# Neurological problems? Help!



## Cheswick3 (May 28, 2015)

Hey all

I've recently acquired an ~18 month old Murray Darling Carpet Python, my first snake. I am concerned she may have neurological damage, or something of the sort. She shakes her head as she moves around, and constantly flips upside down as she moves around. She also seems generally disorientated. 

When I bought her from the breeder, I was assured that this activity was just because she was cold because she'd been soaking in her water bowl. I then brought her back to see them a few weeks later, and was told it was likely heat stress (temps were fine), so I turned down the heat anyway, and saw no change.

She hasn't had any issues feeding, and has shed once no problems.

I've attached a video. Any help or advice would be much appreciated.
[video=youtube;qUCXoFoW0VM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUCXoFoW0VM&amp;feature=youtu.be[/video]

Thank you!


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## Vixen (May 28, 2015)

If no obvious over-heating, or poisoning (from sprays, pesticides etc) - I would be very VERY concerned of a virus. Quarantine immediately from any other snakes you have.

Being cold doesn't cause an animal to behave like this, and if the breeder told you otherwise and knew about this beforehand, I'd be doubly concerned.

How long has it been doing this?


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## Pirateherpss (May 29, 2015)

I have picked up a bredli trio from someone, and all had the same neuro defects. Chances of a neurological disorder?.. unlikely, as they were not related. So the next bet is some sort of virus/ parasites/ whatever... but they all caught it. I wormed them all, gave special liquid on their food to get rid of parasites/ bugs etc. But eventually i sold them cheap as i did not want them 'contaminating' all my other reptiles.

Its your first snake, so I think you should be right by keeping it and caring for it. Maybe it will get better? or maybe it is a neuro defect, that won't go away, and won't affect his general health.. and he will just be a 'loopy' ol' snake for the rest of its life.

You could take it to the vet??? get it check out???


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## Pythoninfinite (May 29, 2015)

Pirateherpss said:


> I have picked up a bredli trio from someone, and all had the same neuro defects. Chances of a neurological disorder?.. unlikely, as they were not related. So the next bet is some sort of virus/ parasites/ whatever... but they all caught it. I wormed them all, gave special liquid on their food to get rid of parasites/ bugs etc. But eventually i sold them cheap as i did not want them 'contaminating' all my other reptiles.
> 
> Its your first snake, so I think you should be right by keeping it and caring for it. Maybe it will get better? or maybe it is a neuro defect, that won't go away, and won't affect his general health.. and he will just be a 'loopy' ol' snake for the rest of its life.
> 
> You could take it to the vet??? get it check out???



You should NEVER on-sell a snake with symptoms like that - it simply increases the chance of spreading what may be a catastrophic viral disease into someone else's collection. You clearly have no idea of the potential damage you could have caused by passing these animals on to someone else - your second paragraph demonstrates a dangerous ignorance of these devastating viral diseases.

Now... sometimes, neurological symptoms like this can be caused by a period of extreme heat, in which case it is usually brain damage and rarely improves. Very much more likely is one of the invariably fatal viruses, Sunshine Virus being the most like from its common occurrence in Australia. I believe this can be tested for now, so I suggest you speak to a reptile vet about getting a sample to Tim Hyndman in Perth.

The viruses are HIGHLY CONTAGIOUS, so if you have other snakes, you MUST keep this one well separated from them, with its own water bowl and feeding forceps, and they must NEVER be interchanged. You must always thoroughly wash your hands after handling the animal to prevent transferring infection to your other snakes. Always change water/feed this animal last when doing the rounds.

You should contact the seller who clearly knew of the problem and seek to return the animal and get your money back - it is highly irresponsible to sell an animal in this condition, but I guess if you were to return the animal, he/she would simply pass it on to some other unsuspecting keeper.

Treat this as very serious indeed. There are many in this country who have had entire large collections wiped out by these viral diseases.

