# Its all a part of keeping snakes!



## PieBald (Feb 2, 2013)

Being only young in the hobby and care for 3 snakes, (soon to be 5) this isnt my favourite part. I was just moving ne of my jungle from feeding tub to enclosure, i touched her, she was fine and then she grabbed me, she is only just over a year old (so only small) but she can bite. So far this is about the 6 time a snake has grabbed me and coiled. I have been biting by my 2 hatchy jungles, a spotted python just over a metre maybe 1.1 metres and plenty of spotted hatchies. Everytime i get biting i just tell my self its a part of keeping snakes. Heres my pics and feel free to post your own.


Even so my fist reaction to the spotted python went something like this. "AARRRHHHH ITS BITIN ohh this dont even really hurt, QUICK GRAB MY CAMERA!!!!" All i cared about was getting a photo to remember it.


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## saximus (Feb 2, 2013)

Why don't you feed it in its enclosure so you don't have to disturb it right after a meal and get bitten?


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## longqi (Feb 2, 2013)

Just a few facts as advice

Fact 1; You dont need to feed snakes out of their enclosures
Fact 2; If your snake is biting and wrapping it is hungry
That is called a feeding response bite
No good for you or the snakes
Easy fixed by feeding it more
Fact 3;Its NOT part of owning snakes to get bitten
If bitten it means you made a mistake
Thats the only thing getting bitten means


Enjoy


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## PieBald (Feb 2, 2013)

I was told and have always been taught to feed outside of the enclosure. As I said I am only young so I am still developing my Ways of doing things, Im sure if you ask me I one years times I will be doing a lot of things different than now. So yea I'm still "experimenting" with things. I'm sure you do thing different now than when you started off.

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Again longqi I'm sure you have been bitten.


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## saximus (Feb 2, 2013)

PieBald said:


> I was told and have always been taught to feed outside of the enclosure. As I said I am only young so I am still developing my Ways of doing things, Im sure if you ask me I one years times I will be doing a lot of things different than now. So yea I'm still "experimenting" with things. I'm sure you do thing different now than when you started off.
> 
> - - - Updated - - -
> 
> Again longqi I'm sure you have been bitten.



Of course I do things differently from when I started. It was just a suggestion to help you fix a simple problem. Take it or leave it. As Longqi said, getting bitten isn't supposed to be a regular thing. Yes, we have all been bitten but it's best to avoid stressing them out if you can


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## Viking_Python (Feb 2, 2013)

View attachment 280147
View attachment 280146

A tag from my Coastal.


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## shell477 (Feb 2, 2013)

PieBald said:


> I was told and have always been taught to feed outside of the enclosure. As I said I am only young so I am still developing my Ways of doing things, Im sure if you ask me I one years times I will be doing a lot of things different than now. So yea I'm still "experimenting" with things. I'm sure you do thing different now than when you started off.



I feed mine out of his enclosure, but only so that he doesnt smear rat blood/etc all through it....


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## PieBald (Feb 2, 2013)

Ok I will give feeding in the cage a go. If I notice a difference in the animals behavior, defensiveness, aggression that kind of stuff I will find alternative. As i said I am trying new things all the time. Thanks for your help.


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## longqi (Feb 2, 2013)

Nobody is having a go at you here
Just giving advice
Yes I have been bitten 
But in every single case it was my fault

Most important thing right now is the types of bite you are getting
If they are feeding bites, which means snakes holds on and wraps, that means the snakes are hungry
Easy to fix by increasing their food


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## thomasssss (Feb 2, 2013)

longqi said:


> If they are feeding bites, which means snakes holds on and wraps, that means the snakes are hungry
> Easy to fix by increasing their food


i agree with you here but it might not necessarily be the case imo , sure reveiwing feed size would be a good idea but it could be that their just still in a strong feeding mode in a case like this where their being moved just after theyve eaten


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## tonesanlainie (Feb 2, 2013)

Have you tried feeding in their enclosure? Is just a suggestion as raised by Longqi. You say you were told to feed outside of their enclosure, but a good method is to listen to people experience and make your own mind up as to what is best for you. There are many threads on here sharing opinions of feeding inside V's outside of enclosures. In your case feeding outside has resulted in quite a few bites. I say quite a few as you say 6 bites from 3 snakes. The benefits you believe from feeding outside the enclosure, would they exceed 6 bites from snakes that are growing? Are the opinions for feeding outside an enclosure based on fact or opinion? Personally I like my snakes to think their enclosure is where they bite, and outside they don't. I only give food inside their enclosure to reinforce this. I cant say factually if this is better or worse than feeding outside their enclosure, but it has worked for me. I can say however that I have never been bitten by any of my adult pythons. But that could also mean I never take them out...lol (for the record I do btw).


