# Chased by a brown?



## Tassie97 (Oct 21, 2011)

[video]http://www.youtube.com/user/goldcoastsnakeshows#p/u/3/BewoMiw8ZKY[/video]


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## Bel03 (Oct 21, 2011)

Well he sure p***** Mr Snakey off didnt he!


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## Tassie97 (Oct 21, 2011)

haha  i wanna see the pics


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## GeckPhotographer (Oct 21, 2011)

I wanna know how he focuses so quick....


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 21, 2011)

Me to, there might be a money shot in that lot, lol..


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## longqi (Oct 21, 2011)

Its amazing how many stories start
"the xxxx snake chased me"

but none of them finish with
"the xxx snake caught me'


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## RCW74 (Oct 21, 2011)

I think he exhausted the snake!!


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## gandal88 (Oct 21, 2011)

lol i would of laughed so hard if he had of gotten bitten on the leg lol!!!


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## moosenoose (Oct 21, 2011)

Tassie97 said:


> haha  i wanna see the pics



I'd definitely love to see the pics. He's got some serious gear there!


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## Red-Ink (Oct 21, 2011)

Wonder if he was shooting with an ultrawide lens as well... as the video was shot on one? Sure made the snake look bigger and closer (though a couple of times it did look like it got very close).


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## Tassie97 (Oct 21, 2011)

moosenoose said:


> I'd definitely love to see the pics. He's got some serious gear there!


^he put a comment on his channel so hopefully we get some pics 
moose if you could put a link to this thread on his channel maybe he will sign up


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## prettypython (Oct 21, 2011)

gandal88 said:


> lol i would of laughed so hard if he had of gotten bitten on the leg lol!!!



Why??? It then would have added to "the snake chased me" best not to give snakes a worse name than they already have.


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## JS974 (Oct 21, 2011)

This just backs up my thoughts on the gene pool being very thin on the gold coast.


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## Mister_Snakes (Oct 21, 2011)

I'm surprised you get away with doing that given all the laws involving wildlife and interfering with it. . Don't get me wrong I'd love to see the pics too!


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## Tassie97 (Oct 21, 2011)

he is a reptile relocator...
its kinda what he does
im on tonys side he is just risking his life to promote reptiles one of those pics may make someone interested in reptiles.


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## chilli-mudcrab (Oct 21, 2011)

I had metre long EB on the driveway today ,3rd I've seen in two days, just stomped my feet and it took off into the paddock didn't look like chasing me


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## BurtonReptiles (Oct 21, 2011)

that crazy


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## Tassie97 (Oct 21, 2011)

haha i was joking about the chasing cause you hear all the time that the person was "chased"by a snake this one is just a bit cranky lol


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## Elapidae1 (Oct 21, 2011)

In my opinion the snake did chase him, even if only briefly.
The thing to keep in mind is this one was warm and agitated before it left the bag and then continually harrased once out of the bag despite repeated attempts to warn the photographer of.
I think most chase stories are perpetuated by people to frightened to actually turn around and see if the snake is still actually behind them, then when they are 500m away turn around only to allow their imagination and fear trick them into believing they were chased. The snake isn't the only animal with instinctual defence mechanisms at work.


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## turtle (Oct 21, 2011)

Very impressive! Must be extremely confident go photograph elapids like that.


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## 69blottfilms69 (Oct 21, 2011)

Subed him
Are Western browns deadly?


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## Elapidae1 (Oct 21, 2011)

69blottfilms69 said:


> Subed him
> Are Western browns deadly?



Yes
But the snake you filmed was a Parasuta.


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## -Peter (Oct 23, 2011)

Snake didn't chase him, he released it in the open without cover then proceeded to take photos. The snake has nowhere to go so it becomes defensive. It eventually backs up to a mound where it feels trapped and by that time is exhausted. 
As to elapidae1's observation about the snake being agitated in the bag it is blatantly wrong as can be seen by how the snake is tipped from the bag and doesn't move straight away.

Its a photo shoot, dont make it more than it is by making subjective assumptions. Tony Harrison seems to be fully on top of the situation and in charge.


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## CamdeJong (Oct 23, 2011)

I agree with Peter. It was entirely self-defense. I've caught plenty of browns, done shoots like that with them and never been 'chased'. What business does an animal 2" tall have chasing a 5 or 6 foot human? On two occasions my boss has had eastern browns whip back towards him, and when he's stood still they've gone straight between his legs and down a hole. The snake wants to escape its predator (you) and when confronted in an open area if it feels it can't escape it will defend itself vigorously in an attempt to scare you off. Not attack. Another thing is the term 'aggressive'. I'm not keen on that word, the snake is not the aggressor. Just ask Metallica, they'll tell you the same thing  I describe browns and taipans as 'volatile' or 'reactive' but never aggressive.


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## Elapidae1 (Oct 23, 2011)

-Peter said:


> Snake didn't chase him, he released it in the open without cover then proceeded to take photos. The snake has nowhere to go so it becomes defensive. It eventually backs up to a mound where it feels trapped and by that time is exhausted.
> As to elapidae1's observation about the snake being agitated in the bag it is blatantly wrong as can be seen by how the snake is tipped from the bag and doesn't move straight away.
> 
> Its a photo shoot, dont make it more than it is by making subjective assumptions. Tony Harrison seems to be fully on top of the situation and in charge.



I agree that my comment regarding the snake being agitated in the bag was wrong, Tony stated that they were hot from being in the car and this is what I was eluding to. Poor choice of word.
I stand by my comment that the snake "chased him, albeit briefly" the word is subjective and the snakes defensive behaviour can still be described as an attempt to chase Tony off.

Saying that He seems to be on top of the situation and in charge could be considered as a little assumptive too. Many might take the fact it managed to chew on his shoe as pushing the boundaries a little to far.

Camdejong I never said it wasn't self defense nor did I say it attacked or was aggressive.

I had 3 people tampering with my car and snooping around my house. Fearfull of them breaking in and or damaging, stealing my property or worse attempting to harm my family I decided to defend us, I grabbed a bat and ran out the house at them yelling, I was **** scared my actions were all bluff but I still managed to chase them off as was my intention, after all what business did I have chasing 3 grown men that were threatening me.

So like I said in my opinion as a defense strategie it did try to chase him if only briefly.