Jamie


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## Pirateherpss (May 29, 2015)

Pythoninfinite said:


> You should NEVER on-sell a snake with symptoms like that - it simply increases the chance of spreading what may be a catastrophic viral disease into someone else's collection. You clearly have no idea of the potential damage you could have caused by passing these animals on to someone else - your second paragraph demonstrates a dangerous ignorance of these devastating viral diseases.
> 
> Now... sometimes, neurological symptoms like this can be caused by a period of extreme heat, in which case it is usually brain damage and rarely improves. Very much more likely is one of the invariably fatal viruses, Sunshine Virus being the most like from its common occurrence in Australia. I believe this can be tested for now, so I suggest you speak to a reptile vet about getting a sample to Tim Hyndman in Perth.
> 
> ...


Mate. The guy I sold them to knew everything I knew on them. He knew exactly what he was buying. He didn't mind because he was buying them cheap. He wanted to take them to the vet himself... I wouldn't sell them without telling anyone they are 'retarded', they would be at my doorstep anyway demanding refund the first time they see them go loopy.


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## stimigex (May 29, 2015)

Pirateherpss said:


> Mate. The guy I sold them to knew everything I knew on them. He knew exactly what he was buying. He didn't mind because he was buying them cheap. He wanted to take them to the vet himself... I wouldn't sell them without telling anyone they are 'retarded', they would be at my doorstep anyway demanding refund the first time they see them go loopy.



You still don't understand what Jamie was getting at! It is simple, you had snakes with a problem and sold them on to another with absolutely no idea of what was wrong with them! Unloading them on someone else and quite possibly passing on a virus such as sunshine virus to another collection as well as the exposure to the others you have in your own collection is wrong in many ways. passing them on cheap is NO excuse!!!


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## Ekans (May 29, 2015)

Pirateherpss said:


> He didn't mind because he was buying them cheap



Not a good sign. You don't sell sick animals. Were the bredli with the defects the ones you sold recently as a breeding trio? 

Having a large collection of animals doesn't make you a herpetologist


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## Herpo (May 29, 2015)

stimigex said:


> You still don't understand what Jamie was getting at! It is simple, you had snakes with a problem and sold them on to another with absolutely no idea of what was wrong with them! Unloading them on someone else and quite possibly passing on a virus such as sunshine virus to another collection as well as the exposure to the others you have in your own collection is wrong in many ways. passing them on cheap is NO excuse!!!


He sold them on to someone who knew what they were getting into. If they bought them, then they were aware of the potential danger to their collection and had most likely taken measures to quarantine the snakes. I'd have done the same. Better sell them of to someone who knows sick snakes than to keep them and have no idea what to do...


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## Peckoltia (May 29, 2015)

I'll add my two bob. 

I think the seller has pulled a shifty on you. Selling a snake that is behaving like that is completely irresponsible, especially to a novice keeper.

I have been keeping snakes for 10 + years now and have only dealt with a 'neurological disorder' once many years ago. My snake (a large wildcaught stimsons python) was behaving similar to yours, looking backwards over itself and not being able to right itself. The snake in question was taken to the vet about 2 months before this with a very minor case of mouth rot. The vet concluded that this infection in the month (even in its early stages) had travelled up the nerve endings in the mouth and into the brain manifesting itself in the neurological disorders that were presented. After some TLC it was decided that the snake would not be able to recover and was euthanized. It is lucky for me that this case wasn't contagious.

My point is that there is any number of things that could be causing the snake to behave like this, other than the already mentioned options.

Scary stuff. 

I would NEVER EVER buy (or sell) a snake that was showing symptoms of any form of neurological disorder.

Good luck with your snake.

Alex


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## Cheswick3 (May 29, 2015)

Thank you all for your help!

I intend to contact the breeder about a refund.

I don't have any other snakes that the potential virus might be passed on to, but I do have three green tree frogs and a bearded dragon. Are they in danger of infection?