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## Barbarossa (Feb 2, 2013)

Going to add my 2 cents worth
I dont own a snake at present, but im babysitting one, two things ive noticed when putting your hand inside keep your fist closed as fingers may look like food, and when im feeding him inside the tank i use chop sticks, he has looked liked he has wanted to go my fingers but this has saved me so far.


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## PieBald (Feb 2, 2013)

I'm feeding 1 fuzzie rat a week, about 1 and a half month ago they could even eat that. Is this enough.


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## longqi (Feb 2, 2013)

the snake in the photo can definitely eat a lot bigger meal than a fuzzy rat
No photos of the other snakes so hard to make a good call there


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## PieBald (Feb 2, 2013)

That spotted python isn't mine. The fuzzie eater is about 60-70cm long. Just over a year old jungle.


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## scorps (Feb 2, 2013)

I agree with longqi, I got bitten abit when I first started keeping reptiles but haven't been bitten by anything apart from hatchos in years, I guess it comes down to handling expericance and knowing how to handle the animals, trust me I have some pretty cranky adult snakes as well haha


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## thomasssss (Feb 2, 2013)

longqi said:


> the snake in the photo can definitely eat a lot bigger meal than a fuzzy rat
> No photos of the other snakes so hard to make a good call there


probably , that info came in after i made that post and like i said , reviewing it would be a good idea as well but it was just a possibility as well

ill admit that ive been feeding my womas in tubs , but it isnt to stop biting , its because i like to keep them on coir peat and they have a habit of dragging their food around and it sort of scoops into their mouth on the last bite and they got heaps on the food item

i was just a little worried it might cause some sort of problem with them eating it every feed whilst they where young , ill be changing to feeding inside the enclosure now their older it was just a precaution whilst they where young 

and ive actually never been bitten or striked at whilst moving them after theyve eaten , the males a food nutter sometimes before his eaten and ive been nailed then ( but it actually wasnt ever on feeding day ) but once his got food in his gut he quietens down completely


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## sharky (Feb 2, 2013)

ha, I've owned snakes for a year and haven't got tagged yet  Even all my hatchies have been rather docile  Guess I'm lucky?


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## PieBald (Feb 2, 2013)

sharkyy1o5 said:


> ha, I've owned snakes for a year and haven't got tagged yet  Even all my hatchies have been rather docile  Guess I'm lucky?



Mm that is lucky, I have a jungle that never bit me.


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## sharky (Feb 2, 2013)

haha, snap! My girl's an angel <3


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## RedFox (Feb 2, 2013)

I have being tagged twice since I have had snakes. Both times were completely my fault. First one I was cleaning the enclosure and though my 3year old woma was in his hide. He was under the substrate and got scared so he bit me. The second time I was feeding my new woma hatchy his mouse when he missed and grabbed my finger. We all make mistakes. It's how we learn.


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## thomasssss (Feb 2, 2013)

sharkyy1o5 said:


> ha, I've owned snakes for a year and haven't got tagged yet  Even all my hatchies have been rather docile  Guess I'm lucky?


your time will come , i was the same , made it to a year with out getting a proper bite only headbutts from my coastal , then one night i reached in to get my male woma out to show a few mates that hadnt seen one and he just latched on out of no where and coiled , since then his gotten me once more same thing but in the early morning


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## frankgrimes (Feb 2, 2013)

My woma(~3months old) latched on and coiled a few times recently(obviously hungry)...very tough to get her off  





Upgraded her to fuzzy rats last 3 weeks, but obviously she needs more


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## Alex72 (Feb 2, 2013)

yeah, has happened to me twice now, same finger too :x I keep forgetting Friday is food day....












although, mines tiny compared to your's! 

whats the best way to get them off when they have bitten? I flicked luke warm water at her and she backed of enough. I've read that you can also detach them slowly by starting at the tail but im unsure how effective that is.
note: she has a vivarium being built for as we speak, so she'll be out of that tub shortly.