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## SteveNT (Oct 23, 2011)

"Snake didn't chase him, he released it in the open without cover then proceeded to take photos. The snake has nowhere to go so it becomes defensive. It eventually backs up to a mound where it feels trapped and by that time is exhausted."

Agreed but I cant help but think this was more as a photo opportunity than any kind of release I would do. Looks like the sort of self glorifying interference with critters the stingrays tried to end.


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## GeckoJosh (Oct 23, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> deleted



At least he isnt trying to hand feed it meal worms................


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## ianinoz (Oct 23, 2011)

SteveNT said:


> "Snake didn't chase him, he released it in the open without cover then proceeded to take photos. The snake has nowhere to go so it becomes defensive. It eventually backs up to a mound where it feels trapped and by that time is exhausted."
> 
> Agreed but I cant help but think this was more as a photo opportunity than any kind of release I would do. Looks like the sort of self glorifying interference with critters the stingrays tried to end.



I agree, that snake was terrified had only only one option , to attack to try to drive off it's tormentor. Terrorising an animal in order to get some video/photo opportunities is OFF IN A BIG WAY IMO. 

I kinda wish the snake had actually tagged him. 

I've had encounters with brown snakes, even had one crawl across my legs once when I was fishing.
That's as close an encounter as I ever want to have with a brown snake, fortunately it was only curious and was only intent on checking the strange creature who was sitting there (me) and when it took a look it went on it's way, and I could breath again. (Yes I was scared it might bite me,and it might have had I tried to get up and away quickly).

Brown snakes are very beautiful creatures, best admired quietly from a safe distance and best not interferred with. With all that expensive photp gear (he must have spent a fortune to get set up like that) I wonder why he has to capture the snakes, take them to a barren field (away from their territory) where they have no cover and torture them to get photos, when he can get much better images using telephoto lens without the need to interfer with or torture them.



Goldmember said:


> At least he isnt trying to hand feed it meal worms................


No - he isn't, he is tormenting and terrorising those snakes and capturing them and taking to somewhere away from their territory - all in order to make out he is getting natural behaviour for his own ego.
Nor am doing anything to stress the lizards I am interacting with though my befriending them and offering them treats and shelter. They are free to come and go and interact with me ON THEIR OWN TERMS.

If you can't see the difference then that says more about you than it does about me.


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## saratoga (Oct 23, 2011)

The snake had quite a few goes at him but looked pretty tired, even from the start.

As others have said it had nowhere to go, and with a photographer jumping around in front of it of course it feels threatened and is going to try and defend itself.

As for the photos being in focus, I would like to see some of the images, pretty hard for an autofocus camera to work under those conditions. The little gopro video cameras are great cameras as the image is in focus between about 30cms and infinity because they are such wide angles.

Here's one I did a few years ago which is a bit more of a chase....although I think it clearly shows that the snake just wants to go on it's way but will readily defend itself when approached too closely and it feels threatened.

I've yet to see a snake chase someone unprovoked, and even then any "chase" is only over a few metres!!

Don't chase Brown Snakes (Pseudonaja nuchalis) - YouTube


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## richoman_3 (Oct 23, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> deleted



how is he an idiot, did he harm the snake? Hes doing what he likes so good on him, ... 
why dont you do a little bit of research before posting a stupid post like that, EB's are very aggressive snakes, its not like he made it serisouly pissed off.
and also, how else do you think you are supposed to get them in a defensive position which is always the best photo?


i think it was a great video and shows how aggressive they can be, and i cant wait to see the pics!


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## saratoga (Oct 23, 2011)

richoman_3 said:


> EB's are very aggressive snakes,
> i think it was a great video and shows how aggressive they can be, and i cant wait to see the pics!



Aggressive : -ready or likely to attack or confront


If he stepped away from it, it would'nt have a go at him so it's hardly aggressive. Most snakes, browns included disappear before you even see them.....heaven help us if they really were aggressive!


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## GeckPhotographer (Oct 23, 2011)

I agree with Saratoga that the photos most likely will not be in focus there is no way he could be focusing at that speed the best chance is that he sets it to focus at a certain distance and hopes one of the shots is precisely at that distance.


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## BrownHash (Oct 23, 2011)

I'm sure when you've got a lot of movement going on it will be hard to get a good shot. But I reckon there would be a few good ones in there. It sounds like the camera is a Canon 7D which has a pretty good AF Servo mode. 

At the end of the day all you need is one great shot to make it worth while.


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## dihsmaj (Oct 23, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> capturing them and taking to somewhere away from their territory


Kind of his job...


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## longqi (Oct 23, 2011)

richoman_3 said:


> how is he an idiot, did he harm the snake? Hes doing what he likes so good on him, ...
> why dont you do a little bit of research before posting a stupid post like that, EB's are very aggressive snakes, its not like he made it serisouly pissed off.
> and also, how else do you think you are supposed to get them in a defensive position which is always the best photo?
> 
> ...



^^^
Thats the main problem with photographers and so called experts nowadays
They want a shot to show how aggressive and dangerous a not very aggressive animal is
So they handle it and provoke until it defends itself because it cannot escape

That gives them great shots that they would never have been able to take under normal circumstances

Shots of an animal doing its own thing are ok
But shots of a snake attacking??
They sell and reinforce the general publics opinion on the danger of snakes in general
Even if they are stage managed and in complete contrast to the normal behaviour of any species of snake


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## richoman_3 (Oct 23, 2011)

Yeah I know what u mean longqi, it makes people go wow


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## ianinoz (Oct 24, 2011)

Snakeluvver3 said:


> Kind of his job...


I seriously doubt harassing and terrorising the snakes in order to provoke them to attack him in defense in order to get some video and photos to post online is part of his JD. I wonder what the authorities would think of his disgusting behaviour.


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## myusername (Oct 24, 2011)

It's not like it took much for that brown to go at him but, he walked towards it once it was out of the bag and it was on basically. I wouldn't be so quick to criticise Tony, he knows his stuff and has no doubt saved more snakes than the vast majority of us.


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## ianinoz (Oct 24, 2011)

longqi said:


> ^^^
> Thats the main problem with photographers and so called experts nowadays
> They want a shot to show how aggressive and dangerous a not very aggressive animal is
> So they handle it and provoke until it defends itself because it cannot escape
> ...



I agree.

I think there is nothing wrong with getting photos of a snake who doing it's own thing and has not been provoked on purpose. They are beautiful animals who are generally extremely shy and timid and should not be terrorised like that and just enjoyed for what they are (at a safe distance for you and the snake).


