# All around favorite?



## Primo (Aug 3, 2016)

I want to ask you folks from Australia what your all around favorite Aussie python is and why. I would love to own another animal here though I doubt my wife will agree. 
As of now I have a select few snakes that have peaked my interest that include an Olive, a Bredli and a Brisbane, locality coastal. Those are the Aussie snakes I'd like. I also like the Suriname boa constrictor and the super dwarf reticulated pythons. 

Right now I currently have my son's female Royal python (boring) she is pretty much completely terrestrial and not very active. Her feeding habits are typical of the species and other than the fact that she was my son's 9th birthday present 4 years ago I really don't have an attachment to her.

I have a Barranquilla, Colombian boa constrictor which I love. He is semi arboreal, thick and muscular and eats anything at any time. I feed him monthly which may seem infrequent but almost all boas are overfed in captivity.

My (our) third snake is a coastal carpet mix/mutt. She is very active, probably beats the boa in activity and is even more arboreal. I will say the 2 traits I really enjoy are semi arboreal activity and activity in general. My female coastal is however a terrible feeder. Carpets would probably beat boas for me if they had the size. I assume my non eater is not the norm for carpets.

If I was to choose an Aussie python based on activity and climbing/display behavior would you guys give the nod to a Bredli, Brisbane coastal or olive? I know olives are not huge climbers but I hear they are quite active.

I'm equipped to handle 10-12 feet and maybe 40 pounds (apologies for the non metric) of snake and I'd like to see at least an 8 footer.

I'm curious to hear your recommendations. Thanks for any insight/experience.

Cheers!

This is how I display our animals.

Carpet cage.






Top cage royal and bottom boa constrictor.


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## pythoninfinite (Aug 3, 2016)

I think each species has its individual appeal, but a perfect, unmarked Olive, with its fine small scales and velvet sheen is hard to beat. M. bredli is also underrated I think, and have suffered in this country by being bred in huge numbers which have made them a bit "ho hum" for many keepers, and hard to get rid of as hatchies. The juvies are especially gorgeous in both these species!

Jamie


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## Primo (Aug 3, 2016)

pythoninfinite said:


> I think each species has its individual appeal, but a perfect, unmarked Olive, with its fine small scales and velvet sheen is hard to beat. M. bredli is also underrated I think, and have suffered in this country by being bred in huge numbers which have made them a bit "ho hum" for many keepers, and hard to get rid of as hatchies. The juvies are especially gorgeous in both these species!
> 
> Jamie


Thanks for the thoughtful response. I'm very interested in both species. If you have a moment could you run down what you think (based on my likes) what I would enjoy more?

I think the Bredli python meets many of my requirements but I don't know enough about olives. If they climb and perch in the slightest and stay active they area real front runner!

It may help to show off my 2 favorites here.

This boa constrictor is very special. It is a true locality animal from Barranquilla, Colombia.

He is a male and is about 6 feet 2 or 3 inches long at 4 years old. I suspect he is 10-12 pounds. I keep my boa very lean and feed a somewhat natural/wild schedule which is really no schedule. He becomes rather active at night and is very controlled and deliberate in his movements. He is probably the stealthiest of my two favorites.






This is my coastal mutt. She is longer than the boa but not nearly as dense or heavy. She is probably 6 feet and maybe 4 inches.





She is by far the busiest of the 2 and loves to climb and perch. If she was a consistent eater, I'd have probably my favorite in this package. Although handling a heavy, strong and docile boa constrictor is special. They really are one of the strongest snakes pound for pound when length is factored in.

And this is an older shot of the 5 year old royal.




She is 5 years old, a click over 4 feet and fairly boring. Non prehensile tail, almost completely terrestrial and a terrible feeder. She'll live forever though because of her self regulating food intake. I like her colors and I love the fact she is my son's snake and she is what got me deeply interested in boas and pythons.

Once again, with my personal likes in mind, feel free to add your experiences with the Bredli, large locality coastals and olives.





Again, thank you for the response!


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## Stompsy (Aug 3, 2016)

Primo said:


> Thanks for the thoughtful response. I'm very interested in both species. If you have a moment could you run down what you think (based on my likes) what I would enjoy more?
> 
> I think the Bredli python meets many of my requirements and don't know enough about olives. If they clim and perch in the slightest and stay active they area real front runner!
> 
> ...