Thanks


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## Pirateherpss (May 29, 2015)

Herpo said:


> He sold them on to someone who knew what they were getting into. If they bought them, then they were aware of the potential danger to their collection and had most likely taken measures to quarantine the snakes. I'd have done the same. Better sell them of to someone who knows sick snakes than to keep them and have no idea what to do...



Exactly! THANKYOU!!! I felt I wasn't experienced enough to handle that responsibility at that time, and gave them to someone who wanted to take on the responsibility, and was capable to do so. Jeezz... calm TF down everyone


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## Herpo (May 30, 2015)

Pirateherpss said:


> Exactly! THANKYOU!!! I felt I wasn't experienced enough to handle that responsibility at that time, and gave them to someone who wanted to take on the responsibility, and was capable to do so. Jeezz... calm TF down everyone


Lol, no problem. Anyway, it's pointless for everyone to make a big deal about this now that it's been done.


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## Freeloader (May 30, 2015)

If you felt you weren't experienced enough to handle the responsibility of having the bredlis why did you buy them in the first place. You have just handed out the advice to the op that he should have taken his Murray darling to the vet. You didn't take your bredlis to the vet. If you don't do the right thing then who are you to give advice to others.
I don't think you realize the serious problems of on selling sick animals never mind the rules and regulations that govern this practice. 
People like you are what gives this hobby a bad name.


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## Pythoninfinite (May 30, 2015)

I'll get back to this this afternoon. The excuses are just blather. What you did was very irresponsible,

Jamie


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## Freeloader (May 30, 2015)

It's not pointless to make a big deal of this if it stops the practice of people on selling sick animals. Why didn't he just get them euthanized to stop any viruses getting into other people's collections.

- - - Updated - - -

Mate you didn't give them away you sold the sick animals for money.


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## pinefamily (May 30, 2015)

Pirateherpss said:


> Exactly! THANKYOU!!! I felt I wasn't experienced enough to handle that responsibility at that time, and gave them to someone who wanted to take on the responsibility, and was capable to do so. Jeezz... calm TF down everyone


What Jamie has said is true. While you may have thought you were doing the right thing by finding someone to take on the bredlis, it was irresponsible to do so without knowing exactly what was wrong. A vet check first before on-selling them would have been the right way to go.


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## Herpo (May 30, 2015)

Freeloader said:


> It's not pointless to make a big deal of this if it stops the practice of people on selling sick animals. Why didn't he just get them euthanized to stop any viruses getting into other people's collections.
> 
> - - - Updated - - -
> 
> Mate you didn't give them away you sold the sick animals for money.


Jeez, you guys are hopeless. Sure it might not be right to give away a sick reptile, but better it dies in the hands of someone who knows sick animals than someone who isn't too sure what to do. You're being way too harsh anyway. What would you have done if you were in his shoes and didn't know what to do. I sure as hell wouldn't want to watch the poor thing suffer in it's cage all day and not know what to do. And it is pointless to judge him now. What's done is done, and it can't be undone.

Sorry for rambling, just annoys me when people judge others without even trying to empathize...

- - - Updated - - -



pinefamily said:


> What Jamie has said is true. While you may have thought you were doing the right thing by finding someone to take on the bredlis, it was irresponsible to do so without knowing exactly what was wrong. A vet check first before on-selling them would have been the right way to go.


That is the smartest comment so far.


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## Ekans (May 30, 2015)

Herpo said:


> Jeez, you guys are hopeless. Sure it might not be right to give away a sick reptile, but better it dies in the hands of someone who knows sick animals than someone who isn't too sure what to do. You're being way too harsh anyway. What would you have done if you were in his shoes and didn't know what to do. I sure as hell wouldn't want to watch the poor thing suffer in it's cage all day and not know what to do. And it is pointless to judge him now. What's done is done, and it can't be undone.
> 
> Sorry for rambling, just annoys me when people judge others without even trying to empathize...
> 
> ...



YOU are being flippant about a possible major situation. Disease outbreak isn't a matter that should be taken lightly and selling sick animals is irresponsible. You buy an animal, you take care of it, your responsibility. Not taking it to the vet is not exploring all avenues. If you can't afford to, borrow the money/sell stock. 