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## BigWillieStyles (Oct 24, 2011)

Did anyone else check out the other videos on his channel. Probably wasnt the nicest thing to do chasing down that brown and scaring it to get some photos. Check out this vid of him with two browns and still holding his camera!

goldcoastsnakeshows's Channel - YouTube


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## XKiller (Oct 24, 2011)

What a stupid thing to say, its people like you that rely aggertate me and make me want to avoid any sort of internet fourms frankly no person deserves to be bitten by a elapid, defentley not tony harrisson. do you even know Him? 

And what about outhers that love photography and reptiles esp elapids like me and meny of my friends do we deserve to be bitten as well? For doing what we love? And are passionate about....To find and photograph these Amazing animals... that do get defensive as soon as you approach them and do continually try and bite... Geez at this rate if small minded people like you keep poping up no one will be posting pictures or videos of some of there amazing finds. I'm sure I won't be in the near future if I'm going to be ridiculed just for taking afew photos 
And what if Tony dident catch and realise it, the owner of the property could have just grabed there trusty shovel... Like so meny others, afew photos isn't that bad considering... I have seen some of the photos he took that day rely nice sharp 



ianinoz said:


> deleted


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## KaotikJezta (Oct 24, 2011)

Note to self: Don't write things when your tired and cranky, however true they may be.


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## -Peter (Oct 24, 2011)

I have seen a brown snake chase someone and when it caught them, hid beind their legs.


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## Snake_Whisperer (Oct 24, 2011)

-Peter said:


> Snake didn't chase him, he released it in the open without cover then proceeded to take photos. The snake has nowhere to go so it becomes defensive. It eventually backs up to a mound where it feels trapped and by that time is exhausted.
> As to elapidae1's observation about the snake being agitated in the bag it is blatantly wrong as can be seen by how the snake is tipped from the bag and doesn't move straight away.
> 
> Its a photo shoot, dont make it more than it is by making subjective assumptions. Tony Harrison seems to be fully on top of the situation and in charge.



The voice of cool headed reason as always Peter. Tony is clearly working with some new gear and it requires a run. Think on this mouth-breathers: 6 months down the track, you see a photo of an EB in full defensive pose, big "S", gaping mouth, etc. You say, "aww cool man!". Where the heck do you think these photos come from anyway? If you don't know, then you don't know much about P. textilis. But enough of that. Tony Harrison has and continues to do more for reptile awareness than you keyboard monkeys will, so keeping bashing your keyboards and flinging faeces, it makes a lot of people laugh!



Goldmember said:


> At least he isnt trying to hand feed it meal worms................



I have a feeling I missed something here, but this made me laugh, thanks! :lol:



richoman_3 said:


> how is he an idiot, did he harm the snake? Hes doing what he likes so good on him, ...
> why dont you do a little bit of research before posting a stupid post like that, EB's are very aggressive snakes, its not like he made it serisouly pissed off.
> and also, how else do you think you are supposed to get them in a defensive position which is always the best photo?
> 
> ...



Hey dude, like your attitude. Gonna help you out a bit though. What you see in that video is not an example of "aggressive" behaviour, it is "defensive" behaviour. The difference is in the intent. Brown snakes are extremely "nervous" snakes and tend to want to get the heck out of there when they are spotted/interfered with. In this case, that one had nowhere to go so it was merely trying to defend itself from a potential predator. On a hot day, that defensive behaviour can be quite impressive. An "aggressive" animal would be something like a polar bear. It's is an apex predator with no other animal in its range that can challenge its dominance. As such, if you are out for a walk in the tundra, and a polar bear spots you from 750m away, and it's hungry, it will approach and attack without fear. That is the definition of "aggressive" behaviour. Hope that makes sense! 



KaotikJezta said:


> Edited out because KJ would prefer it this way!  I thought it was funny though!



LOL! Again, I know I've missed something but this sounds like it has a hilarious back story! I enjoy a good chuckle on a Monday morning so thanks!


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## dihsmaj (Oct 24, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> I seriously doubt harassing and terrorising the snakes in order to provoke them to attack him in defense in order to get some video and photos to post online is part of his JD. I wonder what the authorities would think of his disgusting behaviour.


'harassing and terrorising the snakes in order to provoke them to attack him in defense in order to get some video and photos to post online'
You honestly think that's what he's doing? He's not provoking it, he's following it and trying to get photos.



And relocation it is his job -- if he didn't relocate this snake, then the homeowner would just kill it...


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## KaotikJezta (Oct 24, 2011)

Snake_Whisperer said:


> LOL! Again, I know I've missed something but this sounds like it has a hilarious back story! I enjoy a good chuckle on a Monday morning so thanks!



Damn, didn't edit that post quite fast enough, oh well.


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## Red-Ink (Oct 24, 2011)

People need to get over themselves... He did not hurt the animal, sure it got agitated a bit but it ain't no different than any other so called media personality out there. Brady Barr, Austen Steven, Donald Schutlz and the Late Steve Irwin all did/do this. I wonder if the people that think this is so wrong watch their shows and think "ohh cool"...


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## slim6y (Oct 24, 2011)

Red-Ink said:


> Peopel need to get over themselves... He did not hurt the animal, sure it got agitated a bit but it ain't no different than any other so called media personality out there. Brady Barr, Austen Steven, Donald Schutlz and the Late Steve Irwin all did/do this. I wonder if the people that think this is so wrong watch their shows and think "ohh cool"...



I totally agree - it did what it would do naturally whether it was having a photo shoot or defending against a dog or a cat. 

Where do we see the photos? I'm really keen to see more about this equipment and see the outcome.

I have a quick focus macro lens, but even the quick focus wouldn't be quick enough to get a decent macro of that! 

I certainly would love to 'tag' along to see how it's done, but all that experience he has - it was like he was in total control but always seemed to let the snake think it was winning! Great video. No animals were harmed in the making of that photo shoot


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## moosenoose (Oct 24, 2011)

I've asked him via his Youtube account for some pics  The browns sure know how to put on a show!


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## longqi (Oct 24, 2011)

moosenoose said:


> I've asked him via his Youtube account for some pics  The browns sure know how to put on a show!



