# A Hard Lesson Learned



## beknluke (Oct 8, 2005)

Hi Guys
The following is a bit of a sad story, but with lots of money and a hell of a lot of time and TLC, it just might turn out ok...
I wasn't planning on announcing to everyone my joy at the following purchase because of the dollar figure, but since I have a well secured home and this needs to be a lesson to everyone, I thought I would share.
I don't know how many of you saw this add, but there was an add placed on a website not long ago for 12 pairs of 18mth old Central Beardies with intense colouring for $6k in Nth Qld. I am the buyer.
After a few phone conversations with the seller and some emails going back and forth with things such as "oh they're just beautiful!! I just know you'll be even more excited when you get them!! They're my babies - I had a cry when I packaged them up" yadda yadda, I was happy to proceed with the purchase.
$6000 late and I am opening the container that they came down in, almost wetting myself with the excitement of looking at them in person.
The first thing I noticed is the container that they were shipped in. It was one of those 'roll under the bed' type long but shallow containers. It only had holes drilled in the lid. Only 38 small holes were drilled in that lid - and the con note (along with the freight sticker) said OVER NIGHT TO MEL!!
Next thing I noticed was the way in which they were packed. All of the beardies were SHOVED into these small bags to the point where they were practically folded into them.
THEN, they were stacked on top of each other with nothing in between to allow air to circulate.
Still, I wasn't put off... I started to open the bags... After a few bags, I was a bit less excited, opened a few more and I was concerned, opened the last few and I was in tears.
Whilst some of these animals came down without anything majorly wrong with them other than some nose and chin rubs and the girls being under weight from breeding - some were downright nasty 
Here is a link to some photos.... WARNING - they may ick some people out.

http://photobucket.com/albums/b231/beknluke/Beardies


Needless to say, I raced them up to my local vet to have it recorded that I had them seen to on the same night that I received them and I took the following day off work to get them to Canterbury Veterinary Clinic.
I took ALL 24 in and we were in there for 2 hours.
Over all, there are numerous serious gangrene on a lot of the animals, 1 animal awaiting amputation, 1 waiting to see if the lizard 'self amputates' by the rest of the limb staying healthy and the dead bit falls off, (LOTS of toes are in this way too), at least 3 or 4 cysts, and 5 or so eyes that I am putting ointment on 4 times a day so that the scabs and muck is gone and we can see if there are actually eye balls in there  Oh!! Not to mention the 2 that might have brain damage from suffocation!!
2 of the animals I WAS told had been to the vet that morning, but the seller SERIOUSLY understated what was wrong with them - AND failed to mention that one of them had had its front leg amputated practically at the shoulder.
The seller had THOSE two animals stacked underneath all of the others 
I have to get up an hour earlier each day (making it 5.30am) and am going to bed at about 11.30/12 by the time I am finished with them for the night.
On all of the cuts, gangrene and scabs I am having to apply Bepanthen 3x a day...
I am exhausted 
I spoke to the seller while I was in the vet on the actual night that I received them and they INSISTED that the animals were 'fine when they left me' and they 'find it very hard to believe' that the animals were in the state that I was claiming they were in... 
Yesterday I had to spend another $1100 on enclosures to separate them further so that I almost have 1 animal/tank so that there is limited stress, they have all access to food etc etc.
In hind sight there WERE a few subtly dodgy things about the sale that I should have picked up on, but in my na?ve excitement, I overlooked them 
So guys - let this be a lesson to ALL of you, if you are making a big purchase like this, if you're unable to get references off other people who have dealt with the seller, see if you can stretch the budget just a fraction more to get a flight there and check em out.
Sorry to have gone on about it, but I am always so friendly and trusting of other sellers that sometimes I overlook the possibilities that it 'could be happening to me'
Bex


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## SLACkra (Oct 8, 2005)

holy crap. that person should be reported to the wildlife folk. she should have her licence revoked and should be punished acordingly. not to mention the person should cover the costs of the vet bills not to mention pay back the majority of the money for the animals due to their shape. 

hope things improve beks,

andrew


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## Skorpious (Oct 8, 2005)

You should say who the seller was Bex, so people know. I don't think anyone would believe you would injure that many Beardies to make up a story like this. Thus this person should be identified so no-one else is caught by their horrendous husbandry.
Hope they pull through for you.

(Edit: Or I can just go look at the for sale section myself. Whoops)


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## indicus (Oct 8, 2005)

Yeah; perfect condition.....damn disgusting!!!!
I'd be pushing for a refund; and vet bills covered....
From what's being said; their track record is poor at best!!!!
Sorry this has happened to you....
They should have told you everything about their condition.
Makes it more difficult for the herpers trying to do right by others.
To think they said they were fine when we sent them; what a crock!!!!; makes me wild!!! :evil:


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## BROWNS (Oct 8, 2005)

Man that's disgusting,i'd be asking for full refund ,who knows what other nasties are on them.
The seller should be named that's just straight out wrong how could any animal get in that condition in a few days freight max?Licencce gone and all expenses on your behalf paid with full refund i'd ask for,they have given you a nightmare.Makes you wonder where to buy animals from these days and for that price...did you ask for pics of these animals before you purchased?

That's a lot of money spent on some very sick poor looking lizards there,can i ask if they were through a private sale or a pet shop?


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## Scootaaa (Oct 8, 2005)

shame shame shame people like that dont deserve to have pets.. it made me sick to the state of neglect these animals are in... but thank goodness they are now getting the care they rightly deserved in the first place... I wouldnt regard the seller as herper at all !!!