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## notechistiger (Feb 2, 2013)

I just run them under cold water if they won't let go.

Feed them in their enclosure. Much easier. All mine get fed in their enclosure, I just make sure to use a hook to get them out to save me any silly bites.


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## The_Geeza (Feb 2, 2013)

PieBald said:


> That spotted python isn't mine. The fuzzie eater is about 60-70cm long. Just over a year old jungle.


my jungle was on medium rats every week......Plz listen to all the advise people r giving u......feeding outside an enclosure is not needed as u always run the risk of a food bite trying to get them back in.....Hell is i tried to feed 1 large rat to my 2.2M bredli then tried to put him back in enclose he would deff try to eat me....and my Bredli is the best handler.......U NEED TO KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HANDLING AND FEEDING .....it can be a very fine line


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## SteveNT (Feb 2, 2013)

We sneak their dinner into their enclosure when they're not looking. Neither of us has been tagged because there is no association with us and food. It just magically appears ha ha.

I would bite people if they kept me in a clik clak.


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## The_Geeza (Feb 2, 2013)

thomasssss said:


> your time will come , i was the same , made it to a year with out getting a proper bite only headbutts from my coastal , then one night i reached in to get my male woma out to show a few mates that hadnt seen one and he just latched on out of no where and coiled , since then his gotten me once more same thing but in the early morning


i trust both of my big carpets (Bredli and Jungle) but still use a hook in enclosure to get them in good position for me to handle............only been biten once in my life yrs ago and as Longi states it was my fault (dropped rat while someone talking to me)...lol...bam!!!!!!!!!!!

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Barbarossa said:


> Going to add my 2 cents worth
> I dont own a snake at present, but im babysitting one, two things ive noticed when putting your hand inside keep your fist closed as fingers may look like food, and when im feeding him inside the tank i use chop sticks, he has looked liked he has wanted to go my fingers but this has saved me so far.


This thread will be a good learning curve for u also


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## frankgrimes (Feb 2, 2013)

notechistiger said:


> I just run them under cold water if they won't let go.



Yep, this is the only way I can get my woma to let go.

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Alex72 said:


> whats the best way to get them off when they have bitten? I flicked luke warm water at her and she backed of enough. I've read that you can also detach them slowly by starting at the tail but im unsure how effective that is.



As mentioned..tap, cold water...has worked for me....grab them behind the head so they dont latch on again


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## Sel (Feb 2, 2013)

Ive only ever been bitten by my Antaresia.. which is no big deal..
Unfortunately for me, the next snake to bite me is either going to be a big python or something Venomous.. im hoping it doesn't happen for awhile..lol


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## IceWhiteFreak (Feb 2, 2013)

longqi said:


> Just a few facts as advice
> 
> Fact 1; You dont need to feed snakes out of their enclosures
> Fact 2; If your snake is biting and wrapping it is hungry
> ...




If you want dog tame snakes read on....



As we all know Pythons are opportunistic feeders and not very bright, do they even feel hungry? iv been keeping and breeding for while and iv found the best way to get dog tame snakes is to 1. Handle as often as possible. 2. Feeding out side of the enclosure (this just reduces the amount of scent in the enclosure which would be the main thing that will stop events like the one in the photo above. Food was obviously on its mind if it coiled 2. Stop dangling the food item in front of the snake incouraging it to coiling and then continue to tug on the food item for a few seconds and 3. Let the snake settle into a second click clack wait for it to enter its hide and for its head to be hidden (not with its head out looking at you) and then just place the food item in the click clack letting the snake eat it in its own time.

Eventually the snake will relise it's foods not movin and will slowly opening its mouth without coiling. Iv done this many times and I'd say about 95% of animals become dog tame for me when I turn my attention to them (pets not breeders etc or something I'm feeding up I want to be less likely to bite when it's 8ft long etc.)


