# Eastern Browns....



## KaaTom (Jan 3, 2009)

Would love to know more about them, they are just awesome looking snakes. Any pics and or other info regarding them would be much appreciated.


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## aliveandkicking (Jan 3, 2009)

They like a tickle under the chin


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## horsesrule (Jan 3, 2009)

They are a gorgeous looking snake.

Would not suggest approaching one in the wild on a warm day unless you are used to them though they can move very fast and can be highly aggresive if annoyed.


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## aliveandkicking (Jan 3, 2009)

horsesrule said:


> They are a gorgeous looking snake.
> 
> Would not suggest approaching one in the wild on a warm day unless you are used to them though they can move very fast and can be highly aggresive if annoyed.


 


what book did you quote that from?


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## KaaTom (Jan 3, 2009)

What about ones in captivity... anyone here own one or more?


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## nick_w (Jan 3, 2009)

i see them all the time here in central qld, super common. they are pretty fast moving, love that S shape defensive pose when you get too close. there is a girl in my town who has a couple I think, not sure if they are a breeding pair or just for fun. if i can get pics i will post them.


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## aliveandkicking (Jan 3, 2009)

KaaTOm, have a look at the bottom of the page. There are links to related threads, there is one on breeding browns.


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## horsesrule (Jan 3, 2009)

I have some and mine are fairly placid can ark up a little when disturbed on some days. Other days they are fine.

But they can move very fast i put one out the back once for some sun and it took of so fast i nearly lost it so i learnt never to do that again.


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## swaddo (Jan 3, 2009)

I know bugger all about them except they can be psycho hose beasts when you are trying to bag them , but here is a my favourite pic as requested


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## Bearded_Lady (Jan 3, 2009)

swaddo said:


> I know bugger all about them except they can be psycho hose beasts when you are trying to bag them , but here is a my favourite pic as requested



Awesome! Thats respect right there!


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## Jonno from ERD (Jan 3, 2009)

They are a very fast, agile, nervous species but once you have worked with them they are easy to deal with. They are very predictable. They generally tame down to be puppy dogs in captivity, but should still be treated as the volatile species they are.

They are not *aggressive*, no snake is and if anybody should know this, it would be someone who keeps them.


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## KaaTom (Jan 3, 2009)

Awesome pic.... thanks


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## Sel (Jan 3, 2009)

Swaddo is that the one you had to bag?

Id pee myself i think,,,lol


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## jamgo (Jan 3, 2009)

*some of my easterns they make great pets.*


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## redbellybite (Jan 3, 2009)

puppy dog like in captivity ,that may be ...but wild encountered and in my opinion and experience they are extremely nervous and easily provoked, especially after being hassled by stupid ignorant people or dumb dogs....


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## Jonno from ERD (Jan 3, 2009)

In the wild they are very nervous, but are still highly predictable and easy to handle. 

Just ask Danny Brown


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## horsesrule (Jan 3, 2009)

I think most elapids look nicer than pythons.

There is just so many more colors to choose from.


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## KaaTom (Jan 3, 2009)

jamgo said:


> View attachment 74476
> View attachment 74478


 
i love ure male... just stunning....


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 3, 2009)

Jonno from ERD said:


> They are a very fast, agile, nervous species but once you have worked with them they are easy to deal with. They are very predictable. They generally tame down to be puppy dogs in captivity, but should still be treated as the volatile species they are.
> 
> They are not *aggressive*, no snake is and if anybody should know this, it would be someone who keeps them.


 
REALLY? I might believe it of a CAPTIVE snake, but NOT a WILD one. And if you think that, then PLEASE explain WHY one attacked my mate? He didn't know the snake was there, but he soon figured it out when it was coming for him.




redbellybite said:


> puppy dog like in captivity ,that may be ...but wild encountered and in my opinion and experience they are extremely nervous and easily provoked, especially after being hassled by stupid ignorant people or dumb dogs....


 
Well RBB, I agree that they can be nervous and easily provoked, but it is not just 'stupid ignorant people', but people that don't know it's there and it feels threatened.

BECAUSE I love snakes my mate promised not to kill any more, unless they threaten him... He was apologised for killing it, but with a choice between my mate and the snake... I supported his choice.

But that is one stunning snake in the picture!!!!


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## Jonno from ERD (Jan 3, 2009)

G'day Wild Storm,

I'm used to having people argue that with me 

My point is that the definition of the word "aggressive" insinuates that an Eastern Brown will go out of it's way to attack without being provoked - this will never happen. They are most definitely very defensive, and will respond to the most minor of threats vigorously.


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## redbellybite (Jan 3, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> REALLY? I might believe it of a CAPTIVE snake, but NOT a WILD one. And if you think that, then PLEASE explain WHY one attacked my mate? He didn't know the snake was there, but he soon figured it out when it was coming for him.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 hence the words ESPECIALLY AFTER....thats the key of my comment ...I wasnt saying every interaction with a brown snake is by a stupid person .....


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## wizz (Jan 3, 2009)

[quote=( but he soon figured it out when it was coming for him)................if you back them into a corner they will defend themselfs i have approched over a hundred wild easterns and none of them came at me .... consiser yourself lucky if you do get to see them as they are usually gone before you get there.