Your Boa is gorgeous!

I am slightly bias when it comes to Australian pythons as my first snake was a Bredli and they are still my favourite. He was a wonderfully placid snake, very active and not too worried about movement around his enclosure. He was fed regularly and never refused a feed and even though I downsized to move states and moved him on, I'm still tempted to obtain another, even though they are (as the previous poster suggested), a little boring an ho hum in Australia now.


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## Primo (Aug 3, 2016)

Stompsy said:


> Your Boa is gorgeous!
> 
> I am slightly bias when it comes to Australian pythons as my first snake was a Bredli and they are still my favourite. He was a wonderfully placid snake, very active and not too worried about movement around his enclosure. He was fed regularly and never refused a feed and even though I downsized to move states and moved him on, I'm still tempted to obtain another, even though they are (as the previous poster suggested), a little boring an ho hum in Australia now.


Thanks very much!!

I am really happy to hear the Bredli are well liked. I have some access to them here and am quite interested in them.

A forum like this is very helpful and the "Ho Hum" business doesn't bother me and it shouldn't anybody. I'll sit in my snake room with a beer and the lights off and enjoy my time with any snake I personally like no matter how common it may be.

Thanks again!


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## BredliFreak (Aug 3, 2016)

I'm biased towards Bredli too, but olives are stunning animals and if you have space I advise getting one. I love your enclosures, and I reckon a GTP would go well in one. Also if you have pure albino darwins in the U.S don't rule them out, they are great but underrated pythons. JMO


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## Primo (Aug 3, 2016)

I guess I'll come straight out and ask.

Do olives like to climb and perch? If so I could try to set up and enclosure with that in mind. I have heard they don't from some and they do from others. I'm more inclined to believe they a primarily terrestrial from all the info I've read but I also don't see a lot of study on them.

I know I can probably get many of my requirements in a reticulated python, but the size potential ruins it it for me. Even the dwarf and super dwarf species have that hidden mainland gene. 

Aussie pythons really fit the bill and sans another boa are my favorites.


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## BredliFreak (Aug 3, 2016)

They are predominantly terrestrial, and also semi aquatic and saxicoline (rock dwelling) so you could get away with a long enclosure but they will use a bit of height.


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## Primo (Aug 3, 2016)

Great info and fairly close to what I suspected.

Probably for my enclosures and system here, I may be better suited for a Bredli or Brisbane coastal if I take the Aussie route.

Once again, I'm back to boa constrictors and carpet pythons. Why am I not surprised?? LOL!!!

You guys are very helpful here.


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## pythoninfinite (Aug 3, 2016)

Yep, as BF has said, Olives are primarily terrestrial, but they do climb occasionally. I remember a collector in Western Australia retrieving one about 9ft long out of a tree and it nearly killing him while he had both hands occupied hanging on to the tree. The things we do for love...

Saxicoline... what about crepusclar, matutinal and vespertine :shock:?

Primo, I used to keep Boas (constrictor) when I was living in Perth, and I know what you mean about stealth. My workshop was about 40ft x 20ft and the food freezer was 40ft away from their enclosure. Within about 3-5 mins they knew I had taken rats out of the freezer and left them on the lid - you could see their pupils dilate and they would VERY slowly adjust their positions to one of strike pose - this usually took 15-30 minutes, it was almost imperceptible. I had the great experience of allowing one of them to be used by Alice Cooper when he was doing concerts in Perth - it was a bit heavy but it fit the bill!

Must be well past your bedtime over there matey!

Jamie


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## Iguana (Aug 3, 2016)

You are very fortunate to be able to keep such exotic reptiles! Don't get me wrong the Australian wildlife is amazing, but I have a soft spot for Royal pythons and Retics :lol:
There's a lot of great information already, but i thought i'd put in my suggestion. Based on your preference to the boa, a Bredli shouldn't disappoint. A long but chunky snake which if 'tamed' right, can be a great handler. The 'wild type' have beautiful coloring, but a 'hypo' is great too. If a heat light and sturdy branch is provided you'll find that it will spend a majority of it's time out and about, although carpets in general are pretty active snakes. They also have a great feeding response.
A taller enclosure would be put to good use as well. Also, if you are looking for a display snake, a nice colored jungle would look fantastic. Although, many are prone to have a nasty temper!