Euthanasia is a far better option that exposing healthy animals to a possibly fatal or debilitating disease.

If I was in his shoes I would of taken them to a vet. Which is a BASIC first step. BASIC care that any animal in your care deserves.


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## Herpo (May 30, 2015)

Ekans said:


> You buy an animal, you take care of it, your responsibility. If you can't afford to, borrow the money/sell stock.


I'M flippant now, am I?
That's so stupid. You'd rather buy an animal, and watch it suffer, dying slowly and painfully, than pass it on to someone who knows what to do in this event? And suggesting to sell stock to pay for a vet bill is stupid AND impractical. Why don't you ask him to sell his house while we're here? See, you're being flippant now. Selling something that was worked for just to prove a point.


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## pinkmus (May 30, 2015)

This is why I've decided not to buy any more snakes and stick with what I already have and with what I have in quarantine for two years. I'm really sorry you ended up with a pet snake that clearly has issues. 

As Pythoninfinite suggested, get a vet to send a swab off for viral testing, at the same time the vet will be able to check if there are any other issues with your python. As far as I know sunshine virus has not been detected in bearded dragons or frogs but regardless please, please quarantine any new arrivals for as long as you can, preferably more than a year. The test will give you a good idea of whether the condition is due to a virus.

I am personally worried enough that some snakes infected with these viruses can appear perfectly healthy for more than a year. The fact that reptiles that are clearly ill are being sold is even more concerning. At least that particular person knew about it. I hope they also knew the consequences should the signs have been caused by a virus.

OP I hope your snake recovers, or continues to eat and thrive. If it doesn't and deteriorates, I would seek veterinary advice and make the right decision by the snake.


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## Herpo (May 30, 2015)

I think all this arguing has distracted us from the problem at hand. I can't imagine having the joy of getting a new snake wiped out by it being ill...


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## Ekans (May 30, 2015)

*Prevention of Cruelty to Animals Act 1979 No 200*
Current version for 1 December 2014 to date (accessed 30 May 2015 at 13:23)


width="100%" style="width: 100%"
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Part 2




Section 5

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<< page >>

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*5 Cruelty to animals*(1) A person shall not commit an act of cruelty upon an animal.​(2) A person in charge of an animal shall not authorise the commission of an act of cruelty upon the animal.​(3) A person in charge of an animal shall not fail at any time:(a) to exercise reasonable care, control or supervision of an animal to prevent the commission of an act of cruelty upon the animal,​(b) where pain is being inflicted upon the animal, to take such reasonable steps as are necessary to alleviate the pain, or​*(c) where it is necessary for the animal to be provided with veterinary treatment, whether or not over a period of time, to provide it with that treatment.
*.​

Take care of your animals or surrender them. You care for them when they are sick not only when they are healthy.

People have and do sell possessions to pay for vet bills.


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## Herpo (May 30, 2015)

Ekans said:


> *Prevention of Cruelty to Animals Act 1979 No 200*
> Current version for 1 December 2014 to date (accessed 30 May 2015 at 13:23)
> 
> 
> ...


OK, now you are agreeing with me. He DID surrender them...to someone with more experience. Anyway, let's just stop arguing about something so pointless. Once more, what's done is done...


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## Ramsayi (May 30, 2015)

Herpo said:


> OK, now you are agreeing with me. He DID surrender them...to someone with more experience. Anyway, let's just stop arguing about something so pointless. Once more, what's done is done...



No he sold them off,which is totally different to surrendering them, to become someone elses problem.If they were suffering from a virus there is a high likely hood that it is fatal.So all that has been achieved is to move them from a collection that is now compromised to another collection that if not compromised to begin with will be now,no matter how careful someone is with trying to control the problem.


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## Herpo (May 30, 2015)

Exactly. You're all turning what to one person was common sense into some sort of political drama. It's just stupid. And whether the snakes were sold or surrendered doesn't matter. The point is that they were given to someone with more experience.