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## elapid66 (Jan 3, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> REALLY? I might believe it of a CAPTIVE snake, but NOT a WILD one. And if you think that, then PLEASE explain WHY one attacked my mate? He didn't know the snake was there, but he soon figured it out when it was coming for him.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


if your mate can go to the efford to kill the snake why not just walk away and where were you in the bush or what


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## swaddo (Jan 3, 2009)

swaddo said:


> I know bugger all about them except they can be psycho hose beasts when you are trying to bag them , but here is a my favourite pic as requested




Sel, this is a juvi they brought out after the fact for a few photos. I had to bag a 5-6' one that they left in a nice warm spot for me ... gotta love that.


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 3, 2009)

I know RBB, but people don't see that in the bush (and I have come across a lot in the bush). If you are unfortunate enough to startle one you can be in real trouble. I was walking past the shed one day and saw movement out of the corner of my eye... I don't think I was 'close enough to be in it's space', but geez I had to move it fast. 

SOME snakes are aggro (maybe because it had a bad encounter, I don't know)... But they are the most dangerous because they WILL have a go at you... Without reason, other then you are there, or you moved.

For the sake of NOT starting a flame throwing debate, I won't go into the whys and wherefors of why he killed it, but just think of this... If you are over 600kms from a snake relocator, and the snake CAN'T stay around the area it has to be killed. He hadn't backed it into a corner, and he doesn't go out of his way to chase or kill snakes... He is too darn busy running his Station.


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## aliveandkicking (Jan 3, 2009)

After almost 30 years of either living in or spending a hell of a lot of time in the bush I have only come across one angry snake, I accidentally stepped on a brown when I was about 10. Every other snake I have come across either took of bloody quick or completly ignored me being where I was. The best moment was taking some pics of a Black while it was hunting on a river bank and the thing ended up over my feet and between my legs.


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## swaddo (Jan 3, 2009)

i agree aliveandkicking. I got fly fishing alot and sneak around the river banks quietly. I scare quite a few snakes by sneaking up on them. They most definietly stand up and demand some respect but never have I been attacked.

i have been told fairly interesting tales by people who've been on the land for years ... one was about a tiger that stood up in front of this individual and was "spitting venom". Apprently it spat so much that she had to wipe her glasses ... but it never struck. Go figure?!

I've also heard of rbbs "leaping off river banks" and charging at people.

edit: and then there's the ol chestnut where the tiger chased a mate of a mate and was so fast it kept up with him on his bike ... i have heard this one numerous times 

I think the aggression theory come from the snake mistakenly making a run for it in the wrong direction most of the time.


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## Jonno from ERD (Jan 3, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> I know RBB, but people don't see that in the bush (and I have come across a lot in the bush). If you are unfortunate enough to startle one you can be in real trouble. I was walking past the shed one day and saw movement out of the corner of my eye... I don't think I was 'close enough to be in it's space', but geez I had to move it fast.
> 
> SOME snakes are aggro (maybe because it had a bad encounter, I don't know)... But they are the most dangerous because they WILL have a go at you... Without reason, other then you are there, or you moved.
> 
> For the sake of NOT starting a flame throwing debate, I won't go into the whys and wherefors of why he killed it, but just think of this... If you are over 600kms from a snake relocator, and the snake CAN'T stay around the area it has to be killed.




A lot of it comes down to people misinterpreting what a snake is doing. Just because a snake is "coming at you", doesn't mean it's trying to attack you. Generally if you stand still it will keep moving past you...chances are, you startled it and it is trying to escape...but you are between it and where it wants to escape to. 

Again, NO snake is aggressive and they will NOT have a go at you without reason. Again, put yourself in the snakes shoes instead of yours - when your eyes are 1/2 an inch of the ground, the smallest stimulus can be interpreted as being a big threat. 

I'm not one of those people who gets all up in arms about people killing snakes. Of course I don't appreciate it, but there is little point scolding them about it as generally they enjoy being ignorant and don't want to learn anyway. All you can do is offer a little education which they won't accept anyway as they always think they know better 

It's funny...a few weeks ago we were photographing a Spotted Python near a pub in Cracow, QLD...one of the locals came up and said it wasn't a Spotted Python, it was a baby Carpet Python. Meanwhile I'm there, next to my ute full of snake handling gear, wearing my Educational Reptile Displays shirt, taking photo's of said snake...I asked him if he's going to try and teach me about snakes, can I try and teach him about mining for gold...he didn't like that.


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## redbellybite (Jan 3, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> I know RBB, but people don't see that in the bush (and I have come across a lot in the bush). If you are unfortunate enough to startle one you can be in real trouble. I was walking past the shed one day and saw movement out of the corner of my eye... I don't think I was 'close enough to be in it's space', but geez I had to move it fast.
> 
> SOME snakes are aggro (maybe because it had a bad encounter, I don't know)... But they are the most dangerous because they WILL have a go at you... Without reason, other then you are there, or you moved.
> 
> For the sake of NOT starting a flame throwing debate, I won't go into the whys and wherefors of why he killed it, but just think of this... If you are over 600kms from a snake relocator, and the snake CAN'T stay around the area it has to be killed.


