# fox resuce



## Fuscus (Apr 24, 2012)

Coming next week - Cane toad rescue (Admin : we need a "this is so stupid I don't want to live in this world any more" smiley )
Fox Rescue


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Apr 24, 2012)

Its not such a bad thing. I think its cute and if they want to catch all the foxes and desex them, more power to them. As long as they dont get in my cross hairs, we'll get along fine


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## Daryl_H (Apr 24, 2012)

not sure if i agree ssssssnakeman it will still eat a hek of a lot of wild life in its life desex or not just line em up and sort em out with a nice broardhead


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## slim6y (Apr 24, 2012)

Out of curiosity (and only playing the devil's advocate) - how much feral wildlife do foxes kill? Surely rabbits would be high on a foxes list?

I understand that foxes destroy natives, I'm well and truly up on that... But surely they must do some damage to the feral population too?

Desexing is the wussy way for suggesting people didn't have the gnads to kill em'...

I was offered traps to catch some feral cats, and I asked would they euthanise them... The answer was no - they'd desex them and then re-release them!


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## Fuscus (Apr 24, 2012)

slim6y said:


> Out of curiosity (and only playing the devil's advocate) - how much feral wildlife do foxes kill? Surely rabbits would be high on a foxes list?


Actually there is the trifecta - cats, foxes and rabbits. Read http://www.environment.gov.au/biodiversity/invasive/publications/pubs/interaction.pdf , its long and you need a reasonble IQ but worth the effort


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## slim6y (Apr 24, 2012)

Fuscus said:


> Actually there is the trifecta - cats, foxes and rabbits. Read http://www.environment.gov.au/biodiversity/invasive/publications/pubs/interaction.pdf , its long and you need a reasonble IQ but worth the effort



Thanks - I'll give it a read later


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## Daryl_H (Apr 24, 2012)

thanks fuscus had a quick glance and save'd to read another day... grew up on a hobbie farm and lost alot of lambs to foxes and dogs 9 out of 11 one season. noticed once they started baiting foxes in lakes enterance (vic) the dramatic decline in lacies in the area... hate foxes with a force


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## Elapidae1 (Apr 24, 2012)

As a feral I hate them, as an animal I really like them. I'm not sure that the keeping of desexed fox's from the wild could increase a problem that's already out of control.
Personaly I like the idea of keeping them though I wouldn't advocate it until I'm better informed


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## Red_LaCN (Apr 24, 2012)

De-sexing foxes then releasing them?!?!?! Wot the ..... Offer a bounty on them. They wont be extinct. I like foxes,had a pet one myself years ago,but i know what they do on farms and its not nice nor is it pretty. Shoot em.


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## Elapidae1 (Apr 24, 2012)

I don't think it says anything about releasing them>

Seems like we could legally keep them here in WA too


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Apr 24, 2012)

Yes it does not saying anything about releasing them.I think they want to catch them,
neuter them,and then cage them for the duration of their lives


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## Jungletrans (Apr 24, 2012)

Anyone heard any more about the panic in Tassy ? A couple of years ago there was a suspected fox or two that made it over there . As for catch and neuter , I would prefer catch and skin . Lets start a new trend , wearing feral fur .


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## crocodile_dan (Apr 24, 2012)

While I'm personally unsure whether this is the right solution one could argue that by releasing desexed foxes they are contributing to the intraspecific competition without contributing to the reproduction of the species, thus acting as a form of population control. Every ecosystem has a carrying capacity so releasing non-sexually active dominant individuals may in fact reduce the propagation of sexually intact individuals. I am also unaware of the interspecific interaction they have with other predators such as feral cats and dogs, such that they could potentially contribute to the regulation of these population through indirect or direct competition.

Does the release of desexed mature foxes reduce the survival of immature foxes and thus the proportion of prey items that are native fauna? Does the complete removal of a fox from a territory enable an increase in available resources for conspecifics, thus resulting in an increased proportion of native fauna becoming preyed upon?

Do I think it is a good idea? No, weighing up the cost of capture and veterinary procedure plus man hours with the potential benefits (and negatives) there is most likely a far more efficient method of obtaining satisfactory population control.


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## Jeannine (Apr 25, 2012)

*still amazes me the amount of people who suggest cruelty to species of animals they dislike while complaining about cruelty committed by others on animals on reptiles

cruelty is cruelty and what is good for one is good for the other 
*


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## notechistiger (Apr 25, 2012)

Shooting an animal dead is not cruelty.


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## $NaKe PiMp (Apr 25, 2012)

when an animal is a threat to our biodiversity,its fair game to be knocked off


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## CaptainRatbag (Apr 25, 2012)

I agree.... desexing them is a great idea....