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## westhamsc (Oct 8, 2005)

oh my god bex it's turds like this person that give us herpers a bad name (if you can even call her a herper). for them to get gangrene like that they had to be kept in such bad conditions and not be treated at all rat this B*$%# out post her name and phone number so we can all have a go at her.

if there's anything i can do don't hesitate to call me i'm here for ya.

westie


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## Surfcop24 (Oct 8, 2005)

Gee's...Thats disgusting.... How could firstly, someone keep those animals in such a bad condition...And secondly, sell them off to someone without telling them their terrible condition... Also I dont know much about freighting...But as you described it I am sure that is wrong. Surely someone can do something about this person. BECNLUKE try contacting some wildlife organisation in your area. They may be able to give you advise on what can be done against this person. If you cant get a refund or bills paid be sure to let us know who this seller is.......PPLLEEAASSEE!!!!!!!


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## diamond_python (Oct 8, 2005)

*OMG!!!!!!!!*

That is an absolute disgrace. I have seen animals in better shape in pet shops. I agree with all of the above statements. Something has to be done. *DO NOT LET IT REST!!!!! *Rat the seller out to us. They have done you no favours. Those pics made me sick and angry. C'mon, give us all a name. This has to be stopped..

I hope all goes well for you though in the end with the poor little ones.


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## moosenoose (Oct 8, 2005)

I thought the description sounded terrible, then I saw the photos! :shock: 

That would have been a terrible shock for you, especially seeing first how they were sent and then secondly the state of the animals  

I'd be naming names also Bex. Considering the amount you spent to get those animals to you, you'd think they'd be an perfect health and properly packaged up! Don't let this person get away with it! File a complaint or something with the DSE (Is there an avenue for this sort of thing??), because this person should have his/her license revoked!! :evil:  I hope it all works out well in the end for you and your extended family.

Cheers,
Luke


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## diamond_python (Oct 8, 2005)

Is it add 627-102. Shame it doesn't give out details on the site, well in this instance anyway.


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## foxysnake (Oct 8, 2005)

Oh my god, Good on you for trying to get them better. I wouldn't worry about naming the person here - go straight to a lawyer. Get the seller into the crap so they lose their license and arent allowed to keep any animals. Flat out cruelty. Good luck with the animals, I hope they are able to get better.
Cheers,
Dee.


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## Stevo (Oct 8, 2005)

Those photo's made me feel sick bex. I feel guilty if one of my gippy's gets a nose rub. I am absolutely horrified and although i always thought buyer beware , i think you "should" take the matter further.


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## Lamu22 (Oct 8, 2005)

thats so sad.........., but your doing the right thing, good on ya!, if u need a hand with *anything* just send me a pm im willing to babysit them if things get to much for you i have acouple of spare enclosures. good luck with everything i hope everything works out for you.

LAMU


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## Guest (Oct 8, 2005)

:evil: :evil: :evil:


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## Jason (Oct 8, 2005)

hi bex, i red the post and was horrified then i looked at the photos and feel like punching somthing it really makes me mad, that is bloody terrible. dont let this slide, take it urther, i wouldnt let them get away with this, it is unbeleivable crual what these animals have gone through. i feel so bad for you, i would have been so excited getting all those beardies and then something like this happens, some people just dont care, this is unbelievable and i am shocked that someone could be so shallow and lie to you like this. if you lived in sydney i would offer to help look after a few to help take the load off. sorry for what has happened and i am trying very hard not to use some bad language in this post cause i am furious, i would love to know there name and what state they live in so other people dont ever waste their time dealing with this________!!!!

good luck and im sure that these animals with make a good recovery due to being so well looked after now, good luck and keep us posted.


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## beknluke (Oct 8, 2005)

Hi Guys, thanx so much for your support.
Before I start going any further though, I must send a HUGE thankyou to the following people:

Brain Barnett - Herp Shop: Brian listened to me balling on Tuesday night when I fist got them and has been an INVALUBLE sourse of advice and support. I am also about to buy him out of most of his food products today lol.

Dr Jim Greenwood: What can I say?? What a WONDERFUL vet he is!! He put up with my crying, cringing, and feeling ill while he was picking at things!! Has given me an 'account' to try and get it paid by the seller. Also has offered to speak to the seller to help me get my money back.

Mimmo - Reptahouse: I called Mimmo at lunchtime on Wednesday, desparately tring to get some more enclousres. He couldn't get the timber that he needed till Friday. Offered to chop up other pre made tanks to make mine and delivered 5 perfect enclosures at 5pm on Thursday!!!

Lastly - to OuZo and Souley who have also put up with my tears, are coming down tomorrow to help me out with caring for them all, and OuZo spent her afternoon on Wednesday coming to Sunbury, driving to Canterbury, and back to Sunbury again.

THANKYOU GUYS!! IT MEANS SO MUCH TO ME!!

___________
Ok, to other stuff.
I don't want to mention the sellers name and details until I have been able to discuss with them my refund. As yet I have left multiple messages on their mobile (the only number they listed) and am not particularly expecting a call back. 
Once you add up the animals that I am am practically bringing back from the dead, the vet bills, the vet bills that I am booked in for, my day off work that they wouldn't pay me for, the enclosures and the huge food bill that I am about to get from all of the extra food that I have to buy to 'pump them' (not to mention me crying all of my tears for the year 2005 lol), it adds up to $3000. So that is what I am pushing for.
If they decide not to give me this refund, I WILL be doing eveything within my power to bring them down. Until then though I don't want to get caught out for slander.
These were from a private keeper and they took 5hrs on a plane to get here, so as everyone can understand, there's no way this happened in transport lol. Especially when you consider that they were a bit cold from the flight - they weren't moving anywhere in a hurry.
Also, I most certainly DID get photos before I purchased them!! I'm not THAT silly lol!! But they only sent me 12 photos and some of the animals featured twice. It wasn't until the day before they were shipping that my excited little brain registered that. So I asked for pics of all of them (and they offered me that if there were any that I didn't want - they would refund them!!!!) but I never got ANY of those pics becuase they had to 'rush 2 of them to the vet' for a bitten leg and a sore eye. FAILED TO MENTION THE AMPUTATION OF THAT LEG!!!!!