Brown snakes dont 'put on a show' unless provoked into doing so
There is zero educational use in these shots as 99.99% of people will never see any snake act like that
But there is a great WOW factor

The same snake released into heavy cover would have simply vanished into the undergrowth

But not much WOW in watching that on UTube


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## slim6y (Oct 24, 2011)

Wow factor is education.... That's usually how I rope the students into studying Physics


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## Wally (Oct 24, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> I wonder what the authorities would think of his disgusting behaviour.



Hmmmmm...........


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## snakeluvver (Oct 24, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> I wonder what the authorities would think of his disgusting behaviour.


Well unfortunately authorities dont care at all if someone kills a snake, let alone just annoy it.


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## HoffOff (Oct 24, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> No - he isn't, he is tormenting and terrorising those snakes and capturing them and taking to somewhere away from their territory - all in order to make out he is getting natural behaviour for his own ego.
> Nor am doing anything to stress the lizards I am interacting with though my befriending them and offering them treats and shelter. They are free to come and go and interact with me ON THEIR OWN TERMS.
> 
> If you can't see the difference then that says more about you than it does about me.


AHAHAHA, He's a snake catcher, If he didn't take them away from where they were, they'd probably get a shovel through their head.
I don't see how he's "tormenting" and "terrorising" the snake, he's taking photos, the snakes defensive, and he lets it go.
Go feed your pet EWS some mealworms, bud.


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## FusionMorelia (Oct 24, 2011)

pfft, its not even a big one!
funny though how its ok to annoy the crap outa pythons n dragons to get poses but if ya do it with an elapid 
and your a disgusting monster.....


Nato


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## KaotikJezta (Oct 24, 2011)

Well I did edit my post as I was being nice but after reading various nasty posts by said member on other threads and this one I will say it again. How is it alright to restrain an EWD for a photo op and then try and convince people it wasn't scared and liked being held but this is not alright, hypocrite much . Oh but it was shutting it's eyes when you patted it's head, that is because it was scared not because it was enjoying the interaction. I wonder what the authorities would think of someone deliberately interfering with a lizards natural diet so they can look like some kind of reptile grizzly adams on a forum.


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## richoman_3 (Oct 24, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> Some idiot with a camera who's shoving it in my face continuously and harassing me when all I want to do is be left alone (especially if I'm already upset, stressed, and angry) would be told in no uncertain terms to get [deleted] too, and if this didn't work I'd also resort to physical violence .



you do know that snakes dont know what cameras are, dont you ?


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## Tassie97 (Oct 24, 2011)

you guys geez i just try to show ya some great footage (as are all tonys) and ya go all crazy bout it -.-


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## longqi (Oct 24, 2011)

richoman_3 said:


> you do know that snakes dont know what cameras are, dont you ?



^^^
That is exactly right
[although one of my burmese always poses beautifully when the camera comes out]
But I take it you mean wild snakes?
Same as any wild animal they should never know what a camera is
The camera man should be unobtrusively OBSERVING
Thats all
Look at the great nature documentary makers like David Attenborough
Although there is no doubt he probably did pose a few of the shots that were taken most people would never realise that, and saw animals in their natural habitat doing their natural thing

This new generation of wildlife molesters is exactly that
They torment and molest animals to get a negative reaction from that animal

If they did it to kids they would be in prison
But it makes people who know nothing about the real behaviour of that animal go; "OH WOW" believing that is how these animals act all the time

Years ago someone was hit by a black snake while trying to kill it
60 minutes knew I did a show with a RBB
So they got me to go to the studio for filming
Every single question was directed at how dangerous snakes were
They asked me to get the snake agitated so it would strike
[I had it draped over my shoulders at the time]
Show was never aired because I refused to try to prove that snakes are dangerous by annoying mine and a show proving that snakes are just another part of Australias wonderful wildlife was not good because it had no WOW


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## snakeluvver (Oct 24, 2011)

I much perfer someone chasing a snake with a camera than with a shovel.


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## GeckPhotographer (Oct 24, 2011)

> Look at the great nature documentary makers like David Attenborough
> Although there is no doubt he probably did pose a few of the shots that were taken most people would never realise that, and saw animals in their natural habitat doing their natural thing



They get to see natural behavior which I agree is good, but a lot more is set up than you might realise. You seen Life in Cold Blood? The Pig Nosed Turtle egg dropped into the jar is not the same one that hatches the first one didn't work, the hatching turtles on the bank hatch weeks ago and were reburied, all the hip pocket frog footage is in a small tank apart from a snippet shot in forest 500km south of their range in which you can see a bridge in the backround.


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## dihsmaj (Oct 24, 2011)

Look mate it was already annoyed because it was grabbed, put in a bag and driven for a bit and he's doing what Longqi said, trying to get the "WOW" factor -- also Longqi that 60 minutes story sounds like something they would do!


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## moosenoose (Oct 24, 2011)

longqi said:


> Brown snakes dont 'put on a show' unless provoked into doing so
> There is zero educational use in these shots as 99.99% of people will never see any snake act like that
> But there is a great WOW factor
> 
> ...



Really?? I thought they did that all day long as an expression of their own happiness...fancy that :lol: :lol:


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## CamdeJong (Oct 24, 2011)

Elapidae1 I wasn't referring to your post at all, just adding to Peter's comment in a neutral manner. Richoman did you read my earlier post? Can you make an argument for how any snake is aggressive?


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## moosenoose (Oct 24, 2011)

I really don't see the issue here. 95% of other Aussie males would have puffed the chest out and belted it with a large stick or tossed rocks at it and killed it. Some bloke want to take some snaps of a snake he's obviously rescued form somewhere and we're having a song and dance about it?? Talk about wanting to argue over nothing :lol:


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## notechistiger (Oct 24, 2011)

"Befriend" a lizard and suddenly you're an expert on everything 

Good on you Tony. We need more people like you.


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## longqi (Oct 24, 2011)

Moose
It has zero to do with how great a snake catcher he is

Relocating elapids is great fun and it can be done with minimum stress to the snake on most occasions
No doubt this is how he usually operates and I applaud him for his work 

But to prolong the fear and confusion of any wild animal just to test out some new camera and put it on a web site is pushing the boundaries a bit too far in my opinion


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## $NaKe PiMp (Oct 24, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> deleted




wow the water skink dude thinks his opinion matters !!! how cute

armed with his impressive knowledge and experiance



i find it amazing that people club browns,trap them into a horrific death in birdnetting,run them over,pour boiling water on them,shoot them with shotguns and people are not generally concerned with there welfare whatsover.

