# Hatchling fully submerged into water bowl ???



## Shahista (Mar 13, 2020)

Hey there,

I don't know if this is normal but I found my 4 month old Albino Darwin Carpet fully submerged in her water bowl about two times already. I don't think she has mites as there are no signs of it... is this normal ? Also, she already shed yesterday & the humidity of the enclosure is 63% whilst the temperature is 23.6 degrees celsius


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## WizardFromAus- (Mar 14, 2020)

Shahista said:


> Hey there,
> 
> I don't know if this is normal but I found my 4 month old Albino Darwin Carpet fully submerged in her water bowl about two times already. I don't think she has mites as there are no signs of it... is this normal ? Also, she already shed yesterday & the humidity of the enclosure is 63% whilst the temperature is 23.6 degrees celsius
> 
> View attachment 328692


Hey i have a 4 month old albino also.. im not really sure what that could be aye id like to know my self, theres a few people on here who know there ****!! Ill do some research for ya give us a min 




WizardFromAus- said:


> Hey i have a 4 month old albino also.. im not really sure what that could be aye id like to know my self, theres a few people on here who know there ****!! Ill do some research for ya give us a min
> 
> Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk


Could be alot of things aye, honestly i wouldn't be using a glass tank in my opinion especially being so young, she probably could just be trying to hide, is there many things for it to hide in? Maybe the glass tank is to much exposure to the outside if ya get me.. 




WizardFromAus- said:


> Could be alot of things aye, honestly i wouldn't be using a glass tank in my opinion especially being so young, she probably could just be trying to hide, is there many things for it to hide in? Maybe the glass tank is to much exposure to the outside if ya get me..
> 
> Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk


Put her up high somewhere safe, and maybe some more hides and have the tank looking abit darker and safer for her she will prob get out of the water 

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk


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## Southernserpent (Mar 14, 2020)

It's pretty normal for them to soak in their water. As long as you have your temps on point and are providing a hide I wouldn't worry to much


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## Shahista (Mar 14, 2020)

WizardFromAus- said:


> Hey i have a 4 month old albino also.. im not really sure what that could be aye id like to know my self, theres a few people on here who know there ****!! Ill do some research for ya give us a min
> 
> 
> Could be alot of things aye, honestly i wouldn't be using a glass tank in my opinion especially being so young, she probably could just be trying to hide, is there many things for it to hide in? Maybe the glass tank is to much exposure to the outside if ya get me..
> ...



She is in a plastic 41 x 27 x 15 cm enclosure & I'm getting another hide today so I can put it on the cool end but yeah could be a lot of things. I tried to do some research but couldn't find anything.
Thank you for the reply!


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## Herpetology (Mar 14, 2020)

That setup is useless (I can’t see a heatmat or cord) so it’s probably being too hot due to no hot or cool end

They’ll soak also if they’re too hot


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## GBWhite (Mar 14, 2020)

Shahista said:


> She is in a plastic 41 x 27 x 15 cm enclosure & I'm getting another hide today so I can put it on the cool end but yeah could be a lot of things. I tried to do some research but couldn't find anything.
> Thank you for the reply!
> 
> 
> ...



Hi Shahista,

Unfortunately, as Herpetology has alluded your set up is far from ideal for a 4 month old Carpet Python. From what I see and from what you have said it's highly probable that the enclosure is far too hot for the snake due to the number of lights you have as well as the enclosure being in a location with limited ventilation which would impede any excess heat to escape and the snake is seeking refuge in the water as a means to cool down. They need to be able to thermoregulate which means that they need a hot area to warm up and then once they have reached their desired body temperature they need to be able to move to a cool area where they can slowly cool down. There is a real chance you might just cook the snake the way you have it set up at the moment.

An enclosure with a simple set up is all you need at the moment so the snake remains healthy (you don't need the fake plant or the other piece of furnishing at the opposite end) and then once it's a bit bigger (around 12 months) you can look at relocating it into a larger enclosure and fit it out to look nice with appropriate furnishings..

Personally I think you'd be far better off to relocate the enclosure to a more ventilated, well lit area and place it on a heat mat so around a third of the heat mat covers the bottom of the enclosure. You can then connect a thermostat to the heat pad and set it to around 30 to 32 deg C so it doesn't cook the snake. I'd also suggest you do away with that particular substrate that you are using and just have paper towel or newspaper as a substrate so the heat from the heat mat can pass through the bottom of the enclosure and provide a warm spot where the snake can coil up to heat up and then move away to a cool spot once it has reached its desired body temperature. The hide you have also looks to be a little too large for the snake (it only has to be a little larger than the snake because they like to be able to coil up in a nice, tight spot as a means to feel safe and secure). However in saying that it would be ok if you place that one over the heat mat and get an appropriate sized smaller one to put at the cool end. Likewise place the water bowl at the cool end as well.

