# OENPELLI Python



## stencorp69 (Jun 22, 2005)

Graeme Gow's Snakes of Australia Revised edition 1983 has a picture of an oenpelli python on the cover. When I bought the book in 1984 it was the first time I'd read about this python and I haven't heard much about them since. Previous to the release of his book most of the books I'd read classed most morelia as carpet pythons.

Does anyone keep or breed them? or was it just a new specie classification that got reclassified?

Just curious

Stephen


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## Tommo (Jun 22, 2005)

nope, no one to my knowledge keeps them

the only few in captivity i have heard off are those at teh territroy wildlife park(3 i think). im going to work experience there next week, so ill take afew pics


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## instar (Jun 22, 2005)

Someone keeps one, was one at the herp expo last year! :wink:


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## stencorp69 (Jun 22, 2005)

I'd love to see the pics - make sure you post em when you get a chance. them


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## cwarren72 (Jun 22, 2005)

Toronga Zoo had a pair years ago but they proved to be a difficult species to keep and house and are prone to stress. I can't remember exactly but I am pretty sure they lost both of them. This is going to be a good thread you watch and see. There will be people coming out of the wood work on this one all offering there wealth of knowledge. lol


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## stencorp69 (Jun 22, 2005)

*Re: RE: OENPELLI Python*



cwarren72 said:


> There will be people coming out of the wood work on this one all offering there wealth of knowledge.



I was quite puzzled when I picked up the book to read tonight - with all the threads I've read on this site, I hadn't heard mention of it at all. It will be interesting to read people's responses.


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## imported_Mark (Jun 22, 2005)

*RE: Re: RE: OENPELLI Python*

I went to Oenpelli in Arnhem Land when I was in the NT last week, did not see any pythons though, keep asking the local and guides and none of em even know what the Oenpelli python was...


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## NCHERPS (Jun 22, 2005)

*Re: RE: OENPELLI Python*



instar said:


> Someone keeps one, was one at the herp expo last year! :wink:



That one was owned by the Territory Wildlife park, and was displayed there by 'Marshall Black' one of the keepers from the park.

Didn't think it was anything exceptional really, prefer scrubbies in appearance, but it was nice to see one in the flesh.

Neil


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## BROWNS (Jun 22, 2005)

*RE: Re: RE: OENPELLI Python*

The only person i know of that's kept and bred them is Peter Krauss,they are not available to the hobby.


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## cwarren72 (Jun 23, 2005)

*RE: Re: RE: OENPELLI Python*

Mark the common name is rock python. maybe that is why they were wondering what it was? I have these on my WISH list. Have desired to have a pair for years but like has been touched on briefly the chances of ever owning legal captive ones ???? well I will be getting them about the same time I start up my colloection of hens teeth 
lol


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## Brodie (Jun 23, 2005)

*RE: Re: RE: OENPELLI Python*

Oenpellis arent prone to stress at all. Infact, their husbandry is virtually the same as that for a large carpet python.

Colin,

I have spent a LOT of time out in Oenpelli, and other places in arnhem land. I have never heard it being called a rock python... Oenpelli rock python ive heard. All the locals call them Oenpelli pythons (including guides)


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## R1MAN (Dec 15, 2005)

thought that i would bring this thread back to life by making a post. 

over the years of collecting books, the oenpelli has come a few times so i have grown curious as to why these aren't more common as captive bred! being a top end snake i couldn't imagine them being hard to look after in captivity (no more then a BHP) so it leads me to think of just the rarity of these large snakes. i have read that they can become quite large (bigger then olives). so the question to BROWNS
"do you know why they aren't available to the hobby if Peter Krauss has bred them?"
any other thoughts?


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## southy (Dec 15, 2005)

NCHERPS is right on the money, i accompanied marshall with my uncle to the expo last year with the , nice fella but still alot to be learnt from this species oenpelli


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## BROWNS (Dec 15, 2005)

Don't know the full story and what happened to the offspring i'm sur someone does.There was a good article on him breeding them in HERPETAFAUNA a few year ago....Personally this is one python i would prefer to be left in the wild not available for private colections etc but that's just me...


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## BROWNS (Dec 15, 2005)

damn slow pc's sorry doble post :?


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## R1MAN (Dec 15, 2005)

agree browns, it would be good to get a bit more info on this topic as i am just curious about it as you don't see it in many books or hear many references to them. can you elaberate on why you think they should left in the wild mate?


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## GetCoiled (Dec 15, 2005)

if you like to see some wild pics you can go to ATR site...Image Gallery....Pythons....Oenpelli. You'll find some pics that the Aussie herpetologist Dave Pearson gave me about 7 years ago from a trip at Kakadu.
Cheers
Stefano


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## R1MAN (Dec 15, 2005)

cheers getcoiled i will check them out. have seen oenpelli before in pics but more wont hurt. 

if they ever did take off on the captive stream they would probably come onto the market at something rediculous like $24,000 a pair. talk about monopoly


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## Dicco (Dec 15, 2005)

They have a fairly restrictive Range, only found in parts of Arnhem Land in the Northern Territory.


