# Why do people so readily admit to owning exotics?



## shea_and_ruby (Feb 9, 2012)

As we have been selling some our of tanks lately, we have had a few coming over to check them out. Out of three people who ended up buying, two had exotics - one had corns and the other openly admitted he had boas! wasn't too surprised with the corn snake, but boaS, not just one, but a few, so my guess is that he breeds them. why would you tell a stranger that? one who has all your details? so what are the ratios - are there more exotic owners than there are legal owners?


----------



## Sezzzzzzzzz (Feb 9, 2012)

babe, as soon as i tell people that i have snakes they assume i must have exotics. I have been offered everything under the sun, stuff that just amazes me! i assume either these ppl dont know they are illegal or they just dont care!


----------



## bellany (Feb 9, 2012)

my hubbys mate decided to move his corn snake on a while back and when i walked out the back yard i found myself the new proud owner of a white and yellow cornsnake complete with set up in my patio. cant tell you how fast i peed myself and shipped it on to local wigs


----------



## Megzz (Feb 9, 2012)

Probably makes them feel badass


----------



## bellany (Feb 9, 2012)

chickka wow wow megzz lol


----------



## Snowman (Feb 9, 2012)

There will always be exotics. Just like there will always be illegal drugs around.


----------



## Khagan (Feb 9, 2012)

Probably due to the fact there isn't much chance anything will happen about it anyway even if someone did dob them in.


----------



## Leasdraco (Feb 9, 2012)

Maybe just to show off and feel like theyre impressive.guess its not much fun to have something exotic and be quiet about it.


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 9, 2012)

I had a guy ring my up the other day asking how many geckos were left and how much. He explained how he didnt have a licence, because he let it run out after he sold his last legal snake (woma) and then didnt need to reniew it because he only had illigal animals.

He told me this with out even asking what he has! I was actually surprised. I might text him not and ask what he keeps.

But personaly i dont mind if a few people own them, aslong as they know they are illegal and own only a few with other legal kept snake thats on a licence. And thats its being kept how they should be, not crammed in the back cupboard in a small box, no light and no heat.

Ill post back with what he keeps when he replys.


----------



## Snowman (Feb 9, 2012)

Leasdraco said:


> Maybe just to show off and feel like theyre impressive.guess its not much fun to have something exotic and be quiet about it.


I don't think it's to show off. I think they would talk about them on license or off license. They just love them, so good on them for having a reptile instead of a cat...


----------



## shea_and_ruby (Feb 9, 2012)

lol snakes 123 let us know. i think it must make them feel 'badass'. and what you say is also true: as long as they are kept and loved, thats all you can ask for.

this guy with the boas was just totally strange. as i was taken off guard, i asked him óh wow, where do you come by those?'to which he replied he had quite a few, and then it was as if he was waiting for me to ask to buy one :S


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 9, 2012)

shea_and_ruby said:


> lol snakes 123 let us know. i think it must make them feel 'badass'. and what you say is also true: as long as they are kept and loved, thats all you can ask for.
> 
> this guy with the boas was just totally strange. as i was taken off guard, i asked him óh wow, where do you come by those?'to which he replied he had quite a few, and then it was as if he was waiting for me to ask to buy one :S



Yeah I will, he normally replyed to my texts with a call straight away, but im sure he will reply. I dont think he was the guy to keep it so he felt like a 'badass' i think it was more that he loved them.

However i wouldnt recomend that everyone goes out and buys an exotic just because "Ohh it looks nice i want it" But im not recomending that anyone goes and buys one at all.

But...I can honestly say, if i was offered a chameleon, hognose or any of the other exotics that i extreemly like i can say i probably would get ONE. Just to keep there as a pet, not to breed. But then when i hav that animal, i wouldnt go and tell the world, i probably wouldnt tell anyone on this site, more for the animals sake. Because i know if i was to have one, i would keep it as it shoule and it would be happy.


But there thats what i think. Dont wanna start a rant. Ill get back when he texts back.


----------



## starr9 (Feb 9, 2012)

Could be that they think its one thing like a boa when in reality its something different! There was a thread some mths back where a lady said she had a corn snake or something like that (it was sick and she was seeking help) when after some more q's from ppl on here she didnt even have a corn but it was something like a BHP! So could be these ppl have no idea what they have!


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 9, 2012)

Yes true Starr9

I think there are people that you know, buy things from people they meet in the shops that offer animals, that have absolutly no idea that they are illegat. Which could also be the people that brag, and think they are badass for owning a snake, where as they have absolutly no clue at all that its illegal.


----------



## JezJez (Feb 9, 2012)

I met a fella whilst on a work conference in Sydney not long ago who after we got on to the subject of snakes he showed some pictures on his phone of a friend of his holding what looked to be about a 12ft Burmese python in his backyard!


----------



## waikare (Feb 9, 2012)

Because people like to show off to other people what they are not suppose to have, its the whole wow this illegal and i have one and you dont. If they had half a brain they would own a native one, but its more cool to have and illegal one.


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 9, 2012)

waikare said:


> Because people like to show off to other people what they are not suppose to have, its the whole wow this illegal and i have one and you dont. If they had half a brain they would own a native one, but its more cool to have and illegal one.




But the thing is most of them dont know they are illegal.


----------



## waikare (Feb 9, 2012)

well then they a pretty stupid to me and really that is no excuse everyone knows no natives are illegal


----------



## SteveNT (Feb 9, 2012)

I doubt it.


----------



## rockett85 (Feb 9, 2012)

Unfortunately there is everything from rattle snakes to anaconda's in australia. Have heard of all sorts you name it, its here. Craziest I have heard of was a pair of side winders

Sent from my U8510 using Tapatalk


----------



## waikare (Feb 9, 2012)

its funny doesnt suprise me how much exotics there are here, just as suprising to me as how many oz reptiles are in the states, must of been some good trade offs in the days


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 9, 2012)

waikare said:


> its funny doesnt suprise me how much exotics there are here, just as suprising to me as how many oz reptiles are in the states, must of been some good trade offs in the days




Thats so true!! I saw a post on a fb page of aussies posting there geckos. A bloke from canada posted a pic of his Nephrurus V(not sure of it but there are none from what i know of in the hobby here) It annoys me actually


----------



## waikare (Feb 9, 2012)

doesnt annoy me really ****** me off, we got some of the best reptiles in the world and the bloody yanks have most of them, and this is coming from a kiwi who never saw a snake in his life and just fell in love with them.


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 9, 2012)

lol Half the people on this site would most likely have or know someone that has them, and keep it to them selves there smart enough to keep them on the low.. I know plenty of people with exotics it's not exactly policed, I've been in the car with a mate that breeds corns, boas, has a trio of chameleons, crested iguanas the list goes on (not a "badass" one of the nicest blokes you'll meet)we were pulled up for a random breath test he had 3 corns and 2 baby Agamas in the car going to sell them on our way into the city, the cop asked what we had in the pillow slips and why they were tied of with rubber bands he told the officer reptiles he thought he was full of it so asked us to open them up he shined his torch in had a look and told us to have a good night and let us go basically he didn't care or didn't know they were exotics..

The illegal pet trade is allot bigger then people think as long as there's demand and money to be made you can bet your bottom dollar that someones going to be supplying it.


----------



## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 9, 2012)

I kinda lol about people getting all frothed up about exotics, majority have them and it is definitely not for the " oh look how badass i am owning an illegal animal ". I know a few people that have them and care for them like they are part of the family, no big deal in my eyes but i am sure 70% of aps will disagree with me


----------



## Sezzzzzzzzz (Feb 9, 2012)

starr9 said:


> Could be that they think its one thing like a boa when in reality its something different! There was a thread some mths back where a lady said she had a corn snake or something like that (it was sick and she was seeking help) when after some more q's from ppl on here she didnt even have a corn but it was something like a BHP! So could be these ppl have no idea what they have!




Im pretty sure that that chick was just covering her own *** as far as that thread goes.

People sound suprised by the amount of exotics there are. Every time i mention to someone that I keep snakes i hear "do you want a corn snake i know a dude who has albinos for sale"...

Maybe its just sydney, but they definately seem to be easy to get.


----------



## jacks-pythons (Feb 10, 2012)

you never know whats true and whats bullsh#t these days. so many people just say what they think sounds best. i personally wont do anything which puts my snakes in any bad position. y bother risking the fines and all of them taken away. i personally would be gutted if someone took my snakes


----------



## PythonLegs (Feb 10, 2012)

Most of the ones who brag are just tryhards, banging on about their imaginary animals. Funny how so many supposed reptile lovers are so accepting..you realise how most of these animals get here, and where they come from? I never hesitate to let anyone mouthing off about their exotics know what I think of them and let them know I'll be calling The Guberment. Of course actually doing that would be as useful as turning on the bat signal, but it always gets an amusing response.


----------



## Snake-Supplies (Feb 10, 2012)

I guess if they feel safe, and they don't tell you where they live why wouldn't they?

It's not hard to give a false name, have a private number and never be seen again to someone you only just met up with to buy a tank or a gecko from.


----------



## FAY (Feb 10, 2012)

There are more exotics here than anyone can imagine. Bit like jags, they are here to stay. No use getting your knickers in a knot over it. Sad part about it is, when they do get confiscated in some drug raid or whatever, they get euthanised and that is sad. Down here some chameleons got confiscated ( a baby one as well as an adult) all euthanised. So, you are not doing the animal any favours if you get caught.


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 10, 2012)

BUt if the breeder of them sells the hatchies, they are spread across an area leaving the breeder, if caught, with only two or three being euthanised. Just my oppinion.


----------



## Chris1 (Feb 10, 2012)

years ago i picked up something id bought on ebay from someones house,...he invted me in to a room with massive exotic snake (not good with whats what exoticwise, but it was def exotic) and a bunch of leopard geckos,..

i said, hmmm, you do know all these animals are illegal dont you,...at which point he looked like he was gonna poop himself till i said, i wont dob if you let me hold a leopard gecko, hahaha!
he said he had access to everything and anything, its all out there if you know where to look.


