# What can you tell me about Blue tongues?



## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

Hi all, I need some guidance... I have a couple of resident blue tongues that live on my residential block in the suburbs, it's a 752 square m block that was built on back in 1975 and the gardens beds that border the front and back yards are very well established. I first discovered the blue tongues presence not long after moving in as my Jack Russell Terriers soon located them whilst fossicking about in the garden beds like Jacks do... I set a few live capture rat trap cages and successfully caught them within a couple of hours with the intention of moving them out of harms way and out to the front of the block where the Jacks don't have access.... So I did and let them go...


Several months later, I caught them again back in the original spot...


And now today I've caught one again, 3 hours ago I released it...


Now just 10 mins ago I heard a huge commotion out the back and my 2 daughters screaming "daddy daddy Alaska is chasing a big lizard!" I flew out the back door and here it is again... walking back from the front garden across the back yard in the direction of where it's always been trapped...


Thankfully my Jacks are VERY obedient and once called off, he stood his ground without harming the bluey but I'm concerned for its future... Are they just going to keep coming back no matter how many times I move them out of harms way?? I have nothing against Blueys, I think they're fantastic, I do have garden snails about the place so really it's a bluey heaven but I don't want the Jacks getting them... or hurting them. Although, I guess if it was going to happen, it'd have happened by now...

So, do they have quite a large home territory or something? I don't want to like take them on a drive 10km away and let them go, I'm moving them like probably 50m and it's obviously not working out. LOL They seem pretty determined to stick around. Sounds like a stupid problem to have but I'm only wanting what's best for these cool skinks.

EDIT* I tied the Jacks up and grabbed the Bluey and released it back where it was trapped, hoping it will disappear for now... I'll leave the dogs tied up for another hour to give it a head-start and I'm not really sure what else to do.


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## Nero Egernia (Jan 28, 2018)

Yes, they do have home territories. More often than not, they'll try to find their way home. Removing and then replacing in a new area can present all sorts of problems for the skinks. They may not know where to find food. They'll be vulnerable to predation while searching for a secure shelter or their original territory. They'll come into direct competition with the current resident lizards. What's best for the skinks would be to keep your dogs out of the yard, or to train them to avoid the native wildlife.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

OK, what I'll do is run an electric wire along the edge of the garden beds... That'll at least keep the dogs out of them and hopefully they don't venture out onto the lawn area. I trust they don't wander around at all after dusk?


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## Bl69aze (Jan 28, 2018)

Well... they have a blue tongue and their poop stinks..


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

Bl69aze said:


> Well... they have a blue tongue and their poop stinks..


Yes they do and yes it does... it dropped a black tar like poop in the trap and it reeked! Had to hose it out.


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## dragonlover1 (Jan 28, 2018)

One of the unfortunate things about Jack Russells is they are hunters, they will kill anything they come across.Our last one killed many blueys and creek skinks.Miniature Jacks are used by farmers to hunt rats because they are small enough to crawl down the burrows.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

dragonlover1 said:


> One of the unfortunate things about Jack Russells is they are hunters, they will kill anything they come across.Our last one killed many blueys and creek skinks.Miniature Jacks are used by farmers to hunt rats because they are small enough to crawl down the burrows.


I agree, Mine have dispatched several brown snakes... Training them to not touch skinks or snakes would be like trying to hold back the wind... It just won't happen. Mine are the short-legged breed and they do fit down fox and rabbit holes easily.


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## Ramsayi (Jan 28, 2018)

Ours move around from the back to the front yard in the hotter weather (think it's cooler on the southern side of the house) then into the back yard after the hottest months.They have been doing this for over 10 years now and are the best fed wild blueys in Australia.They get fruit salad fairly often along with small mice occasionally.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

Ramsayi said:


> Ours move around from the back to the front yard in the hotter weather (think it's cooler on the southern side of the house) then into the back yard after the hottest months.They have been doing this for over 10 years now and are the best fed wild blueys in Australia.They get fruit salad fairly often along with small mice occasionally.


Thanks mate, what sort of size is the home range that 1 female Bluey would occupy?? I have a suspicion that this one has learned where my outdoor woody bin is because it was trapped behind it today. The trap is there for rats which I normally catch raiding my woody bin. I've got tens of them... 












I was surprised to see the Bluey back in there today though but I'd rather catch them than the dogs catch them.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 28, 2018)

On a side note that Blue Tongue looks very fat and is possibly gravid, you may have another ten or so to worry about shortly.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> On a side note that Blue Tongue looks very fat and is possibly gravid, you may have another ten or so to worry about shortly.


Hi Rob, thanks.... Do the young hang around or disperse?


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## SpottedPythons (Jan 28, 2018)

They'll stick around a couple of weeks then disperse. Depends on how many blue tongues there are and the food supply.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

SpottedPythons said:


> They'll stick around a couple of weeks then disperse. Depends on how many blue tongues there are and the food supply.


Thanks man. I'll have to Jack-proof the perimeters and give the little dudes a free passage.


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## dragonlover1 (Jan 28, 2018)

Ramsayi said:


> Ours move around from the back to the front yard in the hotter weather (think it's cooler on the southern side of the house) then into the back yard after the hottest months.They have been doing this for over 10 years now and are the best fed wild blueys in Australia.They get fruit salad fairly often along with small mice occasionally.


haha sounds like my daughters place in Noosa,she has a female? that comes to the back door looking for food,my grandkids eat lots of fruit so there is always plenty around.
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Aussiepride83 said:


> OK, what I'll do is run an electric wire along the edge of the garden beds... That'll at least keep the dogs out of them and hopefully they don't venture out onto the lawn area. I trust they don't wander around at all after dusk?


Blue tongues are like most lizards as in being diurnal


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

dragonlover1 said:


> Blue tongues are like most lizards as in being diurnal


Awesome. The Jacks do periodical boundary patrols all night but as long as the skinks are hunkered down somewhere, they'll be out of harms way. 

PS. Noosa is my home away from home... Samara place, Noosa heads... I'm there at least once every coupe of months.  top part of the country. September last year I was escorted off the Noosa dog beach by police after my Jack Russells whipped a couple of Mastiffs. LOL


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## Wally (Jan 28, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> September last year I was escorted off the Noosa dog beach by police after my Jack Russells whipped a couple of Mastiffs. LOL



I don't like seeing this kind of talk. I had a Jack Russell cross a creek several years ago to attack my amstaff and if it wasn't for his training and loyalty I would have been plastered all over the news.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

Wally said:


> I don't like seeing this kind of talk. I had a Jack Russell cross a creek several years ago to attack my amstaff and if it wasn't for his training and loyalty I would have been plastered all over the news.


Hey mate, unfortunately in this instance the mastiffs were at fault and they invaded our space on the beach and interrupted a game of fetch we were playing... my youngest who was 5 at the time was absolutely terrified by the big dogs and the Jacks were defending her. The owner was previously warned twice to control her dogs and she failed to take notice. The third time they interfered, the Jacks did what Jacks do and the rest is history. I was interviewed by the police over the incident and not charged with anything as I have video footage and several photographs of the event unfolding. It was actually myself that called the police to the beach after what happened as I was a little concerned about what the owners of the mastiffs were going to do in retaliation.


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## Wally (Jan 28, 2018)

Fair enough AP. 

If your your dogs were on the defense I don't disagree.

Your original post could be construed otherwise though.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

Wally said:


> Fair enough AP.
> 
> If your your dogs were on the defense I don't disagree.
> 
> Your original post could be construed otherwise though.


I understand... The people involved that day made a huge scene when I first went onto the beach because I had all the Jacks on leads... for obvious reason... They told me that "this is an off leash dog beach, don't come here unless you're going to let your dogs off leash..." I told her politely to mind her own business... and that I'll do with my dogs what I see fit... I kept them leashed, we were only playing fetch in the shore dump... Jacks don't even stand 12' high so they were quite happy and this idiot and her 3 huge retrievers and mastiffs were rushing in from 40 odd meters away... after my daughter screamed, all bets were off...

