made four fake rock walls for my beardies and ridge tailed monitors. As stated above, a couple of extra layers of grout has it hard as a rock. I accidentally dropped a hammer onto mine from a bit over waist height and it didn't leave a mark... Much to my relief! I have had no problems what so ever. They climb all over the walls and it hasn't even scratched the pondtite. Now I am making a submersible one for turtles..... don't even get me started on that disaster!! lol. Good job it is looking fantastic!!! We need a ton more pictures! Can't wait to see it when its finished.


How did you make your background for your ridge taileds because im going to start making one for mine (havent got it yet but will soon  ) soon like what did you put on it and what order cause i dont want to make one then find out that they can destroy it with there claws :/


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## Blinky (Jul 19, 2013)

View attachment 293349


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## BDkeeper (Jul 19, 2013)

Blinky said:


> View attachment 293349


Nice love the lacie


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## oOLaurenOo (Jul 19, 2013)

I just carved out the shapes I wanted with styrofoam, then coated it with four or so layers of tile grout. The number of layers will depend on how thick you make it up. Knock on the wall once it's dry if it feels solid and sounds solid then your on the right track. Just make sure you wait until each layer is dry before you put in the next layer. Paint what ever Colour you want and seal with several layers of pondtite.


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## BDkeeper (Jul 19, 2013)

oOLaurenOo said:


> I just carved out the shapes I wanted with styrofoam, then coated it with four or so layers of tile grout. The number of layers will depend on how thick you make it up. Knock on the wall once it's dry if it feels solid and sounds solid then your on the right track. Just make sure you wait until each layer is dry before you put in the next layer. Paint what ever Colour you want and seal with several layers of pondtite. ������


Thankyou thankful thank you thank you Seriously I couldn't thank you enough I was so confused on how to do it but now I'm not aha you saved me a lot of $$$ But I do have one more question. Did you liquid nail youre styrofoam onto some thin wood or did you do it in the tank?


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## Rogue5861 (Jul 19, 2013)

BDkeeper said:


> Thankyou thankful thank you thank you Seriously I couldn't thank you enough I was so confused on how to do it but now I'm not aha you saved me a lot of $$$ But I do have one more question. Did you liquid nail youre styrofoam onto some thin wood or did you do it in the tank?



I back my backgrounds onto sheets on foam, then ones it is all done silicone around edges of the background to hold it to the enclosure (can easily remove from enclosure if need be then). I used a full 20kg bag of render for my 1200x700 background, its well an truely not gonna get damaged by my ridge tailed monitors.


Rick


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## oOLaurenOo (Jul 19, 2013)

The first wall I made I put it together outside the enclosure, but it was a pain to get in and the edges didn't look as neat as I wanted. After that I just lay the enclosure on its back, siliconed the foam straight into the enclosure. When I was happy I applied the grout in the enclosure. I think it left a better finish and when it dried... it wasnt going anywhere. You would need a jack hammer to get that baby out. Downside, because its so big it now weighs a TON. Its on wheels (thank god) but trying to get it up the three stairs into the house was interesting. I would hate to have had to get it up a flight of stairs or anything so keep weight in mind if you need to trek it up a million stairs.


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