----------



## Spike (Feb 10, 2012)

If breeding exotics is so big how do they manage to sell the babies? It's not like they can advertise can they ?? And another question how much do they ask for there exotics and it's just crazy there getting away with it


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 10, 2012)

People want to buy. They do advertise, some are fake though. They go to pet shops and talk to the people looking at the reptile stuff etc. A friends uncle has chameleons, i think it was like $150 for a veiled chameleion.



shea_and_ruby said:


> lol snakes 123 let us know. i think it must make them feel 'badass'. and what you say is also true: as long as they are kept and loved, thats all you can ask for.
> 
> this guy with the boas was just totally strange. as i was taken off guard, i asked him óh wow, where do you come by those?'to which he replied he had quite a few, and then it was as if he was waiting for me to ask to buy one :S



He got back to me, he dosnt speak much in texts but he said he has balls  As in ball pythons. He didnt seem to keen when i asked if i could see them.


----------



## Tassie97 (Feb 10, 2012)

there are even exotics in Tas, you can buy aligators and cornsnakes here and yet you cant even legally own any Australian pythons!


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 10, 2012)

That is funny Tassie. If i were you id get some corns and an aligator then.


----------



## Tassie97 (Feb 10, 2012)

snakes123 said:


> That is funny Tassie. If i were you id get some corns and an aligator then.


no thankyou


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 10, 2012)

Spike said:


> If breeding exotics is so big how do they manage to sell the babies? It's not like they can advertise can they ?? And another question how much do they ask for there exotics and it's just crazy there getting away with it




Corns around my area go from as low as 80 up to 250 for snow's.. Boas depending on what sub species,size start from around 300.. Chameleons are bit more expensive around the 400-600 mark depending on size, sub species.. It all depends on what species and what the seller want's for them.


----------



## Manda1032 (Feb 10, 2012)

shea_and_ruby said:


> As we have been selling some our of tanks lately, we have had a few coming over to check them out. Out of three people who ended up buying, two had exotics - one had corns and the other openly admitted he had boas! wasn't too surprised with the corn snake, but boaS, not just one, but a few, so my guess is that he breeds them. why would you tell a stranger that? one who has all your details? so what are the ratios - are there more exotic owners than there are legal owners?



I've found a lot of people say they are selling them too. So I offer them twice what they are asking and say I'll take the lot!!! and I never see the person again! They are all liers! I'm yet to see anyone actually be truthful and see an actual animal with my own eyes... or the "owner" a second time!


----------



## Snake-Supplies (Feb 10, 2012)

I'd love a pet gator...

Invite my enemys in for a swim


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 10, 2012)

Manda1032 said:


> I've found a lot of people say they are selling them too. So I offer them twice what they are asking and say I'll take the lot!!! and I never see the person again! They are all liers! I'm yet to see anyone actually be truthful and see an actual animal with my own eyes... or the "owner" a second time!



lol there all liars, so your saying that people don't sell exotics in Australia? lol


----------



## Manda1032 (Feb 10, 2012)

I'm saying they do... just none of the half wits that I talk to! In my experience (worked in pet stores for years) every single person that came in saying they're selling exotics never takes me up on my offer of twice the price and taking everything they have! One dude said he had up to 10 emperor scorps and wanted 50 each, he lived like a day's drive away. I offered 150 each, i'd take all and I'd drive to pick them up asap. whaddya know he's never seen again! Had another customer come in said they had access to corns and boa's etc. 100 bucks for the corns. I said I'll have 20 in all diff colours. I served him and showed him some new products in store etc. said I was dead serious, I'm no tyre kicker! Gave my number etc Yep, never saw him again either.!


----------



## Jason (Feb 10, 2012)

Spike said:


> If breeding exotics is so big how do they manage to sell the babies? It's not like they can advertise can they ??



I get the odd PM from random members offering things. Very kind and convenient of them I think  The money is in chameleons! massive multiple clutches and several hundred a pop.

The only illegal herp I would own is a hatchy freshy and IMO they should be on license in NSW anyway!


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 10, 2012)

Manda1032 said:


> I'm saying they do... just none of the half wits that I talk to! In my experience (worked in pet stores for years) every single person that came in saying they're selling exotics never takes me up on my offer of twice the price and taking everything they have! One dude said he had up to 10 emperor scorps and wanted 50 each, he lived like a day's drive away. I offered 150 each, i'd take all and I'd drive to pick them up asap. whaddya know he's never seen again! Had another customer come in said they had access to corns and boa's etc. 100 bucks for the corns. I said I'll have 20 in all diff colours. I served him and showed him some new products in store etc. said I was dead serious, I'm no tyre kicker! Gave my number etc Yep, never saw him again either.!



Sorry I thought you were saying people don't sell them in Aus, as I said early in the thread as long as there's a demand for supply and money to be made someones going to supply it no matter what it is. 

It was possibly because he thought you were a bit suss saying "double the price and that you would take them all" or as you said he was full of it.



Jason said:


> I get the odd PM from random members offering things. Very kind and convenient of them I think  The money is in chameleons! massive multiple clutches and several hundred a pop.
> 
> The only illegal herp I would own is a hatchy freshy and IMO they should be on license in NSW anyway!



lol you would be surprised at the amount of pm's I've got regarding exotics since this thread started. 

Agree with ya on the freshys, one was found in western Sydney a few weeks ago behind someones bin, obviously someone has a few.


----------



## saximus (Feb 10, 2012)

Aussie-Pride said:


> lol you would be surprised at the amount of pm's I've got regarding exotics since this thread started.



With people offering to sell you some? Maybe I need to start a thread about Boas


----------



## Spike (Feb 10, 2012)

Wow I never imagined them to be worth that much $$$ so people don't keep them cause there cheaper then.


----------



## Wookie (Feb 10, 2012)

Aussie-Pride said:


> lol Half the people on this site would most likely have or know someone that has them, and keep it to them selves there smart enough to keep them on the low.. I know plenty of people with exotics it's not exactly policed, I've been in the car with a mate that breeds corns, boas, has a trio of chameleons, crested iguanas the list goes on (not a "badass" one of the nicest blokes you'll meet)we were pulled up for a random breath test he had 3 corns and 2 baby Agamas in the car going to sell them on our way into the city, the cop asked what we had in the pillow slips and why they were tied of with rubber bands he told the officer reptiles he thought he was full of it so asked us to open them up he shined his torch in had a look and told us to have a good night and let us go basically he didn't care or didn't know they were exotics..
> 
> The illegal pet trade is allot bigger then people think as long as there's demand and money to be made you can bet your bottom dollar that someones going to be supplying it.



Hahaha, does your mate have any Boelens or Panther Chameleons :lol: ?


----------



## Manda1032 (Feb 10, 2012)

How could you not notice your freshy missing! 
LOL "Here Spike" It's amazing what's available in one state isn't in another. It certainly makes us Herpers re-think where we move interstate


----------



## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 10, 2012)

I also think alot of people on this site get so raging about exotics simply because they are illegal without really knowing anything else. If i kept a corn snake and did not breed or let escape and was just like any other python i see no harm. Somewhat like the steroid scene ( for keen gym peoples will know what i am talking about ) how they are illegal and that's why they are so bad lmao.


----------



## PythonLegs (Feb 10, 2012)

FAY said:


> There are more exotics here than anyone can imagine. Bit like jags, they are here to stay. No use getting your knickers in a knot over it. Sad part about it is, when they do get confiscated in some drug raid or whatever, they get euthanised and that is sad. Down here some chameleons got confiscated ( a baby one as well as an adult) all euthanised. So, you are not doing the animal any favours if you get caught.



So what do you suggest we do if we're aware of exotics being sold/bred, Fay? Nothing?


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 10, 2012)

saximus said:


> With people offering to sell you some? Maybe I need to start a thread about Boas



lol nope people wanting and people that already have them. Maybe I should start a thread about marmosets and monkeys


----------



## Manda1032 (Feb 10, 2012)

PythonLegs said:


> So what do you suggest we do if we're aware of exotics being sold/bred, Fay? Nothing?



as long as they are well kept, I don't care. I only have a beef with mistreatment and taking from the wild!


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 10, 2012)

TeKnO said:


> I also think alot of people on this site get so raging about exotics simply because they are illegal without really knowing anything else. If i kept a corn snake and did not breed or let escape and was just like any other python i see no harm. Somewhat like the steroid scene ( for keen gym peoples will know what i am talking about ) how they are illegal and that's why they are so bad lmao.



lol steroids are bad because they shrink your balls lol


----------



## Jason (Feb 10, 2012)

Aussie-Pride said:


> Agree with ya on the freshys, one was found in western Sydney a few weeks ago behind someones bin, obviously someone has a few.



Well they haven't bloody contacted me. How rude  haha


----------



## snakes123 (Feb 10, 2012)

Jason said:


> Well they haven't bloody contacted me. How rude  haha



I was thinking the same thing. I thought i made it clear enough that i would keep some animals.


----------



## FAY (Feb 10, 2012)

PythonLegs said:


> So what do you suggest we do if we're aware of exotics being sold/bred, Fay? Nothing?



You can do whatever you want. I am not your parent. I personally do not know anyone who has them, but know that they are out there as I saw these animals at the vets before they were euthanised. lol


----------



## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 10, 2012)

Aussie-Pride said:


> lol steroids are bad because they shrink your balls lol



You let me down : (, see that is an uneducated answer somewhat parallel to this topic, people are just uneducated about the matter and so just ride what is told to them such as the owning one exotic and you should be in jail


----------



## SYNeR (Feb 10, 2012)

I haven't come across people with exotics.. Then again, I barely know many herpers anyway.


----------



## Ramsayi (Feb 10, 2012)

Plenty about.If I had a dollar for every time I've been offered an exotic I would be a hundredaire.


