# Difficulty heating enclosure



## StellaDoore (Jun 17, 2011)

My house mates and I are buying a snake and he's built an enclosure for it. It's pretty snazzy, 4x2x2 built onto a TV cabinet.
I can't remember what it's made of, but have been assured it's well insulated, and has a perspex front (although he may buy glass).

We're having trouble heating it though. My friend bought a 275watt globe, but that can hardly get the cage up to 30C. I'm pretty sure I'm going to ban him from using the globe coz it could actually cook the snake, but he suggests angling it away from the ground (so the line of light runs parallel with the roof) so it will heat the cage, but not put intense heat on the snake. But then we don't have a basking light or a hot/cold gradient.

What can we do about this? Any combination of heat mat/basking lamp/crazy powerful globe that I can use?
Also, we're getting our first snake, a male classic Bredli =) pretty excited


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## saximus (Jun 17, 2011)

275W for that size enclosure should be huge! Where are you measuring the temperature and what with? You only need upwards of 30 at the hot end and at this time of year as long as it's about that directly under the basking spot it should be fine.

PS congrats on the Bredli. They're gorgeous snakes


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## Chris1 (Jun 17, 2011)

wow, thats a huge wattage!!
you could cook eggs under that!!

how long are you waiting between turning the light on and testing the basking surface?
rocks heat up more and more for hours,....

and how far is your basking spot under the globe?

my bredli thats back to globes has a 100 watter in a 6x4x2 foot tank, his basking area is 40cms under the globe and gets to 35. perfect.


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## solar 17 (Jun 17, 2011)

My only input is with a good size enclosure like that and getting a Bredli you should be looking at 33-35c basking spot mine (the bredli) will bask at up to 40c for hours and hours on end and they are in enclosures 2.4 meters high....l use habistat heat panels ceiling mounted with a 4mm gap between the panel and the ceiling/roof of the enclosure....solar 17 (Baden)


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## NotoriouS (Jun 17, 2011)

Where is your enclosure located and where are the vents located? I was having difficulty with my temps, had to do with a with a draft coming straight through one of my vents. My enclosure is in my gym under my house, and there is a slight gap in the doors which allows a breeze to come in. So I just changed the placing of the vents and my temps went up. My enclosure is a little larger than yours and I'm currently using a 100w ceramic heat emitter. 275w would be overkill imo, and congrats on getting your first! Bredli's are awesome pythons!


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## lisa5 (Jun 17, 2011)

Congrats on getting your first snake and yes as the others have said bredli's are great snakes. Glad you asked the question, as mine will be moving into that sized enclosure in the spring and I was wondering the same. Some very helpful advise.


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## dangles (Jun 17, 2011)

I'm using 75w reflector spots from bunnings in same size enclosure, basking will hit 30ish in our current weather, air temp sits around 26 in the hot end 17 cool end. By closing off vents I could raise temps more


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## fugawi (Jun 17, 2011)

Can you post a photo of the enclosure so we can see the set up?
Remember the whole cage doesn't have to be over 30 degrees.


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## Red-Ink (Jun 17, 2011)

StellaDoore said:


> My house mates and I are buying a snake and he's built an enclosure for it. It's pretty snazzy, 4x2x2 built onto a TV cabinet.
> I can't remember what it's made of, but have been assured it's well insulated, and has a perspex front (although he may buy glass).
> 
> We're having trouble heating it though. My friend bought a 275watt globe, but that can hardly get the cage up to 30C. I'm pretty sure I'm going to ban him from using the globe coz it could actually cook the snake, but he suggests angling it away from the ground (so the line of light runs parallel with the roof) so it will heat the cage, but not put intense heat on the snake. But then we don't have a basking light or a hot/cold gradient.
> ...



Mind getting us a pic of it?
As others said 275w should be cooking what ever is inside that enclosure... I have a 4x2x3 enclosure running a 160w and I'm getting mid to high 40s at my basking spot on the hot summer days and that basking spot is 2 foot away from the light itself.