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## Freeloader (May 30, 2015)

Mate you have put other people's collections at risk and we are morons? You are kidding.

Op you are doing the right thing going back to the breeder. You have paid good money for an animal that has health problems. Hopefully he will do the right thing by you.




The point is: YOU DO NOT SELL SICK ANIMALS TO OTHER PEOPLE. YOU GET THEM VET CHECKED AND IF THEY HAVE A VIRUS YOU GET THEM EUTHANIZED.


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## wokka (May 30, 2015)

The liability both legally and ethically would be on the seller for spreading the disease. Just because you find a gullible buyer doesn't make it right to take advantage of the situation. I believe the right thing to do is to euthanase the animals and wear the loss!


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## Cheswick3 (May 30, 2015)

I just went back to the breeder, and they replaced the snake with another, younger Murray Darling, from different parents.
They suggested it was a neurological disorder, and not viral, as none of their numerous other snakes showed any similar symptoms. 

They apologized for my past dealings with them on the matter, as I had previously dealt with his partner personally, who was less informed on the matter. 

The new snake seems perfectly normal, with a good feeding record.


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## Herpo (May 30, 2015)

wokka said:


> The liability both legally and ethically would be on the seller for spreading the disease. Just because you find a gullible buyer doesn't make it right to take advantage of the situation. I believe the right thing to do is to euthanase the animals and wear the loss!


At least you're making a decent point. But note that Pirate didn't take advantage of the buyer as, for what I hope is the last time, the buyer knew what he was getting into...


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## Prof_Moreliarty (May 30, 2015)

Cheswick3 said:


> I just went back to the breeder, and they replaced the snake with another, younger Murray Darling, from different parents.
> They suggested it was a neurological disorder, and not viral, as none of their numerous other snakes showed any similar symptoms.
> 
> They apologized for my past dealings with them on the matter, as I had previously dealt with his partner personally, who was less informed on the matter.
> ...



its good that the breeder has acknowledged the fault but personally I wouldn't be touching any of their other snakes with a barge pole, as has been pointed out these viruses can lay dormant for 12 months or more and just because none of their other snakes have symptoms now doesn't garuntee they will be ok in future. I would be getting tests done on the replacement snake to ensure it isn't carrying any disease. Sorry I don't want to worry you further but for peace of mind have the test done.


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## swampie (May 30, 2015)

Another APS thread where some very obviously inexperienced keepers are arguing with some of the most experienced and knowledgable keepers in the country.....

Pirate you have admitted to being inexperienced, what you did by selling off your animals that may or may not have a virus was the wrong thing to do, learn from this mistake and listen to the advice from the guys with the knowledge and experience.
Don't make yourself look like a fool by arguing with them and taking what they say as a personal attack.

By saying you sold the snakes with neuro symptoms to someone with the experience to handle the problem speaks volumes for that persons experience, anyone with real experience would have run a mile or advised you to euthanize the animals.


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## Cheswick3 (May 30, 2015)

Prof_Moreliarty said:


> its good that the breeder has acknowledged the fault but personally I wouldn't be touching any of there other snakes with a barge pole as has been pointed out these viruses can lay dormant for 12 months or more and just because none of their other snakes have symptoms now doesn't garuntee they will be ok in future I would be getting tests done on the replacement snake to ensure it isn't carrying any disease. Sorry I don't want to worry you further but for peace of mind have the test done.



There's a reptile vet in my area, I'll look into getting the new snake tested soon. Thanks 
Any idea how much it might cost to do so?


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## Cheswick3 (May 30, 2015)

Don't get me wrong, I'll be getting the test done regardless of price


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## wokka (May 30, 2015)

Herpo said:


> At least you're making a decent point. But note that Pirate didn't take advantage of the buyer as, for what I hope is the last time, the buyer knew what he was getting into...