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 10, 2012)

TeKnO said:


> You let me down : (, see that is an uneducated answer somewhat parallel to this topic, people are just uneducated about the matter and so just ride what is told to them such as the owning one exotic and you should be in jail



hahaha sorry to let you down if you want me to go into detail about steriods and the effects we need to start another thread. lol


----------



## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 10, 2012)

i shall make one when i get back from ze gym , cya laters, exotic haters ; )


----------



## Manda1032 (Feb 10, 2012)

Ramsayi said:


> Plenty about.If I had a dollar for every time I've been offered an exotic I would be a hundredaire.



Yeah but if you accepted how many would have followed thru?


----------



## noved (Feb 10, 2012)

Manda1032 said:


> as long as they are well kept, I don't care. I only have a beef with mistreatment and taking from the wild!



and how exactly do you think the exotics got here...by being caught in there own countries and in there own wild then jamed into some one undies do be smuggled over here if thats not mistreatment what is...


----------



## saximus (Feb 10, 2012)

noved said:


> and how exactly do you think the exotics got here...by being caught in there own countries and in there own wild then jamed into some one undies do be smuggled over here if thats not mistreatment what is...



That reasoning is flawed when you're talking about animals that have been bred here from the smuggled animals. These animals never suffered that sort of mistreatment


----------



## Snowman (Feb 10, 2012)

noved said:


> and how exactly do you think the exotics got here...by being caught in there own countries and in there own wild then jamed into some one undies do be smuggled over here if thats not mistreatment what is...


There are better ways than that to bring animals in. Also a lot are captive bred.


----------



## Megzz (Feb 10, 2012)

TeKnO said:


> I also think alot of people on this site get so raging about exotics simply because they are illegal without really knowing anything else. If i kept a corn snake and did not breed or let escape and was just like any other python i see no harm. Somewhat like the steroid scene ( for keen gym peoples will know what i am talking about ) how they are illegal and that's why they are so bad lmao.


No one ever _intends_ for their animals to escape, yet how often does it happen!


----------



## PythonLegs (Feb 10, 2012)

TeKnO said:


> i shall make one when i get back from ze gym , cya laters, exotic haters ; )


Go tekno! Work that bacne!


----------



## dihsmaj (Feb 10, 2012)

JoshuaAtherton said:


> I'd love a pet gator...
> 
> Invite my enemys in for a swim


get a croc, you're in gippsland, it's legal in vic.


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 10, 2012)

PythonLegs said:


> Go tekno! Work that bacne!



lol watch out he might have a riod rage


----------



## Bluetongue1 (Feb 10, 2012)

TeKnO said:


> I also think alot of people on this site get so raging about exotics simply because they are illegal without really knowing anything else. If i kept a corn snake and did not breed or let escape and was just like any other python i see no harm. Somewhat like the steroid scene ( for keen gym peoples will know what i am talking about ) how they are illegal and that's why they are so bad lmao.


The problem does not come from someone having one or more exotics in their possession. The problems come from how they obtained those animals and what they do with them. 

Animals that have been breed in Australia may very likely have the capacity to breed under natural conditions. Considering the lack of control, they may well end up in an area with a suitable climate and habitat. Escapes or deliberate dumping of no longer wanted animals can then result in establishment of a feral population. Some of the species are going to be invasive, especially under the right environmental conditions.

If you are buying an animal that has not been bred here, but smuggled in... Has the smuggler quarantined it? Given that it costs them time, money and increased chance of being discovered to do so and they cannot make any more money out of appropriately quarantined animals, the likely answer is no. Consequently such animals could be carrying an exotic disease or parasites. If brought into contact with other reptiles, captive or wild, the disease or parasite can spread. Once established here, it can become a problem for legal and illegal collections as well as natural populations.

Hundreds (if not more) of legally held reptiles are stolen every year from licensed collectors like yourselves. Stolen reptiles cannot be legalised so they are destined to end up in illegal collections, either here or possibly overseas. Those illegal collections include the keepers of exotics. Those smuggling animals out of the country are likely to also be smuggling animals in. The very existence of illegal collections is what provides a market and is the driving force behind reptile theft.

While you may be able to point to a "responsible keeper" of exotics, every single animal bought contributes to a system which provides the very real chance of introduction of foreign reptile pest and diseases, establishment of an invasive exotic and sustains the high levels of reptile thefts from legal collections. So you might think your "single corn snake" is doing no harm... WRONG!

Blue


----------



## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 10, 2012)

hahaha Suss 250 does not give ya bakne boiz maybe slight rage ; )


----------



## snakeluvver (Feb 10, 2012)

Is it just me or is APS as a whole suddenly a lot more tolerant of exotics?
Seriously, everyone goes on about how bad they are, then when someone admits to owning one they often think its fine and that people who say otherwise are being arrogant. Yes, walking on the right side of the path or whatever is illegal and we all do it, but owning an exotic is a completely different thing.
Just how I see it, due to recent threads.


----------



## Renenet (Feb 10, 2012)

snakeluvver said:


> Is it just me or is APS as a whole suddenly a lot more tolerant of exotics?



I think you are right Snakeluvver. For the reasons Blue mentioned, plus my dislike of animal smuggling, I'm not one of the tolerant ones.


----------



## PythonLegs (Feb 10, 2012)

Well, it's a date to mark on the calender..not only did I read ALL of bluetongues post, I agreed with every word as well...


----------



## Klaery (Feb 10, 2012)

Aussie-Pride said:


> lol watch out he might have a riod rage




Hmmmm have to agree with Tekno on that one... It is very similar. I compete in a tested league but there are members on my team (powerlifting) that compete in the untested league if you know what I mean and... well the bad wrap steroids get is very overrated.


----------



## Bluetongue1 (Feb 10, 2012)

I think that tolerance comes about due to the perspective people apply. If they know someone with a few animals, highly responsible keeper living in the city where any escapes would not establish, they tend to think "what harm can it do?" You need to step back and look at the big picture to see that they are contributing to an undesireable situation.

There are also those who put their own desires ahead of more general needs. All I can say to them is that it wouldn't be illegal if it was alright to do.

I did not mention it earlier but another reality is that the more people there are that flaunt a law, the less enforceable it tends to become which, in turn, can encourage more to flaunt it. It does not help that enforcement is in the hands of an inept set of departments responsible for conservation and management of our wildlife.

Blue


----------



## dylan-rocks (Feb 10, 2012)

very good read, im quiet shocked but the opinions people have on the subject


----------



## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 10, 2012)

If i had the money and room....the things i would buy


----------



## Bluetongue1 (Feb 10, 2012)

Those keeping exotics are fully aware it is illegal. Acceptance or complacency on legal keeper's behalf is unacceptable in my opinion. 

I accept the reality of the situation, that once things are here and established in collections there is virtually no chance of eliminating them. However, what can be done is to bring sufficient pressure to bear, by way of busts and significant penalties handed out by the courts, to drive the illegal trade deep underground and keep it there. This will reduce the numbers illegally keeping and therefore the size of the potential market. A reduced market means reduced profit means reduced smuggling in as well as reduced trade in stolen reptiles. Effectively, you can reduce the risks and thefts associated with the illegal reptile trade in this manner. 

Sitting on the fence or on your hands won't help.

Blue


----------



## Manda1032 (Feb 10, 2012)

noved said:


> and how exactly do you think the exotics got here...by being caught in there own countries and in there own wild then jamed into some one undies do be smuggled over here if thats not mistreatment what is...



Not all come from the wild. Like anyone here would shove a wild carpet in their pants ( Unless that's your thing!) a lot a purchased in the US and brought over. I knew someone who said one corn was smuggled in a fake breast!


----------



## Spike (Feb 10, 2012)

Amen!!!!!! Bluetongue1 very well said. !!! And so very true


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 11, 2012)

TeKnO said:


> hahaha Suss 250 does not give ya bakne boiz maybe slight rage ; )



haha your all water weight mate lol  how many cycles have ya done..



danielk said:


> Hmmmm have to agree with Tekno on that one... It is very similar. I compete in a tested league but there are members on my team (powerlifting) that compete in the untested league if you know what I mean and... well the bad wrap steroids get is very overrated.



what's the difference between suss 250, Deca and D-anabol..


----------



## Globe (Feb 11, 2012)

Aussie-Pride said:


> The illegal pet trade is allot bigger then people think as long as there's demand and money to be made you can bet your bottom dollar that someones going to be supplying it.



Great conclusion, sadly you're right and will inevitably always be.



Bluetongue1 said:


> I did not mention it earlier but another reality is that the more people there are that flaunt a law, the less enforceable it tends to become which, in turn, can encourage more to flaunt it. It does not help that enforcement is in the hands of an inept set of departments responsible for conservation and management of our wildlife.
> Blue



So very many undeniable & invigorating comments in this thread.


Now i don't really want to get onto a whole discussion of Marijuana though i definitely believe _Blues_ comment apply for that also very much so (not that i'm against Marijuana) but perhaps i'm merely flaunting the law because it's more people are doing it & it's less enforceable.


----------



## Monitor_Keeper (Feb 11, 2012)

water weight pfttt, clenbuterol fixes dat ; ), Dianabol and deca and suss all very similar tbh, tren and test are ya stand outs


----------



## benjamind2010 (Feb 13, 2012)

I often hear so many arguments in favor of legalising and in many respects I agree with them, but there is only one issue that comes to mind with exotics and it's the invasive potential once the animals are established in the wild. Nothing you can do can manage this risk, except require everyone keeping exotics to have routine inspections to ensure their habitats are sealed and escape proof and even then you'll have failures. We do this with other animals, so reptiles should be no exception.

Being illegal, people with corn snakes and the like will be scared and will release them into the wild. How is that helping the environment? Sure, they shouldn't be here in the first place, but they are here, so we need to deal with them in an intelligent manner.