 RUBBISH ....there are so many other things you can do ,other then KILL snakes ......they live there to. YOU HAVE INVADED THEIR ENVIROMENT ,YOU HAVE LEFT THEM NO CHOICE BUT TO LIVE WITH YOU ..YOU HAVE ENCOURAGED RODENTS WITH FEEDS AND FARMING CROPS , YOU HAVE CREATED MANY HIDING OPPORTUNITIES AROUND YOUR HOUSES,YOU LEAVE OUT WATER CONTAINERS AND TROUGHS, YOU HAVE FARMED LANDS AND MADE THEM DESOLATE AND DECREASED THE LIVING AREAS THAT THE SNAKES CAN LIVE IN ,YOU HAVE MADE THE DECISION TO LIVE IN THE BUSH....see now who is more of a danger ? thier only defence is their bite and overall most so called bites ,are dry ones ..venomous snakes do realise you are not food ,they see you only as a predetor and in that they protect themselves...eastern browns snakes are one of the most encountered species of all ,and sadly one of the most killed..all because the "WHAT IF SENARIO" in peoples uneducated heads and fearful actions ...people see a eb halfway down the backyard and need to go and get the shovel or shotgun ..because of the what ifs....well why dont people try the other what ifs like :WHAT IF I JUST OBSERVED THE SNAKE AND SEE WHAT ITS DOING ? WHAT IF I TIE UP MY DOG SO IT DOESNT ATTACK THE SNAKE AND THEN IN RETURN I HAVE TO KILL IT BECAUSE IT BIT MY DOG SENARIO..WHAT IF I CLEAN UP MY HOUSE SO THAT MY GARDENS AND SHEDS ARE MORE VISUAL AND I AM ABLE TO ACTUALLY SEE WHERE I HAVE THINGS OR UNDER SHRUBS ..WHAT IF I ACTUALLY WORE PROPER CLOTHING WHEN I AM OUT BUSH WALKING OR WORKING THE FARM ....see so many what ifs ......


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## wizz (Jan 3, 2009)

It's funny...a few weeks ago we were photographing a Spotted Python near a pub in Cracow, QLD...one of the locals came up and said it wasn't a Spotted Python, it was a baby Carpet Python. Meanwhile I'm there, next to my ute full of snake handling gear, wearing my Educational Reptile Displays shirt, taking photo's of said snake...I asked him if he's going to try and teach me about snakes, can I try and teach him about mining for gold...he didn't like that.[/quote]
LOL that is funny :lol::lol::lol:


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 3, 2009)

Yeah, we have pretty much been the same Aliveandkicking... One cranky Olive (which is still alive) and a cranky Whip snake at the NT Station. A cranky (but fairly small thank you God) brown snake (we didn't know what it was), and a Brown Tree Snake at the home Station (The Brown Tree Snake was alive when we sold the Station). The Brown and a grey snake a few years ago at Charlie's. And I came across a few, well four, cranky ones around Mareeba a couple of years ago. 

I don't like killing snakes, but as much as I can see the beauty in that Brown, I don't feel the same about Vens as I do about Pythons, or Tree snakes. I know that people are going to be upset and want to flame me, but that is my feeling. When a Ven is close to my house and there is no person to relocate them, they are gone. I have a small son and I won't risk him. Out in remote locations we have to be aware, but a number of us promote pythons and tree snakes.


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## Jonno from ERD (Jan 3, 2009)

I will leave you to the more passionate ones, Wild Storm...brace yourself.


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## redbellybite (Jan 3, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> Yeah, we have pretty much been the same Aliveandkicking... One cranky Olive (which is still alive) and a cranky Whip snake at the NT Station. A cranky (but fairly small thank you God) brown snake (we didn't know what it was), and a Brown Tree Snake at the home Station (The Brown Tree Snake was alive when we sold the Station). The Brown and a grey snake a few years ago at Charlie's. And I came across a few, well four, cranky ones around Mareeba a couple of years ago.
> 
> I don't like killing snakes, but as much as I can see the beauty in that Brown, I don't feel the same about Vens as I do about Pythons, or Tree snakes. I know that people are going to be upset and want to flame me, but that is my feeling. When a Ven is close to my house and there is no person to relocate them, they are gone. I have a small son and I won't risk him. Out in remote locations we have to be aware, but a number of us promote pythons and tree snakes.


:evil: as I said ignorance and fear .........very sad you feel that way ...there is so much more dangerous things in the world to harm your son then a eastern brown encounter.....hopefully one day you will understand that ....:cry:


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## DanTheMan (Jan 3, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> Yeah, we have pretty much been the same Aliveandkicking... One cranky Olive (which is still alive) and a cranky Whip snake at the NT Station. A cranky (but fairly small thank you God) brown snake (we didn't know what it was), and a Brown Tree Snake at the home Station (The Brown Tree Snake was alive when we sold the Station). The Brown and a grey snake a few years ago at Charlie's. And I came across a few, well four, cranky ones around Mareeba a couple of years ago.
> 
> I don't like killing snakes, but as much as I can see the beauty in that Brown, I don't feel the same about Vens as I do about Pythons, or Tree snakes. I know that people are going to be upset and want to flame me, but that is my feeling. When a Ven is close to my house and there is no person to relocate them, they are gone. I have a small son and I won't risk him. Out in remote locations we have to be aware, but a number of us promote pythons and tree snakes.



Deep breath.....
Then how about you move into suburbia? That's much safer, btw, make sure to never ever let your son get into a car. Just a guess here, id say cars kill more people than snakes? But maybe I'm just crazy.....


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 3, 2009)

Lol... Yeah Jonno... I am braced... Here is the first! 

Hey RBB, you don't know me... You can't say I am ignorant or fear snakes. Fear is a lack of understanding. I don't 'fear' snakes, I respect snakes. Yeah, they could 'clean up around the Homestead', they could tie up the dogs', they could do a lot of things... But until you've worked and lived the lifestyle it is very hard for people to understand. 