Here she was happily approaching us to hurl abuse and tell me how her dogs could do what they want and go where they want and how it was her beach...


After she kept coming... I cut the Jacks loose and they bolted the lead dog and ... such is life.
My Jacks defended their own. It doesn't matter what it is or how big it is, Jacks don't take sh*t from anything. They're a no nonsense breed and are like fire crackers 24/7. My wife is from South Africa and their Jacks over there regularly bolted Lions that came too close. It has been said that the only thing that can submit a Jack Russell Terrier is another Jack Russell Terrier.


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## Buggster (Jan 28, 2018)

Jacks are nutty dogs for sure.
Had a jackxfoxy pup (must have been 6months old) who managed to kill and tear apart a huge goanna when I was a kid. Dog barely had a scratch on her. Absolute crazy thing- she was scarily good at jumping up and grabbing birds (I swear that dog had springs for legs) and shredding them. 


Coming from the opposite end of the dogscale (having two German Shepherds), I’ve got to say you seem to get off lightly. Usually I’m being asked to leave the off leash park (or put my dog on lead) because they’re German shepherds and obviously aggressive killer dogs. My girl is the laziest thing ever- she’ll keep close to me and just sniff around. I’m a bit scared of small dogs having been attacked by them on several occasions. My girl knows and will stick with me and will move other dogs out of my space (she’ll walk them off). One time a little poodle x was really harassing my dog (jumping on her, nipping at her face, barking...) and had moved on to doing that to me. I guess my girl snapped and she chased it off- literally just rushed at the dog to scare it away, she didn’t move far enough away that I couldn’t touch her.

Anyway, owner comes up to me and tells me my ‘crazy aggressive killer German Shepherd’ should be ‘on a leash or taken away’ or she’ll ‘call the cops’.

It got bad enough id have someone hounding me to leave every time I went- sometimes before I had the chance to unclip her leash. Just because she’s a ‘scary’ dog and they can’t control they’re barking nightmares.

Hate how the aggressors are painted as the ‘victims’ in most cases.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 28, 2018)

Buggster said:


> Jacks are nutty dogs for sure.
> Had a jackxfoxy pup (must have been 6months old) who managed to kill and tear apart a huge goanna when I was a kid. Dog barely had a scratch on her. Absolute crazy thing- she was scarily good at jumping up and grabbing birds (I swear that dog had springs for legs) and shredding them.
> 
> 
> ...


I've also got Shepherd's mate, grew up with them all my life, Jacks and shepherd's are (as far as I'm concerned) the 2 toughest dog breeds on the planet... If a Jack was the same size as a shepherd though, the shepherd would cop a freaking towelling... Check this out... (Not my video but pretty much exactly how it is...) Read the comments. LOL


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## Nero Egernia (Jan 29, 2018)

dragonlover1 said:


> One of the unfortunate things about Jack Russells is they are hunters, they will kill anything they come across.Our last one killed many blueys and creek skinks.Miniature Jacks are used by farmers to hunt rats because they are small enough to crawl down the burrows.





Aussiepride83 said:


> I agree, Mine have dispatched several brown snakes... Training them to not touch skinks or snakes would be like trying to hold back the wind... It just won't happen. Mine are the short-legged breed and they do fit down fox and rabbit holes easily.





Buggster said:


> Jacks are nutty dogs for sure.
> Had a jackxfoxy pup (must have been 6months old) who managed to kill and tear apart a huge goanna when I was a kid. Dog barely had a scratch on her. Absolute crazy thing- she was scarily good at jumping up and grabbing birds (I swear that dog had springs for legs) and shredding them.



That's a poor attitude to have. It's not dissimilar to irresponsible cat owners allowing their pets to free roam. Excuses that "killing things is part of their nature" is no reason to allow your pet to kill wildlife. Seeing as it's near impossible to train cats the only solution is to confine them indoors or in a cat run. Dogs can be trained, however. Or at the very least only allow them into the yard while under supervision. It sounds as though your dogs will attack and kill any small creatures that crosses their paths. That's the impression I get when I read such posts.


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## cement (Jan 29, 2018)

I had a neighbour whose jack Russell used to roam, he was a lovely dog, but I occasionally have snakes out on my lawn. he was quite easily trained to leave then alone, and we never had an issue. I could confidently have snakes out while he was around.
it is possible to train them, and I highly recommend it, I know of two jack Russells killed by black snakes last season. I caught and removed one of the snakes, I got it on the second call out, and thought it would have had an injury, but it was uninjured.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Nero Egernia said:


> That's a poor attitude to have. It's not dissimilar to irresponsible cat owners allowing their pets to free roam. Excuses that "killing things is part of their nature" is no reason to allow your pet to kill wildlife. Seeing as it's near impossible to train cats the only solution is to confine them indoors or in a cat run. Dogs can be trained, however. Or at the very least only allow them into the yard while under supervision. It sounds as though your dogs will attack and kill any small creatures that crosses their paths. That's the impression I get when I read such posts.


I'm not going to argue with you about a hunting breed that has been bred for hundreds of years to hunt, and mine ARE working dogs that are used on foxes, wild dogs and feral cats and pigs...

Tracking wild dogs in the Sunny coast hinterland.



A Jack's nature is very hard to explain to someone who's never kept them before. The key to Jacks is daily exercise and allowing them to burn off that endless energy. I run mine 5km twice daily and give them all the stimulation they need. If you wish to label me an irresponsible pet owner, well that's just a ridiculous misinformed statement.. If you knew anything about the breed you would know that confining them indoors is not an option, not every breed is a mopey lapdog like a King Charles Cavalier hence why I've restricted their access to the rear of the block only and not the front as well, There are further means I can take (as mentioned I will run an electric wire along the garden beds where I know the blueys frequent) The Jacks know what the electric wire means and will steer clear of it.
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cement said:


> I had a neighbour whose jack Russell used to roam, he was a lovely dog, but I occasionally have snakes out on my lawn. he was quite easily trained to leave then alone, and we never had an issue. I could confidently have snakes out while he was around.
> it is possible to train them, and I highly recommend it, I know of two jack Russells killed by black snakes last season. I caught and removed one of the snakes, I got it on the second call out, and thought it would have had an injury, but it was uninjured.


That's awesome mate, but my Jacks don't roam (they're in their own yard) and one Jack Russell isn't the same as a pack of them... The last Brown they got would be over a year ago now and it was in 9 pieces, (I won't post those pics up)... Haven't lost one yet. The odds are stacked highly in a Jack's favour when it comes to snake encounters. Given where I currently live and the fact I have 2 small daughters who regularly play out in the back yard and gardens, the Jacks are there to look after them too. I'll take my dogs getting a snake before my daughters wind up accidentally bit looking for their ball in the garden any day... my kid's aren't plonked in front of the TV or X-box all day like most today are... They actually go outside and get dirty. I would happily stop snakes from getting into my yard (but those snake repellers are garbage) rather than trying to stop the Jacks from doing their job... Protecting.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> I understand... The people involved that day made a huge scene when I first went onto the beach because I had all the Jacks on leads... for obvious reason... They told me that "this is an off leash dog beach, don't come here unless you're going to let your dogs off leash..." I told her politely to mind her own business... and that I'll do with my dogs what I see fit... I kept them leashed, we were only playing fetch in the shore dump... Jacks don't even stand 12' high so they were quite happy and this idiot and her 3 huge retrievers and mastiffs were rushing in from 40 odd meters away... after my daughter screamed, all bets were off...
> 
> Here she was happily approaching us to hurl abuse and tell me how her dogs could do what they want and go where they want and how it was her beach...
> View attachment 323025
> ...