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## JackTheHerper (Aug 3, 2016)

Morelia Bredli and Morelia Carinata, Both such beautiful snakes, And Definitely my favourites!


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## Stompsy (Aug 3, 2016)

JackTheHerper said:


> Morelia Bredli and Morelia Carinata, Both such beautiful snakes, And Definitely my favourites!



Add an Albino Darwin into that mix and I'm with you all the way!


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## BredliFreak (Aug 3, 2016)

Did you keep boas because of museum stuff or another way 

I get to work with boas at the Canberra Reptile zoo and they are great animals to work with. I can't wait till they have more exotics there.


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## pythoninfinite (Aug 3, 2016)

BredliFreak said:


> Did you keep boas because of museum stuff or another way
> 
> I get to work with boas at the Canberra Reptile zoo and they are great animals to work with. I can't wait till they have more exotics there.



Yep, bred at Perth Zoo, and we used them in educational programs at the WA Museum (but it was really just because I wanted them )!

J


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## Buggster (Aug 3, 2016)

In my opinion, nothing makes a better display animal than a Green Tree Python. Would love to get one, but I think I'll leave it for a couple more years when I'm more confident with having such a hard to care for Python!


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## pinefamily (Aug 3, 2016)

The coastal is probably the most arboreal on your list, Primo.


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## Evil_Birdy (Aug 3, 2016)

Not that I keep Morelia, but from the snakes that I _do _keep, I have noticed that behaviour is not really species specific, and therefore a measure of activity re coastals vs. bredli vs. olive vs. boa is a rather subjective thing to try to comment about. 

Let me clarify. While, as I stated, I don't own Morelia, I do own a pair of spotted pythons. My female makes a grand total of two movements in her life:
1. To get from the cold side to the basking area
2. To get from the basking area to the cold area when she's had enough heat. 
She is a very 'boring' snake, so to speak, and loves nothing more than to sleep.
My male on the other hand is on the opposite end of the spectrum, and is very active (and much more slender than her). In fact, he is moving around his enclosure as I write this, and makes an excellent display animal. Because of this, I could not effectively tell anyone that spotted pythons do or do not make good display animals. It depends entirely on the hatchling you happen to pick, and the personality of that animal. There is no species specific level of activity for spotted pythons - or for any animal really. 

In in the same way, you have a very active coastal, but I know several people who have carpets much like my female spotted, that do nothing but perch and sleep. 

All the snakes you have selected for your next pet are beautiful, but I couldn't really give you a suggestion regarding activity. Just pick the one _you _like the look of the best. They're all beautiful animals, but they're not all active animals. Short of learning how to speak snake, and asking the hatchlings, "on a scale of one to ten, how much do you like to move around?" it's really just a lucky dip regarding activity. Good luck on your search for a new snake. Be sure to post picks for us when you get it.


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## Prof_Moreliarty (Aug 3, 2016)

Evil_Birdy said:


> Not that I keep Morelia, but from the snakes that I _do _keep, I have noticed that behaviour is not really species specific, and therefore a measure of activity re coastals vs. bredli vs. olive vs. boa is a rather subjective thing to try to comment about.
> 
> Let me clarify. While, as I stated, I don't own Morelia, I do own a pair of spotted pythons. My female makes a grand total of two movements in her life:
> 1. To get from the cold side to the basking area
> ...



Interesting observation, with MY snakes so im not saying this is a rule of thumb all the females behave pretty much as you describe your female spotted does and all the males are very active so maybe it is a question of sex if you want a really active snake? happy for more experienced owners than me to shoot my theory down.


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## eipper (Aug 3, 2016)

Simalia oenpelliensis are my favorites- I don't keep them yet


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## Primo (Aug 4, 2016)

WOW!
I'm elated to see so many well thought out responses tossed my way on this topic. I should state that when I speak of "activity" levels I'm being very *​general*. There is an understanding of snake to snake (individual) behavior and differences in activity based on species and their specific habits. 

I fully believe the carpet python group will be more active than royal pythons, blood pythons and other similar animals but will not hold a candle to some of the colubrids that are much more active in general.