I think they should desex them with a 222cal or even something a little bigger 

In canberra a few years ago, on the lawns of the gov. generals house (mansion...acres, fully fenced, 3m high) the population of roo's became over the top. Rather than culling some off (no...no.... the wowsers saw to that.... too cruel).... they paid $3,000 per roo :shock: to have them (over 50 roos) moved to somewhere near Braidwood and released. First they terrified the roos by corraling them into a pen..... then they terrified them by physically catching them and man-handling them to give them a seditive to calm them down, then they terrified them by taking them 100km in a truck...... for release in NSW, where shooters were waiting to shoot them after they got off the truck


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## Firepac (Apr 25, 2012)

$NaKe PiMp said:


> when an animal is a threat to our biodiversity,its fair game to be knocked off



So lets knock off the biggest threat to our biodiversity.... us humans!


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## Fuscus (Apr 25, 2012)

Elapidae1 said:


> I don't think it says anything about releasing them...





ssssnakeman said:


> Yes it does not saying anything about releasing them.I think they want to catch them,
> neuter them,and then cage them for the duration of their lives


howfoxrescuebegan



notechistiger said:


> Shooting an animal dead is not cruelty.


It is a hell of a lot kinder than how the steak I had last night was treated - rounded up by helicopter, motorcycles and dogs, stuck in a crowded truck for _x_ number of days then forced to stand in line for its turn to be stunned and slit.


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## Elapidae1 (Apr 25, 2012)

Ah didn't read that bit, while I believe that euthing would be a better option than releasing, it still isn't increasing the problem if people release a neutered animal that came from the wild in the first place.

I don't have a problem with them being shot on sight it's the best option


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## Specks (Apr 25, 2012)

Fuscus said:


> howfoxrescuebegan
> 
> 
> It is a hell of a lot kinder than how the steak I had last night was treated - rounded up by helicopter, motorcycles and dogs, stuck in a crowded truck for _x_ number of days then forced to stand in line for its turn to be stunned and slit.



Ahh my friend, majority of cows are not stunned, proves inneffective through often thick hair and thick skulls
Bolt guns offer instant death/unconsciousness 

Works a lot better, ive seen it a few times


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## Elapidae1 (Apr 25, 2012)

Only if operated correctly. The captive bolt gun is designed to knock unconscious not kill


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## Fuscus (Apr 25, 2012)

Specks said:


> ...Bolt guns offer instant death/unconsciousness ...


Bolt guns are what I was referring to. I think ( and correct me if I am wrong ) that their purpose is stunning Captive bolt pistol


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## sacred_DUC (Apr 25, 2012)

whats point of rescues these are feral animals, are these animal libs for real lets get a thrill killer desex it and let it go, these latte sipping fools have no idea a fox will kill for the thrill killing multiple lambs but not eating any of them, at the moment foxes are in plague they are everywhere breeding like mice after the big floods, never seen them this bad to the point were u see them wandering over major highways during the day.


before the haters and cryers it was clean and fast kill, i don't believe in prolonging it's fate








33 foxes were shot in 10km range i feel sorry for farmers who lost so many lifestock after the floods then have foxes rip thier lambs up to further the misery. where are the animal libs now never see them helping farmers.


edit 3 sorry if this pic offends but this is good fox is a dead fox


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## snakehandler (Apr 25, 2012)

Lets not forget that apart from NSW they are a declared pest species and it is the land holders responsibility to control the populations. They are an animal that needs to be controlled, just as the brown tree snake in Guam needs to be! It still needs to be humane, but once injured they should be captured and euthanized. The same law applies to carp, mosquito fish and any other declared pest.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Specks (Apr 25, 2012)

Fuscus said:


> Bolt guns are what I was referring to. I think ( and correct me if I am wrong ) that their purpose is stunning Captive bolt pistol



Knocking unconscious by force is what I consider better than electrical
They call it stunning aswell but I hope fuscus your weren't referring to electrical stunning in cattle ?


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## solar 17 (Apr 25, 2012)

Some of you people should judge foxes after you witness a lamb crawling around with "some" of its stomach eaten away that then has to be put down see how you go then on adjusting your opinion....bloody tree huggers


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## scorps (Apr 25, 2012)

I love the pop noise cats and foxes make when you put lead through them haha 

All jokes aside though I've shot heaps of feral cats and foxes, imo anyone that says its cruel and wrong is either crazily ignorent or just very slow


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## Fuscus (Apr 26, 2012)

Specks said:


> Knocking unconscious by force is what I consider better than electrical
> They call it stunning aswell but I hope fuscus your weren't referring to electrical stunning in cattle ?