If you can't let your dogs off their leads "for obvious reason" as stated by yourself, you shouldn't be at an off leash dog beach. Also if you weren't at fault then why were you escorted off the beach and not the other way around? Doesn't really make sense.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> If you can't let your dogs off their leads "for obvious reason" as stated by yourself, you shouldn't be at an off leash dog beach. Also if you weren't at fault then why were you escorted off the beach and not the other way around? Doesn't really make sense.


Makes plenty of sense, Jacks' are unsociable when approached by other dogs and I was doing the right thing. Off leash means its permitted not a requirement/condition of entry.. I asked to be escorted off the beach and back to my vehicle so I had witness. Also, the police lodged a formal complaint with the Noosa Council over those involved and their dogs behaviour. I was contacted by Noosa Council the same day and asked to submit a report and include a veterinary report also if my animals were injured, (which they were not). She was apparently issued with an infringement and a fine as your dogs are allowed off-leash on the beach so long as they do not interfere with other beach-goers and their animals. 
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Buggster said:


> Jacks are nutty dogs for sure.
> Had a jackxfoxy pup (must have been 6months old) who managed to kill and tear apart a huge goanna when I was a kid. Dog barely had a scratch on her. Absolute crazy thing- she was scarily good at jumping up and grabbing birds (I swear that dog had springs for legs)



Yeah mate, no fear, no limits... Check out this leap of faith... Lure training off the waterfall into the backyard pool...


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## Buggster (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> I've also got Shepherd's mate, grew up with them all my life, Jacks and shepherd's are (as far as I'm concerned) the 2 toughest dog breeds on the planet... If a Jack was the same size as a shepherd though, the shepherd would cop a freaking towelling... Check this out... (Not my video but pretty much exactly how it is...) Read the comments. LOL




It would be a terrifying world if jacks were any bigger than they were. My girl copped it from a little foxy who was 12, half blind and deaf and probably 1/5 of her size. Hilarious watching this tiny dog whip a giant shepherds butt.




Nero Egernia said:


> That's a poor attitude to have. It's not dissimilar to irresponsible cat owners allowing their pets to free roam. Excuses that "killing things is part of their nature" is no reason to allow your pet to kill wildlife. Seeing as it's near impossible to train cats the only solution is to confine them indoors or in a cat run. Dogs can be trained, however. Or at the very least only allow them into the yard while under supervision. It sounds as though your dogs will attack and kill any small creatures that crosses their paths. That's the impression I get when I read such posts.



I’m sorry I didn’t train my dog better when I was 3?

And with the current dogs it’s not a huge issue- they’ll go after rats (and fail) but will generally leave everything alone (or only chase it from their yard). But if something were to come into their yard, I wouldn’t be overly upset if they did kill it. They’re shepherds, they want to ‘protect’ their home and I don’t want to train that out of them (if that’s even possible...). If something comes into their home, it’s fair game- much like if a skink decided the cat run looked like a good home. Would you blame the cat for killing a skink inside the cat run?

The worst they’ve gotten has been a rat- and we’ve had a few very near misses with the neighbours cat. But they’re inside at night so possum have free run of the yard, and during the day they leave thr lizards and turkeys alone. Well... not completely- we used to have Australorps and my girl keeps trying to herd the turkeys into the chicken coop, but she’s a shepherd who’s grown up with chooks, she’s not likely to touch something that looks like a chook...


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Buggster said:


> But if something were to come into their yard, I wouldn’t be overly upset if they did kill it. They’re shepherds, they want to ‘protect’ their home and I don’t want to train that out of them (if that’s even possible...). If something comes into their home, it’s fair game- much like if a skink decided the cat run looked like a good home. Would you blame the cat for killing a skink inside the cat run?


I agree mate, rather than trying to manipulate my dog's behaviour and turn them into useless good for nothing layabouts, I much rather keep them the way they are BUT at the same time take alternative measures to provide a safe haven/passage for any encroaching wildlife. This is far more practical and desirable for my personal situation. 

Last thing I want is a pack of Jacks tearing through the scrub after a pig or fox and smell a snake and come running out yelping like scolded poodles.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> I'm not going to argue with you about a hunting breed that has been bred for hundreds of years to hunt, and mine ARE working dogs that are used on foxes, wild dogs and feral cats


They may have been used for hunting for hundreds of years, but they still need to be taught to hunt. It isn't something that just happens. It is similar to Pitbulls that get labelled as a 'fighting dog'.
They aren't born to fight and are therefore aggresive, it is something that is taught to them.
Just like Jacks and hunting, once taught they do enjoy it but it isn't something that comes naturally with birth.


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## Bl69aze (Jan 29, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> They may have been used for hunting for hundreds of years, but they still need to be taught to hunt. It isn't something that just happens. It is similar to Pitbulls that get labelled as a 'fighting dog'.
> They aren't born to fight and are therefore aggresive, it is something that is taught to them.
> Just like Jacks and hunting, once taught they do enjoy it but it isn't something that comes naturally with birth.


I don’t understand this one bit. My uncles friend breeds bull Arabs and gave one to my uncle at 3months old, once he reached about a year old he started “pointing” and barking at animals in the trees of the Bush behind their house that you wouldn’t see unless u had binoculars . No training required. Just instinct

Meanwhile my Boston terrier wouldn’t touch a fly and would rather lick a kitten.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> They may have been used for hunting for hundreds of years, but they still need to be taught to hunt. It isn't something that just happens. It is similar to Pitbulls that get labelled as a 'fighting dog'.
> They aren't born to fight and are therefore aggresive, it is something that is taught to them.
> Just like Jacks and hunting, once taught they do enjoy it but it isn't something that comes naturally with birth.


You clearly don't know anything about Jacks. Lol


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## vampstorso (Jan 29, 2018)

It seems the main reason a Jack would "win" against a larger dog is simply the larger being less aggressive, following command with better behaviour, or confused.

Many times small dogs started on my American bulldog. She would ignore them, look at them puzzled and back off.
A dog of similar or larger size started on her, and she'd go in to end them unless told otherwise. Totally left other species alone.

She never started anything but she'd finish it.
Not a trait I loved nor trained, she came from a hoarding situation after being dumped as a puppy which I believe lead to that.




Regarding instinct,
I must say I've never really seen instinct in a dog the majority of the time.
But my mind was changed just a week ago.
Brought home an 8 week old Maremma who instantly guarded the kids, and lays at the perimeter, puts herself back in the yard and won't cross half way down the driveway. She fascinates me.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> You clearly don't know anything about Jacks. Lol


They are still a dog. A Shepard isn't a security dog until trained, a Labrador isn't a guide dog until trained.
As most dogs do unless trained not to, Jacks will chase something for fun but won't be a hunter unless trained to do so.
I had a Pitbull that would point and fixate on things but this was encouraged by me with tone, excitement in my voice and words like "what's that" and is not something that came naturally.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> They are still a dog. A Shepard isn't a security dog until trained


Definitely disagree with that 100%


Scutellatus said:


> They are still a dog. A Shepard isn't a security dog until trained, a Labrador isn't a guide dog until trained.
> As most dogs do unless trained not to, Jacks will chase something for fun but won't be a hunter unless trained to do so.
> I had a Pitbull that would point and fixate on things but this was encouraged by me with tone, excitement in my voice and words like "what's that" and is not something that came naturally.