My point is that just because the buyer knows doesn't make it right. Maybe your are as guilty as each other. In a transaction involving stolen goods, if the buyer knows the goods are stolen he is in trouble as well, however if he doesn't know,then the seller is in trouble and the buyer just loses the item they have bought.


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## Herpo (May 30, 2015)

I get that. It would've been nice if everyone had realised that earlier.


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## Dragon_77 (May 30, 2015)

I agree with what a few other long time reptile keepers have said in regards to not buying or selling any reptiles, that are not 100% healthy and eating and should be vet checked before being passed on or sold, only a responsible keeper who loves and cares for their reptiles, would be willing to do the right thing before moving on their un healthy reptiles.

These days l won't buy any pythons from just anyone l see selling them, and have no intention on buying anymore for the time being, all because of issues concerning cross breeding of sub-species.

currently l only have 1 pair of NT phase Olive Pythons, that were collected on permit from the wild in 2009, and they both have always been 100% healthy and feed when ever l offer them food, and they both are very tame and placid just like a captive breed Python.

lf I ever decide to buy another Python l know who to and not to buy from, cause l have been keeping reptiles since 1989 and know who to buy from Australia wide.

So please do the right thing for your reptiles before selling or moving them on, make sure they are feeding and have no health issues, and there is no risk to the new owner and their collection, and get them vet checked if need be.


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## mikey_mike (May 31, 2015)

This whole scenario sucks. My sympathies go out to everyone involved. It seems clear that you've all been trying to do the right thing, but I'm going to throw in my two bobs... 

I'm horrified to learn that potentially communicable disorders are being knowingly passed around. If you're not prepared to maintain permanent quarantine yourself or find someone who understands the need for permanent quarantine then I'm sorry to say it but you should be considering euthanasia.

Hope everyone who's thinking the worst is wrong.


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## Herpo (May 31, 2015)

All this has made me curious...
If neuro can lie dormant for a year, are there any symptoms to look out for in that case?


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## Ramsayi (May 31, 2015)

Herpo said:


> All this has made me curious...
> If neuro can lie dormant for a year, are there any symptoms to look out for in that case?



It's not neuro it's viral the neuro problems are a symptom.
I suggest you read up on OPMV,IBD and Sunshine virus to get a better understanding of the issue.


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## Herpo (May 31, 2015)

Ok thanks, I've got a book on that I should read...


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## MesseNoire (May 31, 2015)

Herpo said:


> Ok thanks, I've got a book on that I should read...



What book is that if you don't mind me asking?


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## Cheswick3 (May 31, 2015)

Update: The new snake is infested with mites. I can see them crawling all her, and all through the container. Boy am I ******. 
So obviously tomorrow I'll be going back and getting my money back, then going elsewhere. I've caught a few as evidence, in case they're hesitant to believe me, because yesterday I was assured that they're utterly vigilant with mites. 

I'll have to get my beardie checked now as well, just to be sure.

These people have such a good reputation in my area, they're the go to for all things reptiles here. I'm amazed that they could be so clueless to this issue.


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## Herpo (May 31, 2015)

MesseNoire said:


> What book is that if you don't mind me asking?


"Keeping Australian Pythons in Captivity" by Adam Elliot. It has a whole chapter on snake illnesses, including the ones mentioned. On an experienced breeders perspective, I don't know where it sits, but it's helped me.

- - - Updated - - -



Cheswick3 said:


> Update: The new snake is infested with mites. I can see them crawling all her, and all through the container. Boy am I ******.
> So obviously tomorrow I'll be going back and getting my money back, then going elsewhere. I've caught a few as evidence, in case they're hesitant to believe me, because yesterday I was assured that they're utterly vigilant with mites.
> 
> I'll have to get my beardie checked now as well, just to be sure.
> ...


I'd be bitchin about it to if it was me. I'm not sure how, but you should spread the word on the unreliability.


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## pinefamily (May 31, 2015)

Cheswick, in your original post you say they are breeders, but in your last post you say they are the ones to go to for all things reptile. Are they breeders, or is it a business? And what state are you in?