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## Herc (Dec 15, 2005)

the ones bred by Krauss were seized by NT parks officers and returned to the NT, I believe to the desert park but apparently these didn't survive. the reason they were taken was because Krauss didn't have permission to export them out, so that annoyed parks officers.... that is the report on the situation that i got anyway.


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## R1MAN (Dec 15, 2005)

Herc said:


> the ones bred by Krauss were seized by NT parks officers and returned to the NT, I believe to the desert park but apparently these didn't survive. the reason they were taken was because Krauss didn't have permission to export them out, so that annoyed parks officers.... that is the report on the situation that i got anyway.



now thats gotta hurt
:cry: :cry: :cry:


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## chameleon (Dec 15, 2005)

ok, are these pythons the same as "rough scaled python"? (they look similar)...
anyway if they are you can get pairs at www.herpshop.com.au/ht/HerpTraderSnakes.html
this person gives photos(good ones) and only sells pairs ......
got $24,000?


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## GetCoiled (Dec 15, 2005)

you can see the 2 cuties Krauss hatched back in the '80 on the book "Reproductive Husbandry of Pythons and Boas" by Ross and Marzec. I think that $24,000 is a VERY optimistic view as this taxon is far stranger lookink than carinatas and worht even more! 
VERY NICE!!!
Cheers
Stefano


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## chameleon (Dec 15, 2005)

ok, are these pythons the same as "rough scaled python"? (they look similar)...
anyway if they are you can get pairs at www.herpshop.com.au/ht/HerpTraderSnakes.html
this person gives photos(good ones) and only sells pairs ......
got $24,000? he is willing to swap things at same value(got a brand new car)?


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## R1MAN (Dec 15, 2005)

chameleon said:


> ok, are these pythons the same as "rough scaled python"? (they look similar)...
> anyway if they are you can get pairs at www.herpshop.com.au/ht/HerpTraderSnakes.html
> this person gives photos(good ones) and only sells pairs ......
> got $24,000?



completely different snake mate. rough scales are from the kimberlys and alot smaller. oenpellis from arnham land and alot bigger


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## chameleon (Dec 15, 2005)

how did that post get up there again? sorry


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## chameleon (Dec 15, 2005)

same snake or not, im sure he put in alot of time breeding these things,but i must ask.....
is 24,000 too much to ask for? i mean i cant afford that money for snakes!


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## ihaveherps (Dec 15, 2005)

the question is rather....if you had the money would you pay it? the ture worth of a snake is what someone is willing to pay for it! Sorry for going off topic!!!


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## GetCoiled (Dec 15, 2005)

I cant afford that money for snakes too! I was only speaking about a GREAT price/value in order to show how much I like them, even MORE than carinata...just my 2% of course as nobody knows for "much how" and "if" there will be ever available.
Cheers
Stefano


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## R1MAN (Dec 15, 2005)

back to the original question
- does anybody know of any in any private collections


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## ihaveherps (Dec 15, 2005)

It is also my understanding that obtaining Oenpelli is much more difficult now because their range falls entirely within Aboriginal land ownership ie. Arhnem Land. (please dont crucify me if i am wrong)


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## Herc (Dec 15, 2005)

i believe you are correct


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## cwarren72 (Dec 15, 2005)

never heard them called rock pythons? that really funny because every time I have ever been there on safari with my uncle we hear them called that all the time. Have been lucky enough to see one once.


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## herptrader (Dec 15, 2005)

To me they look like children's pythons on steroids and those that have seen the first hand have not disagreed with this description.

I know of somebody who has a captive slough of one ;-)

--
*Herp Shop - http://www.herpshop.com.au*
Make a herper friend very happy this Christmas with
10% off all *Barefoot Bushman DVD's* at the Herp Shop







[/quote]


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## pugsly (Dec 15, 2005)

> To me they look like children's pythons on steroids and those that have seen the first hand have not disagreed with this description.



PMSL yeah im not a real big fan of them.. Give me a Albino Darwin or GTP anyday over one. JMO


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## Tommo (Dec 16, 2005)

ihaveherps said:


> It is also my understanding that obtaining Oenpelli is much more difficult now because their range falls entirely within Aboriginal land ownership ie. Arhnem Land. (please dont crucify me if i am wrong)



you are correct, the three off at the territory wildlife park are the only(legal) ones to my knowledge and from talking to one of the keepers, they arnt that uncommon within their range. its just that they are only found on Aboriginal land. i have heard of afew legal loop holes to this though.

so pretty much to everyone asking about their price...they are not bred or sold so, therefore, there is no price :wink:


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## Gilleni (Dec 16, 2005)

herptrader said:


> I know of somebody who has a captive slough of one ;-)



I know somebody with a rough Scale Python slough too... :lol:


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## Menagerie (Dec 16, 2005)

What sort of loop holes?