Again... you clearly know nothing about Jack's... your comments are poiintless.
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vampstorso said:


> It seems the main reason a Jack would "win" against a larger dog is simply the larger being less aggressive, following command with better behaviour, or confused.
> 
> Many times small dogs started on my American bulldog. She would ignore them, look at them puzzled and back off.
> A dog of similar or larger size started on her, and she'd go in to end them unless told otherwise.


fortunately there's not many larger dogs stupid enough to take on the wrath of a Jack. My boy has been into a bull terrier,, staffy's, burmese mountain dog, greyhound, german shepherd, bull mastiff, dalmatioon, golden retriever, and several others all many times his size... the thing is, Jack's do not know they're small, they're bred bold and fearless.. take a look on YouTube, you can see them used to take on lions, cheetahs, bears... doesn't matter what it is, that's why they're so popular and why I love them... I've had many large dogs but at some point they've all known fear... Jack's know no fear, if you jumped off a cliff, your Jack would jump with you. Best dogs going. 7.5 kilos of heart. Loyal companions, fearless protectors. Complete package.


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## vampstorso (Jan 29, 2018)

Sounds good. Great you enjoy your dogs so much. 

I admit to being bias and favour large dogs, so my views will be far from balanced.


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

I love large dogs, I dislike small ones. Of any dogs I'd either get an Irish wolfhound or Chinese crested.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

vampstorso said:


> Sounds good. Great you enjoy your dogs so much.
> 
> I admit to being bias and favour large dogs, so my views will be far from balanced.


That's totally cool, I'm biased too, we all are... I have large shepherds and Jacks, I keep them both so I love them both... I just know who wears the pants from experience that's all. lol
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Imported_tuatara said:


> I love large dogs, I dislike small ones. Of any dogs I'd either get an Irish wolfhound or Chinese crested.


I never thought I'd own small dogs, always thought they were useless, my wife changed that when I met her Jacks, now I'm all for Jacks... they're just so gutsy. Don't get me wrong, I'd never own a pomeranian or chihuahua or those pugs and crap like that LOL


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

I worded that wrongly, I dislike keeping small dogs usually. i don't mind them in general other than very little dogs like chihuahuas. Chihuahuas are the scariest things ever.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Chihuahuas talk a big game but then they can't back it up.


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## Buggster (Jan 29, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> They are still a dog. A Shepard isn't a security dog until trained, a Labrador isn't a guide dog until trained.
> As most dogs do unless trained not to, Jacks will chase something for fun but won't be a hunter unless trained to do so.
> I had a Pitbull that would point and fixate on things but this was encouraged by me with tone, excitement in my voice and words like "what's that" and is not something that came naturally.




I’ll believe this when you teach a border collie to hunt or a bloodhound to herd. 
Breeds have natural instincts to do what they were bred for (you’ll often see collies ‘herding’, pointers ‘pointing’, hounds ‘tracking’, shepherds ‘guarding’ and so on... without any training whatsoever.)

You train the ‘command’ in order to refine it, control it and/or modify it to suit your needs.

So a trained security dog might be taught to bite arms and ‘take down’ an intruder, while my girl will bark and bite whatever she feels like biting.

A Labrador isn’t a ‘natural’ guide dog- thus why they must have extensive training to be made guide dogs (they are retrievers after all...). And FYI it was the GSD who was the first guide dogs, but they were eventually disused as they have a higher aggression than Labs.

Jacks can take on anything and everything because that’s how they were bred. It’s in their genetic code to be little nutters. High drive, high pain tolerance, high determination, low fear... in all a little dog who thinks he’s a lion. They won’t look before they leap because that’s how’re they’re bred (because a dog has to be pretty insane to take on a predator twice their size as they were bred to).


To reply to vamp’s statement of a bulldog who won’t bother with small dogs, again, how they were bred to be. They’re bred to hang off bulls, not bother with rabbits. They don’t have a very high prey drive at all so a small dog is hardly a bother to them.


And to bring up the pitbull debate (oh boy, here we go...).
The American Pitbull Terrier was a born fighting dog. High aggression, high drive, high determination, high pain tolerance... they were not bred as ‘pet’ dogs. No one in their right mind would want one as a pet- they were bred to kill and kill and kill. Most ‘pitbulls’ around today are staffy mutts- and no one in Aus has a ‘real’ APBT- any I’ve seen are staffyx, amstaffx, bulldogx or mastiffx. I’m willing to bet over 90% of ‘pitbulls’ don’t have a single drop of real APBT blood in them.
[doublepost=1517192581,1517192491][/doublepost]


Imported_tuatara said:


> I worded that wrongly, I dislike keeping small dogs usually. i don't mind them in general other than very little dogs like chihuahuas. Chihuahuas are the scariest things ever.



I work with GSDs including handler aggressive rescue dogs.

Only dogs I’ve ever been bitten by was a spaniel, chi, and some Maltese mix. And the neighbours shiba has a thing about biting my shoes...


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Buggster said:


> I’ll believe this when you teach a border collie to hunt or a bloodhound to herd.
> Breeds have natural instincts to do what they were bred for (you’ll often see collies ‘herding’, pointers ‘pointing’, hounds ‘tracking’, shepherds ‘guarding’ and so on... without any training whatsoever.)
> 
> You train the ‘command’ in order to refine it, control it and/or modify it to suit your needs.
> ...


Dude, you are on my level...RIGHT ON! Well said!

The Only dogs I've ever been bitten by were 2X Blue heelers, 1X red heeler, 1X Rottweiler and 1X Border collie. My Jacks will not bite another human unless you physically abuse the hell out of them... I was walking in public minding my own business on all occasions when I was bitten by large dogs. Still have the scars.

Anddddd... a pedigree Jack would belt the living p*ss out of any Aussie "pit-bull" any day.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 29, 2018)

Buggster said:


> I’ll believe this when you teach a border collie to hunt or a bloodhound to herd.
> Breeds have natural instincts to do what they were bred for (you’ll often see collies ‘herding’, pointers ‘pointing’, hounds ‘tracking’, shepherds ‘guarding’ and so on... without any training whatsoever.)
> 
> You train the ‘command’ in order to refine it, control it and/or modify it to suit your needs.
> ...


I have the paperwork to prove my dog was 100% Pitbull, sixth generation charts that go back to America. They are not bred to kill, kill, kill as you say. This is something taught when young.
No-one in their right mind hey, do some research before making bold statements like that. My dog was as aggressive as a Labrador, not a killing machine as you make them out to be.
Yes there are a lot of crossed mutts, but these don't meet the breed standard, most being a lot shorter and a lot less stocky.


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## Buggster (Jan 29, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> I have the paperwork to prove my dog was 100% Pitbull, sixth generation charts that go back to America. They are not bred to kill, kill, kill as you say. This is something taught when young.
> No-one in their right mind hey, do some research before making bold statements like that. My dog was as aggressive as a Labrador, not a killing machine as you make them out to be.
> Yes there are a lot of crossed mutts, but these don't meet the breed standard, most being a lot shorter and a lot less stocky.



There’s no ‘legitimate’ registery that will register ABPTs. Only the UKC which is a well known sham registry (I think someone registered a stuffed dog on there as well as several other non dogs, all as ‘purebred pitbulls’).

And yes, I do know a thing or two about dogs having worked in competive obedience, agility, rally-o as well as having had the pleasure of watching the training of military dogs as they demonstrated their bite work.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Jack in South Africa... Legit. Lions don't f with them.


Still in South Africa... Cobras, no worries.


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## Buggster (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Dude, you are on my level...RIGHT ON! Well said!
> 
> The Only dogs I've ever been bitten by were 2X Blue heelers, 1X red heeler, 1X Rottweiler and 1X Border collie. My Jacks will not bite another human unless you physically abuse the hell out of them... I was walking in public minding my own business on all occasions when I was bitten by large dogs. Still have the scars.
> 
> Anddddd... a pedigree Jack would belt the living p*ss out of any Aussie "pit-bull" any day.



They sure are nuts. Was told by a friend who went to a kennel to pick up a pup that as he passed by each kennel, he would have sworn the jacks had trampolines as flooring as they were jumping up to his eye level.