We are over 600 kms from Anti-venom... And considering the state of THAT road, it is over 9 hours DRIVE. 

It was due to an Educator like Jonno that changed my opinion from a 'kill any Ven or unknown' to a leave them be, and stay still. It was 2 yrs after that event that my youngest daughter had an Eastern Brown coming towards her, I told her to stay still and it went by her a metre away. I left it be, it left me be. However the clowns I was with decided to attack it with their fishing rods... What did the snake do? It bolted!! I tried to stop them, but I got shoved out of the way. However my intervention allowed the snake to vanish into the vines that grow along the beach at Yepoon.

But I know that I can't educate a 2 yr old child to 'stay still when he sees a snake. What would you have us do? How are we to survive? We don't go out into the paddocks and kill every snake we see. In fact we tend to leave them alone... Lol... Good Rabbit control!!! But around the Homestead??? 

I got told off for telling someone that my brother used a stick and a cloth to catch a snake, that was in our Chook Coop... So what do we do? Take risks, and perhaps they might turn into stupid ones? No, we can't risk $20 million Cattle Stations over a snake. 

Now while this is getting read, I am going to do the dishes.


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 4, 2009)

I had been told a few years ago that Anti-venom had to be administered with 3 hours if it was to work. I thank Jonno for putting me straight rather then trying to flame. I can now say that if a snake is around the homestead and I am the only one to see it, it will live. Give me a chance to work on my 'adopted' brother, and hopefully he will come around too.


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## redbellybite (Jan 4, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> I had been told a few years ago that Anti-venom had to be administered with 3 hours if it was to work. I thank Jonno for putting me straight rather then trying to flame. I can now say that if a snake is around the homestead and I am the only one to see it, it will live. Give me a chance to work on my 'adopted' brother, and hopefully he will come around too.


glad to read your comming around ,,,,I am a licensed catcher with QLD parks ..have caught many 'BROWNS" that have been in the farming situation , hay sheds ,cattle yards , homesteds, FEAR is what makes people act the way they do ,you FEAR for your son as to be expected, but dont under estimate the abilities of a two year old either..no he may not fully understand the dangers of what an eastern brown can do to him BUT he should be able to let mummy know if he see's a snake considering he is only two and wouldnt be left on his own ,on a station where cranky cattle and DAMS AND TROUGHS are around now would he ? he would obviously be with either parent or a much older wiser person now wouldnt he? so my point is as the adult you can make an adult decision which is no need to KILL the snake but to do something else ....instead like if your in the backyard of the homested and find a EB on your back lawn GET THE HOSE you spray the snake in the face , as it has not got any eyelids, it wont like it but you wont hurt it and you can safely move it on without getting to close to it ...."Jonno" may know his stuff but he isnt the only one either ..that deals with QLDS venomous snakes , some of us on here actually catch wild vens too by the way you have more chance of a FARMING ACCIDENT then a fatal snake bite ...just a thought too...


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## moosenoose (Jan 4, 2009)

elapid66 said:


> if your mate can go to the efford to kill the snake why not just walk away and where were you in the bush or what



That is quite amusing isn't it ... In all honesty! So he killed it and wonders why on earth it was showing such
a defensive mannerism :? ...... The mind truly boggles! There's one of those stupid people redbellybite was talking about before I think! Hard to identify straight away, but when their cover is blown like that, boy are they easy to spot! :shakes head:


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## edgewing (Jan 4, 2009)

redbellybite said:


> puppy dog like in captivity ,that may be ...but wild encountered and in my opinion and experience they are extremely nervous and easily provoked, especially after being hassled by stupid ignorant people or dumb dogs....



Don't you mean dumb people and ignorant dogs? At least the dogs have an excuse


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## Kersten (Jan 4, 2009)

My favourite idiot redneck story from Kris is the guy who called him to a place where someone had a dead EB they wanted identified. So he turned up and identified the snake and listened to the guy's tale of woe about how aggressive the snake was, biting at everything that moved....especially the broom and the dog. The broom and the dog?? Yeah mate the guy said, when I first saw it I tried to whack it with the broom which was when it arced up and so I got the dog to hop in and have a go too but it started biting at the broom AND the dog. Guess the EB hadn't read the book about rolling over and taking it when someone tries to kill you.

I seem to recall reading a story somewhere the other day about a poor unfortunate boy who was the victim of snakebite after he'd picked a mulga or some such up and swung it over his head.

Yup, it's just so much better to interfere with them than let them go.


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## waruikazi (Jan 4, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> Yeah, we have pretty much been the same Aliveandkicking... One cranky Olive (which is still alive) and a cranky Whip snake at the NT Station. A cranky (but fairly small thank you God) brown snake (we didn't know what it was), and a Brown Tree Snake at the home Station (The Brown Tree Snake was alive when we sold the Station). The Brown and a grey snake a few years ago at Charlie's. And I came across a few, well four, cranky ones around Mareeba a couple of years ago.
> 
> I don't like killing snakes, but as much as I can see the beauty in that Brown, I don't feel the same about Vens as I do about Pythons, or Tree snakes. I know that people are going to be upset and want to flame me, but that is my feeling. When a Ven is close to my house and there is no person to relocate them, they are gone. I have a small son and I won't risk him. Out in remote locations we have to be aware, but a number of us promote pythons and tree snakes.