Quote :
"This morning when I started packing I noticed one had a badly chewed front
leg, (sob sob) so I raced to the vet and he has given shots of vitamins and
antibiotics plus fixed up the leg and another has an eye infection also
received shots. I have put these 2 in purple bags so you can see which ones
I mean. If you would like a refund on these 2 just let me know or if you
want to keep them and take them to the vet again and let me know what the
bill is.
Otherwise they are excited about their flight.
I will email you the flight details when I get back from the airport at this
stage I know it gets into Melb at 4.55pm today.
I did have a cry this morning, I do hope you love them too."

How them missed all of the OTHERS with the probs, I'll never know!!
The vet WAS fairly impressed with the colours (I took pics of all 24 on the night that I bought them as proof) but I couldn't be bothered sitting up all last night waiting for them to load!! lol
The thing that I am most concerned about is the fact that the seller has 150+ eggs of these guys in their incubator. I don't think that they deserve to be getting any sales after this - but no doubt they WILL sell quickly becuase of the colours of the animals....
Thanx again guys, and I'll keep you updated.
Bex


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## zulu (Oct 8, 2005)

*re A Hard*

Gross cruelty by the person who had them bex and they should be charged with cruelty and the QNPWS should revoke the persons license to keep reptiles,and i pity any other animals this person owns truly  Yep ide be onto rspca in QLD and whatever they call npws up there then into a lawyer if possible,makes me spew,pm me there details please.Sorry this has happened to you bex..


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## beknluke (Oct 8, 2005)

Sorry Zulu, but I am unwilling to mention their dets until this is all over....


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## Guest (Oct 8, 2005)

You have a legal claim folow it up pay for a brief


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## Jake.msv (Oct 8, 2005)

BeknLuke, 
I can't believe what i just read, if i was you i'd be taking the next flight to the sellers and speaking to them face to face, with the QNPWS in toe. If you dont get refunded ring "Ray" @ ACA bet he'd be glad to help. Also "yer" those 150 incubating eggs  

3 more words.
report
Report!
REPORT!


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## Robbo (Oct 8, 2005)

beks
sorry to hear about it 
especially after the way you where when i brought the bearded dragon from you
you couldnt ask for someone better to buy from
you were very reassuring and concerned about your animals
then this happens to you karma will come back and bite them on the but ( or mabey just a few of there animals )
but if you do need some help i am only just up the road 

shane


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## olivehydra (Oct 8, 2005)

Beknluke,

That is disgusting. I cannot understand how someone could treat their animals and you like that. At least for the animals sake, it sounds like they are definetly in better hands now.


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## beknluke (Oct 8, 2005)

Thankyou guys - I am touched by the overwhelming responses I have received from everyone. You're all so kind.
The sellers mobile is 'not responding' to my home number (can they have gotten it blocked??) and when I call from a private number their 'msg bank is full, please try again later'... I haven't got high hopes for this..
Bex


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## Jason (Oct 8, 2005)

its terrible, take it further, dont give up!!


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## SLACkra (Oct 8, 2005)

maybe its just me but have you threatened them yet? i mean having QNPW come and take their animals away and revoke their licence would cost more than simply refunding you the $3000 and more. anybody know if you can sue some one for causing you extreme emotional stress? 

i hope the lizards start feeling better and i hope you feel better.


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## danw (Oct 8, 2005)

thats really bad...I can't believe the state that the beardies are in..when I saw that add I thought they must have been really beautiful for that price but that's absolutely disgusting what they have done!


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## danw (Oct 8, 2005)

oops forgot to say hope all goes well.


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## diamond_python (Oct 8, 2005)

Well, IMO, I think the person should be named. If you don't want to do it, PM me and I will see it is done 

The only reason I say this is because I don't want any one else to be caught by this person but in the end, it is up to you. BUT, definately report them. Do not settle for just compensation. If it was me, I would be seeking blood 

Take care and I hope all goes well


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## Grant (Oct 8, 2005)

I know its all been said already but contact the QLD EPA (Environmental Protection Agency). Their Central Office details are:

160 Ann St
Brisbane QLD 4000
(07) 3227 7111

Postal Address:
PO Box 15155 
City East QLD 4002

These are the people you need to contact up here in QLD. They will have this person on record in their licensing records.
I sincerely hope you contact the EPA, this needs to be reported.
Good luck with the dragons, admire your commitment to bringing them back to health.


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## ether (Oct 8, 2005)

This just bloody gees me up..


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## soulweaver (Oct 8, 2005)

she should be reported, and i would be asking for at least $4000 back.....

am actually very interested to see them first hand 2morrow.


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## OuZo (Oct 8, 2005)

I've seen em...it's heartbreaking :cry:

Don't have a lot of time to write now but I've already annoyed the crap out of Bex by telling her she HAS to sue if this person refuses to give her a reasonable refund. These sort of people are SCUM and they need to learn what happens when you do these things. Sue the crap out her, leave her penniless and without any animals by reporting her to the department in her state.

We'll see them tomorrow again anyway but I hear they're on the improve with all the work Bex is putting into them. Our task will be to wash the green poo off that they're covered in from being crammed in bags on top of each other :?