Now a bloke who loves snakes takes a few pics of one of his favourite species arcing up,and all the numptys pipe up as if they actually suddenly care for the brown snakes welfare.

Tony is a great snake ambassador and does more than you haters ever could for there welfare,
keep taking pics tony i look forward to seeing them


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## myusername (Oct 24, 2011)

$NaKe PiMp said:


> Tony is a great snake ambassador and does more than you haters ever could for there welfare,
> keep taking pics tony i look forward to seeing them



Agreed!


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## Red-Ink (Oct 24, 2011)

I see people's point about the harassment....
I was having a look around and found other videos of people harrasing snakes and making them take a defensive stance, to the point that the snake can be said to be "attacking".

Here's one I found where an old pommy bloke kept harassing a cobra for the camera to the point were the cobra took a stance and spat venom towards his eyes.... when will this people ever learn hey? And all for what a bit of footage....

LiveLeak.com - Spitting Cobra


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## Snake_Whisperer (Oct 24, 2011)

snakeluvver said:


> Well unfortunately authorities dont care at all if someone kills a snake, let alone just annoy it.



So many instant classics! You're not wrong here, just have a look at the recent thread Jungleman and Jewelz had running and how well the authorities responded to a legitimate and legal situation. I don't think Tony has to put on his Ned Kelly gear just yet!



snakeman112 said:


> AHAHAHA, He's a snake catcher, If he didn't take them away from where they were, they'd probably get a shovel through their head.
> I don't see how he's "tormenting" and "terrorising" the snake, he's taking photos, the snakes defensive, and he lets it go.
> Go feed your pet EWS some mealworms, bud.



LOL! What's with the "mealworms" thing? Is there some unlicenced, unqualified dolt out there interfering with native wildlife? Hate those idiots!



KaotikJezta said:


> Well I did edit my post as I was being nice but after reading various nasty posts by said member on other threads and this one I will say it again. How is it alright to restrain an EWD for a photo op and then try and convince people it wasn't scared and liked being held but this is not alright, hypocrite much . Oh but it was shutting it's eyes when you patted it's head, that is because it was scared not because it was enjoying the interaction. I wonder what the authorities would think of someone deliberately interfering with a lizards natural diet so they can look like some kind of reptile grizzly adams on a forum.



Heh heh, I removed your earlier quote from my post but I didn't want to, it was well worded and hilarious! Thanks for stepping back up to the plate KJ!



snakeluvver said:


> I much perfer someone chasing a snake with a camera than with a shovel.



See, now that is ACTUALLY important! Well put SL.



moosenoose said:


> I really don't see the issue here. 95% of other Aussie males would have puffed the chest out and belted it with a large stick or tossed rocks at it and killed it. Some bloke want to take some snaps of a snake he's obviously rescued form somewhere and we're having a song and dance about it?? Talk about wanting to argue over nothing :lol:



Always a way with words Moose! You are not wrong, I'll also add to it, 90+% of fatalities caused by EB bites are/were to the same morons Moose is talking about. That EB will go on to eat, hide, and mate in peace thanks to Tony. Gawd, some people are just silly.



notechistiger said:


> "Befriend" a lizard and suddenly you're an expert on everything
> 
> Good on you Tony. We need more people like you.



Lol, gotta love the "experts"!



$NaKe PiMp said:


> wow the water skink dude thinks his opinion matters !!! how cute
> 
> armed with his impressive knowledge and experiance
> 
> ...



Last but definitely not least... post of the month goes to the Pimp. Well said mate. Lol, "water skink dude"! I don't know what it means but the title sure is underwhelming!


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## ianinoz (Oct 24, 2011)

Red-Ink said:


> People need to get over themselves... He did not hurt the animal, sure it got agitated a bit but it ain't no different than any other so called media personality out there. Brady Barr, Austen Steven, Donald Schutlz and the Late Steve Irwin all did/do this. I wonder if the people that think this is so wrong watch their shows and think "ohh cool"...



Was never a fan of Steve Irwin for that very reason. Admired his enthusiasm for animals, did not like how he harassed animals into doing things to get "spectacular' or "scary" video clips.

If that offends anyone (since he's now dead) then sorry - get over it.



longqi said:


> Moose
> It has zero to do with how great a snake catcher he is
> 
> Relocating elapids is great fun and it can be done with minimum stress to the snake on most occasions
> ...



I agree .



richoman_3 said:


> you do know that snakes dont know what cameras are, dont you ?


It's the big scary human behind the camera who is harassing them that's the problem.


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## Elapidae1 (Oct 24, 2011)

LOL
This has turned into a rather amusing thread. I'm sure it'll be remembered long after the Snake has forgotten its torment


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## saximus (Oct 24, 2011)

Ian your understanding of the word "troll" is completely wrong. You jus make yourself look foolish when you keep saying it. Having said that I'm addicted to any thread you post in now. They all turn into great entertainment. 

As for the original video I'm a little torn. I love the "wow" pictures that this sort of thing gets but feel bad for the animal. Maybe they forget about it as soon as the "threat" is gone and I shouldn't anthropomorphise so much though. Odds are the guys like Tony who have been in the game so long know much better than I


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## Elapidae1 (Oct 24, 2011)

Yes I believe they have very short memory, I'm sure once the percieved threat has gone and said snake has found comfortable shelter it soon gets over it.