I'm a bit over trying to shout down people who kill snakes so i'll stay civil this time lol. 

The reality is in your situation out in the bush when you kill one ven another will take its place pretty quickly so you are really fighting an uphill battle. Statistically, no matter how much experience you have, you are at a much higher risk of being bitten when you are interfering with a snake. But what i think is the biggest problem is you are acting as a role model for your son and he will think it is ok to kill snakes when they are close to the house and that is when he will get bitten.


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 4, 2009)

moosenoose said:


> That is quite amusing isn't it ... In all honesty! So he killed it and wonders why on earth it was showing such
> a defensive mannerism :? ...... The mind truly boggles! There's one of those stupid people redbellybite was talking about before I think! Hard to identify straight away, but when their cover is blown like that, boy are they easy to spot! :shakes head:


 

Lol... He didn't know it was there until it was 3 foot away from him and heading for him striking when it could. Knowing my mate (15-16 years now) he would have been thinking about something else and wouldn't have seen the snake until the last moment. 

They are very safety minded on the Station... Having to pay compensation to someone is too expensive, so the rules in place keep all safe (supposedly). Recently some person left the houseyard gate open and (while I was cooking) I realised after about 10 minutes that my son was NOT in the house. It doesn't take long, however I am lucky... He usually heads for the shed (coz all Unca Arlie too "Uncle Charlie tools" are there... and make LOTS of noise!!) or for the dogs... Which ARE chained up unless working as otherwise they entertain themselves (NOT a good idea).

We only have a few dams on the property, and none of them are within 50km of the homestead. The only troughs are in the yards, which is still a little too far for him to go. BUT some times he is in the house yard while I am cooking (the only animal in the houseyard is Wrecker (a cat, but let's NOT go there) who is a children's pet from day one. 

That was the only reason I was for killing the Vens, however they DO get replaced by the next one, I knew that. We had a beautiful huge BHP, but the LATE Roxy (Foxy x Border Collie) sent him to Snake heaven. The other day Charlie was yet again off doing something else in his mind when he nearly stood on ANOTHER BHP (this one about 8 foot apparently), Charlie walked on air... BHP is still alive. We love the pythons around the house, what rats and rabbits Wrecker can't get, the pythons do!!

As Jonno suggested it might do for someone there to do a Snake handling course- I agree, then I would be able to re-locate the ones I DON'T want there and bring back those I DO!!

And before you start, I KNOW that won't work either, as they are territorial animals... :cry:


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## m.punja (Jan 4, 2009)

I bought my first EBD about a year ago now. I wasn't keen on EBD's, didn't think highly of them at all but this one came available and was well tempered and good priced, so i thought why not. He grew on me pretty quickly and their place in my favourite reptile scale jumped up a fair few spots and I soon had a partner or him. This snake was also not badly behalved and I think it's cause it shared a pit with other snakes. At first I was worried if I put the two together I'd have to tear appart two real angry browns but after a while the second became more flighty and agitated and I was coaxed into putting the two together to see what would happen, they have been together ever since and are my most well behalved browns to this date. I now keep eight eastern browns and love them all too bits, over that time EBD's have scaled higher and higher in my most favourite reptiles list and are currently in the top five aussie snakes in my eyes. Although some of mine are complete nut-bags as Jonno said they calm right down after a while, and if you put two together I've found this speeds up the calming process. Hope this info alll help's and if you are thinking of getting one just remember that they still need to be respected and try and buy one that is fairly calm so you can get used to them and feel more comfortable around them. Buying an absolute pyscho and diving into the deep end might ruin the experience for you which would be a pitty because they are such nice snakes.

cheers
Mark


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## DanTheMan (Jan 4, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> Lol... He didn't know it was there until it was 3 foot away from him and heading for him striking when it could. Knowing my mate (15-16 years now) he would have been thinking about something else and wouldn't have seen the snake until the last moment.



Aah I see! It's SO much easier and quicker to kill it than to run the opposite direction!


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## m.punja (Jan 4, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> We are over 600 kms from Anti-venom... And considering the state of THAT road, it is over 9 hours DRIVE.
> .


 

Wont the helicopter fly out your way? 
If you are truely a reptile enthusiast and truely don't want to kill any perhaps you should invest in a reptile relocation course and a hoop bag and jigger and put the shovel away. I know plenty of people who aren't keepers or true lovers of reptiles but respect them and understand that they have just as much of a right as we do to be here that they have taken it upon themselves to learn how to relocate venomous snakes safely. 
If you are really roughly 9hrs drive from the hospital and really that worried about your son maybe you should move closer to the hospital, or lock him in a padded room? Venomous snakes are just one of many dangers way out, you'll have a full time job protecting him from them all.

If any of this has been said earlier then sorry, I only skimmed across the crap as the true meaning of this thread was browns in captivity, or so I thought it was anyway.

cheers

Mark


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## m.punja (Jan 4, 2009)

Wild_Storm said:


> SOME snakes are aggro (maybe because it had a bad encounter, I don't know)... But they are the most dangerous because they WILL have a go at you... Without reason, other then you are there, or you moved.
> .


 

I love the idea of this. Imagine this. An Eastern Brown snake waking up one morning, absolutely bawling his eyes out and muttering, 'that damn farmer and his damn shovel. Chopped mum in half yesterday. Today I dedicate my life to going out and hunting and killing every member of his family!' - thats what I call aggressive. I can't see how any snake can be refered to as aggressive rather then defencive. 