Just finally (and this might assist you to WizardFormAus) go online and Google "Care Sheets for Carpet Python"s or alternatively purchase one of the books available that outlines the best practice for keeping these snakes.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

George.


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## WizardFromAus- (Mar 14, 2020)

GBWhite said:


> Hi Shahista,
> 
> Unfortunately, as Herpetology has alluded your set up is far from ideal for a 4 month old Carpet Python. From what I see and from what you have said it's highly probable that the enclosure is far too hot for the snake due to the number of lights you have as well as the enclosure being in a location with limited ventilation which would impede any excess heat to escape and the snake is seeking refuge in the water as a means to cool down. They need to be able to thermoregulate which means that they need a hot area to warm up and then once they have reached their desired body temperature they need to be able to move to a cool area where they can slowly cool down. There is a real chance you might just cook the snake the way you have it set up at the moment.
> 
> ...


Cheers mate!! 

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk


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## Shahista (Mar 14, 2020)

Herptology said:


> That setup is useless (I can’t see a heatmat or cord) so it’s probably being too hot due to no hot or cool end
> 
> They’ll soak also if they’re too hot



yeah I mean how are you supposed to see the heat mat anyways since it’s under the enclosure lmao


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## Ramsayi (Mar 14, 2020)

Shahista said:


> the temperature is 23.6 degrees celsius



How are you measuring the temp? If correct then it is too cold.

Snakes will sit in water bowls for a few different reasons.
Can be because they are too hot and need to cool down.
Alternately because they are too cold and when the water is warmer than the surround temps they will sit in the water bowl for that warmth.
Young pythons also tend to sit in water bowls as it makes them feel more secure.
Also if infested with mites.


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## Shahista (Mar 14, 2020)

GBWhite said:


> Hi Shahista,
> 
> Unfortunately, as Herpetology has alluded your set up is far from ideal for a 4 month old Carpet Python. From what I see and from what you have said it's highly probable that the enclosure is far too hot for the snake due to the number of lights you have as well as the enclosure being in a location with limited ventilation which would impede any excess heat to escape and the snake is seeking refuge in the water as a means to cool down. They need to be able to thermoregulate which means that they need a hot area to warm up and then once they have reached their desired body temperature they need to be able to move to a cool area where they can slowly cool down. There is a real chance you might just cook the snake the way you have it set up at the moment.
> 
> ...



I only turn on the lights to check up on my snake when it's dark which is obviously turned back off once done. There is no way I would leave the lights on full time as obviously the cool end must remain cool & like you mentioned, it would get far too hot... I think that is common sense. I agree that the location probably causes limited ventilation... that didn't cross my mind until you mentioned it so thank you, I placed it in a different location.

I know that snakes need to thermoregulate which is why the heat mat is placed on the left side whilst the water bowl is on the far right of the enclosure. What made you assume I didn't know this ?

I really do hope @Herptology knows that heat mats are supposed to be *under *the enclosure & not on *sight *otherwise it would be *useless*.

I see no problem with the substrate ? The heat definitely does pass through the substrate. As for the ornaments, my snake loves climbing on it & the plant is there so my snake can feel less exposed.




Guess there is a lot more going on behind a simple picture lol.

Thank you for your reply & your suggestions


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## Ramsayi (Mar 14, 2020)

Shahista said:


> I'm using a reptile thermometer to measure the temperature


No idea what that is.
Get yourself a non contact thermometer.These allow you to check temps anywhere that you point the laser including the python.


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## Shahista (Mar 14, 2020)

Ramsayi said:


> No idea what that is.
> Get yourself a non contact thermometer.These allow you to check temps anywhere that you point the laser including the python.



It’s this thing and yes that’s probably the best option


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## Bl69aze (Mar 14, 2020)

Wait, so what heats the larger enclosure? When you use it, heat mats inside wooden enclosures especially are a nono, underneath wood is also a nono

In your picture it looks upside down, but every mat brand is different 

Those ^ probe thermometers are t great for measuring hot spots, air temps yes, hot spots no

It worries me that your temps were only 23.6?
You can get a laser gun off eBay for 15$ ( the orange ones )


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## Shahista (Mar 14, 2020)

Bl69aze said:


> Wait, so what heats the larger enclosure? When you use it, heat mats inside wooden enclosures especially are a nono, underneath wood is also a nono
> 
> In your picture it looks upside down, but every mat brand is different
> 
> ...



What do you mean the larger enclosure ? I already moved the enclosure to a new location & the heat mat isn’t upside down, 100% sure of it.
23.6 cool end. It doesn’t pick up the hot spot temp.

I’ll order the laser gun now


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## nuttylizardguy (Mar 15, 2020)

Shahista said:


> Thanks, I’ll order the laser gun now


Make the noncontact thermometer has a higher spot diameter than 12:1 , 20:1 is OK , this means the spot being measured is 1cm in diameter at 20cm from the gun.