With marijuana, I couldn't care less about the legalities, it's a bloody weed and it's psychoactive properties are no where near as brutal as alcohol, so as far as I'm concerned it should be legal to use in any way, even grow it. I don't see what the problem is, it's another drug of course but nothing close to say heroin or cocaine which I consider to be a serious problem and shouldn't be used at all because they are so incredibly addictive. You can't abuse cannabis and it is not addictive.

Tolerance comes from people looking at the facts and realising that what they've been taught and brainwashed with isn't necessarily right. Things like gay marriage and abortion come to mind as these ones tend to stand out but there are other issues too, like interracial marriages (that some people look down on without rational reason).

You CAN legislate morality, but you have to be smart about it or you'll get no where. Putting people in prison over cannabis when we have gay marriage and abortion being openly accepted smacks of hypocrisy. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. We already have lots of exotics here already, we do need a keeper's system, but only if it can be regulated. None of this pet shop trade because you are going to end up with major headaches before you even realise it.



TeKnO said:


> tren and test are ya stand outs



+1,000,000,000

Trenbolone is by far the best steroid, at least from a serious strength gain perspective...and I used to lift very heavy weights and know people who used trenbolone, including one guy who used to bench press 310kg as his one-rep-max...did I ever use it? Not a bloody chance! I know about horror stories about one man who used it and after he stopped he ended up with a severe case of impotence that he never really recovered from. Pretty sure I don't want to end up with a floppy pecker...steroids are not my cup of tea.


----------



## Goppy78 (Feb 13, 2012)

In Sydney, it really isn't that difficult to get some exotics, especially Corns, which can be picked up for as little as $50 for excess stock from breeders, double it if your buying through the pot dealer the breeder buys his weed from. Have not been directly offered Boas or Balls, but have heard from different herp people that they are plentiful, especially Red-tailed Boas, and have heard of people with Rectics and Burms, and that's just the pythons. The most interesting part is that a lot of those breeding exotics, are also legal breeders.

It's just a case of these breeders being so involved in herping, that the next step is desiring something more unique. Unfortunately the down side is the people that buy excess stock, who have no real understanding of what is involved in owning, and caring for there reptile, are the ones most likely to brag, or even worse allow it to escape or deliberately release it.

Personally my preference is for natives, as the only exotic python that takes my fancy are Balls, but not enough to warrant one over a woma, and prefer having one of th anest. Species rather than having a corn and telling people it's a Children's.

Just my thoughts.


----------



## hilly (Feb 14, 2012)

benjamind2010 said:


> I often hear so many arguments in favor of legalising and in many respects I agree with them, but there is only one issue that comes to mind with exotics and it's the invasive potential once the animals are established in the wild. Nothing you can do can manage this risk, except require everyone keeping exotics to have routine inspections to ensure their habitats are sealed and escape proof and even then you'll have failures. We do this with other animals, so reptiles should be no exception.
> 
> Being illegal, people with corn snakes and the like will be scared and will release them into the wild. How is that helping the environment? Sure, they shouldn't be here in the first place, but they are here, so we need to deal with them in an intelligent manner.
> 
> ...



310 raw or equipped? What's his name?


----------



## Southern_Forest_Drag (Feb 18, 2012)

I've been offered exotics so many times, about 10 days ago i was at a blokes house who owned a breeding pair of Iguanas.


----------



## Belv6 (Feb 18, 2012)

from what i have herd if you get caught with exotics your in a lot more trouble if you own a wild life license because then you cant play the fool in court because your supposed to know about wildlife and the laws involved in keeping them


----------



## Bluetongue1 (Feb 18, 2012)

I notice that there is a presumption by some that legalising exotics will result in all those keeping them getting a licence. I don't think so. you only have to look at the number of people who keep native reptiles which could be kept on a licence but do so illegally without a licence. 

To put it simply, legalisation of exotics will not get rid of all illegal keeping of exotics. What it would do is see a dramatic rise in the number exotics held. 

As for regulating the keeping of exotics and making strict escapeproof requirements. You can make cages and reptile rooms as escape-proof as you like. They still require access by keepers. They are therefore vulnerable to human error which can result in escapes. And it can happen to even highly experienced keepers. A phone call at the wrong moment. A cage not actually locked before the key is withdrawn. A door later propped open to allow a rubbish bin to be taken out and emptied in the garbage. And a snake has made it way outside in that time.

Blue


----------



## JasonL (Feb 18, 2012)

Because people have been owning up to keeping exotics for many many years now and no one ever gets in trouble about it, if no one is seeking out the keepers of exotics then your basically allowed to keep them.


----------



## Psilo (Feb 19, 2012)

i take pride in being an ultra *** when people tell me about there friends exotics, and i do find that most people are don't even know that they are illegal to have in the coutry.. sad really

here is a video of an alien Burmese boa sparring an alligator in the states

Python vs Alligator 01 -- Real Fight -- Python attacks Alligator - YouTube

cool to watch, but our natives have enough competition already


----------



## Chris1 (Feb 19, 2012)

awesome vid, not the result i expected either!!!


----------



## cwebb (Feb 19, 2012)

When people see my bredlis they get bored and say "such and such has a pink and purple snake" i get so angry when.people insult my stunning bredlis by saying they have seen better.corn snakes !!

i hate.corns they are horrible snakes. i know two people i hate who have underfed mistreated corns.. who do i dob on them too??


----------



## Nighthawk (Feb 19, 2012)

Your local wildlife authority I presume cwebb, I'd just call DEH (or whoever you guys have, stupid how they're all different isn't it? They could have the same name at least and just have Vic or SA or whatever after it so you know it runs under that state's laws, but anyway...) and see where I went from there.


----------



## cma_369 (Feb 20, 2012)

Just going to say it, i'd own a chameleon in a heartbeat if i could!
Don't care what you think i'd give it a good home feed it properly and keep it in a locked enclosure at ALL times.......
What do people think of a person capturing an exotic from the wild here in aus????
It would be very hard for me to give it away to be "euthanised"
Would probably give it to someone who knew how to look after it (not sell it for $$$ though)
There are plenty of red eared sliders in rosemeadow and eagle vale duck ponds........
If i was to find one in say the nepean or georges river though it wouldn't be released in saying that i don't think i could kill it either


----------



## Beard (Feb 23, 2012)

Why do people own up to drink driving or using drugs etc etc. Cause they just do.


----------



## MJAussie360 (Feb 23, 2012)

shea_and_ruby said:


> As we have been selling some our of tanks lately, we have had a few coming over to check them out. Out of three people who ended up buying, two had exotics - one had corns and the other openly admitted he had boas! wasn't too surprised with the corn snake, but boaS, not just one, but a few, so my guess is that he breeds them. why would you tell a stranger that? one who has all your details? so what are the ratios - are there more exotic owners than there are legal owners?



Some people are just too stupid I think.
I was browsing through a facebook buy swap place in my local area when I stumbled apon a massive 7 foot tall enclosure. Being a first time snake owner I got ahead of myself and though, if I bought it, that I would have an awesome enclosure for my year old coastal carpet, lol.

Went there, thing was amesome and only $200 so I bought it. When I got it home and started to get all the old logs, branches and sawdust out of it, there was movement. 
Apparently I had purchased it with a 5 foot cornsnake hiding under the sawdust. Had to get the ranger etc to sort it, but it was a suprise I wont forget too soon, lol


----------



## Miffy (Feb 23, 2012)

reminds me I must feed my Galapagos Tortoise in my back yard.


----------



## zuesowns (Apr 13, 2012)

Does anyone know the penalty for owning exotics in AU?

It would be funny if someone actually stated "Red tail boa" on their license and send it to DERM, I wonder how long it would actually take them to send someone out.


----------



## cwebb (Apr 13, 2012)

my friends corn snake died haha sucker.


----------



## moosenoose (Apr 13, 2012)

I've seen the odd exotic here and there in peoples collections and quite frankly it doesn't bother me. The chances of that one corn escaping then surviving the local cats, dogs, kookas etc etc are very slim. The chances of it finding a mate and breeding a "monster army" are even more remote :lol: 

These animals have as much disease as any other locally bred native and really aren't an issue. Certainly not in the situations I've seen them in anyway. 

As for keeping them to impress people? Impress who? Anyone who doesn't know snakes are still asking me if my pythons are venomous, most snake lovers are appreciative of any snake whether its exotic or not, and can also understand the appeal of keeping something like this rather than seeing it destroyed (as realistically that's the creatures only option outside its current captive arrangements). They must be giving them away because I wouldn't pay a dollar for one :lol: The bigger question is who's forking out the bucks for them?? 

Personally I couldn't be bothered with the hassle, and certainly not as a registered reptile keeper. This is one reason they keep them illegally -actually two, it's cheaper :lol:...and secondly it is harder to find a keeper who is off the grid. The DSE or NPWS aren't going to do a spot checks on someone who is unregistered or unlicensed unless someone has reported them.


----------



## HerperBaz (Apr 13, 2012)

Good thread seeing everyones different opinions on the matter. 

I think some are slightly jealous that they don't own an exotic which turns them against the people that do. I believe if the snake is kept in the right conditions by a somewhat experienced herper there is no problem morally, it's just the legality of it all that turns some away, just like tekno and a few other mentioned with steroids and illicit drugs. 

However I must say IMO if the opportunity ever arose I would be happy to buy an exotic on the terms that I have read up on the reptile I'm buying and felt comfortable in being able to care for it the way anyone else would care for their python/reptile etc.


----------



## vampstorso (Apr 13, 2012)

HerperBaz said:


> Good thread seeing everyones different opinions on the matter.
> 
> I think some are slightly jealous that they don't own an exotic which turns them against the people that do. I believe if the snake is kept in the right conditions by a somewhat experienced herper there is no problem morally, it's just the legality of it all that turns some away, just like tekno and a few other mentioned with steroids and illicit drugs.