Maybe it just makes the story sound better, got attacked by a deadly aggro eastern brown the other day, --- must have stood to close to a brown the other day because he wasn't happy, --- yea first story sounds better.


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## GSXR_Boy (Jan 4, 2009)

Why not put a snake proof fence around the main "homestead" ?? (picturing toothless hill billy sitting on an old rocking chair on the verandah. " Hey ma, it's one of them dang brown snakes again")


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## Fuscus (Jan 4, 2009)

I have encountered about two dozen browns in my travels. Most of the times you can't get near them but the ones I have got close to have not shown any "aggression" at all, in fact the last one allowed me to re-arrange him for photoing ( mind you, it wasn't that warm and he did have a lot of ticks on him).
In SA , I needed to answer a call of nature and put a foot right next to one. He did the smart thing and bolted. I remember being very annoyed at myself because I wasn't wearing boots.


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## redbellybite (Jan 4, 2009)

if you had been listening to Jonno he shouldve told you that in a 3 foot diametre of the snake YOU STAND STILL .....you are in the strike range that is why us catchers and keepers inform people that it is best to stand still ......practise this and you will be at a minimal risk ..as the EB will either move on or settle down again ...then you take TINY steps back at first all the while watching the snake if you get a reaction STAND STILL and repeat the following ,,,once you are of a 4 or more feet away you can flee at a faster pace .... its not that its hard to do ,its just that its hard to remain calm whilst doing that ..but you choose to put yourself amongst the wildlife then practise your safety as well ...


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## elapid66 (Jan 4, 2009)

moosenoose said:


> That is quite amusing isn't it ... In all honesty! So he killed it and wonders why on earth it was showing such
> a defensive mannerism :? ...... The mind truly boggles! There's one of those stupid people redbellybite was talking about before I think! Hard to identify straight away, but when their cover is blown like that, boy are they easy to spot! :shakes head:


what are you trying to say ?? its sounds like your baggin me if so why


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 4, 2009)

elapid66 said:


> what are you trying to say


 
I think the person mis-read my post, but that is ok... :lol:... My mate didn't kill it and then wonder, he almost got bitten and there is no way at the time he could have stood still. I am not saying it wouldn't have worked, but he couldn't have.

Yes Mark, you are right, it is about Browns in Captivity... I questioned Jonno saying they are pussycats, saying that the ones we've experienced have been very fiesty... And then all heck broke loose. Me trying to explain how things and snakes are on remote Cattle stations ended up hi-jacking the thread. SORRY KaaTom.


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## moosenoose (Jan 4, 2009)

elapid66 said:


> what are you trying to say ?? its sounds like your baggin me if so why



No, I'm actually agreeing with you. Probably just badly worded on my part.


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## redbellybite (Jan 4, 2009)

wild storm what do you mean he couldnt stand still? was he having a FIT?


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## elapid66 (Jan 4, 2009)

moosenoose said:


> No, I'm actually agreeing with you. Probably just badly worded on my part.


sorry mate


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## moosenoose (Jan 4, 2009)

ps:Wild_storm I'd also misread the initial thread, I thought the guy HAD killed it. My mistake.


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## [email protected] (Jan 4, 2009)

*hi*



m.punja said:


> I love the idea of this. Imagine this. An Eastern Brown snake waking up one morning, absolutely bawling his eyes out and muttering, 'that damn farmer and his damn shovel. Chopped mum in half yesterday. Today I dedicate my life to going out and hunting and killing every member of his family!' - thats what I call aggressive. I can't see how any snake can be refered to as aggressive rather then defencive.
> 
> Maybe it just makes the story sound better, got attacked by a deadly aggro eastern brown the other day, --- must have stood to close to a brown the other day because he wasn't happy, --- yea first story sounds better.




Thats like when i told my grand parents that i got a tiger snake '" my nans words were"" (Steven i dont mind the red bellied blacks or the pythons but snake i dont like are those dam tigers as i remember this very young girl on her walk to school from the farm got chased and she was bitten several times, when the father got to her she was already dead "' there evil rotten creatures and if one came next to me i wouldn't hesitate to shovel it, steven are you trying to give your nan a heart attack, becarefull that it dosent get out and come after you in the night and bite you. gosh child for heavens sake steven get rid of it. ) My good old nan shes just a protector, but most of the storys come from old school.  I told my nan just to make her feel better about my reptiles that i gave the tiger away. she was releaved. The funny thing is she loves my red bellied black (kit) she always asking about it.:lol:


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Jan 4, 2009)

Ok, imo a snake that has been man handled does remember the experience.
The snake becomes more wary of human contact than an animal that has had no such experiences, therefore becoming more dangerous to humans.
That dosnt mean to say they are activly seeking revenge but they have learned that people are bad and they react more defensivly.
*M.punja*



> 'I love the idea of this. Imagine this. An Eastern Brown snake waking up one morning, absolutely bawling his eyes out and muttering, 'that damn farmer and his damn shovel. Chopped mum in half yesterday. Today I dedicate my life to going out and hunting and killing every member of his family!' - thats what I call aggressive. I can't see how any snake can be refered to as aggressive rather then defencive. '


 

In your nans day there were a lot more tigers around, and a lot more contact with tigers and a lot more wivestales 
*[email protected]*



> 'Thats like when i told my grand parents that i got a tiger snake '" my nans words were"" (Steven i dont mind the red bellied blacks or the pythons but snake i dont like are those dam tigers as i remember this very young girl on her walk to school from the farm got chased and she was bitten several times, when the father got to her she was already dead "' there evil rotten creatures and if one came next to me i wouldn't hesitate to shovel it, steven are you trying to give your nan a heart attack, becarefull that it dosent get out and come after you in the night and bite you. gosh child for heavens sake steven get rid of it. ) My good old nan shes just a protector, but most of the storys come from old school.'