I don't have a large study group here and can only go off my experiences with other snakes that I've observed and my own collection. Most all of this is based on the captive environment which is obviously very different from the wild. I have also taken into account what I've read in books and other media plus I'm adding *​YOUR* (the forum community) experiences in to get a wider range.

I am a rather big believer that a "fat and happy" captive snake will be a boring snake. Boa constrictors are some of the most consistent eaters, rarely refusing a meal, yet they are one of the first types to become overfed, lazy and often they die an early death because of excess stores of fat. There is a bit of a learning curve to properly figuring them (boa constrictors) out, at least for a serious keeper that wants to see a snake live beyond 20 years. 

Being acutely aware of seasonal changes, hours of light, humidity and temperatures is important and will play a role in longevity and day to day behavior. I keep my guy lean and he is off feed in the winter. Because of this, he is probably more active than the average boa kept by an overzealous keeper that enjoys watching weekly feedings.

I'm not a breeder nor do I plan to be so I won't even touch on the effect of reproductive pheromones and their related cues that alter activity and behavior.

I'm WAY off track LOL!

Anyhow, I think because I like semi arboreal VS completely arboreal or completely terrestrial I'm very inclined to look at bigger coastals (mine is a mutt) and possibly a dwarf or super dwarf reticulated python. I had considered a Timor python but I'm hearing a lot of poop and pee and musking reports. Even the retics generate a lot of waste fairly often.

I think the carpet group or another locality boa constrictor would fit here best but that doesn't quash my interest in the right olive or possibly smaller reticulated python. 

Personally, and this is only my experience my carpet seems to be the most active and social of the 3 snakes. She would get the nod if the boa constrictor wasn't so fun and impressive to handle. She's actually all over the cage as I type this. She has been active all morning and it is splendid!

I could probably send my wife into a frenzy if I just got another carpet and boa. Problem solved LOL!


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## BredliFreak (Aug 4, 2016)

An oenpelliensis would be awesome!

I have found that my male Carpet is somewhere in the middle, but during the day he spends 90% of it basking. My suspected female/male (got her sexed, the guy thought it was a male but couldn't be too sure as the probe went in a place where you couldn't tell very well) isn't very active and will spend her days and nights just switching where she sits occasionally.


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## pythoninfinite (Aug 4, 2016)

From my own experience, GTPs would have to be the most inactive species I have ever kept, and this applies especially to the females, which will rarely move from under their heat source for weeks on end. It's my belief that this inactivity leads to a number of health issues with these animals - poor muscle tone and reduced bowel activity which leads to tail-hanging and the increased potential for prolapse, and a general lack of fitness. It's been my experience that males generally are much more resilient and retain better overall fitness, and often have longer, healthier lives than females. Given our tendency to overfeed our pythons, and a poor level of activity, it's a disaster waiting to happen. I was talking to the late Rico Walder on one of his visits to Oz a few years ago, he told me he had cut back to one mouse a week for his breeding females as a general rule, and their overall health was very much improved, with far less tail-hanging. It seems to me that much more environmental stimulation and more reasons to keep them moving (such as they would encounter in the wild) would greatly benefit female GTPs in particular.

It would be interesting to know (maybe a survey) from long-term keepers which sex has an overall longer life in captivity, and this may not just apply to GTPs, given the reproductive stresses female pythons face through their breeding years. Primo, I suspect that very few keepers see their animals reach 20 years, even though this is very doable with informed husbandry. Many specimens in zoos live to ripe old ages because they are simply not over-indulged.

Jamie


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## Primo (Aug 4, 2016)

pythoninfinite said:


