# Baby Rsp Setup



## Harry89 (Jan 22, 2017)

Hello All,

I'm a long time watcher and a soon to be mummy to a baby RSP, super excited! I just wanted to jump on and share my recently setup enclosure for the new little guy, proud as punch with how it's turned out and I hope he loves it and feels safe in his soon to be home! I'm not big on click clacks, so I have a little cube enclosure about 30 x 33cm in an ikea cube unit for insulation with a little heat pad under. I will be testing temps this week to be sure he will be warm, but in this QLD heat, I should be safe for now. Also have a little LED strip after seeing similar on another thread. He has an option of two hides and a branch that disappears into a bunch of fake leaves, so I'm hoping this will give him a variety of dark and light options along with plenty of temp regulating space. At the risk of criticism, do you like it and would you advise changing anything to keep a baby RSP happier? Thank you all, I appreciate your input as I have been waiting 13 years for this to happen!

Harry89


----------



## pythoninfinite (Jan 23, 2017)

I would certainly ditch the rock shelter - far too heavy and very dangerous if it falls on the animal. if you want a natural look, suitable pieces of bark are a much safer option, then if the snake moves it or you drop it, it won't have catastrophic consequences. I'd also get rid of the fibrous substrate - it will stick to the food items and the snake will either end up swallowing it, or getting it stuck in the mouth. Plain paper is much safer and more satisfactory for young pythons. probably a few more branches - Roughies are quite arboreal, so a bigger choice would be beneficial.

Jamie


----------



## Harry89 (Jan 23, 2017)

Hi Jamie, 

The rocks are all glued together and have a bracing along the back so its all three side and the top secured and solid, does that make a difference at all? I am also not intending to feed in the enclosure, but in a separate box to avoid the eating substrate concern and to help with handling being non food related. As for the branches, I can do, I have another ready at home, was just trying to avoid over crowding the enclosure so he can stretch and search if I cant get him out for a week or so, but can easily add another one that's forked as well.

Thank you for the info, I look forward to your reply, much appreciated.

Sarah


----------



## pythoninfinite (Jan 23, 2017)

It's a basic principle of mine to make sure that all enclosure furnishings are selected to minimise the risk of physical damage, and in any enclosure, unnecessarily heavy items are to be avoided at all costs. Not the most elegant item, but far safer (and probably more secure for your animal) are cardboard light globe boxes. That's why I suggest the use of suitable pieces of bark or a couple of pieces of hollowed branch, which would look far more natural than those commercial rock chunks. Of course it's your choice, but I wouldn't use the rocks - it's too easy to shift or drop something that heavy while the snake is under them.

I wouldn't worry about the ability to stretch - you'll find that the animal will very happily negotiate a quite complex environment, and will enjoy having a selection of branches to choose from, even though it will probably end up selecting a favourite to use most of the time. Especially while they are small and vulnerable, snakes don't like being too exposed, so young pythons usually stay concealed during the day - the wider range of shelters on offer, the better.

The matter of handling difficulties being related to offering food in the enclosure is greatly exaggerated. Being bitten while trying to remove the snake from an enclosure is likely much more related to the keeper's choice of times when cleaning duties or general handling is undertaken. I don't handle my snakes unnecessarily anyway, but I never clean enclosures or try to remove them when they are alert from late afternoon to after dark. Pythons are mostly semi- to nocturnal, and you'll be much more likely to cop a bite if you ignore that characteristic and play around with them after dark than if you take them out and do whatever you must do during the day. I wouldn't even change a water bowl in my GTP enclosures any time from dusk because I'd be sure to bleed, whereas I can do whatever I like with them during the day. I feed at night and leave them to their own devices, and clean during the day. Hope this helps...

Jamie


----------



## Harry89 (Jan 23, 2017)

Ok, I can remove the slate, that's ok and will add the other branches and find some bark instead. I was just aiming to give him choice and stimulation as I have a friend keeping one in a little click clack with a peanut butter lid for a water dish and a piece of bark as a hide, that's all, no branches or other hides, just a paper towel floor. I just feel he might like having different textures and places to hide and thought the slate good to help with sloughing and keeping heat better during the night for him.

I know there are mixed feelings on enclosure feeding and it's not him biting I'm worried about, I just want him healthy and to be content with some substrate to play in, like in the wild as they don't live on paper towel outside. Knowing the risks of compaction, external feeding was always my plan for him, and a little tub is easier to clean than the enclosure if the rodent leaks blood or makes a mess, cleanliness was part of the aim too.

I know he will have moody times (we all do hahahahaha), so I am hoping with time I will learn when he is willing to be handled and when not, I figure he will let me know and I have no intention of forcing him past any boundaries. Thank you again for the help.