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## beknluke (Oct 8, 2005)

Thanx guys - all of your kind words are doing me wonders
I am about to go off for the 'nightly administering of meds' - should be in bed in a few hours!!
Grant - THANKYOU for posting up the phone numbers!!
I have emailed the seller back as it appears that they are avoiding me. In any case, I have advised them that I will be contacting the RSPCA in QLD and QLD Parks and Wildlife. Hopefully their license will be revoked and all animals removed!! Poor things...
Unfortunately, at this stage I am still unwilling to give out their name as I am giving them a chance to right the wrong so to speak. I am fully aware that by telling the world who it was, I am effectively destroying most of the chance that they have of selling (or buy for that matter) any herps again. So like I said, I am being the nice one and giving them a chance.
Thanx again guys, and Zo and Soul, look forward to seeing you both
Bex


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## basketcase (Oct 8, 2005)

its good to see the animals are in good hands now. good luck with them

i'd love to see some pics in a couple of months when they're all hopefully doing very well.

as for the seller, well yeah, there are a few ppl in the herp community like that, and its very very sad.


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## pugsly (Oct 9, 2005)

I agree bex, you DO have a legal claim and a damn good one at that, problem being you only have a mobile number or email address, could be a little difficult. I would be speaking to a solicitor now, and asking for costs when you win the court case, that is an absolute DISGRACE, the pigs who could do that to those poor things should be put in jail. 

Im sorry but those kids who stoned the cat were sentenced and those beardies are just as worse or more damaged than the kitten.

If you cant get through post there number here and let the whole herp community know what we think of them!!!!

PIGS!!!


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## snakes_alive (Oct 9, 2005)

My heart goes out to you and your beardies, I too would of been in tears, But it's good to see their in LOVING hand's now, I do wish you all the best and hope everything goes well for you bex.


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## Retic (Oct 9, 2005)

Wouldn't their full address be on the movement advice ?


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## beknluke (Oct 9, 2005)

I have their full address, their name, the name of their bank account and the bank account number, a mobile AND an email address.
They won't be getting away with this. Whether it's me getting my refund AND the satisfaction of being told that they are now not allowed to keep herps, or just the latter - I will be content. 
I know that some people here think that 'i don't want blood', but trust me, underneath all of these calm words, I am VERY worked up by this and I too want to see something done.
Does anyone know a good solicitor in Melb?? lol
I really don't have the $$ for this to go to court - but I will try everything that I can to have them brought to justice.
Thanx again guys - you're all so kind
Bex


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## Jason (Oct 9, 2005)

good luck with every thing!!! im sure the beardies will be much better soon with the care they will now get.


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## Jake.msv (Oct 9, 2005)

It's a pity that solicitors do charge like dentists, u know, like, through the nose.
However it wont cost you anyhing if police and QNPW are invlolved. And if the QN are anything like our vic counter parts the actually have a little more pull than police in certain circumstances, probably such as this, i've heard a few storys on entry and seizure.

"NOBODY LIKES A COP, 'TILL YOU NEED THEM!"

But i still say contact Ray @ ACA if things go sour. Send him ur promo vid that u sent to funny home vids 8)


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## beknluke (Oct 9, 2005)

lol
Thanx Jake!!


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## pugsly (Oct 9, 2005)

All you will need is for a solicitor to write a letter to them and they will pack it in trust me. Get one to draw up a letter saying what laws they have broken and will be charged with if they do not give you your money back, hell i would do it for you but i dont have the nice solicitors letterhead! 

They wont want it to go to court either so will more than likely agree to the terms.

Goodluck bex.


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## Morelia_Hunter (Oct 10, 2005)

I was duped in the same way lest year. I spent $11000 on a whole collection of pythons! All adults and I am sure I would have made the money back when I bred them. Unfortunately it turned out they were all sick and had respiratory infections. I did not pick it up as the women who was selling them never allowed me to look at them properly. Lost a black head in the first week I had them! Lost abig female childrens a few weeks later, and so on and so on. Guess they heard my accent and saw some easy money. I tried to recover some of the money, No luck! The authorities can not do anything if they say they left their house healthy! Its their word against yours? Innocent until proven guilty? Bulls#$t if you ask me! In my country we deal with people like this in a different way :twisted: :twisted: !!! Lets just say they never do things like this again, or anything else for that matter!


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## Menagerie (Oct 10, 2005)

Bek this is terrible  Hope the poor things recover well and that these people lose their licence


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## pugsly (Oct 10, 2005)

Morelia Hunter that may be the case in your circumstances, however it would be quite easy to prove that the animals bex has just aquired DEFINATELY did not pick these injuries such as gang green, and sists in a 3 hour plane trip. Bex has a very good case against these PIGS.


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## OuZo (Oct 10, 2005)

Well we had a fun day yesterday lol 

They're starting to look a lot better! The girly with the amputated leg eats like a PIG and will tear around the cage after roaches lol. Her eye's starting to open up again as well which is great!

Can I just say an almighty HOLY CRAP about the colours on some of them! :shock: MUST....STEAL....BEARDIES.... :shock: 

Oh and a little tip for anyone that has Beardies....don't put them in a bath tub full of nice warm water and rub their tails to clean them up. I think Bex woulda heard my screams of horror from the other room when I saw fart bubbles right next to my finger and just dodged a bright green poo as it came out lol :lol:. The vet wanted em cleaned though so I took a toothbrush to em lol. Does a bloody good job too :lol:. And one of the females was pushing her head into it for scratches which is very cute .


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## herptrader (Oct 10, 2005)

We used to put our green iguanas in sudsy bath. (Dave Barker's Mite treatment.) They always looked pretty cute with their heads poking through the bubbles. They seemed to quite enjoy it.... once they were in. We used to make the suds with shampoo.