I’m not a small dog person, but they’d certainly be my first small dog choice if it ever came to that.
[doublepost=1517194250,1517194144][/doublepost]


Aussiepride83 said:


> Jack in South Africa... Legit. Lions don't f with them.




Omg lol that pup schooled those lions xD


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Buggster said:


> They sure are nuts. Was told by a friend who went to a kennel to pick up a pup that as he passed by each kennel, he would have sworn the jacks had trampolines as flooring as they were jumping up to his eye level.
> 
> I’m not a small dog person, but they’d certainly be my first small dog choice if it ever came to that.
> [doublepost=1517194250,1517194144][/doublepost]
> ...


Imagine a jack the size of a great dane... LOL Ultimate dog.
[doublepost=1517195855][/doublepost]Some excellent points in this video for those who have "opinions" about Jacks that have never kept them.


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

Sorry but we don't want the red roos to be extinct!


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## Nerdhero (Jan 29, 2018)

I still remember the day I went outside to find a snake head...then about 10 metres away was my Jack Russell sitting next to the body as it twitched away. He ripped the things head clean off, it wasn't a big snake, maybe 1.2m but dam he knew exactly what he was doing.

He never was aggressive toward humans, only to other dogs, never really liked any dogs upon first meeting, would tolerate/ignore them once he got to know them.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 29, 2018)

The White'Terrier was often bred with larger rangier bull types to bring their size down for the initial purpose of ratting. Ratting was a gambling sport that often took place in holes or Pits dug in the center of pubs where a certain number of rats were released and then a dog released in the Pit for a certain period of time. At the end of the allotted time the number of rats killed was added up and the dog with the most kills was the winner. This sport was perpetuated due in part to Bull baiting being made illegal. Because space was limited in most pubs the Bully breeds that took part in the sport needed to be bred down in size for this new sporting and gambling activity. Adding terrier to the mix was a natural conclusion as terriers were known for their natural inclination for small game hunting. This is where the American Pit Bull Terrier got the name Pit added to its name. Many people who are uneducated or mis-educated on the Pit Bull make the mistake that the breed got its name first from fighting other dogs.

This was taken from the following website and has some great information for dispelling the myths of them being a 'fighting dog' and nothing else.
http://americanbullyassociation.com/American-Pit-Bull-Terrier.html

There are also several other breeders registries, one being.
https://adbadog.com

@Buggster Have you had any contact with Pitbulls or are you just going off what the media portrays them to be?


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Nerdhero said:


> I still remember the day I went outside to find a snake head...then about 10 metres away was my Jack Russell sitting next to the body as it twitched away. He ripped the things head clean off, it wasn't a big snake, maybe 1.2m but dam he knew exactly what he was doing.
> 
> He never was aggressive toward humans, only to other dogs, never really liked any dogs upon first meeting, would tolerate/ignore them once he got to know them.


You're spot on mate, so many people in Toowoomba treat the entire city as an off leash dog park... So many times I've been out with my dogs running (all on leads) and other people's dogs (unleashed) have come running up to us... I've always yelled out "can you please restrain your dog/s?" to which the reply is usually, "he's right, he won't hurt your little ones"... and I'm like "it's not my little ones I'm worried about...." People just do NOT get it... Jacks do not like other dogs approaching them.. period. On the beach that day, that wasn't my fault... that was due to the ignorance of a person with very little intelligence.

Nowadays I carry a big stick to whack other dogs if they come up to us... I'd sooner give them a swift clip then have to pry my jacks off them...


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## Buggster (Jan 29, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> The White'Terrier was often bred with larger rangier bull types to bring their size down for the initial purpose of ratting. Ratting was a gambling sport that often took place in holes or Pits dug in the center of pubs where a certain number of rats were released and then a dog released in the Pit for a certain period of time. At the end of the allotted time the number of rats killed was added up and the dog with the most kills was the winner. This sport was perpetuated due in part to Bull baiting being made illegal. Because space was limited in most pubs the Bully breeds that took part in the sport needed to be bred down in size for this new sporting and gambling activity. Adding terrier to the mix was a natural conclusion as terriers were known for their natural inclination for small game hunting. This is where the American Pit Bull Terrier got the name Pit added to its name. Many people who are uneducated or mis-educated on the Pit Bull make the mistake that the breed got its name first from fighting other dogs.
> 
> This was taken from the following website and has some great information for dispelling the myths of them being a 'fighting dog' and nothing else.
> http://americanbullyassociation.com/American-Pit-Bull-Terrier.html
> ...



ADBA is not a legit registry. Only ‘legit’ ones are ANKC, AKC, CKC (Canadian, not continental) and so on.
Not only are only 3 generations ‘pedigree’ required to make a dog ‘purebred’, if you browse the pictures of ‘pitbulls’ on their site, there is no conformity to the dogs. Head shape, jaw type, body structure... and so on are all over the place. No way anyone who knows anything about what defines a ‘breed’ would class them under a single ‘breed’. They’re all mongrels as far as I’m concerned.

Pitbulls are named as such (as you said yourself), for fighting in pits. Perhaps yes, initially against bulls, but as you said, when this was restricted they began to use them for dog-on-dog matches.

And hey, the German Shepherd started out as a simple sheepdog. After generations of breeding they became a protection/guardian dog. Just as the pitbull might have been bred for bull baiting stock with the intention to turn it into a dog fighter.

And no, I haven’t worked with the APBT because there are none in the country. And I wouldn’t want to work with one either, as the only thing a real one is good for is dog fighting. I don’t care how much you pay me, I can’t make a Bloodhound a herding dog, just as you can’t make a APBT a family pet.

You said above that you own(ed?) a pitbull. Please, post an image of the dog and I’ll prove to you that the dog is not an APBT. And if by some chance your dog does resemble an pitty, if it’s the sweet family pet you say it is, there’s no way it’s an APBT, just an unfortunate lookalike


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## Scutellatus (Jan 29, 2018)

Buggster said:


> ADBA is not a legit registry. Only ‘legit’ ones are ANKC, AKC, CKC (Canadian, not continental) and so on.
> Not only are only 3 generations ‘pedigree’ required to make a dog ‘purebred’, if you browse the pictures of ‘pitbulls’ on their site, there is no conformity to the dogs. Head shape, jaw type, body structure... and so on are all over the place. No way anyone who knows anything about what defines a ‘breed’ would class them under a single ‘breed’. They’re all mongrels as far as I’m concerned.
> 
> Pitbulls are named as such (as you said yourself), for fighting in pits. Perhaps yes, initially against bulls, but as you said, when this was restricted they began to use them for dog-on-dog matches.
> ...


Did you actually read what I posted? I didn't say anything about them and the naming, I copied and pasted the first paragraph. Maybe take a few breaths and re-read what I posted.
If you haven't had any dealings with them you are going off the 'Media Pitbull' not the real Pitbull.
Have a look in the dog thread, I posted his picture not long ago.
[doublepost=1517205821,1517199039][/doublepost]How can you class a registry that was formed in 1909 as non-legitimate?
Again I think you need to do some research before commenting.


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## bluedragon (Jan 29, 2018)

i thought this was supposed to be about blue tongues not dogs but any way my favorite dogs are Dogo Argintino and Tosa which are both very illegal in Australia i know a friend in my area who has the placid est pit bull ive met


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

bluedragon said:


> i thought this was supposed to be about blue tongues not dogs but any way my favorite dogs are Dogo Argintino and Tosa which are both very illegal in Australia i know a friend in my area who has the placid est pit bull ive met


It was about blue tongues, I wanted to know if they'd keep coming back no matter how many times I move them out of harms way... I thought that would be a simple solution... obviously it's Not, now I know that I just need to make a few little changes so that the blueys can have a refuge and the Jack's can't harass them... too easy. I just wasn't aware that blue tongues had such a strong homing behaviour.