> From my own experience, GTPs would have to be the most inactive species I have ever kept, and this applies especially to the females, which will rarely move from under their heat source for weeks on end. It's my belief that this inactivity leads to a number of health issues with these animals - poor muscle tone and reduced bowel activity which leads to tail-hanging and the increased potential for prolapse, and a general lack of fitness. It's been my experience that males generally are much more resilient and retain better overall fitness, and often have longer, healthier lives than females. Given our tendency to overfeed our pythons, and a poor level of activity, it's a disaster waiting to happen. I was talking to the late Rico Walder on one of his visits to Oz a few years ago, he told me he had cut back to one mouse a week for his breeding females as a general rule, and their overall health was very much improved, with far less tail-hanging. It seems to me that much more environmental stimulation and more reasons to keep them moving (such as they would encounter in the wild) would greatly benefit female GTPs in particular.
> 
> It would be interesting to know (maybe a survey) from long-term keepers which sex has an overall longer life in captivity, and this may not just apply to GTPs, given the reproductive stresses female pythons face through their breeding years. Primo, I suspect that very few keepers see their animals reach 20 years, even though this is very doable with informed husbandry. Many specimens in zoos live to ripe old ages because they are simply not over-indulged.
> 
> Jamie



We seem to be on the same page and have a lot of similar views. I have heard the same about GTP's and am not surprised by your personal findings and observations.

Yes !!! 20+ years is very doable for a lot of the snakes we keep. I think some would be surprised by my age, though I'm not ancient, I am close to retirement and picked up this snake hobby because my wife and I bought our son the royal python for his 9th B-day 4 years ago.

I think because I'm not facing life changes and actually got into the hobby for relaxation and a true interest in the critters I keep, I'm able to think long term and don't worry about marriage, job changes or relocation. Please don't take that (you younger keepers) as anything more than what it is. There are myriads of school kids, and young adults that are well prepared and passionate about the hobby. You Aussie folks really seem fit for this because these snakes, at least the ones I'm interested in live side by side with some of you and you know more about them than most.

I seem to get off track a lot LOL!

I too would be curious to see some studies whether they are from personal experience or actually long term field studies on the topic Jamie mentioned.

OH, another snake that is on my "hot list" would be a scrubby of a smaller locality. The word is that they are not a great keep, but maybe that is because, at least in the US, there aren't many captive breeding programs.

In all actuality they may be my favorite snake of period. However olives eat other snakes I'm told and that to me makes them pretty spectacular.

Another species is the Papuan Olive python but again they are not readily available. Another snake eater from what I've read.

I'm not into morphs and prefer Mother Nature colors and patterns.

Do you folks in OZ find sexual dimorphism favoring the male carpets, at least the species that participate in combat? Does that change in captivity if you are just raising a pet?

My apologies as I'm all over the board with attention deficit disorder which is my nature but I'm trying to get information and type and when I think of something I tend to blurt it out. Hopefully this is not overly confusing.

As you can see, I'm very much leaning toward and Aussie Bredli or Brisbane locality coastal.

Sans a beautiful Suriname boa constrictor or just the right super dwarf reticulated python I think this is a no brainer.

Here are a few more reasons why I love locality boa constrictors.

This is my male Barranquilla, Colombian. He was produced by Gus Rentfro who is a world authority on boa constrictors. He lives in Texas and obviously selectively bred this line of boas. That said these animals often look just like this in the wild.


Thank you ALL for making this discussion informative and enjoyable!

On the rocks.







In the green. These guys are hard to beat for looks and activity, plus general handling but I think carpets may just edge them out for me right now.


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## Buggster (Aug 4, 2016)

pythoninfinite said:


> From my own experience, GTPs would have to be the most inactive species I have ever kept, and this applies especially to the females, which will rarely move from under their heat source for weeks on end. It's my belief that this inactivity leads to a number of health issues with these animals - poor muscle tone and reduced bowel activity which leads to tail-hanging and the increased potential for prolapse, and a general lack of fitness. It's been my experience that males generally are much more resilient and retain better overall fitness, and often have longer, healthier lives than females. Given our tendency to overfeed our pythons, and a poor level of activity, it's a disaster waiting to happen. I was talking to the late Rico Walder on one of his visits to Oz a few years ago, he told me he had cut back to one mouse a week for his breeding females as a general rule, and their overall health was very much improved, with far less tail-hanging. It seems to me that much more environmental stimulation and more reasons to keep them moving (such as they would encounter in the wild) would greatly benefit female GTPs in particular.
> 
> It would be interesting to know (maybe a survey) from long-term keepers which sex has an overall longer life in captivity, and this may not just apply to GTPs, given the reproductive stresses female pythons face through their breeding years. Primo, I suspect that very few keepers see their animals reach 20 years, even though this is very doable with informed husbandry. Many specimens in zoos live to ripe old ages because they are simply not over-indulged.
> 
> Jamie



As a person who is interested in owning a GTP in the future, I found this a very interesting read.