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## Pythoninfinite (Jun 1, 2015)

Cheswick3 said:


> Update: The new snake is infested with mites. I can see them crawling all her, and all through the container. Boy am I ******.
> So obviously tomorrow I'll be going back and getting my money back, then going elsewhere. I've caught a few as evidence, in case they're hesitant to believe me, because yesterday I was assured that they're utterly vigilant with mites.
> 
> I'll have to get my beardie checked now as well, just to be sure.
> ...



Gee, you've had a rough trot! I'm sure if you make known the region in which you live, you'll get a few good recommendations from some of the reliable members on this site. I suggest you do it on APS so that those of us who have been in the game a long time can be sure you get pointed in the right direction, and don't have to deal with more disappointment.




Herpo said:


> At least you're making a decent point. But note that Pirate didn't take advantage of the buyer as, for what I hope is the last time, the buyer knew what he was getting into...



Interesting that buyer "knew what he was getting into" when the seller didn't know what the problem was, and clearly wasn't aware of the potentially catastrophe resulting from such a sale. What's your relationship to "Pirate?" Why are you so strongly defending the indefensible Herpo?

Jamie


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## Grogshla (Jun 1, 2015)

Is it possible for 'normal' species of snakes to get neuro problems? I have a Childrens python with one eye and sometimes he seems to be acting weird. I have him in a rack setup which limits his vertical movements but I am going to put him into a proper enclosure this week.


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## Pythoninfinite (Jun 1, 2015)

Yep, anything with a brain can have neurological problems caused by a pathogen, physical or environmental injury, oxygen starvation or birth defect. The big one to be super aware of is pathogenic damage - viral or bacterial damage, almost always leading to death.

Jamie


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## Cheswick3 (Jun 1, 2015)

They're a breeder, not a business.
I'm in Canberra.

I went and saw them today with the snake, expecting a refund, and instead they gave me mite spray with instructions to use it.
Do you think I should call them up and ask about a refund? I don't really want to have to deal with this problem myself, when I feel it should be their responsibility. Especially if the snake may have already contracted the virus from the mites that I suspect the last one had.


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## Grogshla (Jun 1, 2015)

for sure get a refund. Sounds like they are avoiding it


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## MesseNoire (Jun 1, 2015)

Cheswick3 said:


> They're a breeder, not a business.
> I'm in Canberra.
> 
> I went and saw them today with the snake, expecting a refund, and instead they gave me mite spray with instructions to use it.
> Do you think I should call them up and ask about a refund? I don't really want to have to deal with this problem myself, when I feel it should be their responsibility. Especially if the snake may have already contracted the virus from the mites that I suspect the last one had.



Hi mate, I am in Canberra too. Would you mind PMing me the name of this person?
I have a sneaking suspicion I know who it it but would like to know for sure....
Thanks.


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## Freeloader (Jun 1, 2015)

Well done herpo that will be another of your pointless posts that will be deleted. 
The bloke you are referring to probably has forgotten more about reptiles than you will ever know.
You would be doing yourself and your animals a favor by tapping into his knowledge rather than being obnoxious.


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## Freeloader (Jun 1, 2015)

If you two space cadets are the future of this hobby count me out.


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## arevenant (Jun 1, 2015)

Thread closing in 3...2...


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## Ollie15 (Jun 1, 2015)

Newbie to you newbies: Herpo and Pirate... Please take some constructive criticism here, tough as it is...there are people here that have a lot more experience and knowledge than we do... nastiness and name calling overall just doesn't yield a positive response... whether it is from the beginner or from the experienced person, it becomes very negative, turning us against each other and taking us all off topic..not cool :cry:

To the original poster Cheswich3, I am so sorry this happened to you and know you have tried to do the right thing from the word go, I hope you and your snake pull through this ordeal and are ok. I have a feeling you will steer clear from this breeder in the future. I don't blame you. take care Ollie..


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