Yes Ianinoz, you are a troll but entertaining


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## longqi (Oct 24, 2011)

I simply cannot understand why so many senior members here support these actions

You are telling all the younger members that it is a great idea to pose; harass; and stage manage nature photos; regardless of the unknown consequences for the animal being photographed; and regardless of the very real danger of encouraging a ven to behave like that


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## $NaKe PiMp (Oct 24, 2011)

another factor of "annoying" a brown snake could be quite a positive one.
From what i have learnt from studying Captive Animal Husbandry is the importance of behavioral enrichment. Now behavioral enrichment is animal husbandry principles that seek to enhance the quality of captive animal care by identifying and providing the environmental stimuli needed for psychological development.
Apart from providing pleasant experiences to the animal, it also involves sometimes providing " predatory responses" such as momentarily scaring the animal by different stimuli,such as simulating the presence of danger that would be present everywhere in the animals natural world,but absent in captivity.
Now Even though this is a wild Eastern brown snake and not in captivity, provoking it for a few pictures surely would not leave it to psychologically dammaged and alot less stressful than other stimuli in its environment of cats,dogs, people with shovels etc.
i cant say for sure, but from my extensive experience of encounters with the Eastern Brown snake i would say they do just fine.
Now i also take into account people with the opposite opinion to this one,usually have 0% experience of being close up with this species.
just sayin...


oh and P.S for all the haters of Steve Irwin and his take on engaging and interacting with wild animals for the camera,he was the most successful wildlife activist the world has ever seen and made more people aware of the environment than any other human being in history,
I applaud his methods and his ability to present to the world our amazing creatures.
what you haters got? yea nothing


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 24, 2011)

Well said Rob


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## MathewB (Oct 24, 2011)

longqi said:


> I simply cannot understand why so many senior members here support these actions
> 
> You are telling all the younger members that it is a great idea to pose; harass; and stage manage nature photos; regardless of the unknown consequences for the animal being photographed; and regardless of the very real danger of encouraging a ven to behave like that



The closest I ever want to be to a brown at the moment is on the end of some binoculars haha


And Ian I'd pack it in, quit while your ahead (so to speak)


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## Elapidae1 (Oct 24, 2011)

longqi said:


> I simply cannot understand why so many senior members here support these actions
> 
> You are telling all the younger members that it is a great idea to pose; harass; and stage manage nature photos; regardless of the unknown consequences for the animal being photographed; and regardless of the very real danger of encouraging a ven to behave like that



Firstly I would like to discourage young and or inexperienced people from interacting with snakes in this manner, however provided that the snake manages to stay away from shovels and cats etc I'm sure it will continue to live a long and fullfilling life with no long term phsycological damage.

Longqi I cannot understand why someone like yourself who has obviously been around the traps for a while still holds onto such anthropomorphistic ideas. 
As for your comments regarding Attenborough he likely has a group of handlers/botherers helping him stage shots. The fact is most herp photographs would be near impossible to obtain without some level of posing/manipulation.


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## Specks (Oct 25, 2011)

ok rightio lets start off by saying you clearly have no i dea whats going on
Tony a good mate of mine captures and relocates snakes as his job. He also does reptile awareness shows for functions events and parties. He does for the love of the animals. Back 15 odd years ago when he moved here he became known as the snakeman around his area and he never intended in being a snakecatcher and ran a fishing charter buisness. after being called to a neighbors house to catch a snake. he now thought " oh wow i could really teach a few people with this and he thought why not start a buisness catching snakes and giving the coast a greater awareness of reptiles and so it started. for the last 15 years or so thats what he has been doing. He works tirelessly and he gets put through hell and back by people like you who think he isnt good enough or is doing the wrong thing. where you say "Presumeably he is paid to capture and remove snakes, quite well judging by the vehicle, how it's kitted up and by the camera gear he is using." thats because he works BLOODY hard to get it, he uses the money he earns and puts it back in his buisness to keep it going and does it for the love of the animals. he loves his photography and uses the great opportunity he has to his advantage. 
Cheers



longqi said:


> I simply cannot understand why so many senior members here support these actions
> 
> You are telling all the younger members that it is a great idea to pose; harass; and stage manage nature photos; regardless of the unknown consequences for the animal being photographed; and regardless of the very real danger of encouraging a ven to behave like that



tony and others like him should be the only people out there photographing these animals, he does it cause he is experinced and knows what he is doing.


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## longqi (Oct 25, 2011)

Just relax for a moment and pretend that it was Bear Grills that posted the link on Utube

Every single one of you would condemn his actions; and rightly so

Its ok to stick up for a mate
But just for once pretend that you did not know the photographer
What would your reaction be then???

I completely understand that shows like Attenboroughs have to be stage managed
But even in the staging he kept everything as natural as possible
Crikey was the greatest ambassador for wildlife in Aus history and was a terrific showman
But his legacy left us with the spin offs who believe that showing an animal up in its worst possible light is the only option available to draw audiences
Armand and Micheala Denis, as a simple example of nature lovers who made many great docos, would cry to watch that video; and neither of them particularly liked reptiles

Maybe my ideals are too old fashioned
Maybe my belief in taking nothing but photos and leaving only footprints is also too old fashioned

Maybe I will never change those ideals


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## notechistiger (Oct 25, 2011)

longqi said:


> Its ok to stick up for a mate
> But just for once pretend that you did not know the photographer



Standing up for a friend is one thing. Standing up for someone that actually does something good for the animals, is experienced and IS respected in the profession is another. I hope he keeps saving snakes from moronic home owners. If that means annoying the snake for five minutes for a photo shoot, who on earth cares? The snake won't remember it in 10 minutes time, and if you believe they have human emotions- perhaps it'll teach them to stay away from people?


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## longqi (Oct 25, 2011)

Notchister
If it was anyone else who posted the video would you support the way that video was taken??
Would you be able to find any educational benefit in that video??
[apart from "This is what a Brown Snake very very seldom does unless provoked pretty hard"]

Believe me I hope he continues his great relocation work to
But I also think this video was a huge mistake to place in a public arena like Utube where any kid can watch it and think that this is the way all brown snakes act all the time; and that this is how to treat any snake they see

If it was the late great JC himself who posted it I would have exactly the same reaction


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## KaotikJezta (Oct 25, 2011)

ianinoz said:


> deleted



I saw the pictures you posted of the EWD, that dragon was being held in a manner that did not allow it any escape. As I stated earlier, lizards don't just close their eyes because they enjoy being patted and if you kept dragons you would know that. My bearded dragons will close the eye facing me when they are feeling threatened, kind of like a little kid covering their face so you cant see them. If that EWD truly was choosing to interact with you it should have been allowed to just sit on your hand or arm with no restraint but as the owner of a very skittish adult EWD who I have owned for 4 years and still doesn't want to be held, I find it very hard to believe a wild one would seek you out for attention. It may be coaxed into taking food, my girl totally forgets herself sometimes when food is involved, but not into sitting comfortably on you and allowing photos and patting.


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## moosenoose (Oct 25, 2011)

Elapidae1 said:


> LOL
> This has turned into a rather amusing thread. I'm sure it'll be remembered long after the Snake has forgotten its torment



Haha how true! Anyone would thing the thing will be traumatized for the rest of its life they way people carry on about it :lol: Maybe we could get a snake psychologist to take a better look at the poor thing. It's probably rocking back and forth in a dark chook-shed somewhere.