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## westhamsc (Oct 10, 2005)

lmao zoe you had a good weekend first the BHP then the beardy :lol:


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## beknluke (Oct 10, 2005)

Hey MH - that's AWFUL!! I sympathise completely!!
Well guys - there has been an incredible turn in events!!
After spending the weekend ringing and ringing and RINGING the seller (their mobile was switched off the whole time) and sending email after email, on Saturday night I finally gave up. I sent them an email explaining who I would be contacting today, and that they would hear from a solicitor.
I got a phone call this morning (as I was applying the meds to the beardies!!) not from the seller, but someone on BEHALF of the seller.
They told me how distressed the seller was, how they have no idea how this happened, and they said that they want to help me out and for this never to happen again.
More or less without any Qs asked (which seems a bit sus for the amount!!) they informed me that they would be depositing $3000 into my account - which they have and they've faxed me through their receipt.
So there you go - I am still VERY sus about it all, but at least my expenses have now been covered.
Also, the beardies appear to be on the up and up. They had a wonderful time in the bathtub yesterday thanx to OuZo and Souley, another eye opened to reveal a good eye - and this one has eyelids too!!
So all in all, I am wrapped with their progress!! So thanx to everyone for sending those positive vibes their way  
Bex


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## The Rock (Oct 10, 2005)

No one should be selling sick animals full stop. I hope that these people are brought to justice and kicked out of the industry. My heart goes out to you Beknluke.


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## westhamsc (Oct 10, 2005)

thats great bex and i'm glad to see the guys are on the up


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## beknluke (Oct 10, 2005)

Thanx Rock and I agree wholeheartedly.
I intend to contact their relevant departments AFTER the money has cleared.
And Zo - you make me laugh!! :lol:


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## pugsly (Oct 10, 2005)

Awesome news bex, im glad they are in a loving home and be sure to post some pictures as they start to look a little healthier.

Pugs


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## Shamus (Oct 10, 2005)

I am unsure if you can do this with direct cash deposits into your account but you can with cheques so I wouldn't wait for the money to clear especially now you have mentioned what you are going to do when it does clear. If the seller is aware of what you are about to do (i.e. a member of this site?) you may find the money gone from your account pronto. I would be asking the bank if there is a 'quick clearance' on direct deposits. I am aware that it would cost you but IMO worth it in the end.

Someone else here could probably answer the 'quick clearance' query


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## Mangles (Oct 10, 2005)

If they pay into your account by cheque, it will be subject to clearance. You can order a Special Answer from your bank on this cheque, which they will charge a fee for, but you will then know it is cleared funds.

If they pay be electronic transfer, or cash it would be clear funds, and they cannot stop payment once it has gone through.


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## Shamus (Oct 10, 2005)

There you go. I almost knew what I was talking about....


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## darkness (Oct 10, 2005)

Good stuff !

At least now they know that they cant get away with scum acts like that again !

A big thumbs up to Bek for not giving up.. teach them a lesson !

Would still love to know who it was so I know who to avoid


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## Gerry (Oct 10, 2005)

good on you bex. and I cant commend you enough for not returning the animals to them. at least this way the animals have a chance. congrats for getting part of that money back.


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## BeardyBen (Oct 10, 2005)

YAY for bex  I am so happy this horrible situation is starting to come right. I think that you have saved these guys from the horrible life they were living. 3 cheers for bex YAY!!!!!!!!!!


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## beknluke (Oct 10, 2005)

lol
Thanx guys
And it is an electronic transfer - so no going back now!!
And no, they're not a member of this site - or any of the others for that matter.
I expect that the monies should clear tomorrow - and when they do, you'll all know about it!! lol
I will try to take some photos tomight if they're looking pretty - I think I have a nice one of Zos head with a lizard in amongst my cameras memory lol
And thanx agin everyone for all of your support and kind words. It means a LOT.
Bex


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## Gerry (Oct 10, 2005)

does this now mean that you can buy the other animals you were going to get? if so thats awesome too


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## OuZo (Oct 10, 2005)

WHY do I do these things to myself? :shock:


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## danw (Oct 10, 2005)

good news...I am so happy it all turned out well!


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## westhamsc (Oct 10, 2005)

bex once all is cleared are you going to name this person? i think it is a good idear to warn people


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## SLACkra (Oct 10, 2005)

thats fantastic news! 

good on ya, threatening em getting your expenses paid! 

we need pics though seriously!!! update photos etc!


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## Brodie (Oct 10, 2005)

Good news! Im glad it worked out ok.

Still shouldnt have spent 6k on beardies even if they were from the best breeder in oz! Kinda like those greedy ppl who sell their adult beardies for 250-300. I saw one for sale on the notice board at the shop down the road for 450!!!! 

Hope ya manage to sue the pricks for all their worth


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## Gerry (Oct 10, 2005)

Brodie_W said:


> Still shouldnt have spent 6k on beardies even if they were from the best breeder in oz!



yeah I dont think its hugely relevant what was paid for them brodie. Its a personal thing and if someones happy to pay it then so be it. The main issue here is the condition of the poor animals


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## beknluke (Oct 10, 2005)

If a beardie was unreal in my opinion and will be an adult breeder - you don't want to know how much I would pay.
I think that beardies are very valuable animals when you consider their breeding potentials, and whack some FANTASTIC colours in there and you got (IMO) something well worth the $250 and then some!!

Each to their own


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## westhamsc (Oct 10, 2005)

you know what the sad part is bex i'm starting to get back into these guys ever since a family friend showed me one of my offspring and now i want some again


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## Brodie (Oct 10, 2005)

im just having a go at the seller for selling them for so much if someone wants to spend 300 buks on a beardie its their choice. But to sell a bunch that are rooted like that for 6k is ridiculous. The breeder should be shot.