Not sure why anyone would be jealous about people owning exotic animals that would be easily attainable if they looked, and you have to keep a secret and can't even openly enjoy, and can look at and be reminded they brought disease over, have and will continue to breed in the wild thanks to people being selfish and wanting an exotic pet and hence killing off our defenseless wildlife, and are the offspring from animals treated unethically when stuffed into who knows what to come here?


nope, not jealous at all.

The illegal wildlife trade and animal smuggling are nothing to be jealous about. More so ashamed of.


----------



## apprenticegnome (Apr 13, 2012)

Its good to see that Australia has a tight set of rules in regards to exotic ownership. When you look at the damage and inballance caused by introduced species here and overseas its good to see that we are making a fairly reasonable attempt at not repeating past mistakes. I understand that the majority of people would be responsible if they were allowed to keep these animals but it only takes a few bad eggs to ruin the good that we already have. Look at how many introduced animals kept as pets in the US that have been released by the irresponsible and how much damage it has caused. I don't blame people for wanting exotics, I like and would most likely own some myself if the laws allowed but while our rules are the way they are we are at least making a possitive attempt at protecting our wildlife that are our identity here in AUS. We are lucky that the exotics that exist at present are minimised as best we can.


----------



## Skeptic (Apr 13, 2012)

I don't think there's any risk in owning exotics and that's why people admit it. I don't have any but that's because for one, no ones ever offered me a milk snake , and two, i wouldn't want the $70K fine and to lose all my other animals. But I've been keeping reptiles for over 10 years now and have never even heard from any authorities let alone been inspected so probably not that risky. Has anyone on this forum been inspected and if so, why?

Seriously though, I would report anyone who offered me anything exotic, especially a milk snake or a chameleon. Let me repeat that, I would report ANYONE who OFFERed ME anything exotic, especially A MILK SNAKE OR A CHAMELEON.


----------



## DionP (May 10, 2012)

Man, I would kill for a pet anaconda... Damn Australian laws! but suppose its for the better, what is it that happened in the states, there is a large population of I think Burmese Pythons or something that have overtaken many wetlands and are thriving.. Wouldn't want that in our waterways. But I really want a Anaconda..  haha


----------



## Skelhorn (May 10, 2012)

Skeptic said:


> Seriously though, I would report anyone who offered me anything exotic, especially a milk snake or a chameleon. Let me repeat that, I would report ANYONE who OFFERed ME anything exotic, especially A MILK SNAKE OR A CHAMELEON.




I love the code!



DionP said:


> Man, I would kill for a pet anaconda... Damn Australian laws! but suppose its for the better, what is it that happened in the states, there is a large population of I think Burmese Pythons or something that have overtaken many wetlands and are thriving.. Wouldn't want that in our waterways. But I really want a Anaconda..  haha




Not when those suckers get to 20 Foot lol!

An overseas snake that I fell in love with is the Red Tailed Boa, Tho they get HUGE! soooooo fat, but look awesome  Maybe oneday if I ever move overseas! But it will be a must to hold one if i travel to the states


----------



## pythrulz (May 10, 2012)

Beacause like most people they wabt to show off oh yeah Ive got a exotic python something dont have blah blah others are too stupid to know there illegal


----------



## Kam333 (May 10, 2012)

So anyone in Brissy wanting to go on a hunt for a reticulated python, try Boondall wetlands :shock:. A few possible escape's from the airport may have found there way down there. . . . only a rumour I cannot and will not confirm. . . but I would not dismiss it.


----------



## Snake-Supplies (May 10, 2012)

Kam333 said:


> So anyone in Brissy wanting to go on a hunt for a reticulated python, try Boondall wetlands :shock:. A few possible escape's from the airport may have found there way down there. . . . only a rumour I cannot and will not confirm. . . but I would not dismiss it.





I heard about a burm in a park in sydney somewhere...
I think...:?


----------



## snakefreak16 (May 28, 2012)

i was talking to some one the other day who owns there own reptile shows not naming wich one but he was telling me he has a albino burmese and he could get me one for 20 grand i laughed and said thats 16 green tree pythons and walked away. but i have to admit i would love a boa or a chamelion  stupin australian laws


----------



## Rocky (May 28, 2012)

If I was offered an Iguana, Chameleon or even a komodo dragon i would struggle to say no. The only reason I would say no is because I wouldn't want to risk my collection.

I follow the laws and everything... but if my favorite animal came along.. well I'd have to be put in that situation to give a answer.


----------



## konp69 (May 28, 2012)

I wouldn't refuse getting my hands on some corn snakes if someone had some they were looking to offload. They're absolutely splendid little creatures and they come in such a wide variety of patterns and colours.

But at the same time, I wouldn't act like I wasn't doing something that broke the law. Disagreeing with a law and its reasons for existing doesn't mean you get to just contravene it. A fact I solemnly wish more people understood.


----------



## Jaws07 (Jun 29, 2012)

I agree with the Australian laws of not permitting exotics, because of what has happened in the past, but then again I don't think that I would be able to turn down a Chameleon, Savannah Monitor, Tegu or Leopard Gecko. :s


----------



## DragonLizard (Jun 29, 2012)

For exotic herps as pets I do understand the attraction, though in most cases not over the animals which we do have. I mean personally i've always wanted to keep land tortoises (Maybe if I live overseas or get a job at the zoo lol), but I understand the ruling and wouldn't want to encourage it the illegal trade though If I ended up with one I wouldn't be sure I could turn the animal in due to the fact it would be put down a practice I do not agree with, for healthy animals as the case may be. Especially as it isn't the animals fault for being in the wrong place .... Just adding my opinion to the brewing pot.


----------



## gemrock2hot (Jun 29, 2012)

It's such a hard thing to comment on. Don't like the idea of breaking laws but if someone offered me a leopard gecko and it was in horrible conditions then I wouldn't say no. Couldn't handle the thought of someone killing a reptile :-(


----------



## Jeffa (Jun 29, 2012)

I think it would be quite suprising to put up a poll on this thread (who owns exotics)? and find out how many members actually have exotics. The polls on here are confidential so know one knows who's answers are who's.
If anyone is more computer saavy than me please feel free to organise, the options could be
Do you own an exotic?
Would you get one under current laws and legislation?
Know of and friends that keep exotics?

Cheers


----------



## Martin_T (Jun 29, 2012)

report them for sure, especially the person owning multiple boas they could have a huge environmental impact just look at Burmese pythons in america


----------



## Marzzy (Jun 29, 2012)

I don't think anyone who owned exotics would own up on here anyway someone would dob instantly, I may know where to get boas corns albino corns chameleons king snakes. But I wouldn't tell anyone or encourage that kind of thing. Not worth the risk unless your a million dollar man


----------



## crazzzylizard (Jun 29, 2012)

_Ok I just read all the stuff blue tongue said and I think they're right besides the bit about funding the theft of natives because I think there are probably alot people selling reptiles without licenses and to those who also don't have licenses but that's another story, the only thing I hate about that is the amount of animals that would be "disposed of" and I hate that thought. But there has to be a way that we can have exotics because is a species of reptile that Australia just doesn't have and that is the humble land tortoise I mean why cant we have them they are the only major reptile species we dont have
_


----------



## d.dog_b.ross (Jun 29, 2012)

we as a community generally do the right thing and get a license and stuff but people who dont care for the internet and dont much care for the law are fine owning illegal reptiles.. before i had a license i only had a pair of beardies that i got from a shop and lied to get the pair as they would only sell a single without it. i thought it was dumb to have to have a license so my lizard could have a friend. now i am by the books and see reason in the laws, but then i would have gotten a chameleon if i could have... i mean living in sa its a very common thing to see and hear people growing green in their house or graden.. thats illegal but deters very few. most people are ignorant, and more like to brag.. as a wise sole once told me loose lips sink ships and you only have yourself to blame..


----------



## benjamind2010 (Jun 30, 2012)

Marzzy said:


> Not worth the risk unless your a million dollar man



And not even worth the risk even if you are a million (or even a billion) dollar man. One reason I would never own (let alone admit to such) an exotic is that many breeders are very particular to who they will sell any of their animals to...and if you admit to owning exotics they may simply refuse to sell anything to you for that reason alone. I've met a few breeders who are like this. I'm talking about breeders of native animals. Some of those prized woma localities may be much harder for me to obtain if I kept exotics and told everyone...even if I were a millionaire.

It's a quarantine issue as well as an ethics issue. I don't keep exotics...and it's not because they're illegal either mind you. It's because they could, at least theoretically if not actually, carry diseases and pathogens not native to Australia (uncommon but not so uncommon that it can't be considered a major risk), and could become feral if released and established (rare, but very possible - the would-be rabbit hunters thought rabbits would never survive here because it "seemed too hot"...but look back at those sentiments and laugh). The same arguments were said of cats, but we have plenty of feral cats, so it appears they adapted to the Aussie heat and once adapted they thrived.


----------



## Recharge (Jun 30, 2012)

I suggest it's just a case of, "there are plenty of stupid people everywhere" 
also, self serving, narcissistic, ignorant, well, you get the idea... 
I just hope each and every one of them gets caught and pays dearly for it


----------



## kawasakirider (Jun 30, 2012)

benjamind2010 said:


> And not even worth the risk even if you are a million (or even a billion) dollar man. One reason I would never own (let alone admit to such) an exotic is that many breeders are very particular to who they will sell any of their animals to...and if you admit to owning exotics they may simply refuse to sell anything to you for that reason alone. I've met a few breeders who are like this. I'm talking about breeders of native animals. Some of those prized woma localities may be much harder for me to obtain if I kept exotics and told everyone...even if I were a millionaire.
> 
> It's a quarantine issue as well as an ethics issue. I don't keep exotics...and it's not because they're illegal either mind you. It's because they could, at least theoretically if not actually, carry diseases and pathogens not native to Australia (uncommon but not so uncommon that it can't be considered a major risk), and could become feral if released and established (rare, but very possible - the would-be rabbit hunters thought rabbits would never survive here because it "seemed too hot"...but look back at those sentiments and laugh). The same arguments were said of cats, but we have plenty of feral cats, so it appears they adapted to the Aussie heat and once adapted they thrived.