My point is, who cares if the bloke rolls off a few reels of film on a snake he's actually saved from death. Small price to pay. Especially considering the cameraman is the one in danger - not the snake. 

Yawn, yawn, yawn - go hug a tree for Petes sake :lol:


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## saximus (Oct 25, 2011)

I finally got to watch it last night when I got home (from the carry on I pretty much knew what was going on anyway). I'm more impressed with his footwork and his ability to stay calm. I would have fallen over about 47 times running backwards across rough terrain like that. I lol'ed at "I need to get in better shape" too


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## moosenoose (Oct 25, 2011)

Careful Geckphotorapher....you might be next because of the way you tease those poor geckos :lol: Spraying them in the eyes with water for god sakes :lol: :lol:


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## GeckPhotographer (Oct 25, 2011)

> Careful Geckphotorapher....you might be next because of the way you tease those poor geckos :lol: Spraying them in the eyes with water for god sakes :lol: :lol:



Tease poor geckos.... gecko shots come out better when you don't disturb them.... they don't pose so nice when you move em. ;P For the record I also don't spray geckos in the eyes with water, whatever gave you that idea?


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## moosenoose (Oct 25, 2011)

Oh  ...there goes that stealthy attack :lol: I was just trying to keep in the spirit of the thread and launch an assault on you :lol:  I failed.


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## snakeluvver (Oct 25, 2011)

moosenoose said:


> Oh  ...there goes that stealthy attack :lol: I was just trying to keep in the spirit of the thread and launch an assault on you :lol:  I failed.


I sometimes spray water on my gecks eyes so hell lick them...
I know. Im a monster 
I should be reported to the authorities :O


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## moosenoose (Oct 25, 2011)

:lol: :lol: I knew there was a monster lurking there somewhere!


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## serpenttongue (Oct 25, 2011)

The trouble is, too many people seem to think that a reptile put under this type of stress is going to be mentally scarred for the rest of its life. It's not. This brown snake will get over this 'terrifying' ordeal so fast that it's actually quite laughable, as far as I'm concerned.


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## GeckPhotographer (Oct 25, 2011)

And here you were wondering why your gecko always tries to attack you?


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## snakeluvver (Oct 25, 2011)

serpenttongue said:


> The trouble is, too many people seem to think that a reptile put under this type of stress is going to be mentally scarred for the rest of its life. It's not. This brown snake will get over this 'terrifying' ordeal so fast that it's actually quite laughable, as far as I'm concerned.


Exactly. Its like if someone startles you, your scared for a moment and then you forget about it.


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## KaotikJezta (Oct 25, 2011)

What happened,, I go away from APS for a bit and I come back and he's suspended


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## $NaKe PiMp (Oct 25, 2011)

i understand your disapointment
whats going to happen to lizzy updates?? what if we have to name her baby?? what if we even have to work out what sex lizzy is so we know if she can have a baby or not???
god im so lost right now,im going to have to wear a little frilly dress and self mutilate with sharp impliments to cope

oh and back on topic

wrapping up i say most of us agree that tony is a perfectly capable snake handler/relocator/photographer and we love watching him photograph an Eastern Brown snake in its defensive mode,and aapreciate what there behaviour isreally like as 99.9 % of you people will not encounter this behaviuor as you dont go anywhere near brown snakes,and if your curious you can watch tonys vid,no need to repeat what he does to you young impresionable ones,and also no need to harass those who have the balls to do what you wont,quite simple really, and damn what a fine species is the Eastern Brown snake,i never tire of my nervous but Beautiful friend


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## KaotikJezta (Oct 25, 2011)

$NaKe PiMp said:


> i understand your disapointment
> 
> god im so lost right now,im going to have to wear a little frilly dress and self mutilate with sharp impliments to cope


Lucky I had just finished my mouthful of coffee when I read that.


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## Tassie97 (Oct 25, 2011)

wow my thread got him suspended bhahaha


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## longqi (Oct 25, 2011)

serpenttongue said:


> The trouble is, too many people seem to think that a reptile put under this type of stress is going to be mentally scarred for the rest of its life. It's not. This brown snake will get over this 'terrifying' ordeal so fast that it's actually quite laughable, as far as I'm concerned.



Nobody seems to understand that this was never about stressing out the snake
It was about deliberately provoking a wild animal into reacting in such a way as to make it appear much more dangerous than they really are
There is zero educational use for this video

As I said earlier if it was Bear Grills or anyone else doing this you would be screaming your heads off


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## GeckoJosh (Oct 25, 2011)

longqi said:


> Nobody seems to understand that this was never about stressing out the snake
> It was about deliberately provoking a wild animal into reacting in such a way as to make it appear much more dangerous than they really are
> There is zero educational use for this video
> 
> As I said earlier if it was Bear Grills or anyone else doing this you would be screaming your heads off


I found the video quite educating, it showed me a rarely seen "behind the scenes" view of a wild elapid photo shoot


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## GeckPhotographer (Oct 25, 2011)

> I found the video quite educating, it showed me a rarely seen "behind the scenes" view of a wild elapid photo shoot



I agree with this. 

But I also agree with some things longpi is saying. We shouldn't be encouraging every Tom, Dick and Harry to do this. As well as that portraying Eastern Browns in these poses gives the species a bad light. 

But I still think there is potential value in these pictures. One could show one to your average Joe as an educational thing labelling it as an EB bluff stance. Saying that when an EB is doing this it is feeling threatened, that you should move off and leave it alone. That is helping to break the general view of EBs being highly agressive and chasing people.


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## imported_Varanus (Oct 25, 2011)

I personally don't see the point really. You can get some great elapid shots without all the hoo haa ( Matt Summerville's pics for example), but there's a bit of showman in every elapid keeper! Maybe that's why some of us get bitten ?!

In terms of vids on vens, I much prefer ssssnakemans (Barry) approach.


