# Brick red green tree pythons



## Bricked (Dec 30, 2009)

I am interested in getting a green tree python, but i really want a brick red one. About what age the it lose its coloring? if i mated to GTPs that were red at childhood, would that increase the likerlyhood of the children of them being red in coloration?


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## GeckoJosh (Dec 30, 2009)

trickedoutz31 said:


> Bahahahahahahahahhahahaahahahahhahahahaaha


Now come on thats not being nice


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## reptilefan95 (Dec 30, 2009)

No comment, but i will only say what i know, GTP's will either be born with a beautiful maroon red or a fluro yellow, which changes at around the one year mark (?) there is no way you can get a Green tree python to keep that same red colouration throughout its life, but some GTP's will turn a nice blue colour at maturity.


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## blakehose (Dec 30, 2009)

fake account, anyone ?


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## Bricked (Dec 30, 2009)

er.... not a fake account. any way, good to how unhelpful you've all been..


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## TahneeMaree (Dec 30, 2009)

The ones that are red as babies are PNG Green Tree Pythons and the ones that are Yellow as bubs are Australian Native Green Tree Pythons... so I believe... Correct me if I'm wrong.


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## wiz-fiz (Dec 30, 2009)

would u b able 2 breed them so that they stay that colour 4 longer? by line breeding the ones that are the desired colour 4 the longest b4 they start changing 2 green? it would take years tho.


Will


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## Lene (Dec 30, 2009)

no one is encouraging new people to post on this forum. or even people like me who have been a member for years but hardly post due to replies exactly like these.
shame shame
there is no dumb question, only dumb answers, and plenty of them here


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## Jdsixtyone (Dec 30, 2009)

I agree with you Tahnee


TahneeMaree said:


> The ones that are red as babies are PNG Green Tree Pythons and the ones that are Yellow as bubs are Australian Native Green Tree Pythons... so I believe... Correct me if I'm wrong.


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## Jdsixtyone (Dec 30, 2009)

Bricked, at the age of one most green tree pythons change from yellow or red (not native)become a green colour. You might be able to but it would take years like Will said.


Bricked said:


> I am interested in getting a green tree python, but i really want a brick red one. About what age the it lose its coloring? if i mated to GTPs that were red at childhood, would that increase the likerlyhood of the children of them being red in coloration?


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## Bugsy (Dec 30, 2009)

G up?? Maybe at least learn to spell before trying to breed green tree pythons.


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## GreatSnakes (Dec 30, 2009)

Bricked said:


> I am interested in getting a green tree python, but i really want a brick red one. About what age the it lose its coloring? if i mated to GTPs that were red at childhood, would that increase the likerlyhood of the children of them being red in coloration?


 
All baby GTP's lose their red or yellow colour at around 12 months old.
Yes, if you mated 2 that were red babies you have an excellent chance of the babies being red.
Please don't believe that all yellow babies are native aussie GTP's as this is simply not true. Where some people are getting confused is the fact that to date no native aussie GTP has produced (nor have any been found in the wild) a red baby therefore it is accepted that our natve GTP's only produce yellow babies. In PNG where GTP's are also found there are plenty of localities where the babies are yellow and a few where the babies are red.


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## redbellybite (Dec 31, 2009)

Bricked said:


> I am interested in getting a green tree python, but i really want a brick red one. About what age the it lose its coloring? if i mated to GTPs that were red at childhood, would that increase the likerlyhood of the children of them being red in coloration?


 Bricked if you like the look of the REDDISH type of snakes we have in Australia ...and your keen on finding out more about them ,and probably suit the budget a bit better then a GTP ....
look at the BROWN TREE SNAKES and the BREDLI PYTHON ....you can get very brick red colours ....


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## Costa (Dec 31, 2009)

yeah i want i bredli when i move out of home
they are beautiful pythons and very nic colouring


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## pythons73 (Dec 31, 2009)

Just a few maroon-red photos of a Chondro


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## hawkesbury reptiles (Jan 1, 2010)

Would have been nice if some of you had actually READ what bricked had posted before commenting....:shock::x

Quite a legitament question, I learnt something, thanks for the useful answers from evryone else.

kelly


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## Owzi (Jan 1, 2010)

Bricked said:


> I am interested in getting a green tree python, but i really want a brick red one. About what age the it lose its coloring? if i mated to GTPs that were red at childhood, would that increase the likerlyhood of the children of them being red in coloration?



Brick red GTP babies are mostly from the Biak Locality Type (I have also noticed that High Yellow lines seem to have brick red babies, perhaps because most high yellows originate from Biaks?), other maroon babies are from different localities of PNG, they often have yellow siblings. As has been stated, Aussie Green babies have no other colour than yellow. Yes the colour change happens at about one year of age, but its the size of your animal that determines the change. David Wilson studied Aussie Greens in the Iron Range for several years and never found a yellow animal over 60cm. From my experiance a snake thats a good feeder from the start and fed a moderate size meal weekly, will change at more like 10 months. 

If you had two red babies and bred them as adults, yes you are more likely to have more red babies from their clutch.