Iv never had my snakes coil me in 13 years of keeping, if this happends your doing something wrong. you need to read your snakes body language and keep track of its head at all times, iv been bitten heaps of times but that's what snakes do and it is apart of keeping. I beleive I could tame any water python, scrub python etc to be very calm. Iv tamed jungles that were a nightmare, but with useing a hook and then eventually working my way up to free handling, calming the snake they eventually get dog tame....

You need to send multiple msgs to the snake so it knows its not feeding time when your in the equation.

I havnt delt with any retics etc so Im not sure if they'll take to my methods aswell as the Morelia, lasis etc iv delt with in the past. But feeding out side the enclosure is going to reduce the water comeing off the food and the scent from the food item so I don't why you think it wouldn't benifit the snake......


And why is the snake on sand? If it were to rest it's head on the sand and inhale a few granules then what? I know ants live on sand but you want to eliminate possible problems, replace it for paper towl or newspaper would be my advice and learn how to read your snakes.


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## Tildy (Feb 2, 2013)

Lol, I just got my first tag from my pygmy python last night. I have had her for about 2 yrs now, since she was a hatchie. It surprised me enough that I didnt get a photo. She was very hungry and went for the food and accidentally got my finger instead. Poor baby wouldnt take her food till I put it on the floor and left. Wish I had gotten pics to share now.


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## Kracken (Feb 2, 2013)

IceWhiteFreak have you ever kept scrubbies? the reason they have such a bad rep in captivity is people handle them as often as they can when their a juvenile, much the same as lace monitors


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## Pauls_Pythons (Feb 2, 2013)

There is some fantastic advice on here but there is also advice that contradicts the good stuff, its your job to decide for yourself what works for you but my bit of advice is this...........If what you are doing now isn't working but you keep doing the same things I think its only fair to expect the same result. 
Feeding outside the vivarium is in my opinion a total crock.
In the many years of keeping snakes including some rather large ones I have never resorted to this and never will. 
If your animal is coiling on you its probably still hungry or at least thinks it is.
While I do not have the opinion that any snake should be considered tame I do think that most can feel secure enough so they do not bite out of fear. Feed time is different and if you put your hands in front of the animal during or shortly after a feed you can expect that at some time you are likely to be on the receiving end.


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## Kracken (Feb 2, 2013)

scrubs compared to your carpets and ants are a very nervous snake, handling them as often as you can whilst their young creates a fear they dont shake when they reach a decent size, as for elapids sure a fairly placid un nervous species like red bellies or any of the pseudechis can become relaxed enough to free handle if you can read them well enough, try it with a flighty species like the browns though or a hoplo you'd find its a whole other ball game, each species is different and should be treated different and handling something as often as you can while its young you will find can actually cause the opposite effect


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## Pauls_Pythons (Feb 2, 2013)

What is this "dog tame" thing you keep talking about?

Have you ever encountered a really angry, BIG, python?


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## Darlyn (Feb 2, 2013)

I don't understand what your perception of "dog tame" is. Walking it on a leash, getting it to sit, fetch? Sorry don't get it.


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## Pauls_Pythons (Feb 2, 2013)

Mate, what I do works for me. If it didn't work I would take on board the opinions of others whom I respect and consider a course of action.
My first snake was a burm many years ago. I would love to see you feeding that out of the enclosure and then trying to put it back.


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## IceWhiteFreak (Feb 2, 2013)

I'm not goin to play 20 questions mate, snakes arnt really tame at all, they just tolerate it all. But dog tame is a little term for snake that tolerates alot and won't bite some thing you would be familiar with, if doing everything you needed to like feedin out side of enclosures etc it just reduces the risks of getting wrapped up for eg.


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## longqi (Feb 2, 2013)

How about we all take chill pills

OP has plenty of reasonable information now
No need to get too carried away

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Sel said:


> Ive only ever been bitten by my Antaresia.. which is no big deal..
> Unfortunately for me, the next snake to bite me is either going to be a big python or something Venomous.. im hoping it doesn't happen for awhile..lol



Sel you will notice about ven keepers
They very very rarely get tagged
So when you are ready for vens you will have a similar outcome


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## IceWhiteFreak (Feb 2, 2013)

I don't really care man. you don't know my intentions with how/what I post.