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## Specks (Oct 25, 2011)

Hey geckophotographer

tony just contacted me and told me this about his camera
the canon 7 d traces its subject. thats why he bought it and thats how it focuses. allows him to get fast moving shots and perfect for these situations

Ok so to those who doubted what these photos would come out like tony sent me some of them that he got from the session 

More things about his camera, it takes 8 photos a second. It has 19 focul points and it will track a moving target. Thats why he bought it and gecko, he throws a majority away


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## $NaKe PiMp (Oct 25, 2011)

Specks said:


> Hey geckophotographer
> 
> tony just contacted me and told me this about his camera
> the canon 7 d traces its subject. thats why he bought it and thats how it focuses. allows him to get fast moving shots and perfect for these situations
> ...




me like


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## GeckPhotographer (Oct 26, 2011)

They are nice. 

Yeah I have been using the Canon 5D for a few months now and it also supposedly can track the subject. However I haven't had much luck with this mode, maybe I'm just doing it wrong. 

They are nice pictures and some are even about as sharp as you might think you could get them, others might have been sharper under normal focusing but they are still bloody good. 

Thanks and thanks to Tony for allowing us to look at these amazing images here. I guess I'll have to go find me an EB to play around with this mode (JKing I'll try it with an active skink or something, much safer).


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## moosenoose (Oct 26, 2011)

longqi said:


> As I said earlier if it was Bear Grills or anyone else doing this you would be screaming your heads off



Bear Grylls would have clubbed it and eaten it for a start 

This is clearly a one-off photoshoot with one snake (and then it's obviously released). The educational value of these photos is one that they portray a very typical defensive stance should anyone startle or corner a wild eastern brown. I don't know what the whoo-har is all about? A captive eastern brown will only continue putting on a show like this for a limited duration anyway as they settle down quite fast in captivity (hence the reasons plenty of people running snake shows turn them over and obtain new ones). Like I said earlier, the only one in harms way is the photographer.


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## Tassie97 (Oct 26, 2011)

[video]http://www.youtube.com/user/goldcoastsnakeshows#p/u/2/Jk0GrL6uf74[/video]

OMG now ian is harassing him :O

GO!! TONY!!!!


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## saximus (Oct 26, 2011)

I can't see anything Tassie? There's only one comment on the vid you posted


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## Tassie97 (Oct 26, 2011)

go to 4:08 in vid "so to you ian in newcastle"


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## saximus (Oct 26, 2011)

Ah I see haha. That is actually a really good explanation video. It's just a shame that he felt he had to make it at all though.
Anyone in contact with him I think they should request he come down to Sydney to give us a show. He seems like someone who would be really cool to meet and learn from


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## richoman_3 (Oct 26, 2011)

Loooooool


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## Tassie97 (Oct 26, 2011)

saximus said:


> Ah I see haha. That is actually a really good explanation video. It's just a shame that he felt he had to make it at all though.
> Anyone in contact with him I think they should request he come down to Sydney to give us a show. He seems like someone who would be really cool to meet and learn from


yes i soooo wanna meet him


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## GeckPhotographer (Oct 26, 2011)

pmsl I hope he keeps doing well and gets that shot he's after.


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## GeckoJosh (Oct 26, 2011)

Heheehe


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## Specks (Oct 26, 2011)

saximus said:


> Ah I see haha. That is actually a really good explanation video. It's just a shame that he felt he had to make it at all though.
> Anyone in contact with him I think they should request he come down to Sydney to give us a show. He seems like someone who would be really cool to meet and learn from



yeh he does great shows and goes through all this thoroughly
i doubt he would go all the way down there but wash a fair bit of money to him and im sure he could someday ahah



Tassie97 said:


> yes i soooo wanna meet him



So glad to see a young kid like you tassie, im lucky enough to know him and he does his job really well and has a genuine passion for reptiles as you could see in this video
He doesnt want keyboard bandits talking crap and as you can see others on here agree with ton but then you get the people that are either stubbon or " never wrong" in their mind


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## ryanm (Oct 26, 2011)

Tony presented at the Gold Coast Reptile Expo earlier this year. He did a great show (apart from one dropped Elapid ) and had a great selection of animals for people to get up close and personal with. Seemed very knowledgeable and had real passion for what he did.


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## Specks (Oct 26, 2011)

ryanm said:


> Tony presented at the Gold Coast Reptile Expo earlier this year. He did a great show (apart from one dropped Elapid ) and had a great selection of animals for people to get up close and personal with. Seemed very knowledgeable and had real passion for what he did.



yeh i was lucky enough i got to help him out and hold crocs, lizards, monitors and snakes for the little kids to pat and look at
Twas an awesome expo


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## Tassie97 (Oct 26, 2011)

Specks said:


> yeh he does great shows and goes through all this thoroughly
> i doubt he would go all the way down there but wash a fair bit of money to him and im sure he could someday ahah
> 
> 
> ...



hehe  i have watched every vid


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## longqi (Oct 26, 2011)

Good to see that he explained why the shots were taken

Cant say I completely agree with the reasoning
But any explanation is better than none


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## MathewB (Oct 26, 2011)

Tassie97 said:


> go to 4:08 in vid "so to you ian in newcastle"



What a boss


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## snakeluvver (Oct 26, 2011)

He shouldve mentioned the water skink... I god I wouldve LOL'ed


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## Heelssss (Oct 28, 2011)

That is some courage on him and very stressful to the poor snake. Traumatised much? Far out that brown will surely tag any two legged bugger that roams freely near him. but kudos for awesome footage!


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## camspeed (Oct 28, 2011)

I don't know him and I thought both the video and the shots are awesome, great work

he didn't hurt it, like others have said it could have ended up on a shovel.


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## souldoubt (Oct 28, 2011)

Snakeluvver3 said:


> 'harassing and terrorising the snakes in order to provoke them to attack him in defense in order to get some video and photos to post online'
> You honestly think that's what he's doing? He's not provoking it, he's following it and trying to get photos.
> 
> And relocation it is his job -- if he didn't relocate this snake, then the homeowner would just kill it...



he poked it with his foot, provoking and harassing is exactly what he's doing. You really think photos of snakes looking aggressive saves them from ignorant people? 
Yes he's relocating snakes, and yes thats a good thing but ******* it off just to get a good photo seems extremely counteractive to me and videos such as this just helps to fuel the irrational fear held by a lot of people in this country. I'm hardly going to harbour a hatred towards Tony, but I do have to question exactly what has been achieved by such a video

oh and I dont really care what Ian said or if you agree with him but bullying him is nothing to be proud of. I think its pretty disgraceful actually that some of you can take such pleasure in bullying another member of the forum, not much different to being in high school really is it? except that some of you are late 20's and older.


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