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## africancichlidau (Dec 16, 2005)

Yes, I'd be very interested in hearing of these loopholes


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## Rossagon (Dec 16, 2005)

Hmmm loopholes, may have something to do with gifts from landowners(with a few other legalities left out). But I'm no expert!!


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## Tommo (Dec 16, 2005)

Rossagon said:


> Hmmm loopholes, may have something to do with gifts from landholders. But I'm no expert!!



thats one of the ones ive heard, i beleive(not 100% sure) that is how the youngest came to the territory wildlife park. but, these dont think it includes private keepers lol, or else i would have asked some friends of mine who are traditional land owners to keep their eyes open for them :wink:


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## mark351 (Dec 16, 2005)

Hi guys 
I'm new here. I used to keep reptiles and am going to get back into it. I have worked around the country and always took opportunites to go looking for local herps. There are Oenpelli Pythons at the Territory Wildlife Park. They were not on display the days I was there as there was a cyclone warning and their cages are outdoors. The guide organised me to go backstage and look at them. They were not in great condition in my opinion. I would guess they were wild caught. According to other locals i had met while working in Darwin, Oenpellis are very hard to find and live up high in rocky outcrops that are off the beaten tracks. I was told the areas are basically inaccessible and carefully monitored by rangers for poachers. Also being predominantly nocturnal and also rare would make it hard to find them. That is what a few local guys up there told me. I did hear of a guy with Oenpelli pythons in South oz about 8 years ago, but did not know his name. My guess that they are around, but probably not legally.


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## mark351 (Dec 16, 2005)

Sadly, there are many loopholes in law with Traditional landowners. I have worked for many mining companies and they use them all the time. It is called money! It speaks all languages...


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## GetCoiled (Dec 16, 2005)

Here in Europe, and in the USA I heard the same, since 8-9 years there is a rumor: the presence of a bunch of those creatures in Canada (?). Have you ever heard a thing like that?
Cheers
Stefano


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## Tommo (Dec 16, 2005)

GetCoiled said:


> Here in Europe, and in the USA I heard the same, since 8-9 years there is a rumor: the presence of a bunch of those creatures in Canada (?). Have you ever heard a thing like that?
> Cheers
> Stefano



ive only heard of one overseas and i beleive the animal died awhile ago


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## Hickson (Dec 16, 2005)

Gilleni said:


> herptrader said:
> 
> 
> > I know of somebody who has a captive slough of one ;-)
> ...



I know somebody with a Roughscale Python. 



Hix


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## africancichlidau (Dec 16, 2005)

I know a roughscale python


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## the_brad (Jul 14, 2006)

thought i would bring this post back up and see if anyone has put these loopholes into action or know any more news on the subject


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## herptrader (Jul 14, 2006)

I have not heard anything, not even the slightest hint of a rumour!


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## NicG (Dec 19, 2006)

Thought it was time to bring this thread to life again ...

Being a relativel newcomer to Herping world (2 years), I have only just found out about the existence of these snakes, at least as Australian. I'd seen their name written down, but had always assumed that they were an exotic.

Is there any current news on them? Any successful breeding programs in wildlife parks following loophole exploitation?

Are they really:
a) the biggest or 2nd biggest Australian Snake?
b) not that rare in their native habitat?

Cheers,
Nic


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## Samantha Gow (Dec 23, 2006)

When my father discovered this python it was very controversial. He named it himself and there was a picture of me with it in the bath printed in the NT News at the time, which I know have the original on my wall. I was about 4 years old which would make it about 1983. My mother knows the full story of it's discovery, if your interested let me know and I will ask her and post it. I believe at the time alot of the well know herp's didn't believe that there could possibly be another species but dad knew better and finally due to the patterns and the scale count they had to agree. As to whether or not anyone has them in captiviy at the moment I couldn't be sure.


stencorp69 said:


> Graeme Gow's Snakes of Australia Revised edition 1983 has a picture of an oenpelli python on the cover. When I bought the book in 1984 it was the first time I'd read about this python and I haven't heard much about them since. Previous to the release of his book most of the books I'd read classed most morelia as carpet pythons.
> 
> Does anyone keep or breed them? or was it just a new specie classification that got reclassified?
> 
> ...


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## chuck norris (Dec 23, 2006)

interesting, i would like to hear about it.


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## warp81 (Dec 23, 2006)

i wanna hear about it to, any one got any web links or pics


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## Samantha Gow (Dec 23, 2006)

Great!! I will get the run down and let you know.


chuck norris said:


> interesting, i would like to hear about it.