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## StellaDoore (Jun 17, 2011)

Saximus, we're measuring the temp with a little digital read out thing (has a sensor attached by a cord to a small screen). So there just has to be an area at 30C for the snake to be in? As in, not an entire half of the enclosure has to be hot, just a large patch under the basking light? Because I think my house mates are trying to get the whole cage up to 35C, which they're finding difficult.

Chris1, cook eggs or get a log to start smoking...yeah, banning them from using that light. I don't think my mates measuring basking temp, more ambient temperature. I'll definitely keep that in mind about your enclosure and Bredli, I'll probably try to have a similar set up.

Oshakoor, it's in the lounge room (it's a pretty small house, the only place where it will fit!) so moving it is a problem. However, the house is usually _freezing_ and gets to 8C in the lounge, would that have anything to do with it? Coz I'm trying to convince them to turn the heater on, this may help =P

Thanks for the help everyone! Pretty pumped to get a first python, been trying to convince parents for years and now I've moved out, snake time! Just wanted to make sure all the conditions were perfect before putting him in the enclosure. Also glad everyone says the Bredli is such a great snake. Been tossing up between getting an olive or BHP, but one was just too big, the other too pricey. Bredli, however, seems like a perfect first snake


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## saximus (Jun 17, 2011)

StellaDoore said:


> Saximus, we're measuring the temp with a little digital read out thing (has a sensor attached by a cord to a small screen). So there just has to be an area at 30C for the snake to be in? As in, not an entire half of the enclosure has to be hot, just a large patch under the basking light? Because I think my house mates are trying to get the whole cage up to 35C, which they're finding difficult.


 Yeah you only want the basking area to be in the 30s. The cool end can basically get as low as ambient temp just as long as he has a nice toasty warm end. Trying to get the whole cage that hot is not only futile but it's not healthy. They need to have the ability to regulate their own body temperature which means having a range of temperatures through the enclosure (what we call gradient).


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## Red-Ink (Jun 17, 2011)

StellaDoore said:


> Saximus, we're measuring the temp with a little digital read out thing (has a sensor attached by a cord to a small screen). Not to sound patronising but... do they have the correct setting on the thermo? Those probe thermos have a dual setting for the cord and the screen itself so it can measure two spots. So there just has to be an area at 30C for the snake to be in? As in, not an entire half of the enclosure has to be hot, just a large patch under the basking light? Because I think my house mates are trying to get the whole cage up to 35C, which they're finding difficult.
> 
> Chris1, cook eggs or get a log to start smoking...yeah, banning them from using that light. I don't think my mates measuring basking temp, more ambient temperature. I'll definitely keep that in mind about your enclosure and Bredli, I'll probably try to have a similar set up.
> 
> ...




Cheers


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## StellaDoore (Jun 17, 2011)

Well having just a hot basking spot makes things so much easier! Okay, awesome. I was a bit confused about how they were planning on getting a thermal gradient if they were trying to get ambient temperature that hot...

The 275 watt goes cook stuff in the enclosure. It started to cause the log to smoke and makes a rock too hot to touch. I was not with my friend when he bought this, and did not approve when he installed it -.-" I think I'm going to buy a 100watt lamp (should it be ceramic? Or just a bunnings globe?) and make him get rid of the other one.

I'm pretty sure they have the thermometer set correctly, there's no way the lounge room was getting up to 30C! We are still getting a thermostat (in the mail, just hasn't arrived yet), another reason for not getting the snake right now, and I'll probably look into getting a better thermometer if it's needed.

Will take some pictures next time I see the cage. Currently only have ones of when it was being built.