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## elapid66 (Jan 4, 2009)

:shock::shock::shock: wot tha


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## m.punja (Jan 4, 2009)

I don't disagree with you Baz. A snake that has had a bad experience with humans before may be more incline to want to defend itself if it comes back into contact with a human. The idea of it being aggressive is still IMO inaccurate. These snakes would look at humans as a predator, something further up the food chain them prehaps, so it would be more defencive and more easily intimidated. 

IMO I can only imagine snakes attacking for a feed or to defend themselves, so the term an agressive snake doesn't sit right for me.


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## elapid66 (Jan 4, 2009)

hey baz i was thinkin that a snake would of forgotin about it after about 3 mins


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## m_beardie (Jan 4, 2009)

arent they poisonous?


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Jan 4, 2009)

Ok well some peoples definitions of aggression vary, for the record, i dont think reptiles are capable of "aggression" either.
And they have a memory of a lot longer the a few sconds, that im sure of.


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## AustHerps (Jan 4, 2009)

What if the reptile has had a few rums? Rum _always_ makes me angry...


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Jan 4, 2009)

Aaron, i cant imagine you angry mate.


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## [email protected] (Jan 4, 2009)

ssssnakeman said:


> Ok, imo a snake that has been man handled does remember the experience.
> The snake becomes more wary of human contact than an animal that has had no such experiences, therefore becoming more dangerous to humans.
> That dosnt mean to say they are activly seeking revenge but they have learned that people are bad and they react more defensivly.
> *M.punja*
> ...



back in there day when they didn't have antivenom when people got bitten and just died , then people would come up with tales cause back then they would have been twice as scary as they didn't have the antivenom. like my grand dad told me this guy on his farm once got bitten on the hand from a tiger snake while lifting hay bails , he died from loss of blood as he choped his hand of with an axe. 
*The good old days hey* *ssssnakeman*


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## pythons73 (Jan 4, 2009)

If a snake was cornered,the only thing to do is bite,other than try to escape,if they had arms,they might punch,but they dont,they only have a mouth in which thats their only defense,alot of ppl put themselfs in harms way,also if you plan to go walking in bush or where there is snakes,where appropiate footwear,you see so many ppl that go herping,wearing thongs,also take first aid equipment,just incase.


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## wizz (Jan 4, 2009)

Well i would happily stand in a pit with no shoes and only shorts on and put twenty of your eastern browns in there with me and i wouldn't get bitten if i just stood still.if you treat them with respect they will respect you back


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## m.punja (Jan 4, 2009)

wizz said:


> Well i would happily stand in a pit with no shoes and only shorts on and put twenty of your eastern browns in there with me and i wouldn't get bitten if i just stood still.if you treat them with respect they will respect you back


 
agreed.


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## $NaKe PiMp (Jan 4, 2009)

every dumb person in the world has a story of being "chased " by a snake

i even heard a storey from a mates mum a couple of days ago,that when she was young a tiger snake chased her from a wood pile al the way back to her house,and when she got inside and closed the door it went up to all the windows and was tapping on the windows trying to get in,and it was only when some dude,turned up and killed the tiger snake that they where saved from the foul and loathsome creature:lol:


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## dodgie (Jan 4, 2009)

That sounds like the "hoop snakes" they used to get in the country.There where these snakes that would put there tails in there mouth and then roll down the hill and bite people.


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 4, 2009)

$NaKe PiMp said:


> every dumb person in the world has a story of being "chased " by a snake


 
Yeah, and so do some smart ones. It's not a persons fault they didn't know to 'stand still' and ran in a straight line. Let's be factual- for years people have lived in fear, because they haven't understood snakes. If we go around flaming them, will they learn?? No. It takes people like Jonno, and other Educators and snake re-locators to explain the truth to people.

Human nature- something attacks, we must fight or flight... As soon as someone is verbally attacked they CEASE to listen. By calmly and quietly explaining things people DO come around. I have witnessed it and I have done it with hostile people who wanted to kill my python.

If we use arrogance, telling them they are dumb, ignorant, stupid, etc we are not trying to explain, we are attacking.


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## $NaKe PiMp (Jan 4, 2009)

these "chase" storeys seem only ever come from people with litle knowledge of elapids and there behaviour
i think these instances in reality would be extremely rare and almost always false as people with alot of experiance and knowledge and deal with these creatures on an almost daily basis,never seem to report witnessing this behaviour
perhaps these people should write a paper on there experiance of being chased down by a rouge brown snake,i would like to read


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## Wild_Storm (Jan 4, 2009)

$NaKe PiMp said:


> these "*chase" storeys seem only ever come from people with* *litle knowledge of elapids and there behaviour*
> i think these instances in reality would be extremely rare and almost always false as *people with alot of experiance and knowledge and deal with these creatures on an almost daily basis,never seem to report witnessing this behaviour*
> perhaps these people should write a paper on there experiance of being chased down by a rouge brown snake,i would like to read


 

I rest my case... People that DON'T know if they stand still the snake wouldn't know they are there. People that haven't been educated!! 