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## bluedragon (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> It was about blue tongues, I wanted to know if they'd keep coming back no matter how many times I move them out of harms way... I thought that would be a simple solution... obviously it's Not, now I know that I just need to make a few little changes so that the blueys can have a refuge and the Jack's can't harass them... too easy. I just wasn't aware that blue tongues had such a strong homing behaviour.


nahh that cool mate


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

bluedragon said:


> nahh that cool mate


Blue tongues are pretty cool... I've never kept any lizards as pets but it's nice knowing they're in the back yard and living happily. Do they live in some sort of burrow or something?


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## bluedragon (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Blue tongues are pretty cool... I've never kept any lizards as pets but it's nice knowing they're in the back yard and living happily. Do they live in some sort of burrow or something?


yeah ive seen blue tongue burrows and mine loves her pvc pipe because she thinks its her burrow in her outdoor pit


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

bluedragon said:


> yeah ive seen blue tongue burrows and mine loves her pvc pipe because she thinks its her burrow in her outdoor pit


Nice! I think I have a pretty good idea where it is in my garden so I'll run a few electric wires to keep the dogs away.


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

The pygmy blue tongue found in SA(endangered) is basically a burrowing only species actually it's similar to a trap door with how it gets food, but has larger tunnels, seeing them eat is awesome.


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## Bluetongue1 (Jan 29, 2018)

Each breed of dog has been selectively bred for certain attributes. These may be physical attributes alone or primarily behavioural. For breeds based on physical attributes is appropriate to formalise these and expect members of the breed to conform to a highly specific set of narrow physical criteria. Where the breed is based primarily on behavioural characteristics, these take precedence over physical characteristics and depending upon the genetics of the breed, this can result in differing degrees of degrees of physical variation within the breed. 



Buggster said:


> … there is no conformity to the dogs. Head shape, jaw type, body structure... and so on are all over the place. No way anyone who knows anything about what defines a ‘breed’ would class them under a single ‘breed’. …


Jack Russell Terriers were bred as a working dog for fox hunting. Although primarily behavioural, this required physical attributes that enable it to follow foxes down earths and manoeuvre underground as freely as the fox does. They are genetically variable in physical features, with a broad standard but less so in their instinctive hunting behaviours. Based on the above quoted criterion. Jack Russell Terriers also cannot be considered as a breed.



Buggster said:


> … And hey, the German Shepherd started out as a simple sheepdog. After generations of breeding they became a protection/guardian dog ….


From the start GSD’s were bred to guard the flock and stop it from straying into adjoining crops. Intelligence that allowed training to stop the flock wandering into specified areas was also selected for. These attributes of protection of home territory and its occupants, loyalty/responsiveness to its owner, and intelligence and trainability, have been selected for from the outset and are what suit it to the role of protection/guardian dog in modern situations, including families.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Bluetongue1 said:


> Each breed of dog has been selectively bred for certain attributes. These may be physical attributes alone or primarily behavioural. For breeds based on physical attributes is appropriate to formalise these and expect members of the breed to conform to a highly specific set of narrow physical criteria. Where the breed is based primarily on behavioural characteristics, these take precedence over physical characteristics and depending upon the genetics of the breed, this can result in differing degrees of degrees of physical variation within the breed.
> 
> Jack Russell Terriers were bred as a working dog for fox hunting. Although primarily behavioural, this required physical attributes that enable it to follow foxes down earths and manoeuvre underground as freely as the fox does. They are genetically variable in physical features, with a broad standard but less so in their instinctive hunting behaviours. Based on the above quoted criterion. Jack Russell Terriers also cannot be considered as a breed.
> 
> From the start GSD’s were bred to guard the flock and stop it from straying into adjoining crops. Intelligence that allowed training to stop the flock wandering into specified areas was also selected for. These attributes of protection of home territory and its occupants, loyalty/responsiveness to its owner, and intelligence and trainability, have been selected for from the outset and are what suit it to the role of protection/guardian dog in modern situations, including families.


Jack Russell terriers are considered a breed with their origins being in England but their country of development is Australia.


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## dragonlover1 (Jan 29, 2018)

Nero Egernia said:


> That's a poor attitude to have. It's not dissimilar to irresponsible cat owners allowing their pets to free roam. Excuses that "killing things is part of their nature" is no reason to allow your pet to kill wildlife. Seeing as it's near impossible to train cats the only solution is to confine them indoors or in a cat run. Dogs can be trained, however. Or at the very least only allow them into the yard while under supervision. It sounds as though your dogs will attack and kill any small creatures that crosses their paths. That's the impression I get when I read such posts.


If you read my post properly you would understand that I don't condone dogs attacking wildlife especially reptiles and natives( I don't care about indian minors though). When I was married,we had rottwiellers and dobermanns which would never attack small creatures,after I got divorced and her rottie died my ex got a miniature foxie which turned into a small animal killer,hence the dead lizards.
And I agree totally with keeping cats indoors,anyone who lets them roam is an [email protected]#$e in my opinion


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## Nero Egernia (Jan 29, 2018)

dragonlover1 said:


> If you read my post properly you would understand that I don't condone dogs attacking wildlife especially reptiles and natives( I don't care about indian minors though). When I was married,we had rottwiellers and dobermanns which would never attack small creatures,after I got divorced and her rottie died my ex got a miniature foxie which turned into a small animal killer,hence the dead lizards.
> And I agree totally with keeping cats indoors,anyone who lets them roam is an [email protected]#$e in my opinion



I'm pleased to hear that, dragonlover1. I share a similar opinion to those who allow their dogs to harass and kill wildlife, regardless if it's part of their breed characteristics or not. People have a responsibility to keep their pets under control.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Nero Egernia said:


> I'm pleased to hear that, dragonlover1. I share a similar opinion to those who allow their dogs to harass and kill wildlife, regardless if it's part of their breed characteristics or not. People have a responsibility to keep their pets under control.


Pets are always under control when we're present. Simple. If I'm home and have the opportunity to intervene and help something that my dogs may possible bolt, I'll always do what I can and I've been actively protecting the blueys. If I'm not home and nature takes place... that's life. People have to accept that certain things are a certain way and not everything is peaches and cream. In the end it all evens out in the wash. Man created every K9 breed that exists and we created them each for different things, protection, companionship, and hunting etc. We can't turn around and bitch and moan about the things we created. Jacks will be Jacks and of you can't handle that, the world you live in must be a very shallow one... me, I shoot for a living every day, I'm not as "oh my god" that animal attacked another creature as the tree huggers of today are... What next, should I be preventing the blueys from attacking and eating the snails in my garden?? Or the peewees from eating the worms??


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## bluedragon (Jan 29, 2018)

dragonlover1 said:


> If you read my post properly you would understand that I don't condone dogs attacking wildlife especially reptiles and natives( I don't care about indian minors though). When I was married,we had rottwiellers and dobermanns which would never attack small creatures,after I got divorced and her rottie died my ex got a miniature foxie which turned into a small animal killer,hence the dead lizards.
> And I agree totally with keeping cats indoors,anyone who lets them roam is an [email protected]#$e in my opinion


at my old house i used to let my cat out and shes been out for 8 years and has never killed anything but rats and mice that annoy my aviary birds we let her out at our new one and she leaves every thing alone but the mice and huntsman's ive seen a baby bearded dragon at her feet and she didn't care


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

bluedragon said:


> at my old house i used to let my cat out and shes been out for 8 years and has never killed anything but rats and mice that annoy my aviary birds we let her out at our new one and she leaves every thing alone but the mice and huntsman's ive seen a baby bearded dragon at her feet and she didn't care


Well that certainly bucks all the trends.