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## warp81 (Dec 23, 2006)

heres a link or 2
http://www.nt.gov.au/nreta/wildlife/threatened/pdf/oenpelli_python_vu.pdf
http://www.nt.gov.au/dcm/ocm/media/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewRelease&id=1037&d=5
http://www.territorywildlifepark.com.au/olc-reptiles.html


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## Mrs Mac (Dec 23, 2006)

*heres are pic of one i found*

http://www.tbc.net/~gknaack/pics/pythons/oen

pelli.html


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## warp81 (Dec 23, 2006)

hmmm different i certainly like 1 if i could get 1 along wit every other reptile 2


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## raptor (Dec 23, 2006)

The story I heard (from someone who knows Peter well) is that Peter had a pair on a research permit. Apparently after years of study & failed attempts at breeding, he finally succeeded in producing a clutch. As soon as that happened, the department stepped in, took the lot, and cancelled the project. True? I cant say, but my source is reliable, and similar situations have happened before. As far as I'm aware, Oenpellis aren't permitted on any state's schedules.


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## MoreliaMatt (Dec 23, 2006)

they look like a massive childreni


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## Tristis (Dec 25, 2006)

cant see any really reason why we cant keep them. hopfuly some one will get them and start breeding them like rough scales and kimbirly rock monitors


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## FAY (Dec 25, 2006)

The best way to get a rare, endangered etc etc species plentiful is allow breeders to keep them.....what a shame the greenies, government departments never think snsible or logical!!!!


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## Tristis (Dec 25, 2006)

100% agree Fay


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## NRE-808 (Dec 25, 2006)

If bred in captivity though, would that make them any less tolerant to all the little buggies etc that goes with living in the big wild world...?

I wont detract from your statement though... the best way to increase populations would be letting breeders go a little silly  it'd be the smart thing to do


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## paul4 (Dec 25, 2006)

From what i understand the animals at the territory wildlife park are all males and even they cannot get a permit to get a female. So the only way they will become available to us mere mortals is if the park does does get permission to get a female then if they successfully breed them enough times to supply other parks and zoos etc. Then probably ten years on we might get hold of some, unless another state or territory has some sort of amnesty to declare illegally held animals and then the people that do hold these animals currently illegally will be able to come forward and we will have access to them. I dont know what the problem is besides some beauracratic bull*h*t holding everything up. They are more common than people know and are scattered around the country in various collections allready anyway and still fetching well over $20 K a pair from what i have heard. Its only a matter of time and we will get there eventually. (fingers crossed)


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## elapid68 (Dec 26, 2006)

paul4 said:


> From what i understand the animals at the territory wildlife park are all males and even they cannot get a permit to get a female.



Well one must have had a sex change cause when I was there at the beginning of the year the one on display was one very large healthly looking female. The young male was not on display and off the top of my head I can't remember the sex of the third.


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## waruikazi (Dec 26, 2006)

From what i understand the animals at the territory wildlife park are all males and even they cannot get a permit to get a female...

Well they do have current collection permits. It'sjust tat they aren't collecting atm.


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## paul4 (Dec 27, 2006)

waruikazi said:


> From what i understand the animals at the territory wildlife park are all males and even they cannot get a permit to get a female...
> 
> Well they do have current collection permits. It'sjust tat they aren't collecting atm.


Well that is good news then, that means that things are finally in motion even if there are some grey areas.
Good stuff


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## Bigweem (Dec 27, 2006)

elapid68 said:


> Well *one must have had a sex change *cause when I was there at the beginning of the year the one on display was one very large healthly looking female. The young male was not on display and off the top of my head I can't remember the sex of the third.




it wouldnt be the first time thats happened to a captive snake.:lol:


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## stencorp69 (Dec 27, 2006)

Samantha Gow said:


> When my father discovered this python it was very controversial. He named it himself and there was a picture of me with it in the bath printed in the NT News at the time, which I know have the original on my wall. I was about 4 years old which would make it about 1983. My mother knows the full story of it's discovery, if your interested let me know and I will ask her and post it. I believe at the time alot of the well know herp's didn't believe that there could possibly be another species but dad knew better and finally due to the patterns and the scale count they had to agree. As to whether or not anyone has them in captiviy at the moment I couldn't be sure.


 
Hi Samantha, I heard a little of this story from Dave @ Pilbara Pythons, but it would be good to get an account from the source -so post away


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## Hickson (Dec 27, 2006)

What a lot of people don't realise is that even if the Park has the permits to collect, they may not have permission from the Aboriginal Landowners who own the land where the Oenpelli's are found. You can't even go there without their permission.

As I understand it, Graeme Gow was the ONLY person with permission from the Aboriginals to collect Oenpelli's (and anything else he wanted). And since his death last year, that makes it a little difficult to get hold of them.



Hix


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