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## fugawi (Jun 17, 2011)

You have to think of where Bredlis come from. Days are hot but in winter nights can get pretty cold so they can handle some cold. All snakes and reptiles will try to find some sun to warm up in the morning and when they get warm enough they will head to some shade, then sun, then shade etc to keep their temp right. This is called ectothermic. They have a slow pumping heart that unlike us, does not warm their blood. In a captive situation you need to give it a place to heat up and a place to cool down. The Bredli will know to move itself around the enclosure depending on its temp. The basking area needs to be hot but not too hot as it can burn. If you put a rock under the lamp, it cant get too hot. The lamp needs to be far enough away so as not to heat the rock too much, warm not hot. Touch the rock, if it burns you it will burn the Bredli.


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## saximus (Jun 17, 2011)

Haha yeah I don't even think I've seen a 275W globe before. That thing must have been pretty bright as well!
The ceramic vs globe thing is personal choice. I don't like ceramics any more just because of how expensive they are. However, they are more efficient for providing heat (all of their energy gets converted to heat rather than some being converted to light like a globe). Also just to throw a spanner in the works, if you or your friend is pretty handy you might be interested at looking into heat cord as another option. People who have converted to these tend to say they will never go back to globes


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## StellaDoore (Jun 17, 2011)

saximus said:


> Haha yeah I don't even think I've seen a 275W globe before. That thing must have been pretty bright as well!
> The ceramic vs globe thing is personal choice. I don't like ceramics any more just because of how expensive they are. However, they are more efficient for providing heat (all of their energy gets converted to heat rather than some being converted to light like a globe). Also just to throw a spanner in the works, if you or your friend is pretty handy you might be interested at looking into heat cord as another option. People who have converted to these tend to say they will never go back to globes


 
Just double checked on the globe, it's the kind used as heat lamps in bathrooms. So if it's used to get an entire room hot, it's probably a bit too much for an enclosure 1/10th the size. I can't remember globe prices, so I'll double check ceramic vs normal, but cheaper will most definitely win (being a poor uni student and all =P).

What's the heat cord? How does it work and how do you install it? Speaking of heating sources, is it worth putting in a heat mat? I have one left over from when family used to own lizards.


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## saximus (Jun 17, 2011)

"What's the heat cord?" - Haha you totally just sounded like my grandmother then. "Daniel I need you to help me look up the internet"  jks. Heat cord just looks like a length of rubber cord type stuff with a 240V plug on the end. It comes in different lengths that equate to their power rating. They are water proof and seem very efficient.
I wouldn't use a heat mat. Other people can tell you about the sensational stories for why not. I personally think they are a rare occurrence that seems to be more prevalent with one particular brand. So that shouldn't be the only reason not to but heat cord just seems so much better in comparison.
Heat cord does require a bit more effort to set up though - you need to zig zag it back and forward on a piece of wood by either routing the wood or just wrapping it around screws/nails/hooks. Then you sit a ceramic tile on top and it provides a nice warm spot.


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## fugawi (Jun 17, 2011)

I use 60-100w focus beam spot lights from Wollies or Coles. They are made by Phillips and come in a twin pack for around $5.

Another thing you could look into is a t/statically controlled basking heat rock.


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## vampstorso (Jun 17, 2011)

I bought a ceramic heat emitter the other day for my lizards...it does seem to be amazing! certainly recommend them  (was $50 for 100watt that heats my 3ft glass enclosure in a house under 5 degrees in winter!)

I've only had experience with heat cords in click-clacks, but they certainly proved better than the heat mat I had. They also only seem to heat up to a certain point that is still safe to touch, whereas heat mats get much hotter.

Goodluck!


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## StellaDoore (Jun 17, 2011)

Aw, feel even more like a granny now that I did actually do a Google search on it *blushes*
It does sound pretty good though, I may just look into that. Or maybe for the next snake enclosure =) 
Doesn't seem too tricky to set up, I reckon i could manage it okay. Where do yo get them? (Reptile shop? Bunnings?)
And thanks for all the advice Saximus, so helpful!