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## Nero Egernia (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Pets are always under control when we're present. Simple. If I'm home and have the opportunity to intervene and help something that my dogs may possible bolt, I'll always do what I can and I've been actively protecting the blueys. If I'm not home and nature takes place... that's life. People have to accept that certain things are a certain way and not everything is peaches and cream. In the end it all evens out in the wash.



If everyone were to adopt your reasoning then it's perfectly fine for free roaming cats to kill wildlife simply because the owner's not present to intervene.


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

While I agree with cat and dog trapping I'd think you'd be pretty pissed if you got a call from the pound saying you'd need to pay because your dogs somehow got out but for some reason a cat owner should be any less angry?...not trying to take a piss at you but that logic is pretty dumb.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Nero Egernia said:


> If everyone were to adopt your reasoning then it's perfectly fine for free roaming cats to kill wildlife simply because the owner's not present to intervene.


Free roaming cats aren't the same as dogs confined to a yard that bail up something that comes into the yard... stupid logic...

Ever seen a Jack scale a 6ft colorbond fence, launch into a tree and smash a bird?? Keep dreaming.


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## Murph_BTK (Jan 29, 2018)

Where does one find one of those live traps? I need a couple [emoji6]

Instagram: murph_BTK


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

Councils usually.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Murph_BTK said:


> Where does one find one of those live traps? I need a couple
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I've got half a dozen of my own. You can buy them online or at Mitre 10.


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## Murph_BTK (Jan 29, 2018)

Champion AP I tried Bunnings but drew a blank look [emoji849].. I was searching gumtree and eBay..
Also tried the council where I live but they have none for loan.. 
I'll be off to mitre 10 2moro 

Instagram: murph_BTK


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Murph_BTK said:


> Champion AP I tried Bunnings but drew a blank look [emoji849].. I was searching gumtree and eBay..
> Also tried the council where I live but they have none for loan..
> I'll be off to mitre 10 2moro
> 
> Instagram: murph_BTK


The one pictured above I got from here. 
http://www.easypestsupplies.com.au/feral-cat-trap.html
It's a nice trap, have caught many cats in it. My others are slightly bigger traps from Mitre 10 as some cats are quite large and won't walk into the smaller trap.


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

The cats here are Maine coon sized, guessing I'd need the mitre 10 ones lol


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 29, 2018)

Imported_tuatara said:


> The cats here are Maine coon sized, guessing I'd need the mitre 10 ones lol


Yeah, get a Mitre 10 dog trap. They're made to catch foxes.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 29, 2018)

Murph_BTK said:


> Where does one find one of those live traps? I need a couple [emoji6]
> 
> Instagram: murph_BTK


Make sure to ring Mitre 10 first Murph so it isn't a wasted trip, the store he bought them from would be classed as rural I think and will have a lot more of those type of things, city stores don't appear to carry them.

I have bought from the below business before and can definitely recommend them. 
https://traps.com.au


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## Murph_BTK (Jan 29, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> https://traps.com.au


You are a superstar!! Once again thank you for the link and Info [emoji4]

Instagram: murph_BTK


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## dragonlover1 (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Blue tongues are pretty cool... I've never kept any lizards as pets but it's nice knowing they're in the back yard and living happily. Do they live in some sort of burrow or something?


Nah mostly they live behind bricks ,tiles, wood ,rubbish etc.
[doublepost=1517225658,1517225192][/doublepost]


Imported_tuatara said:


> The pygmy blue tongue found in SA(endangered) is basically a burrowing only species actually it's similar to a trap door with how it gets food, but has larger tunnels, seeing them eat is awesome.


It's been really great to see pygmy blue tongues again after they were thought to be extinct, so I would love to see them in private collections to build up their numbers.But correct me if I'm wrong,they are the only burrowing species!


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

They'd probably be quite a lot easier than most blue tongues to keep too, then again the appeal of most is the handling, if legal I'd love one, pretty sure they're the only known borrowing species, yeah.


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## Nero Egernia (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Pets are always under control when we're present. Simple. If I'm home and have the opportunity to intervene and help something that my dogs may possible bolt, I'll always do what I can and I've been actively protecting the blueys. If I'm not home and nature takes place... that's life. People have to accept that certain things are a certain way and not everything is peaches and cream. In the end it all evens out in the wash. Man created every K9 breed that exists and we created them each for different things, protection, companionship, and hunting etc. We can't turn around and bitch and moan about the things we created. Jacks will be Jacks and of you can't handle that, the world you live in must be a very shallow one... me, I shoot for a living every day, I'm not as "oh my god" that animal attacked another creature as the tree huggers of today are... What next, should I be preventing the blueys from attacking and eating the snails in my garden?? Or the peewees from eating the worms??





Aussiepride83 said:


> Free roaming cats aren't the same as dogs confined to a yard that bail up something that comes into the yard... stupid logic...
> 
> Ever seen a Jack scale a 6ft colorbond fence, launch into a tree and smash a bird?? Keep dreaming.



It's all the same to me. Cat. Dog. Killing in or out of the yard. I see it as the result of an irresponsible owner allowing their pets to kill wildlife. Call me a tree hugger if you like. While I don't actively hug trees I care deeply for our native flora and fauna. As you so eloquently put, dogs are man-made. To have them killing wildlife is not really a part of nature, is it? I find it interesting how the world is full of double standards. When cats and cane toads wreck havoc on our native wildlife many howl for blood. When man's so called best friend does the same, no one appears to care and simply dismisses it as "life". They're all doing what comes naturally to them, but that's no excuse to allow it to happen.

For the record, I didn't create dogs. I'm fully aware of life and death as I breed and kill my own food. I also keep carnivorous animals as pets, of which I also breed and kill food for them.

Seeing as you're quick to edit the main content of your posts, as well as slinging foul language to get your point across, and readily insult people with who you don't agree with; trying to engage in a rational discussion with you is pointless.


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

Dogs are basically inbred deformed domesticated wolves, nothing natural about them, they've just been so defined/inbred that they're so genetically different that they're a different species. I'd get rid of a dog on my lawn as fast as any cat or cane toad, or at least will once I hopefully own my own property. -No,I'm not saying the keeping of dogs is absurd or that they're any less important because of their history. Either.


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## dragonlover1 (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Pets are always under control when we're present. Simple. If I'm home and have the opportunity to intervene and help something that my dogs may possible bolt, I'll always do what I can and I've been actively protecting the blueys. If I'm not home and nature takes place... that's life. People have to accept that certain things are a certain way and not everything is peaches and cream. In the end it all evens out in the wash. Man created every K9 breed that exists and we created them each for different things, protection, companionship, and hunting etc. We can't turn around and bitch and moan about the things we created. Jacks will be Jacks and of you can't handle that, the world you live in must be a very shallow one... me, I shoot for a living every day, I'm not as "oh my god" that animal attacked another creature as the tree huggers of today are... What next, should I be preventing the blueys from attacking and eating the snails in my garden?? Or the peewees from eating the worms??


Settle down Kev,if you keep them under control we have no problem,We are talking about morons who don't control their animals!


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## Stompsy (Jan 29, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Free roaming cats aren't the same as dogs confined to a yard that bail up something that comes into the yard... stupid logic...
> 
> Ever seen a Jack scale a 6ft colorbond fence, launch into a tree and smash a bird?? Keep dreaming.


Actually, it is the same thing. It’s an introduced animal, not native to this country, killing native wildlife. It makes no difference if it’s a cat or a dog. And if you think otherwise, your logic is ridiculously flawed. 

Also, anyone who says ‘my cat never killed anything’ has no clue about how cats work. But further to that, after all the talk in this thread about how jack russells are bred to be hunters, it is your responsibility to ensure that doesn’t happen to our native wildlife, even in your own backyard, by training that dog. 

They were here long before you were and we brought in these animals, so it should be our obligation to ensure their survival. 