----------



## pythoninfinite (Jan 23, 2017)

With all due respect, I think you're attributing a lot of your own sentiments when it comes to managing your snake - what do you mean by "substrate to play in?" Young snakes need security, food, water, reasonable temperature parameters and enclosure hygiene - not much more. The snake being raised in a plastic tub will very likely be just as healthy (maybe even more so) than one raised in a larger, more natural enclosure, because those needs are all very easily met in a tub, and all potential risks are minimised. You might find that as a hatchie, the young snake will be too stressed to feed if you haul it out of the enclosure and offer food. Very often the best way of feeding them is to simply offer food on tongs/forceps just at the entrance of the hide if they are inside it - any handling is disruptive and threatening, hence the use of paper towel as a substrate. Juvenile pythons do very little other than eat, digest, shed and grow, so while they are small, a click-clack is very suitable accommodation - this type of baby snake accommodation has revolutionised the successful raising of snake newborns in the last 20 years.

Jamie


----------



## Harry89 (Jan 23, 2017)

I am aware of the positives with captive pythons being in basic homes, knowing most end up living in sterile boxes with no view or interaction with the outside world with keepers worried about infection, I also see that often babies are kept in drawers. While this seems great for those breeding and selling, in my ignorance it seems almost cruel long term for them. I understand I am not able to ask snakes about preference of home and know long term practice yields certain results, my confusion however stems from our ability to take a wild animal and assume that after a few generations it won't care that it lives in a box on some paper. Humans often interfere and assume that if animals are eating and breeding they must by happy. I also am not wishing to speak out of turn, but feel I have address all of your listed criteria for a basic level of survival, but fail to see issue with attempting to replicate a natural surrounding that will prevent mental and physical boredom, hence the 'substrate to play in'. From reading the 'Keeping and Breeding Australian Pythons' handbook by Mike Swan, my interpretation was that RSP's are quite content in a variety of enclosure sizes and settings, showing versatility depending upon the options they were given. From a safety point of view, I will remove the main hide as suggested, thank you, but hope I am not being rude in suggesting that my 'sentiment' is with good intention toward a comfortable and somewhat fulfilling captive life for him. 

The previously mentioned click clack RSP hatchie is also fed outside her usual home in a specific feeding box and has never refused a meal from being moved in and out for the whole process, she also spends a lot of time out and about the house at all hours of day and night, being handled quite a lot by many individuals and shows no wariness or aggression at any time. Perhaps it is personality that determines if feeding and handling will be an issue? If there are any concerns with feeding however once settled in, I will indeed remove the substrate and attempt enclosure feeding to see if that helps. Would you view this as a healthy compromise on the setup, knowing he will have the final say?

There are just so many wonderful enclosures of extreme variety, theme and inclusions and differing methods to keeping reptiles that after years of evolution (with no noted issues of natural setups causing detrimental side effects), surely there is not simply one way to keep them safe and happy in captivity. Maybe also to note, having time being an owner of only one, I can dedicate more time to cleaning, observation and care than those with larger collections.

(I will keep an eye out for plastic tubs in the bush though, you never know, maybe that's where the base idea came from!) LOL


----------



## pythoninfinite (Jan 23, 2017)

I'm not trying to deter you from your chosen path Harry, but if I may be so bold, I think you're attributing your pet with a bit too much human sentiment. Snakes are, by choice, secretive creatures, and probably don't really appreciate a "view" as we humans do - indeed, a view probably means exposure, and therefore risk. In my (well over 50 years) experience keeping reptiles as pets and professionally, every one of my captives has done its best to avoid interaction with the outside world - in the bush they live under rocks and in hollow logs and under bits of tin and in long grass... I understand fully that you are aiming for environmental stimulation, and that's a good thing, but I doubt that a snake hatched in an incubator and raised in a tub laments the lack of a view, and it would certainly appreciate the lack of interaction with the "outside world," because the outside world is full of danger for a young snake. Similarly, I don't handle my snakes, except when necessary, because I know they simply tolerate it, they don't "enjoy" it. It is actually torture for a snake to be "handled day and night, quite a lot, by many individuals" as you describe. I would never allow that to be done to any of my animals - the best I do is let my Green Pythons crawl around on the grass outside once or twice a week because it forces this very lazy species to exercise (and usually defecate). Their environmental stimulation comes from my keeping pots of live plants in their enclosures, and changing them every couple of weeks. I've never seen snakes "play" in any kind of substrate, in fact I've never seen snakes "play" at all, not even baby snakes.

Each school of thought has its own merits, but I don't believe that a well-fed snake in a clean enclosure of any type with the correct temps and enough shelter to feel totally secure has the objectivity to lament not being in the bush. Life is what it is for them - we can only attempt by various means to keep them relaxed (rather than the human concept "happy") and healthy by whatever means we can. The best way to do that is to provide a safe and hazard-free enclosure, and minimise handling. Basically when all said & done, they like to be left alone.

Jamie


----------



## Harry89 (Jan 23, 2017)

Hi Jamie, 

Thank you for all your information, I will keep it all in mind and see how things pan out, you have given me a lot of things to watch out for long term, and I will assess as I go. Thank you.


----------