Cheers,
Andrew


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## Jdsixtyone (Jan 1, 2010)

I absolutly had no idea that even red gtp's where native!!


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## Owzi (Jan 1, 2010)

snakemadness said:


> I absolutly had no idea that even red gtp's where native!!



They are not. Biak is an area of Papua New Guinea


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## Short_Brown (Nov 18, 2010)

Bricked said:


> I am interested in getting a green tree python, but i really want a brick red one. About what age the it lose its coloring? if i mated to GTPs that were red at childhood, would that increase the likerlyhood of the children of them being red in coloration?


 
It will increase the chances of having Red or even Blue hatchlings in your clutch as the colour is formed from good blood lines...


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## scorps (Nov 18, 2010)

The funniest thing is everyone jumping up on there high horses saying omg you want an exotic gtp, and only yellow ones are native, ***?

Majority of green tree pythons in captivity in Australia are exotics so come on guys pull your head in.

Everything that was originally posted made a hell of alot more sence then alot of posts recently been put up on this website.

Scorps


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## CodeRed (Nov 18, 2010)

they dont stay red, sometimes they turn yellow


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## D3pro (Nov 18, 2010)

If you cross a biak gtp with a collete they might stay red...


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## Greenmad (Nov 18, 2010)

code red thats a very nice snake mate what is the age of him/her


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## Greenmad (Nov 18, 2010)

this one was a red baby and is nearly fours years old know.


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## Greenmad (Nov 18, 2010)

this is the most updated pic i have of her and one of when she was a hatchie


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## SamNabz (Nov 18, 2010)

Greenmad, maybe you could shed some more light on this subject??!

I'm sure we can all benefit from your input. 

Cheers


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## CodeRed (Nov 18, 2010)

Greenmad said:


> code red thats a very nice snake mate what is the age of him/her


 
It was 2 yrs old in that photo

looked exactly like your one as a youngster


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## pythons73 (Nov 18, 2010)

Such beautiful Greens Codered and Ryan,they look simarlar in colour also..The red hatchie i had turned out a very light lime green with small patches of white along the back...Thats one main reason i LOVE the chondros,you dont know how they will turn out once they go through the colour change....


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## Greenmad (Nov 18, 2010)

If you crossed 2 reds together the likly hood of getting red babies is high, if you cross a red to a yellow being that the yellow is from the right origin you will get reds in the clutch as well, i have heard that yellows from the right origin will still produce reds as well. Can any one answer this, i have not expreniced this.


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## Tristan (Nov 18, 2010)

hmm, i would imagine if you can get 2 parents with the mutated gene causing late colour change than you would be able to pass that onto the off spring.

my question tho regarding the Chondro change, does any one know why they are one colour then change to another? 

I'm guess that in the jungle as a bright yellow or red they look more like they are poisons and or dangerous so they are less prone to be taken by predators? and the colour change happens as they mature as they are larger and can defend them selves and also to signify maturity for mating etc? 

so then surmising my above guess is correct, would a Chondro that takes longer to change colour be considered a weak gene as the late colour change would mean later maturity and less change of breeding? so even if you were able to breed that gene into some young would this then not make them even harder than normal to breed and pass the "weak" gene down?

and secondly does any one have any issues with deliberately passing weaker genes on i mean in nature the strong breed and the weak genes die out, not saying we would kill off any pets that carry a weak gene but to deliberately pass weak genes on for aesthetic reasons would seem counter productive for the species no?


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## Waterrat (Nov 18, 2010)

Amazing reading!

Biak is not in PNG, it's an Indonesian island.
Ontogenic colour change is not size dependent.
Yellow neonates occur in Australian, PNG and Indonesian populations but Aussie natives produce only yellow naonates.
Red neonates are not restricted to Biak.

Scorps, no need for anyone to pull their head in. There are plenty of pure Asussie natives in collections. 
Breenmad and CodeRed, you have some beautiful snakes, I am envious.

Cheers
M


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## Waterrat (Nov 18, 2010)

_my question tho regarding the Chondro change, does any one know why they are one colour then change to another? 

I'm guess that in the jungle as a bright yellow or red they look more like they are poisons and or dangerous so they are less prone to be taken by predators? and the colour change happens as they mature as they are larger and can defend them selves and also to signify maturity for mating etc? _ 

Tristan, go to the sticky "GTP essential info" and read D. Wilson's paper on that subject. You'll find all the answers there.

cheers
M


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## Greenmad (Nov 18, 2010)

Waterrat said:


> Amazing reading!
> 
> 
> Breenmad and CodeRed, you have some beautiful snakes, I am envious.
> ...



Thanks micheal you have the collection im envious of lol


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## da_donkey (Nov 18, 2010)

damn this thread just about takes the junk award for the week!

Amazing reading alright!!!!


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## Tristan (Nov 18, 2010)

Waterrat said:


> _my question tho regarding the Chondro change, does any one know why they are one colour then change to another?
> 
> I'm guess that in the jungle as a bright yellow or red they look more like they are poisons and or dangerous so they are less prone to be taken by predators? and the colour change happens as they mature as they are larger and can defend them selves and also to signify maturity for mating etc? _
> 
> ...



ah cheer Waterrat, ill check it out was i even close tho?