Pffft, money talks and everyone has a price. You can have he pickiest breeder ever but I guarantee if an exotic owning multi offered enough for the prized woma, he'd get it.


----------



## MonsieurFang (Jul 8, 2012)

Hi, 

Would someone please explain why it's so bad if someone has a corn snake? 
I didn't realise exotic snakes, like corns and boas were illegal (I'm pretty new to reptile land - have had my python for just a week!).
I do know a girl who has a corn snake and she said she got it because the previous owner was being cruel (keeping him in vile conditions, provoking it etc.)

Thanks! Anni


----------



## Frozenmouse (Jul 8, 2012)

JoshuaAtherton said:


> I heard about a burm in a park in sydney somewhere...
> I think...:?


I heard about a 15 foot long python being caught at a backpackers in darwin city, I am not sure who took it or where it went but from the description it was either a burm or a retic , I have always wanted a red tailed boa, something about them.


----------



## Recharge (Jul 8, 2012)

really? because if people keep getting them, more will need to be imported illegally, without checks and balances in place. 
you asking why something is illegal? do you plan to go through the entire justice system questioning every law and ruling? 
how about you go through all the previous threads on this and read the arguments there? instead if asking everyone to rehash them again and again and again? 
and if you know someone with an illegal animal, report them, they're putting every one else's animals at risk. what happens if one escapes? (and many have) and we start getting cross breeds that start competing better for food than natives? are you willing to risk all the other wild snakes out there over some pathetic selfish want of some idiot? dont' we have enough other wild exotic animals doing enough damage already? you want more?

and that's my rant for tonight.


----------



## Twitch_80 (Jul 8, 2012)

There are laws against exotics as they pose a danger to the ecosystem, so owning them poses a risk (escapes or releases etc). Its just not worth it. There are also differences in laws from sate to state as to what natives you are allowed to own, for example you cant have painted turtles in Vic. You risk a large fine owning them as well as your license being revoked and animals seized. 

With something like 75-80% of the worlds python species here (correct me if Im wrong I cant remember the number), and some of the most beautiful it not like we aren't spoilt for choice.


----------



## TheCheshireCat (Jul 8, 2012)

Recharge said:


> really? because if people keep getting them, more will need to be imported illegally, without checks and balances in place.
> you asking why something is illegal? do you plan to go through the entire justice system questioning every law and ruling?
> how about you go through all the previous threads on this and read the arguments there? instead if asking everyone to rehash them again and again and again?
> and if you know someone with an illegal animal, report them, they're putting every one else's animals at risk. what happens if one escapes? (and many have) and we start getting cross breeds that start competing better for food than natives? are you willing to risk all the other wild snakes out there over some pathetic selfish want of some idiot? dont' we have enough other wild exotic animals doing enough damage already? you want more?
> ...



What exactly would a corn snake or boa "cross" breed with?


----------



## Frozenmouse (Jul 8, 2012)

The painted turtle thing is ridicules , They would never survive a victorian winter and we have red eared sliders in every waterway in the greater melbourne area.


----------



## MonsieurFang (Jul 8, 2012)

Twitch_80 said:


> There are laws against exotics as they pose a danger to the ecosystem, so owning them poses a risk (escapes or releases etc). Its just not worth it. There are also differences in laws from sate to state as to what natives you are allowed to own, for example you cant have painted turtles in Vic. You risk a large fine owning them as well as your license being revoked and animals seized.
> 
> With something like 75-80% of the worlds python species here (correct me if Im wrong I cant remember the number), and some of the most beautiful it not like we aren't spoilt for choice.



Thanks! 



Recharge said:


> really? because if people keep getting them, more will need to be imported illegally, without checks and balances in place.
> you asking why something is illegal? do you plan to go through the entire justice system questioning every law and ruling?
> how about you go through all the previous threads on this and read the arguments there? instead if asking everyone to rehash them again and again and again?
> and if you know someone with an illegal animal, report them, they're putting every one else's animals at risk. what happens if one escapes? (and many have) and we start getting cross breeds that start competing better for food than natives? are you willing to risk all the other wild snakes out there over some pathetic selfish want of some idiot? dont' we have enough other wild exotic animals doing enough damage already? you want more?
> ...



Hi Recharge, 

It's great that you are so passionate about this issue, however your post seems quite condescending. 

I wrote my post because I want to understand if there is a specific reason exotic _snakes _(like corns and boas) are illegal as opposed to exotic breeds of other species of animals which can be kept in captivity in Australia, for example peacocks and macaws. I thought if anyone knew, it'd probably be someone on this site.
I didn't come across any previous posts which explained that but your comment makes me think that I probably could've articulated myself better in asking the question. 

All that aside, I found this to be helpful. Keeping exotic (non-native) animals - Wildlife trade and conservation in Australia


----------



## K3nny (Jul 9, 2012)

MonsieurFang said:


> Hi,
> 
> Would someone please explain why it's so bad if someone has a corn snake?
> I didn't realise exotic snakes, like corns and boas were illegal (I'm pretty new to reptile land - have had my python for just a week!).
> ...



It is relatively irrelevant to legalize the importation of exotic species simply because they currently exist in private collections or the environment, more like adding fuel to an out of control burning flame so to speak. Same goes for like say those that possess amnesty animals. If the current condition is already so fragile, theres even more justification to ban what they can i suppose.

Reptiles are not exactly mainstream anyway (+ as some may agree, our scaly friends tend to get the short end of the stick when it comes to legality and wildlife management), so it would probably be more feasible to ban the minority rather than nit pick at every single potential/already existing problem present. Of course this is just me taking a stab at things

On top of the legal and political mess it creates, theres always the environmental/green issue at hand, disease spreading, etc etc (pretty much if you can't even bring something like dried bananas into the country via customs, the more goes for living breathing organisms, which lets be honest, may be host to a massive number of potentially harmful organisms)

Regarding that government website link, apart from zoos and possibly scientific research what would "non commercial purposes" constitute of?


----------



## Recharge (Jul 9, 2012)

TumbleWeed said:


> What exactly would a corn snake or boa "cross" breed with?



seeing that Corn Snakes are Colubrids, and we in australia have a few type of those, it *may* be possible.
I don't know if any one has tried though. but it's not just corn snakes, there are a thousand different type of snake across the world, the potential is there.
but it's also diseases, or infiltration of other breeds escaping into the wild and starting colonies, the potential environmental and competition damage to natives is very real.

as for comparing reptiles to other animals that are allowed to be imported, we already have problems, the Indian minor for a start, a huge pest problem in queensland and nsw.

do we need to add yet another/more problem(s)? all for someone to have some rare (here) animal they can epeen with?


----------



## Susannuh (Jul 10, 2012)

We have idiots in the US releasing gaboon vipers out just because they didn't "realize what they were getting into". Let alone I'm not even sure how people get a hold of them....


----------



## shrinkie (Jul 10, 2012)

The other day i was walking around campus with my diamond python hanging around my neck and some random guy comes up to me and says hey your the girl thats really into reptiles arnt you? one of my mates told me about you. Confussed as as i was i said yeah and this guy started talking to me about lizards then turns to me and asks if i want to purchase an iguana off him, I said mate there highly ilegal in australia he then takes off his backpack gently so i start to backaway and he pulls out a male baby iguana and then immits he smuggled it as an egg back from my last trip. Of corse i didnt buy it but did how ever report him and not only did he have an illeagal animal but then admitted to smuggling it.


----------



## phantomreptiles (Jul 10, 2012)

^^ why would you be walking around the campus with your python???
You understand exotics are illegal but can't seem to follow your license restrictions.........


----------



## Tassie97 (Jul 10, 2012)

Twitch_80 said:


> There are laws against exotics as they pose a danger to the ecosystem, so owning them poses a risk (escapes or releases etc). Its just not worth it. There are also differences in laws from sate to state as to what natives you are allowed to own, for example you cant have painted turtles in Vic. You risk a large fine owning them as well as your license being revoked and animals seized.
> 
> With something like 75-80% of the worlds python species here (correct me if Im wrong I cant remember the number), and some of the most beautiful it not like we aren't spoilt for choice.


only elapids in Tasmania...


----------



## rvcasa (Jul 10, 2012)

snakes123 said:


> But the thing is most of them dont know they are illegal.




Of course they do!
They're just showing off!!
(exotic herps are not that stupid or they wouldn't be keen on an exotic in first place - it's the "I'm so cool cause no one else have one, but I do," syndrome)

If not, when they need to research husbandry, they'll soon realise they're not on a common pet list. 

I bet if/when they get caught, they'll use the cheap excuse they "didn't know"...

Well, ignorance is not an excuse!

What upsets me, is people's greed and need of showing off (totally ignorance, if you ask me) and not be acquainted with the damage some of these exotics may cause when 'dumped' in a backyard cause they can't get rid of it...

I was reading an article about Corns released in the wild (possibly from DERM) and explains how they destroy native wildlife in SE QLD and NSW.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Cameddy (Oct 7, 2012)

one of my mates on the sunny coast QLD owns an 8 foot red tailed BOA!!!!!


----------



## rvcasa (Oct 7, 2012)

MonsieurFang said:


> Hi,
> 
> Would someone please explain why it's so bad if someone has a corn snake?
> I didn't realise exotic snakes, like corns and boas were illegal (I'm pretty new to reptile land - have had my python for just a week!).
> ...



@ MonsieurFang
Please read attached:
http://www.environment.gov.au/about/media/dept-mr/pubs/mr20100906.pdf

I no longer have the Dep. of Environment docs I read before, they were too long, but this one above still explains a bit (very briefly) the issue.
Also, if you research what Cane Toads are doing to wildlife in Australia (in particular, ie, the black tiger snake) you'll understand it better.