Your beardies are very nice, but not worth that much IMO. I have seen beardies with the same sort of colours at the petshop in palmo for 65 dollars, subadults. If its from a breeder it should be much, much less.


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## Brodie (Oct 10, 2005)

PS - Were you going to sell some of them? I'd never have the time for that many beardies lol. It must be hard looking after them all when theyre sick! Should be pretty proud 'bout that!


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## OuZo (Oct 10, 2005)

From memory none of the ones in the pics were the ones I was talking about that are insane! Plus they aren't at their happiest in the pics which means crap colours!


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## sobrien (Oct 10, 2005)

I just can't wait for those piccies :twisted: . And hey, if the same sorta colours that they advertised when they were trying to sell them, I'd definately buy a few!


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## fishead (Oct 10, 2005)

Good on ya Bex, glad it's all turning good for you and the beardies.
It sucs that's there is those kind of people to deal with in life hey. 
I think you should be very proud of the way you handled the whole thing, you are indeed a good person!
Regards, Steve.


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## SLACkra (Oct 10, 2005)

i shall be patient and wait for the pics, even though that shall be a great challenge.


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## Jason (Oct 10, 2005)

thats great im happy you are getting the costs back and it is good to here that the beardies are getting better, good luck and keep us posted, i two will be waiting for some healthy happy beardie pics.


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## pugsly (Oct 10, 2005)

I hope you breed crix or woodies!! :shock: :lol:


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## beknluke (Oct 10, 2005)

Hello again everyone!!
Thankyou again for EVERYTHING!! You've all been so caring!!
FYI: I will be posting some new pics in that album - just a couple of boring (  ) ones from yesterday. I will add more as they show me their colours!!
And Pugs - yeah mate, I breed roaches and money :shock: :lol: Safeways fruit and vegie section LOVE me!!!


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## diamond_python (Oct 10, 2005)

Way to go Bex. I am happy that you got back $3k. You should have got back the whole $6k. $3k for the medical and enclosure bills and $3k for a 50% reduction in the price.  But hey, $3k is better than nothing 

I hope these beardies make you many babies and you make a killing on them. 

And to the person who sold them, god help you if you ever show your face on this forum


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## beknluke (Oct 11, 2005)

HERE HERE
Thanx DP


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## redline (Oct 11, 2005)

r u going 2 name the person, so ppl dont buy from them again?


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## Linus (Oct 11, 2005)

Good on you Bex. To be honest I couldn't bring myself to look at the photos of the sick beardies. Call me soft but it breaks my heart to see sick/injured animals. I'd be a terrible vet. But judging from everyones responses it must have been horrendous for you...only compunded by forking out a good wad of cash.

So well done for coming through it and maintaining your resolve with the seller. Looking forward to seeing some pics of some smiling beardies.


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## OuZo (Oct 11, 2005)

This one's smiling! :lol: He's not scared!!! :lol:







And this one


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## Jason (Oct 11, 2005)

they are great looking beardies.


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## Gerry (Oct 11, 2005)

looks like youre coming out the shower then zo. no wonder the beardy's smiling :shock:


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## OuZo (Oct 11, 2005)

Lol the Beardie was coming out of the shower, not me! :shock: :lol:


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## SLACkra (Oct 11, 2005)

they look fantastic! you guys are doing a fantastic job. 

do they enjoy a good scrub?

andrew


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## OuZo (Oct 11, 2005)

Well the one with the toothbrush on his head seemed to not mind it at all lol. The other one in the pic (number 15) was scratching her ear with her back foot so I scratched it for her with the toothbrush and she was pushing her head into it :lol:

They didn't like their legs being scrubbed much but it had to be done. They came up sparkling once it was done though!


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## Gerry (Oct 11, 2005)

good work bex and zo and souley. nice to hear that theyre coming good. the one with the 15 on its back is a nice orange phase. great colours on him/her


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## OuZo (Oct 11, 2005)

I tell ya Gezza, that's NUTHIN compared to a few of the others! I NEED to nick them :twisted:


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## Gerry (Oct 11, 2005)

nick one for me too eh zo :wink:


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## Slateman (Oct 11, 2005)

I am sad to read all the trouble this beardies had due bad handling and transport.
On the other side, I am feeling good to be member of APS because of this story. Well done people for support you give when one of us is in the trouble.


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## OuZo (Oct 11, 2005)

Not a prob gezza. Did you want a high green or a magenta?


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## Gerry (Oct 11, 2005)

greeeeeeeeeeeen one zo!!!


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## OuZo (Oct 11, 2005)

Lmao you're a funny man :lol:


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## westhamsc (Oct 11, 2005)

use the force zoe


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## beknluke (Oct 11, 2005)

Guys - due to a very confusing turn in events, I think that for now, I won't discuss what is currently happening. Suffice to say that I got the $3000 cleared, the beardies are slowly picking up, I AM getting the animals that I committed to prior to this disaster (YAY!!!) and that I am not naming the seller at this stage...
Anyone with genuine concerns can call me on 0419 267 120.
Other than that, I will update you all as to how the beardies are going accompanied with more pics - and once this is ALL over (it's gt a while to go yet!!) I will tell you all the bed time story version 
Bex


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## danw (Oct 11, 2005)

ok well hope it all goes well..you are doing an awesome job


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## Jake.msv (Oct 11, 2005)

GREAT NEWS BEX!! So happy for ya's that it all worked out in the end. 
Bettin you couldn't get that grin of ya dial for hours when they said they'll refund ur costs, or was there tears of happiness? 
How weak gutted was the seller "not to talk" to you because "he" was too distraught. Nice to see he was thinking for himself on that one! Funny how quick they jumped on the dog n bone when a solicitor was mentioned LOL :lol: 
I agree with other friends of the forum that the person should be named, or at least their general area, so others are forewarned. They've got 150 youngens on the way remember.
GOOD LUCK with it all bex.