Also strongly advise you get a gun that has an adjustable emissivity , most really cheap consumer noncontact thermometers have a preset (built-in emissivity of 0.9 which will mean the termperatures measured will be inaccurate if the surface has an emissivity more that is not the same, you can end up with errors of about 30% depending on the emissivity of the surface being measured.
ie
incorrect emissivity setting programmed into the gun for the surface being measured by the , if the surface actually has a higher emissivity , the temperature measurement will be too low, and conversely if the emissivity of the surface is actually lower, the temperature will be too high





This error can compensated for but it's not a "simple" calculation


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## Shahista (Mar 15, 2020)

nuttylizardguy said:


> Make the noncontact thermometer has a higher spot diameter than 12:1 , 20:1 is OK , this means the spot being measured is 1cm in diameter at 20cm from the gun.
> 
> Also strongly advise you get a gun that has an adjustable emissivity , most really cheap consumer noncontact thermometers have a preset (built-in emissivity of 0.9 which will mean the termperatures measured will be inaccurate if the surface has an emissivity more that is not the same, you can end up with errors of about 30% depending on the emissivity of the surface being measured.



Just checked the gun I ordered, says the emissivity is 0.1-1 (adjustable) but is 12:1 distance to spot size


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## nuttylizardguy (Mar 15, 2020)

Shahista said:


> Just checked the gun I ordered, says the emissivity is 0.1-1 (adjustable) but unfortunately is 12:1 distance to spot size



The large spot diameter ( 1cm diameter at 12cm distance ) means you will have to be careful to measure close enough to surface being measured that the part of surface you want a SURFACE temperature for COMPLETELY fills the spot.
If you hold the gun too far away, you will end up with incorrect temperatures even if you dial up the correct surface emissivity BECAUSE you will be getting an "averaged" temperature for the background and the target surface , the background is likely to be cooler ==> your measurement will be misleadingly low.

Make sure you know where the laser spot is in relation to the area being measured, very few have the spot aligned at the measurement area's centre , most have the spot at one side of the measurement area or somewhere "near" the top of the measurement area.
My gun has a spot 30:1 and adjustable emissivity and dual sighting lasers. (*Testo 831*)


Also keep in mind the non-contact thermometer ONLY measures the radiant heat reflected from the surface , and reemitted heat ( heat given up ) from the hot surface , it will not tell you the air temperature .


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## Shahista (Mar 15, 2020)

nuttylizardguy said:


> The large spot diameter ( 1cm diameter at 12cm distance ) means you will have to be careful to measure close enough to surface being measured that the part of surface you want a SURFACE temperature for COMPLETELY fills the spot.
> If you hold the gun too far away, you will end up with incorrect temperatures even if you dial up the correct surface emissivity BECAUSE you will be getting an "averaged" temperature for the background and the target surface , the background is likely to be cooler ==> your measurement will be misleadingly low.
> 
> Make sure you know where the laser spot is in relation to the area being measured, very few have the spot aligned at the measurement area's centre , most have the spot at one side of the measurement area or somewhere "near" the top of the measurement area.
> ...



thANKS


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## mrkos (Mar 16, 2020)

You could also stick your hand in where the heat mat sits and if the bottom of the tank is pleasantly warm on your hand then it should be right seriously some of the people answering on here have no real common sense on keeping reps and shouldn't be answering
By the way if one end of your enclosure floor sits at room level and the other 1/3 feels warm on your hand (not hot )then you know your on the right track


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## CF Constrictor (Mar 16, 2020)

Hi Shahista
You said the humidity is around 63% ? That sounds to high, if its like that constantly , i could lead to respiratory infection. I keep the humidity in my enclosures at around 40% and have not had any health issues. I only raise the humidity when they are in pre shed by misting the enclosure once a day.


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## Shahista (Mar 17, 2020)

mrkos said:


> You could also stick your hand in where the heat mat sits and if the bottom of the tank is pleasantly warm on your hand then it should be right seriously some of the people answering on here have no real common sense on keeping reps and shouldn't be answering
> By the way if one end of your enclosure floor sits at room level and the other 1/3 feels warm on your hand (not hot )then you know your on the right track



I really don’t get some of the people answering


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## CF Constrictor (Mar 18, 2020)

Yeah , your right, no common sense, use a thermometer instead of your hand , much more accurate.


mrkos said:


> You could also stick your hand in where the heat mat sits and if the bottom of the tank is pleasantly warm on your hand then it should be right seriously some of the people answering on here have no real common sense on keeping reps and shouldn't be answering
> By the way if one end of your enclosure floor sits at room level and the other 1/3 feels warm on your hand (not hot )then you know your on the right track


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