I hope this helps. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## themadherp (Oct 7, 2012)

people can agree or disagree on whether it is ok to keep exotics but as long as they are available for people to purchase them you will have people ready to buy them


----------



## disintegratus (Oct 7, 2012)

As far as the exotics debate goes, as much as there are some stunning creatures O/S that I would love to keep (Emerald tree monitors and Boelens pythons spring to mind), I absolutely adore our natives, and I think we are blessed to have some of the most stunning fauna in the world, and would not do anything to compromise that.
I think people are so vocal about owning exotics for several reasons, most of which have already been mentioned here; they want to be badass, or they simply don't know any better being the main ones. I think a lot of the reason is for the same reason I feel the need to tell everyone everytime I get a new anything (regardless of whether they know it's illegal or not): "Look at this new pet/thing I have! It's AWESOME!!!" 

Although, I have finally found something I disagree with Bluetongue about:



Bluetongue1 said:


> There are also those who put their own desires ahead of more general needs. *All I can say to them is that it wouldn't be illegal if it was alright to do*.
> 
> Blue




I can't help but bring to mind: the ban on PP collars (prong collars) in Victoria; The ridiculous BSL/Pit Bull laws that have been (reasonably recently) introduced in Victoria; the restrictions on other dogs (Dogo Argentino, Presa Canario, Japanese Tosa etc) that have been around for years.


----------



## chilli-mudcrab (Oct 8, 2012)

Most people probably don't care because we are as a society quite used to breaking the law. Anyone ever drove a little to fast, smoked a joint, gone fishing without a license, camped on a remote beach without a permit, not voted, bought a banned video game from overseas, pirated a movie, cut down a tree on your own property. Christ I've done all these in the last month but I'm. Still ahardworking responsible taxpaying father of two beautiful girls, who if offered would consider a chamleon or ball maybe and even though I know its wrong they're just so pretty


----------



## Justdragons (Oct 8, 2012)

Id say a good half of you are racist to snakes, hating on a reptile because its not from Australia( kinda tongue in cheek but true ).. futher more the ones of you who think its good reptiles die because they are not native in my opinion cannot call themselfs true reptile lovers. I dont think killing animals is the answer, i dont claim to have the answer but i dont feel that is it. 

I would love a chameleon and i seriously doubt that chameleons will have an impact on our wildlife but putting my collection on the line is a massive risk. i feel that the americas problem in the everglades is a bad example of the risk on our environment as it was a massive breeding facility that got caught in a cyclone releasing hundreds of thousands of burmese and alike pythons in to the wild at the same time.. 

Im not saying i think that blanket legalisation is the answer but i think they are here and its time to stop being ignorant to that and look and controling the problem that exists.. 

JMO


----------



## eddie123 (Oct 8, 2012)

one of my friends just got a chamelian??? There are so many exotic animals in australia that we dont know about


----------



## cathy1986 (Oct 8, 2012)

justdragons said:


> Id say a good half of you are racist to snakes, hating on a reptile because its not from Australia( kinda tongue in cheek but true ).. futher more the ones of you who think its good reptiles die because they are not native in my opinion cannot call themselfs true reptile lovers. I dont think killing animals is the answer, i dont claim to have the answer but i dont feel that is it.
> 
> I would love a chameleon and i seriously doubt that chameleons will have an impact on our wildlife but putting my collection on the line is a massive risk. i feel that the americas problem in the everglades is a bad example of the risk on our environment as it was a massive breeding facility that got caught in a cyclone releasing hundreds of thousands of burmese and alike pythons in to the wild at the same time..
> 
> ...



yeah why not just have an international licence and maybe only sell desexed reptiles so if they do get out they cant go crazy and take over atleast then it can be monitored (lol can you desex reptiles its just sounded like a good idea ;-) .)

Cathy


----------



## Justdragons (Oct 9, 2012)

cathy1986 said:


> yeah why not just have an international licence and maybe only sell desexed reptiles so if they do get out they cant go crazy and take over atleast then it can be monitored (lol can you desex reptiles its just sounded like a good idea ;-) .)
> 
> Cathy



Thats what im getting at actually, i would pay an extra 50 for a desexed chameleon or a red tailed boa. 

Just on exotics has anyone been to the hub library in Aberfoyle pk? I grew up there and for as long as i can remember they have had a snake called soloman who would have to have been 12ft long and i think a boa from wat i remember.. Ill have to dig up the photos of me and 5 or 6 other kids holding him. even all the leadlight windows in the place had him in them. I dont see a library having a zoo license lol. see even local government owns exotics hahah

- - - Updated - - -

so i just rang the hub library and soloman died 3 years ago at the ripe age of 44 years old  the lady said that he has a fb page somewhere i will check out..


----------



## BIGBANG (Oct 10, 2012)

just wondering with all these exotics getting round, people with licenses must have them and keep them illegally, what do you do with them if you get a knock at the door by your licensing division for your state/territory? or how many people have actually had the authorities turn up on their door step to inspect their collection???


----------



## nonamesleft (Oct 10, 2012)

BIGBANG said:


> just wondering with all these exotics getting round, people with licenses must have them and keep them illegally, what do you do with them if you get a knock at the door by your licensing division for your state/territory? or how many people have actually had the authorities turn up on their door step to inspect their collection???



Would start by asking them to come back later.


----------



## BIGBANG (Oct 10, 2012)

you would need to do some quick taling wouldnt ya, i think as long as the license holder is home it is part of the terms on ya license that they are allowed access anytime they want. has anyone ever been checked?


----------



## miichoouu (Oct 27, 2012)

honestly i dont think theres anything wrong with owning an exotic, just that Australia needs to lighten up a little bit more, because what happens when a corn snake (or other illegal) gets sick you cant really go to the vet now -.- i dont see the harm why we are not allowed to keep them, i wanted one, i could of gotten one... though i thought i may as well go the correct way went and got my licence and now looking around to buy my first snake


----------



## Gonemad (Oct 27, 2012)

Bragging about owning exotics is stupid I would never brag! But if I did own one I would ***** myself every time a car came up my drive way. lol (what's the good of owning one if it's not displayed)?
We have frequent visits from inspectors due to legally owning monkeys! So exotics would be out of the question for me! People have illegal natives too!


----------



## Slateman (Oct 27, 2012)

I just hope people that you realize who is reading our forums. All written here is in archive available to anybody who make search. If you get in trouble in future, you have pretty good record here what is your opinion on this subject. 

APS is strongly advising all members to stay a way from illegal trades.


----------



## disintegratus (Oct 28, 2012)

Gonemad said:


> Bragging about owning exotics is stupid I would never brag! But if I did own one I would ***** myself every time a car came up my drive way. lol (what's the good of owning one if it's not displayed)?
> We have frequent visits from inspectors due to legally owning monkeys! So exotics would be out of the question for me! People have illegal natives too!




I know what you mean, I don't have exotics (why would I want to, our own fauna is incredible) but I do have 4 dogs in a council area zoned for 2. I know damned well that I would not hesitate to pack them all up and move house if I needed to, but I still **** my pants every time an unknown car pulls up in front of the house!!


----------



## crocodile_dan (Oct 28, 2012)

Gonemad said:


> We have frequent visits from inspectors due to legally owning monkeys!



What species and purpose do you have to legally hold primate species? I have heard of it being done before, same as big cats. I ask not because I want to but due to my interest in zoological facilities and it is a side connection, feel free to PM me to avoid taking this thread off topic. Cheers


----------



## Justdragons (Oct 28, 2012)

Nah start a thread with monkey photos. That's so cool.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Beard (Oct 29, 2012)

justdragons said:


> Nah start a thread with monkey photos. That's so cool.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk




Just go to the faces to names thread. Plenty of monkey photos there


----------



## mad_at_arms (Oct 29, 2012)

miichoouu said:


> because what happens when a corn snake (or other illegal) gets sick you cant really go to the vet now



Yes you can.
Vets are bound by a code of ethics.


----------



## damian83 (Oct 29, 2012)

Beard said:


> Just go to the faces to names thread. Plenty of monkey photos there



Hope your not talking bout me beard?.............


----------



## zactus (Jan 8, 2013)

I have been keeping a range of exotic fish for a very long time. It always amazes me how exotic non-importable fish are traded openly. I have never been offered any exotic reptiles and it would certainly be hard to resist some Leopard Geckoes, Corn Snakes of even Red Eared Sliders. 

I don't see how its any different to a lot of the fish that are kept and sold openly. I personally don't have a problem with people keeping exotics. As long as they are sensible about it. The most destructive exotic animals have already overrun much of the country - and were released legally. I see plenty of talk about exotic reptiles being readily available. Im starting to think its a bit of exaggeration.


----------



## Ryderthefrog (Jan 8, 2013)

They're probably proud of it. Like they know that who they're talking to most likely doesn't have exotics so it makes them feel special.


----------



## benjamind2010 (Jan 8, 2013)

zactus said:


> I see plenty of talk about exotic reptiles being readily available. Im starting to think its a bit of exaggeration.



No, it isn't. 2 weeks ago I was offered the following (all of them snakes):

High-orange corn snakes (I saw these in the flesh, they aren't classified as "okeetee" but they were a rich orange with pure clean white and black/tortoiseshell patterns on the belly.
Amelanistic corns (fluorescent orange, probably albino forms of the above)
Black&White corns
Snow corns
Coral (pink) snow corns (see the high-orange above, probably related)
Pueblan milk snakes
Honduran milk snakes
Gopher snakes
Ball pythons
Blood pythons

None of them were of any interest to me since I keep RHD womas and in my opinion they are equal first with corns as being the best pet snake - except at feeding time. Idiot-proof and so easy to keep/breed/maintain. Milks are a lot harder to keep, and I've got friends who've had them and tended to lose a few from time to time due to stress (heat, enclosure?).