As I said before- It all depends how we attempt to educate them to how they listen. When my Mom started ranting about my snakes the other day- I STOPPED LISTENING (I'm over 21 and not at home!!). However when calm and quiet people listen. I've seen it at displays, and I am sure people like Jonno have seen it too.

EDIT: I think we are on the same page, but I believe it is wrong to say 'dumb people', I believe the term should be 'uneducated'. Dumb implies being unable to use the knowledge, uneducated means they DON'T know. 

I bet if you approached the average person on the street and asked them "Did you know that if you see a snake and stay still it will go away?" MOST would say "What? No way." I know I didn't before I learnt.


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## voodoo (Jan 5, 2009)

Browns are by far my favorite elapid spp. I currently have 5 all have different, looks, colourations and temprements.
Agree with jonno from ERD s comments. Attached is a pic of my syd form brown,he was wild caught on permit when it was a yearling, he is now 3 yrs old, and probably my most placid snake.




Ps - Should have some NON feeding Gosford Brown hatchlings for sale by late feb-early march.

Dee


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## Vixen (Jan 5, 2009)

voodoo said:


> Browns are by far my favorite elapid spp. I currently have 5 all have different, looks, colourations and temprements.
> Agree with jonno from ERD s comments. Attached is a pic of my syd form brown,he was wild caught on permit when it was a yearling, he is now 3 yrs old, and probably my most placid snake.
> 
> View attachment 74658
> ...


 
Wow you are trusting haha.

If I ever have vens no way am I going to freehandle, just not worth the risk no matter how placid they might be.


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## redbellybite (Jan 5, 2009)

voodoo said:


> Browns are by far my favorite elapid spp. I currently have 5 all have different, looks, colourations and temprements.
> Agree with jonno from ERD s comments. Attached is a pic of my syd form brown,he was wild caught on permit when it was a yearling, he is now 3 yrs old, and probably my most placid snake.
> 
> View attachment 74658
> ...


voodoo where are the sunshine coast (qld) wild caught placid brown sliding up your arm pics?....and wild storm I never said dumb people ..I said dumb dogs and stupid ignorant people ,the ones that even after you have been at a call out and explained the situation about snakes and THEY STILL BEG TO DIFFER ...even Jonno has experienced those type of people..


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## borntobnude (Jan 5, 2009)

we saw 2 on our trip around wombeyan caves the 1st was dor about 7 ft 2nd was on road but alive . I stopped for a pic from a safe distance ,got back in and drove slowly so it could get off the road . It didnt move far reared up and wanted to have a go at the car . No i dont think there a very freindly snake
rodney


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## wizz (Jan 5, 2009)

Thats the way dee......


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## Kersten (Jan 5, 2009)

The mind boggles.


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## Vincey (Jan 5, 2009)

voodoo said:


> Browns are by far my favorite elapid spp. I currently have 5 all have different, looks, colourations and temprements.
> Agree with jonno from ERD s comments. Attached is a pic of my syd form brown,he was wild caught on permit when it was a yearling, he is now 3 yrs old, and probably my most placid snake.
> 
> View attachment 74658
> ...



Beautiful snake!

If that were me my heart would be pounding.lol


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## cris (Jan 5, 2009)

Jonno from ERD said:


> G'day Wild Storm,
> 
> I'm used to having people argue that with me
> 
> My point is that the definition of the word "aggressive" insinuates that an Eastern Brown will go out of it's way to attack without being provoked - this will never happen. They are most definitely very defensive, and will respond to the most minor of threats vigorously.



It really just comes down to what you mean by aggresive, just because the snake is stupid and thinks its defending itself makes little differance.

I think most stories about snakes attacking are BS or misinterpreting behaviour. I have had a rbb come directly at me, it was just cruising around and didnt see me but to another person it would no doubt be hunting them down. I have been "charged" by a marsh snake going at full speed after i disturbed it and it was trying to get away silly thing didnt realise it was going straight towards what it was scared of.


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## JasonL (Jan 5, 2009)

I walked up to a massive Brown a couple of years back, it stood up near my thigh height in a defiant threat showing it wanted to kill me if I didn't back down, but I kept walking right at it not wanting to give away my rights to use the track, only when I was a meter away from the killer beast did it retreat and flipped off the walkway and went bush hiding it's head in shame never to be seen again. Maybe next time I should watch where I'm going? but who would think they would stay sunning themselves on those suspended metal walkways that vibrate like buggery when you walk on them? well I know better now!
I was on the coast walk km's from help or mobile service in the Royal, and was looking for Red throated skinks to my left as I walked, the brown, a honest 6 footer was in front on my right, I only saw it a fraction of a second before it flipped over the side, all happened so fast in reality though was so slow in my head, the kid walking behind me saw the whole thing and was "stoked" he got to see such a big snake.


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## TrueBlue (Jan 5, 2009)

Some browns are infact VERY docile, even qld browns. Its certainly more of an exception than a rule thou.
I had a brown once that you could do absolutely anything with as long as there was no sent of food around.


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## [email protected] (Jan 5, 2009)

The only good snakes a venomous one.


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## elapid66 (Jan 5, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> The only good snakes a venomous one.


yeah now where talkin


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