/endrant


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## Scutellatus (Jan 29, 2018)

Stompsy said:


> Actually, it is the same thing. It’s an introduced animal, not native to this country, killing native wildlife. It makes no difference if it’s a cat or a dog. And if you think otherwise, your logic is ridiculously flawed.
> 
> Also, anyone who says ‘my cat never killed anything’ has no clue about how cats work. But further to that, after all the talk in this thread about how jack russells are bred to be hunters, it is your responsibility to ensure that doesn’t happen to our native wildlife, even in your own backyard, by training that dog.
> 
> ...


Well said Stompsy! It isn't a rant if it is factual, which that is.


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## Imported_tuatara (Jan 29, 2018)

I'm definitely a "tree hugger", I'd rather have native wildlife over any exotic species.


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## Stompsy (Jan 29, 2018)

I really need to quit my job and work with animals. I should have done it years ago.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 30, 2018)

You want to label me irresponsible I suggest you go back and have a look at the very first photos in this thread.... they would be a lot different if I was an irresponsible pet owner, matter of fact, this thread wouldn't even exist if that were the case I have done everything to protect those blueys and will continue to do so. A Jack's prey drive cannot be revoked and attempting to do so is a fool's errand, however, the IMPACT of a Jack's prey drive can be minimised and that's what I've been doing at home. If you look back through this thread you'll see I even trap the goddamn rats! Why would someone trap rats when they have Jack Russell terriers, the best rat hunters that exist?? Why?? Firstly because Australia has a number of native rats and small marsupials... If I trap them I can safely release them.... If I trap Rattus rattus, I can dispose of them humanely... will a Jack differentiate between native and non native wildlife? No. Minimising the IMPACT is my angle. With me actively trapping I'm also removing the opportunity for my Jack's to exercise their prey drive in an area that I don't want them to So quit bashing me and my dogs and calling me irresponsible when I'm actually very far from it. I can protect the creatures within the perimeter of my property without having to "train my ruthless killing machines" of dogs. My dogs are working terriers, I want them to have that high energy and high drive when in the field. At home I've always taken measures to remove the opportunity for them to exercise that drive. In public I always ALWAYS keep them from attacking other dogs unless that dog attacks them.

My young children have also been educated on our native wildlife and understand the importance of preserving it. They alerted me by screaming out for assistance when they could have quite easily encouraged Alaska to kill the skink. I'm proud of my children and I love them and my dogs.

Comparing free roaming cats to a confined dog is absolutely ridiculous. My dogs, like all dogs wish to protect its family/pack on their home patch/territory, cats are not protecting their family when sollitarily hunting and indiscriminately killing wildlife all over the bloody neighbourood.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 30, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> You want to label me irresponsible I suggest you go back and have a look at the very first photos in this thread.... they would be a lot different if I was an irresponsible pet owner, matter of fact, this thread wouldn't even exist if that were the case I have done everything to protect those blueys and will continue to do so. A Jack's prey drive cannot be revoked and attempting to do so is a fool's errand, however, the IMPACT of a Jack's prey drive can be minimised and that's what I've been doing at home. If you look back through this thread you'll see I even trap the goddamn rats! Why would someone trap rats when they have Jack Russell terriers, the best rat hunters that exist?? Why?? Firstly because Australia has a number of native rats and small marsupials... If I trap them I can safely release them.... If I trap Rattus rattus, I can dispose of them humanely... will a Jack differentiate between native and non native wildlife? No. Minimising the IMPACT is my angle. With me actively trapping I'm also removing the opportunity for my Jack's to exercise their prey drive in an area that I don't want them to So quit bashing me and my dogs and calling me irresponsible when I'm actually very far from it. I can protect the creatures within the perimeter of my property without having to "train my ruthless killing machines" of dogs. My dogs are working terriers, I want them to have that high energy and high drive when in the field. At home I've always taken measures to remove the opportunity for them to exercise that drive. In public I always ALWAYS keep them from attacking other dogs unless that dog attacks them.
> 
> My young children have also been educated on our native wildlife and understand the importance of preserving it. They alerted me by screaming out for assistance when they could have quite easily encouraged Alaska to kill the skink. I'm proud of my children and I love them and my dogs.
> 
> Comparing free roaming cats to a confined dog is absolutely ridiculous. My dogs, like all dogs wish to protect its family/pack on their home patch/territory, cats are not protecting their family when sollitarily hunting and indiscriminately killing wildlife all over the bloody neighbourood.


"If I am not home and nature takes place.... that's life". 

Why do you think people are calling you irresponsible.
In a case like that your mutt is the invasive pest killing native wildlife. They could easily be restrained, on or in a dog run when you aren't present, that's if you were serious about protecting natve wildlife.


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## Stompsy (Jan 30, 2018)

Scutellatus said:


> "If I am not home and nature takes place.... that's life".
> 
> Why do you think people are calling you irresponsible.
> In a case like that your mutt is the invasive pest killing native wildlife. They could easily be restrained, on or in a dog run when you aren't present, that's if you were serious about protecting natve wildlife.


^ this

The simple fact is, cats have always been seen as the only domestic killing machine, when really, dogs can do just as much damage.

And no matter which way you present it, it is not natural. As I stated previously, your dog is an introduced animal, it isn't native and has no place in any ecosystem in this country. So when it kills a lizard/snake/native rat, that's not nature taking place...


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 30, 2018)

Has been a very productive morning so far walking a 500 acre privately owned property with the bow in Goombungee. Have successfully whistled up 4 cats with the Silva fox whistle, all dispatched with 85g Auscut Broadheads on 58lb draw from no more than 30-40m.

Hoping for a fox or 2 later in the day as the wind dies down.


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## Stompsy (Jan 30, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Has been a very productive morning so far walking a 500 acre privately owned property with the bow in Goombungee. Have successfully whistled up 4 cats with the Silva fox whistle, all dispatched with 85g Auscut Broadheads on 58lb draw from no more than 30-40m.
> 
> Hoping for a fox or 2 later in the day as the wind dies down.


Good to see you avoiding discussions again... round and round we go.


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## Scutellatus (Jan 30, 2018)

Aussiepride83 said:


> Has been a very productive morning so far walking a 500 acre privately owned property with the bow in Goombungee. Have successfully whistled up 4 cats with the Silva fox whistle, all dispatched with 85g Auscut Broadheads on 58lb draw from no more than 30-40m.
> 
> Hoping for a fox or 2 later in the day as the wind dies down.


Is this your idea of "it all evens out in the wash"?
While what you are doing by hunting feral pests is a great thing, it no way negates your dogs killing anything native.
There is no "evens out in the wash" when a native animal is killed, something that can be so easily prevented by locking your dogs up when not present.


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## Flaviemys purvisi (Jan 30, 2018)

Hey champ I've ignored your ridiculous comments because all you came back with is I should confine my dogs to a dog run, lock them up when I'm not there... If you had been paying attention to all the info presented here you would see that Jack's can't be confined like your fake American pit bull mut. And buy the way, my mutts as you put them, all combined would be worth more than your car. But let's just say for arguments sake that you could mistreat Jack's that way and confine them... great... might as well take the front door off my house, take it out to the street and lean it against the mail box and paint a sign on it saying "open house, 2am -2pm free sh*t, help yourself, don't worry about the dogs, they're locked up." Not to mention I'dbe reported to the RSPCA for mistreatment of JRT's the noise they would make would be insane.

Dumbest idea ever. 2 words cobber - 1. Electric, 2. Fence. She's all sorted. I've run a wire to keep thjem from getting into the bordering garden beds 

When you eventually get your own house and property, you do with it what you see fit but since this is my property and my dogs (which you have no idea about at all) I suggest you stop trying to push your ridiculous impractical ideas.

Problem has been solved, the blueys haven't been hurt to this day and will not be hurt now.


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