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## Greenmad (Nov 18, 2010)

Why is that da donk


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## Waterrat (Nov 18, 2010)

Tristan said:


> ah cheer Waterrat, ill check it out was i even close tho?



We know that when they change to green, they move from the rainforest edges into the interior and change their diet from skinks and frogs to mammals and birds. Why are yellow / red neonates important to this species? A million dollar question.

The red has nothing to do with aposematic colouration (pretending to be dangerous) but the red babies live amongst vines and colourful foliage (presumably different to Iron Range flora). The colour change is not linked to maturity. GTPs are sexually matured at 2,5 years (males) and 3.5 years (females). GTPs have no means of defence other that their camouflage.

I talked about ontogenic colour change at the Ipswich festival and I am now writing it up for Scales & Tails mag.

cheers
M


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## pythons73 (Nov 18, 2010)

That will be a very interesting read Michael...From your experience at what age do they generally go through the ontogenic change,whats the youngest you have had-oldest you have had go through it...So when will the million dollar Q get answered,is there anyway of finding a answer for it...


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## Waterrat (Nov 18, 2010)

pythons73 said:


> That will be a very interesting read Michael...From your experience at what age do they generally go through the ontogenic change,whats the youngest you have had-oldest you have had go through it...So when will the million dollar Q get answered,is there anyway of finding a answer for it...



It's an interesting concept and I really don't want to go into it here (it would compromise the article). I think the million dollar question will remain unanswered for a long time yet. It's not unique to GTPs, Emerald Tree Boas and other species have different colour offspring. I am more interested in what triggers the colour change, it's a physiological process that's either triggered by hormonal activity or some environmental influences. As you may know, I kept a number of juveniles from 2008 and 2009 clutches for 1 year to get some solid data on the OCC. The results are interesting.


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## Greenmad (Nov 18, 2010)

CodeRed said:


> It was 2 yrs old in that photo
> 
> looked exactly like your one as a youngster



Thanks bud hopefully it dosnt change much more on you.


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## Kristy_07 (Nov 18, 2010)

I look forward to the article, Michael. Cheers.


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## olivehydra (Nov 18, 2010)

Waterrat said:


> The red has nothing to do with aposematic colouration (pretending to be dangerous) but the red babies live amongst wines and colourful foliage (presumably different to Iron Range flora). M



sounds like a wonderful place


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## pythons73 (Nov 18, 2010)

Waterrat said:


> It's an interesting concept and I really don't want to go into it here (it would compromise the article). I think the million dollar question will remain unanswered for a long time yet. It's not unique to GTPs, Emerald Tree Boas and other species have different colour offspring. I am more interested in what triggers the colour change, it's a physiological process that's either triggered by hormonal activity or some environmental influences. As you may know, I kept a number of juveniles from 2008 and 2009 clutches for 1 year to get some solid data on the OCC. The results are interesting.


So the Tree Boas and GTPs,what other species has offspring that goes through the colour change..With the data that you collected,was there anything that surprised you at all.So in your opionion do you think something triggers the colour change,not just the hatchie getting older.As i had a fussy eater that was forced fed for 12months,once i got it to my place it ate the first night,it was not much bigger then a hatchie,was around 30-40cm..It ate 6 straight meals then shed,after another 3 meals it began to change colour..At this stage it was around 50-55cm,but 14months old..Now its 110cm it has doubled in size since October 09...


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## bally (Nov 18, 2010)

TahneeMaree said:


> The ones that are red as babies are PNG Green Tree Pythons and the ones that are Yellow as bubs are Australian Native Green Tree Pythons... so I believe... Correct me if I'm wrong.



Correct


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## Waterrat (Nov 18, 2010)

pythons73 said:


> So the Tree Boas and GTPs,what other species has offspring that goes through the colour change..With the data that you collected,was there anything that surprised you at all.So in your opionion do you think something triggers the colour change,not just the hatchie getting older.



The results were quite surprising, I am writing second page of the article now, few more to come - too much to post here ... be patient, all in good time.

Bally, "correct" but don't forget to add that the PNG / Indo GTPs ALSO have yellow babies, not only the Aussie natives. Quite often you see both yellow and red neonates in one clutch, sometimes they are all red or all yellow. In our natives, the neonates are only yellow.


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## CodeRed (Nov 18, 2010)

Greenmad said:


> Thanks bud hopefully it dosnt change much more on you.



Dunno how it looks now since I sold it 18 months ago


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## da_donkey (Nov 18, 2010)

Greenmad said:


> Why is that da donk


 
just some of the mis information given by people who clearly have no ideaand should have an understanding of the species before commenting.

( not all just some)


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## giggle (Nov 22, 2010)

My thought was that the colouration as a juvie was beneficial as the majority of their diet would have been located on the jungle floor and lower canopies... browns and yellows being closer to the colouration of the leaf litter and trunks of trees.


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