No - bolt stunning. Just to be clear, and since we appear to be talking across each other, I don't consider the act of stunning cruel. My original point was that being ( properly ) shot in the field is a lot less inhumane that round up, transport and processing


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## moosenoose (Apr 26, 2012)

I didn't read the article (I will) but the immediate thing that springs to mind is who's paying to have the foxes desexed?? 

I'll still shoot them :lol:


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## Shotta (Apr 26, 2012)

notechistiger said:


> Shooting an animal dead is not cruelty.



lol unless you shot the beejesuz out it with a .308 lol


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## GeckPhotographer (Apr 26, 2012)

Looks to me someone likes to do foxes and is offering that they will help people get rid of foxes in what that person sees as a more humane way. It'll only provide a way for people that don't want to see foxes killed a way to have them removed. I see no problem. *shrugs*


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## moosenoose (Apr 26, 2012)

I'm also with Sacred_DUC on the matter. The best way of dealing with a fox is fast and humane. The quicker the better. I get no joy out of shooting animals I’m not going to do anything with, and to be honest I tend to feel a little sorry for the old fox. Not the rabbit because he’s just so damned delicious! Shocking to be a shooter with a conscience at times, but it keeps me thinking about an animals welfare and that it’s not to suffer.

Seems that foxes aren’t considered a pest in NSW. I find that almost incredible. They are literally out of control here in Victoria and I’d gladly go out of my way to help anyone wanting to dispatch a few. Absolutely free of charge


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## Specks (Apr 26, 2012)

Ok fuscus good to know
I hate people saying "oh it must hurt them so much"
In all honestly its the least stresfull part of the whole process


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## Manda1032 (Apr 26, 2012)

we shoot and harvest Roos etc why not foxes? I kill cane toads, I kill mice and rats and If I catch your cat I'll kill it too! We are becoming a huge country of "politically correct Nancies"!


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## slim6y (Apr 26, 2012)

I remember a while back I posted an article from the newspaper up north about a fellow who shot a dog, on his property, mauling a wallaby... 

Do you know what happened?

That fellow had to go to court to defend himself against 'animal cruelty' charges.... 

Here's a link to that thread:
http://www.aussiepythons.com/forum/chit-chat-39/man-cruelty-charge-shooting-dog-158187/

Man on cruelty charge after shooting dog to save wallaby | The Courier-Mail (the article)

So - yes, I agree, Australia does seem to be a country of "politically correct nancies"!

Also note, in that very thread the actual shooter replies (kindly enough).


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## moosenoose (Apr 26, 2012)

That's exactly the sort of political correctness garbage Manda1032 is referring to!


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## Crystal..Discus (Apr 26, 2012)

I like how she advocates importing silver foxes into Australia like it'd be a great idea with no repercussions.


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## baxtor (Apr 26, 2012)

I remember one a few years ago, took off as soon as the light hit it, desexed it fair up the kyber with a 223 ballistic tip.
Only way to deal with an imported threat to our natives.


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## -Peter (Apr 26, 2012)

Manda1032 said:


> we shoot and harvest Roos etc why not foxes? I kill cane toads, I kill mice and rats and If I catch your cat I'll kill it too! We are becoming a huge country of "politically correct Nancies"!



No, politically correct is to shoot the fox, get it right.


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## Manda1032 (Apr 27, 2012)

snakehandler said:


> Lets not forget that apart from NSW they are a declared pest species and it is the land holders responsibility to control the populations. They are an animal that needs to be controlled, just as the brown tree snake in Guam needs to be! It still needs to be humane, but once injured they should be captured and euthanized. The same law applies to carp, mosquito fish and any other declared pest.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Yep... in QLD you need to have at least 100 acres before you can qualify for the 1080 baits and you have to put up signs in advance and put it in writing to all your neighbours your intent to bait so they can lock up their stupid dogs that probably roam (they all do around here) it turns out to be too much bs for the farmers and the people who have the actual problem with them can't cause the live on a half acre!!!!!
More needs to be done to control our pest species then freakin desexing and releasing them to kill more animals. I wanna know where they are getting their funding and have they thought of desexing domestic cats and dogs to stop the masses of unwanted animals there


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Apr 27, 2012)

1080 is not a nice way to die for a fox, usually taking between 4 and 6 hours, sometimes it will take up to 4 or 6 days.
There is lovely video showing a fox dying from 1080.
It is a time lapse video and I wont show it here or link it because it is so distressing.
You will have nightmares like i have.

And Manda, where does it say they are releasing the desexed foxes.