----------



## Shotta (Jan 8, 2013)

zactus said:


> I have been keeping a range of exotic fish for a very long time. It always amazes me how exotic non-importable fish are traded openly. I have never been offered any exotic reptiles and it would certainly be hard to resist some Leopard Geckoes, Corn Snakes of even Red Eared Sliders.
> 
> I don't see how its any different to a lot of the fish that are kept and sold openly. I personally don't have a problem with people keeping exotics. As long as they are sensible about it. The most destructive exotic animals have already overrun much of the country - and were released legally. I see plenty of talk about exotic reptiles being readily available. Im starting to think its a bit of exaggeration.



ha ha what sort of exotic fish i know that certain aquariums/petstores in sydney that have illegal things for eg..genetically modified danios,corydoras which glow, and red tail catfish and alligator gar


----------



## benjamind2010 (Jan 8, 2013)

zactus said:


> Wow. Was this just friend of a friend? Advertised somewhere? Or just someone you randomly met?



I used to know a lot of people in that scene, and still have the occasional offer. About 6 or 7 times a year. Mostly bred interstate, particularly around Melbourne, is where most of the corns I've been offered come from. From what I gather corns don't handle temps higher than say 33, they just lock up and refuse to eat, shed, defecate, so unless I had air-con on all the time 24/7 keeping them wouldn't be 100% viable even if they were legal.


----------



## nch90 (Jan 8, 2013)

BIGBANG said:


> just wondering with all these exotics getting round, people with licenses must have them and keep them illegally, what do you do with them if you get a knock at the door by your licensing division for your state/territory? or how many people have actually had the authorities turn up on their door step to inspect their collection???




U look through ur peep whole and sit the shotty out


----------



## beardedman (May 9, 2013)

the funny thing is im 13 ive been asked if i want corns ,leopards, ball pythons, burmeses and chameleons all of which i wish i said yes to and with all those people ive said u do realise there illegal for about 5mins there like stunned mullet than a sec after i will be like i wont dob the only reason why is because you should of seen the conditions of the tanks and racks for the leopard gecos the racks would get cleaned evry day with the chameleons had a ginormous tank with a imaculate dispaly of a rainforest wit bromiliards and get sparayed every day for the burmese and ball pythons tanks that cost thousands and also poison dart frogs last time i got offered them they were 1000 for a pair just for 2 frogs ARE U MENTAL just couldnt do it for frogs no matter wat


----------



## geckodan (May 10, 2013)

mad_at_arms said:


> Yes you can.
> Vets are bound by a code of ethics.



Actually we swear no oaths to anything except "Do no harm". Vets have no obligation with regards to what they must see or treat. Most will turn a blind eye to exotics however for the sake of the animal.


----------



## Snowman (May 10, 2013)

BIGBANG said:


> just wondering with all these exotics getting round, people with licenses must have them and keep them illegally, what do you do with them if you get a knock at the door by your licensing division for your state/territory? or how many people have actually had the authorities turn up on their door step to inspect their collection???



DEC inspect all the time in WA. I've had three officers go through my reptile room on one occasion. I've been inspected twice so far. They check my paperwork from the time I got my first license. And check every tub and visible enclosure in my reptile room looking for 'extra' animals.


----------



## Snowman (May 10, 2013)

geckodan said:


> Actually we swear no oaths to anything except "Do no harm". Vets have no obligation with regards to what they must see or treat. Most will turn a blind eye to exotics however for the sake of the animal.


What? I thought there was a ritual that involved a massive stone iguana and the blood sacrifice of virgins. Later the oath is taken which is witnessed by the vet gods.


----------



## treeofgreen (May 10, 2013)

Snowman said:


> What? I thought there was a ritual that involved a massive stone iguana and the blood sacrifice of virgins. Later the oath is taken which is witnessed by the vet gods.


I think you are getting vets mixed up with bankers Snowman. Pretty much the same but the stone statue is an owl


----------



## Snowman (May 10, 2013)

treeofgreen said:


> I think you are getting vets mixed up with bankers Snowman. Pretty much the same but the stone statue is an owl


Also vets use vegan virgins and bankers use women of the night. It's a link to the owl symbology.


----------



## beardedman (May 10, 2013)

jeez thats pretty harsh in WA here in sydny youd be lucky to get a wildlife person to do a inspection there all to lazy pretty much


----------



## andynic07 (May 10, 2013)

Snowman said:


> What? I thought there was a ritual that involved a massive stone iguana and the blood sacrifice of virgins. Later the oath is taken which is witnessed by the vet gods.


You cannot call it a ritual unless a goat is involved.


----------



## Snowman (May 10, 2013)

beardedman said:


> jeez thats pretty harsh in WA here in sydny youd be lucky to get a wildlife person to do a inspection there all to lazy pretty much



I think its a waste of time. If I was going to keep illegal reptiles.. Then I wouldnt have got a license in the first place. They should be out doing something useful, other than slapping people on the wrist for not having correct paperwork.


----------



## beardedman (May 10, 2013)

yeah thats true but put it this way im 13 there not gonna come running to my house asking do u have exotics show me your records wats in this tub true


----------



## Snowman (May 10, 2013)

beardedman said:


> yeah thats true but put it this way im 13 there not gonna come running to my house asking do u have exotics show me your records wats in this tub true


They would if you lived in WA. Most likely the license would be in your parents name and the inspection would be the same regardless of how old you are.


----------



## Trimeresurus (May 10, 2013)

Most DSE inspectors can't tell the difference between chondros and emerald tree boas.


----------



## bohdi13 (May 10, 2013)

Snowman said:


> They would if you lived in WA. Most likely the license would be in your parents name and the inspection would be the same regardless of how old you are.



how early do they inform you of their arrival? and do you know if they just inspect people with a mid-large collection or even people with 1-2 reptiles?


----------



## Snowman (May 10, 2013)

bohdi13 said:


> how early do they inform you of their arrival? and do you know if they just inspect people with a mid-large collection or even people with 1-2 reptiles?


No warning and my first visit I only had a few pythons.


----------



## luehmans (May 10, 2013)

I think the laws suck. And they aren't that readily available, we have been trying to find a chameleon, after some research I found they are now illegal but had been legal for some time so the breeding population is still out there.. Somewhere..... It's easier to get your hands on alligators and stuff than a basic chameleon...


----------



## Trimeresurus (May 10, 2013)

luehmans said:


> I think the laws suck. And they aren't that readily available, we have been trying to find a chameleon, after some research I found they are now illegal but had been legal for some time so the breeding population is still out there.. Somewhere..... It's easier to get your hands on alligators and stuff than a basic chameleon...




There's plenty of chameleons around, you just need to know who to talk to. Many people don't have much trust. Like many people on this site, some people will dob anyone in to make themselves feel righteous or whatever.


----------



## luehmans (May 10, 2013)

So everyone says... But not easy to actually get hold of one. We handled one at the zoo and they were pretty cool. Wanted one since then. Personally don't see the issue if they are kept in captivity. And honestly half the exotics would never survive in the wild here with our climate... Melbourne especially


----------



## beardedman (May 10, 2013)

No warning and my first visit I only had a few pythons.
yeah but ive only got geckos and beardies does that make a difference and a stage 1 license and also do u think the reason why there are so may exotics in sydney is because the wildlife people dont really give a poo like im not complaining because if someone offered me a leopard gecko i would say yes to it straight away haha


----------



## Trimeresurus (May 10, 2013)

beardedman said:


> the funny thing is im 13 ive been asked if i want corns ,leopards, ball pythons, burmeses and chameleons all of which i wish i said yes to and with all those people ive said u do realise there illegal for about 5mins there like stunned mullet than a sec after i will be like i wont dob the only reason why is because you should of seen the conditions of the tanks and racks for the leopard gecos the racks would get cleaned evry day with the chameleons had a ginormous tank with a imaculate dispaly of a rainforest wit bromiliards and get sparayed every day for the burmese and ball pythons tanks that cost thousands and also poison dart frogs last time i got offered them they were 1000 for a pair just for 2 frogs ARE U MENTAL just couldnt do it for frogs no matter wat




Riiiiiightooo


----------



## beardedman (May 10, 2013)

im guessing that was sarcasm


----------



## borntobnude (May 11, 2013)

P%t B&%n sell books on the keeping of Leopard Gekos , and other assorted "illegals " :evil:


----------



## MesseNoire (May 11, 2013)

borntobnude said:


> P%t B&%n sell books on the keeping of Leopard Gekos , and other assorted "illegals " :evil:



They get them from the supplier as a "pack" and that includes the leopard gecko book and the tortoise book.
They don't individually just order those books.


----------



## borntobnude (May 11, 2013)

Fractal_man said:


> They get them from the supplier as a "pack" and that includes the leopard gecko book and the tortoise book.
> They don't individually just order those books.



Fair enough to an extent but DO they sell ??


----------



## MesseNoire (May 11, 2013)

borntobnude said:


> Fair enough to an extent but DO they sell ??



I bought them (at a discount) purely because I enjoy learning about these kinds of things.
And they do sell, but it's also a dead department so to speak, I usually make an order from the supplier for all books once every 3-4 months if they're lucky.

As for people owning exotics, I have a rep for one of our suppliers that has told me he collects exotics from people's homes and delivers them to the reptile park. How true this is I am not sure. He also mentioned that his company are trialling/ and going to be supplying a new brand of reptile product manufactured in Germany......


----------



## Imported_tuatara (Dec 1, 2017)

i'd still rather exotic reptiles being legal than cats and such, wouldn't be no where near as many native deaths than with cats. also, don't think i could resist if someone asked me for a red tailed boa, always have thought boas were beautiful, but wouldn't spend one 20$ on a cornsnake, they're very lazy, and being caught with one would suck(tho same with any exotic, so while i don't support smuggling, but go big or go home. (yes this is an old thread, lol.)


----------



## Prof_Moreliarty (Dec 1, 2017)

SFD has now moved to Europe probably carried by exotics from America.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-03352-1

That’s just one of many pathogens we don’t want in Australia.


----------