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## vampstorso (Jun 17, 2011)

heat cords come from pet stores  or you can order from ultimate reptile supplies online 
they're about $30 upwards

http://www.ultimatereptiles.com.au/...e&category_id=28&Itemid=43&vmcchk=1&Itemid=43

it's the same brand you'll generally see at pet stores


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## Red-Ink (Jun 17, 2011)

StellaDoore said:


> Just double checked on the globe, it's the kind used as heat lamps in bathrooms. So if it's used to get an entire room hot, it's probably a bit too much for an enclosure 1/10th the size. I can't remember globe prices, so I'll double check ceramic vs normal, but cheaper will most definitely win (being a poor uni student and all =P).
> 
> What's the heat cord? How does it work and how do you install it? Speaking of heating sources, is it worth putting in a heat mat? I have one left over from when family used to own lizards.



Here's a thread about heating with a heat cord.... What Sax is talking about in post #17.
http://www.aussiepythons.com/forum/diy-zone-5392/fixing-pine-unit-vinnies-160128/


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## saximus (Jun 17, 2011)

I think you mean #7 Red. Yeah that whole thread pretty much sets the standard for conversions in my opinion.


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## Red-Ink (Jun 17, 2011)

saximus said:


> I think you mean #7 Red. Yeah that whole thread pretty much sets the standard for conversions in my opinion.


 
????? wait I am confused now lol

post #7
Dangles


> I'm using 75w reflector spots from bunnings in same size enclosure, basking will hit 30ish in our current weather, air temp sits around 26 in the hot end 17 cool end. By closing off vents I could raise temps more


 
Yours #17


> "What's the heat cord?" - Haha you totally just sounded like my grandmother then. "Daniel I need you to help me look up the internet"  jks. Heat cord just looks like a length of rubber cord type stuff with a 240V plug on the end. It comes in different lengths that equate to their power rating. They are water proof and seem very efficient.
> I wouldn't use a heat mat. Other people can tell you about the sensational stories for why not. I personally think they are a rare occurrence that seems to be more prevalent with one particular brand. So that shouldn't be the only reason not to but heat cord just seems so much better in comparison.
> _Heat cord does require a bit more effort to set up though - you need to zig zag it back and forward on a piece of wood by either routing the wood or just wrapping it around screws/nails/hooks. Then you sit a ceramic tile on top and it provides a nice warm spot. _


 
Isn't the little number on the upper right the post number? Have I gotten that wrong all this time ?


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## saximus (Jun 17, 2011)

lol oh you're talking about #17 in this thread. Sorry I meant that in the link you posted, #7 has a picture of a heat cord and how to set one up. My mistake sorry. Now we're on the same page


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## Red-Ink (Jun 17, 2011)

saximus said:


> lol oh you're talking about #17 in this thread. Sorry I meant that in the link you posted, #7 has a picture of a heat cord and how to set one up. My mistake sorry. Now we're on the same page


 
I did'nt even check what the post number with the pic was on the link... freaky coincidence lol


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## zuesowns (Jun 21, 2011)

ceramic definitely last longer than normal. I first purchased a normal one (also went for the cheaper option) and it lasted 6 weeks. I then purchased a ceramic which has lasted me 3 years so far.

I could see from your first post you were trying to get the whole enclosure to 30 degrees, You only need a hot spot for the snake to bask and it will regulate it's temp to it's own desire.

If you were to use a heat cord, usually they put them on the floor of the enclosure with a tile on top of it and news paper - should also get a 30 degree hot spot. or they put them on a shelf and cover it with a tile or glass.

I am using 3 methods of heating.

1 is using a lamp
1 is using a heat radiator 
1 is using heat cord

Heat radiator is the winner imo. easy to mount to the roof of the enclosure and you don't need to cover it with a ugly cage and use a lot of space (where the lamp hangs from the roof). and heat cords are fiddley and are annoying IMO, much easier to go with the heat radiator, that said...I am using the heat cord for a hatchie that is in a tub so yeah..


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