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## yeahbutno (Apr 27, 2012)

They arent releasing them into the wild. If you actually had a look at the website, you would have seen
Ps : i kinda want one


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## Manda1032 (Apr 27, 2012)

ssssnakeman said:


> 1080 is not a nice way to die for a fox, usually taking between 4 and 6 hours, sometimes it will take up to 4 or 6 days.
> There is lovely video showing a fox dying from 1080.
> It is a time lapse video and I wont show it here or link it because it is so distressing.
> You will have nightmares like i have.
> ...



How is that any different to Rat and Mouse baits that can take up to a week to die? 

Dunno about the release.... didn't read it all, too disgusted to think that we were desexing them and not just humanely euthanasing them. If they are keeping them in captivity holy crap the enclosures must be huge along with the food bill!


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## JUNGLE-JAK (Apr 27, 2012)

http://www.aussiepythons.com/forum/groups/bow-hunters-286/
join if you love bow hunting


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## Manda1032 (Apr 27, 2012)

oh and the link doesn't say a lot but for $50 you can adopt a fox to keep of your very own.... am I the only one saying WT...F????


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## JUNGLE-JAK (Apr 27, 2012)

foxes are pests, would you rather keep all foxes and let em kill the native wildlife, or cull them off humanely and save millions of native animals. every one is entitled to there opinion and dont necessarily have to agree with someone elses but i choose option 2, noone has to agree, but i stick by it like you stick by your opinion manda. and im not trying to start an argument by saying this.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Apr 27, 2012)

Foxes are pests and culling them all of them humanely would be best for everything, I agree with this. 
But a desexed fox kept in a cage is not a pest..even though i dont agree with keeping it captive as it seems silly, cruel and self indulgent to me


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## vampstorso (Apr 27, 2012)

Manda1032 said:


> How is that any different to Rat and Mouse baits that can take up to a week to die?
> 
> Dunno about the release.... didn't read it all, too disgusted to think that we were desexing them and not just humanely euthanasing them. If they are keeping them in captivity holy crap the enclosures must be huge along with the food bill!



Who said he agrees with mouse and rat baiting either? you can't justify something as something else just as awful exists.



Moving on, 
Culling is acceptable, taking a sick enjoyment too it is not. Pest or otherwise.


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## Kareeves (Apr 27, 2012)

***???? 

A free service offering an alternative to killing foxes when you find them injured or too young to survive.

Rescued wild foxes will be desexed and vaccinated while in my care. This prevents the spread of disease and stops future geneations of foxes from being born. 
It aids both native wildlife and foxes.


There is no alternative to killing foxes. All must die. DIE DIE DIE all foxes. How the hell dose desexing a fox aid endangerd wildlife of Australia. 
I wonder if we all went out and found a bunch of injured foxes ( rolf ) and sent them to them if they would try and save them because I think I could fined alot of injured foxes for our Australian Fox lovers. 
I just want to ad I like red Foxes in the UK i would love nothing more than to go to the UK and see a wild Red Fox.
I would just like to say again that in Australia All Red Foxes must die.


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## yeahbutno (Apr 27, 2012)

Everyones entitled to their own opinion. But would it be okay for someone to shoot your dogs and cats? Or bait them? Oh wait they have the 'pet' label so its okay

Not to mention were not even native to australia! Ask the indiginous about how well we are looking after the land. Weve done great for the 'native wildlife'.


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## JrFear (Apr 27, 2012)

i love foxes i might get one! =]

oh and i reckon more cars kill our native wildlife than foxes and cats combined!


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## -Peter (Apr 27, 2012)

The site says that no animal kills for fun, sorry but I can think of at least four, orca, dolphins, cats and us.
It also goes on to say that no exotic animals harm the environment. The people behind this are cloud brained dolts.


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## snakehandler (Apr 27, 2012)

I emailed them about their site and the misinformation on it...they were not too happy about it.


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## Manda1032 (Apr 27, 2012)

Yeahbutno said:


> Everyones entitled to their own opinion. But would it be okay for someone to shoot your dogs and cats? Or bait them? Oh wait they have the 'pet' label so its okay
> 
> Not to mention were not even native to australia! Ask the indiginous about how well we are looking after the land. Weve done great for the 'native wildlife'.



Ahh but technically even the Aboriginals are migrants! Now we are nit picking

I wanna know what they said Snakehandler

Oh and I'm sorry if I offended anyone. I'm just saying my opinion and giving other examples. I wasn't questioning others beliefs or opinions nor trying to change them



JUNGLE-JAK said:


> foxes are pests, would you rather keep all foxes and let em kill the native wildlife, or cull them off humanely and save millions of native animals. every one is entitled to there opinion and dont necessarily have to agree with someone elses but i choose option 2, noone has to agree, but i stick by it like you stick by your opinion manda. and im not trying to start an argument by saying this.