My Woma hatchling is either extremely lazy, or I'm just unlucky enough that I never see him move (well, other than when he smells a meal...). 

Considering getting him a second heat mat or possibly a lamp to put on the opposite end of his terrarium and switching up the hot/cold ends every couple days just to get him to move...

Do you reckon something like that could benefit a GTP, given you had the space to do so?


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## pythoninfinite (Aug 5, 2016)

Buggster said:


> As a person who is interested in owning a GTP in the future, I found this a very interesting read.
> 
> My Woma hatchling is either extremely lazy, or I'm just unlucky enough that I never see him move (well, other than when he smells a meal...).
> 
> ...



Hi Buggster, that's an interesting thought, and it's one I've had myself but not yet tried. I've often wondered if something like the reversing or alternating water movement used in high-end reef aquariums which promotes better water circulation and improved health for reef inhabitants might work for arboreal snakes like GTPs - having a heat panel at each end of the enclosure which alternate maybe every 24 hours or whatever, to stimulate the animal to move regularly. The problem is that GTPs in the wild are subjected to lots of influences which require a much higher level of activity, plus they have lots of air movement and rain etc. The enclosure environment is an appallingly static environment for a GTP, which, unlike many pythons and by virtue of the mild and stable environment in which they live, spend much of their time relatively exposed to the elements. In captivity they get very little, if any, temperature variation, almost no air movement, no branch movement (no wind or even a breeze), nothing like real rain, and they get their food offered to them on tongs under their heat panel, so very little environmental stimulation, hence they don't need to do any work whatsoever and as a consequence become very unfit.

I'm sure that this is bad for the long-term health of the species, and I've been thinking of ways to overcome these problems. I hope to build an aviary on my property here on the mid-north coast which can be fully climate controlled (economical heating through the colder months is the biggest concern for me). I have my Boyd's outside in a similar setup, but offer no heat during the cooler months because they just go to ground when it's cold and don't seem harmed by this. They also go to the lower level when the top levels heat up to over 50C on summer days (it's fully enclosed with polycarbonate sheeting on the roof & half the sides) - so they remain active and subjected to environmental changes. I've been wondering if GTPs might do the same - move around in the higher levels when conditions suit, and if it gets too hot, go down into cooler, lower levels during the heat of the day. It's been suggested to me that they may always want to stay in the highest parts for security, which would obviously prove fatal if the enclosure wasn't suitably ventilated, but I'm not sure if, in a well planted tropical aviary with lots of suitable hiding spots, thermoregulation might be more important than a height-related sense of security, and they might head to the cooler, densely planted lower levels.

Waterrat has the ideal setup in his back garden, and I'm giving a lot of thought to how to duplicate those conditions in a climate that, while relatively mild, still has extremes which would be harmful to GTPs.

Ideas anyone?

Jamie


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## alexbee (Aug 8, 2016)

Get a bredli,, awesome animals


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## pythoninfinite (Aug 8, 2016)

alexbee said:


> Get a bredli,, awesome animals



I agree, beautiful animals, but been there & done that...

Jamie


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## Pauls_Pythons (Aug 8, 2016)

Love Boas, used to have a breeding pair in a previous life.
Those were the days when my dream was a Diamond Python.........have you considered these?
Semi-arborial, can be very active.....(My male drives me crazy some nights rearranging his enclosure for me)

Seem to be quite readily available State side and easy to look after.


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## pythonmum (Aug 14, 2016)

I am a huge fan of the albino Darwins. They are a nice size for a carpet and very arboreal. My pair both love to crawl around and perch on their branches. They are 9 years old and still vibrantly coloured - no fading or greying like you get with some that have a lot of black.
As stated before, the olives will be terrestrial and so will a large Bredl. If you want one to climb around, a Darwin or jungle is probably the best bet. Both feed well as a rule, but there are always individual exceptions. If you enjoy handling, be selective about the jungle line. Most of my albino offspring have been great handlers, but about 1 in 20 is a snappy little jerk. My adults are mellow as. There are many great choices!


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