Luv the above pics too!!

JAKE. still says ring RAY!! lol i just wanna see those rockin beardies again! 8)


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## zulu (Oct 11, 2005)

*re A Hard*



Slateman said:


> I am sad to read all the trouble this beardies had due bad handling and transport.
> On the other side, I am feeling good to be member of APS because of this story. Well done people for support you give when one of us is in the trouble.


 Fair Dinkum i dont know about you slatey but ime dying myself orange and going to melbourne so ouzo and behnuke can comb my beard and pamper me,thats the life,eat when you want and fart in the bath YAY


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## westhamsc (Oct 11, 2005)

nah according to farmdog that has been taken by the lost little dog me


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## tweety2 (Oct 12, 2005)

hey bex, i hope all is going well with the beardies treatment. Those pics are terrible, have you got any further in having the person charged with animal cruelty?? Even though i am down in geelong if there is anything i can do to help you out let me know and i will do my best. People like your seller need to be shot!!!
good luck bex


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## FAY (Oct 12, 2005)

Gerry said:


> Brodie_W said:
> 
> 
> > Still shouldnt have spent 6k on beardies even if they were from the best breeder in oz!
> ...



Exactly Gerry, an animal is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it......it is not up to you or me to say whether someone is getting ripped off or not.....everyone has a choice!!!!!!


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## instar (Oct 12, 2005)

Hello Bex, sorry to hear of your bad experience, but nice to hear of a positive outcome. Im sure the beardies will thrive in your hands. best wishes Inny


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## beknluke (Oct 12, 2005)

Thanx guys  
I'll update you all as things progress!!
Bex


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## tia (Oct 12, 2005)

Hi Bex, Just wanted to let you know I feel for you and hope all recover. 

Linda


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## orsm (Oct 12, 2005)

congrats on getting $3k back.


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## Slateman (Oct 12, 2005)

LOL zulu is going to Melbourne to anoy Zoe. Good luck mate.


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## foxysnake (Oct 12, 2005)

Great stuff Beknluke, and all who are helping. Good to see those poor animals are finally getting the treatment (and lovin') they deserve!


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## inthegrass (Oct 12, 2005)

Slateman said:


> I am sad to read all the trouble this beardies had due bad handling and transport.
> On the other side, I am feeling good to be member of APS because of this story. Well done people for support you give when one of us is in the
> trouble.




i agree.


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## OuZo (Oct 14, 2005)

> Fair Dinkum i dont know about you slatey but ime dying myself orange and going to melbourne so ouzo and behnuke can comb my beard and pamper me,thats the life,eat when you want and fart in the bath YAY



Sure you can come down zulu, Bex and I will take good care of you :twisted:. I'm sure on a diet of cockroaches, eye ointment 4 times daily and cream on your feet, legs, chin and butt you'd be a very happy chappy! Oh, but you do get to fart in the bath :twisted: :lol:


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## beknluke (Oct 14, 2005)

:lol:
I agree!! lol


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## Jason (Oct 14, 2005)

so do we get a short update yet on their recovery?


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## Slateman (Oct 14, 2005)

Zoe if you come to my house, I will let you fart in my bath any time LOL.


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## beknluke (Oct 14, 2005)

Basically they're eating and doing all of the normal things that beardies do 
They're off to the vet again tomorrow morning though a) for a follow up and b) because I am concerned about a few things...
I will know more AFTER tomrrow appoitment.
#6 (Featured in the original nasty pics with some serious gangrene up her right front leg {think it's right, or is it the left?? lol}) laid 18 eggs on Wednesday in a tank NOT set up for laying... Why? Coz neither myself or the VET knew that she was gravid!!! And trust me - I felt them ALL!! Looks like most are infertile, but some are still puffed up so we'll see.
And #9 (a beautiful orange female with an eye that HAS gotten worse  ) laid 16 eggs last night and had a lovely time soaking in a warm bath afterwards. Again, looks like a decent number of them MAY be infertile, but quit e afew had visible embryos 
I'm so proud of my lil troopers!!
I will start a new thread when I have info tomorrow on their progress 
Bex


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## OuZo (Oct 14, 2005)

Lol Slatey you dirty old man :lol:


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## Jason (Oct 14, 2005)

thats great bek they must be feeling better if they had the energy to lay some eggs, congrats and its good they are behaving natural.
jason


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## beknluke (Oct 14, 2005)

Yep, and the one that has the large solid bump on its vent? Well, turned out that it was a retained egg that she managed to pop on Sunday after Zo fed her 
THEN it started getting all swollen again  I hadn't felt ANY eggs inside of her (and that one seemd VERY old and purply) and Luke (other half) has just confirmed that she popped ANOTHER one!! :shock:
At lease it looks like it's NOT a cyst :? But I'll be talking all of this through with the vet tomorrow
Bex


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## alexr (Oct 14, 2005)

WOW... You may have already made some of your money back.... fingers crossed some are fertile...