I agree with you... when didn't I?


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## borntobnude (Apr 27, 2012)

After chasing a fox around my backyard at 2am one morning with my peeking duck in its mouth i say a good fox is a dead fox , SA seem to have a problem with foxes but from observations they just need to build more roads and that will take care of them ( last xmas it was 1 fox every 50 mtrs )


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## sacred_DUC (Apr 27, 2012)

snakehandler said:


> I emailed them about their site and the misinformation on it...they were not too happy about it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



i just wasted 2 mins reading this site and can't believe how misleading this site is, foxes don't thrill kill foxes don't climb trees! um both false i've shot at foxes coming out of tree's and heard of stories by farmers of foxes sitting in tree's no surprising thier information comes from Animal Australia bunch of urban terrorist with no formal education in anything other then collecting thier dole payments.







was killed by fox as u can see not eaten just killed was this lamb was found with other lambing ewe, pic was taken by another shooter who had pretty decent night shooting 13 in that area whilst walking and whistling in foxes


yet another photo for veiwers discretion


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## Fuscus (Apr 29, 2012)

Manda1032 said:


> we shoot and harvest Roos etc why not foxes? I kill cane toads, I kill mice and rats and If I catch your cat I'll kill it too! We are becoming a huge country of "politically correct Nancies"!


All animals are not equal - at least in the eyes of the law. Post images of you feeding properly euthanased kittens to your snakes and expect lots of flak, including RSPCA and police. This happened to an APS member a few years ago. But if you feed live rats most people will go "Meh".



JrFear said:


> oh and i reckon more cars kill our native wildlife than foxes and cats combined!


 Have you got evidence to back this up? Cars are very bad for out wildlife but cars and foxes are worse



borntobnude said:


> ...build more roads and that will take care of them ( last xmas it was 1 fox every 50 mtrs )


 During spring when the kittens leave the den, huge numbers get run over but too many survive. I would prefer no road kill foxes because there are no foxes.



sacred_DUC said:


> ..was killed by fox as u can see not eaten just killed ..


Canidae don't have a killing bite like members of the Felidae family do. This translates into killing larger prey by holding them down and ripping into them, generally at the softer parts. The fox can't help it, blame whoever set-up the system  As foxes are easily scared off by humans it is very possible that the animal was disturbed before meal time.
The other endearing feature foxes have is that if they find a place where it is easy to kill (eg a chook coop) they will kill as many as possible, then try and take the "booty" away for burial and later consumption. In the case of a chook coop they are often disturbed before the take away process is completed (lots of noise and attention getting "BUK-BUK-BUKKING" during the killing phase) , hence the owner finds lots of dead chooks that appear to be killed for fun


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## -Peter (Apr 29, 2012)

People like to trot out the old "more things die from ..." spray. So what, we are talking about foxes. You want to start an anti car campaign go ahead but it doesn't stop foxes or cats from decimating native wildlife.


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## Manda1032 (Apr 29, 2012)

Fuscus said:


> All animals are not equal - at least in the eyes of the law. Post images of you feeding properly euthanased kittens to your snakes and expect lots of flak, including RSPCA and police. This happened to an APS member a few years ago. But if you feed live rats most people will go "Meh".
> 
> Have you got evidence to back this up? Cars are very bad for out wildlife but cars and foxes are worse
> 
> ...



I don't feed my babies rubbish... I kill cats who attack my birds. I breed birds


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## moosenoose (Apr 29, 2012)

borntobnude said:


> After chasing a fox around my backyard at 2am one morning with my peeking duck in its mouth i say a good fox is a dead fox , SA seem to have a problem with foxes but from observations they just need to build more roads and that will take care of them ( last xmas it was 1 fox every 50 mtrs )



Goes to show how out of control their numbers have become.


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## Frozenmouse (Apr 29, 2012)

I thought peeking duck was a dish not a breed.


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## slim6y (Apr 30, 2012)

Frozenmouse said:


> I thought peeking duck was a dish not a breed.



Definitely a type of duck...

Usually brown, featherless, (depending on the breed) headless.... Looks like this:







So - what would be wrong with a fox having one of those in its mouth? Clearly it's not endemic or native to Australia... Unless Peeking is in South Australia (which I guess is possible)...


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## smeejason (Apr 30, 2012)

plenty of these types of video on you tube 
Fox bites wallaby - YouTube


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