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## Sel (Feb 2, 2013)

longqi said:


> How about we all take chill pills
> 
> OP has plenty of reasonable information now
> No need to get too carried away
> ...



Yeh Longqi  Im actually more worried about the Big Pythons..lol


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## Sel (Feb 2, 2013)

You guys are getting boring.. chill 

:lol:


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## Skippii (Feb 3, 2013)

longqi said:


> Just a few facts as advice
> 
> Fact 1; You dont need to feed snakes out of their enclosures
> Fact 2; If your snake is biting and wrapping it is hungry
> ...



As always, you make some very good points. I just wanted to add though, you say that getting bitten is not part of owning snakes. I have to disagree in a way. As snake owners, we've all been bitten at some point, whether it was our fault or not, and as such we've learned not to make those same mistakes again. That learning experience to me seems very much part of keeping snakes.


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## nintendont (Feb 3, 2013)

Skippii said:


> As always, you make some very good points. I just wanted to add though, you say that getting bitten is not part of owning snakes. I have to disagree in a way. As snake owners, we've all been bitten at some point, whether it was our fault or not, and as such we've learned not to make those same mistakes again. That learning experience to me seems very much part of keeping snakes.


Yep, Im sure all the elapid keepers on here just love copping a tag and shrugging it off because 'its just a part of owning snakes'


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## Skippii (Feb 3, 2013)

nintendont said:


> Yep, Im sure all the elapid keepers on here just love copping a tag and shrugging it off because 'its just a part of owning snakes'



You make a good point lol but slightly flawed. People that keep elapids *generally* don't start out with their first snake being an elapid. They learn and pick up handling skills over time. I'd like you to find me an elapid keeper that has never been bitten by any snake (mainly when they were new to reptiles, likely a python bite). Plus, there are certainly people that do get bitten by elapids, and to quote someone I spoke to the other night that frequently handles them: "All elapid handlers know it's coming eventually". So I stand by what I said.


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## Renenet (Feb 3, 2013)

Alex72 said:


> whats the best way to get them off when they have bitten?



My stimmie hates F10 and pulls back from it every time I use it. So, when she bit me and held on one time, I sprayed her with diluted F10. She let go very quickly.


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## Davesgonefishin (Feb 3, 2013)

Whoah - I was giving my spotted 2 fuzzies & was still getting feeding aggressiveness so now on hoppers (after some advice from a very expereinced breeder) & he's now he's as happy as a pig in....& he looks half the size of your jungle (maybe eve less) so I would go with what longqi said as he would know!!!!


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## thomasssss (Feb 3, 2013)

IceWhiteFreak said:


> All the good points that i made had a few posters lost for words and saying they'll bow down to my supiour knowledge .


i think you took it all the wrong way , no ones really lost for words because they where good points so to say , just give it up mate , your coming across as an arrogant know it all , nothing more nothing less


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## Sleazy.P.Martini (Feb 3, 2013)

I think its more than fair to think you know more than somebody who has kept reptiles for 15 years longer than you've even been alive. This reminds me of someone else who recently, and constantly, liked to remind us of there 7 years experience lol


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## Davesgonefishin (Feb 3, 2013)

I love keyboard warriors


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## buffcoat (Feb 3, 2013)

Alex72 said:


> yeah, has happened to me twice now, same finger too :x I keep forgetting Friday is food day....
> 
> 
> 
> ...



A little dab of listerene or a dab of whiskey right near their mouth get em off ya every time. Remember, some snakes are ok with being in water and it doesn't faze them. 

My boa had my thumb in her mouth once (stupid feeding error), I had 180 perfect teeth marks. Water did not work. After she realized I wasn't food, she let go. My Cali King I had (RIP Sebastian, old age got him) latched and wrapped me a good one once, a lil dab of Bushmills was all it took. Guess he wanted some meat to go with his before dinner shot!


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## Firepac (Feb 3, 2013)

If you have an issue with a post someone makes do NOT respond in a similar manner, report it and let the mods deal with it.


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## J-A-X (Feb 3, 2013)

Enough of the arguing ! 
Thread now closed.


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