# White Lipped Island Pit Viper????



## longqi (Sep 12, 2012)

Cryptelytrops insularis and Trimeresurus albolabris insularis

What is the difference or are they the same snake??

Ive always called them T a insularis, but was told after posting this rescue photo that that is incorrect

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http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphot...40956615_n.jpg

Any definitive reply would be appreciated as there may be slight differences in venom etc


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## eipper (Sep 12, 2012)

Longi,

Trimersurus was broken up about 5 years ago. Since then many species such as poperum, albolabris etc have split up into a number of species.

Cheers
scott


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## longqi (Sep 12, 2012)

eipper said:


> Longi,
> 
> Trimersurus was broken up about 5 years ago. Since then many species such as poperum, albolabris etc have split up into a number of species.
> 
> ...



Thanks Scott
Looks like I better buy a book one day?
Damn
Rather catch slitherers than read about them

Peter


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## eipper (Sep 12, 2012)

Hi all,

I stand corrected following my post, a mate sent me a paper that has put insularis back into Trimeresurus (it is actually the type species for genus). It also recommended a number of the genera proposed by Malthora and Thorpe to be sub genera for a clear understanding of the relationships between Asian Pit Vipers.

I suppose it comes back to taxonomists change their opinion based of evidence at hand and as a result things are far from stable.

Cheers
scott


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## longqi (Sep 12, 2012)

It used to be a subspecies of _Trimeresurus albolabris_, but was given species status in 2001 - _Trimeresurus insularis_. The whole _Trimeresurus_ genus was then revised in 2004, during which _T.insularis_ was assigned to _Cryptelytrops_, hence_ Cryptelytrops insularis_.

More recently (2011), another revision has taken place, with most species being put back into the genus _Trimeresurus_, including _C.insularis_. So, currently, the correct name for this species is back to being _Trimeresurus insularis_.

Thanks Scott

Now another question
Is the Island variety just _Trimeresurus insularis_.or is it back to Trimeresurus albolabris insularis


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## eipper (Sep 12, 2012)

Hi longi,

The specimens from Bali are Trimeresurus insularis.

Cheers
Scott


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## longqi (Sep 13, 2012)

Thanks Scott

Its fairly important we get the information right even though there is not much difference
Just wish they wouldnt play games and switch things around

Peter


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## Snotty (Sep 13, 2012)

longqi...just to throw in my 2.6 cents if you are playing around with _T. insularis_ (or anyone else) they should be aware that the venom is nasty - stating the obvious, but what I am getting at is it is worse than the others. The AV (GPV) is not really that effective at the best of times (although arguably better than nothing), but in the case of _T. insularis_ being more isolated there is a greater divergence so the AV is even less effective. At least that is my memory/understanding of the situation.

Or to put it another way the AV is for "Green Pit Vipers", but _T.insularis _is less like the others. 

Not wanting to rain on any picnic but some things are better to know up front. Still love the Pit Vipers even though they have a bad habit of popping up from nowhere. (Or more honestly me walking along day dreaming then a sudden...whoa s%^$...)


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## longqi (Sep 13, 2012)

Probably the cause of more bites in Bali than any other snake
Very defensive and we are finding too many inside houses at the present time
Mostly big females and the fangs are huge for such a relatively small snake
We cleared 14 mixed sizes from one small area of bush in a resort here last week
Hard to find in daylight or full moon as they hide away
But easy most nights as they feed in the trees and stand out light bulbs when you hit them with a torch
Wet season coming up and they are all on the move lately


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