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## alexr (Oct 14, 2005)

(don't forget photos of the eggs please :wink


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## SLACkra (Oct 14, 2005)

i might have to dropped off some coral frags and take a look. i want to see em in person


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## beknluke (Oct 14, 2005)

Ok - ANOTHER update lol
(If a mod would be so kind as to cut this thread at my reply that was directly under Slateys and make it a new thread called "24 sick beardies - UPDATES" that would be WONDERFUL!!)
#15 Laid 17 eggs tonight - about 15 believed to be fertile, and #8 (in Souleys opinion, the best female out of the lot) is believed to be gravid :shock:
Had to go to the supermarket tonight and buy another 4 incubating containers!! :lol:
Lucky you picked up that BIG bag of vermiculite for me that time Westy ey?? lol
Bex


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## beknluke (Oct 14, 2005)

Oh, and Slacker (  ) if you're bringin' free frags - you're welcome ANY time


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## foxysnake (Oct 14, 2005)

Wow! Unreal! Hope it all works out and good luck with the sound of little 'pitter-patters' from the babies! - Must be something about the number 15?!


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## westhamsc (Oct 15, 2005)

> Lucky you picked up that BIG bag of vermiculite for me that time Westy ey?? lol
> Bex


yeah lucky i did still got heaps left? by the way i must of looked like the biggest pot head wheni got that and people looking in the back of my car seeing 100L of vermiculite 8) 8) 8) :lol:


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## OuZo (Oct 15, 2005)

#15 was the one that liked the head scratch yeah? They're gonna be some spunky babies hey


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## SLACkra (Oct 15, 2005)

> free frags



free? depends on which corals. i got a tini mushroom which you could have for free (mainly because he would be easy to frag) and some standard zoas. rest i would want to trade!

andrew


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## beknluke (Oct 15, 2005)

:lol:
I was making a joke hun
I can't fit anything else in my tank!! lol


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## SLACkra (Oct 15, 2005)

well if you find some space i got some corals 4 ya.

andrew


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## beknluke (Oct 16, 2005)

Oh, very brief update since it's so late:
The one that had had its leg amputated has to have it done AGAIN b/c the vet that did it in Nth QLD used dead skin to fold over the cut and it killed all of the tissue  So she's booked in for surgery on Monday along with the Male who definately DOES need his back leg removed.
Most of the nasty cysts/abses (sp?) that were there the vet has gotten rid of and they all need intensive bepanthen.
A couple of the dead toes are coming good and have fallen off cleanly.
The female (#6) who laid when we didn't know she was gravid has been given a 50/50 chance of survival coz her body is riddled with infection...  There aren't many places where I'm NOT putting bepanthen on her. She has also been put on antibiotics for the next 3 weeks. She won't touch fruit or veg but still has a healthy appetite for roaches  We also think that she may need her front leg amputated at the elbow eventually, but for now I will keep trying
One of the boys (#24) had a really bad chin where it's practically down to his jaw bone so we are hoping that with time, bepanthen and soft food, it MIGHT grow some healthy tissue back over the area.
Two are early gravid (#3 and #10) and 2 are probably about half way through their pregnancies (#8 and #13). Also, 2 of my other dragons have been found to be gravid tonight 
All 18 eggs from #6 that were believed to be infertile had to be chucked tonight with my innitial beliefs being confirmed...
Other than that, I think that's it for now...
I will tell you more as it comes to hand 
Bex


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## pugsly (Oct 16, 2005)

Wow how exciting! Still poor little things still goin through a tuff time, hope they come good for ya, man ya goingto have 50,000 of those things running around soon!

Goodluck with the pregnancies, and of course keep us updated!


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## Rossagon (Oct 16, 2005)

Ya better start breeding them crickets now!!!! Good onya guys. Good luck.


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## Guest (Oct 16, 2005)

Im probably the only one with the guts to ask it so i will. 

Are you happy with your 6K purchase and do you think you got your money's worth? (apart from the vet bills).


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## beknluke (Oct 16, 2005)

That's a VERY fair Q Alan - one that I am more than happy to answer.
I innitially looked at this purchase as a business investment. I have a few ideas for my future and I thought that these guys would help me get there. So when I weighed up $250/animal, intense colours, some are gravid etc etc, I thought that it would probably be a VERY smart purchase.
When I got the animals in the state that they were in, I actually said to my Mum who was with me at the time that they animals (in that state) were worth no more than about $3000. I felt them all and only 2 were gravid, which though it was a HUGE let down coz I was told that almost ALL 12 females WERE gravid, I was releived that the animals wouldn't go through any further strain.
Since then, I have gotten $3k back from the seller an that has covered the vet bills, a full refund for 4 of the animals and the extra enclosures that I had to buy.
After being to the vets for the 3rd time, I now know that ALL of these guys (except for maybe #6) are going to be PERFECTLY fit and healthy for breeding next year - AND some of them are now gravid (must have been in the very early stages when they were shipped) so hopefully some of the eggs are fertile and I can make a bit more of my money back.
In all, yes, I am happy with my purchase and now that I have had my expenses covered, I do think that they were worth it. I AM finding it hard every morning and every night putting on the creams, weighing, feeding cleaning (I HATE newspaper in cages!!!) but when I look at their lil faces (brightly coloured ones at that!!) I can't begrudge them my time.
Thanx for asking Alan and I hope that I have answered your Q thoroughly 
Bex


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## Guest (Oct 16, 2005)

Cheers for the honest answer Bek, an honest question deserves an honest answer and thats exactly what you have given me....wholly appreciated!!!

Cheers, Alan.


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## orsm (Oct 16, 2005)

What's the normal price for central bearded hatchlings? Shouldn't they be about the same as the eastern bearded ones, about $25-30 ea?


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## beknluke (Oct 17, 2005)

Depends on a hell of a lot of things, but for really good colours, I have seen hatchies go from anywhere between $80 - $175
Petshops will pay you $25/beardie down here if your desperate, but who wants to sell them to a place that won't take care of them??


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