# Raven Care Sheet



## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

Is there a link to a care sheet for ravens that anyone knows of?


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## Jen (Oct 30, 2007)

Raven as in the bird?


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## nuthn2do (Oct 30, 2007)

I don't know of one specifically for crows but they are no different to currawongs or magpies when it comes to raising them.


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## Jozz (Oct 30, 2007)

Why help a crow! Damn things!!!


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## Jen (Oct 30, 2007)

ravens are different to crows, i think, smarter? Just don't name it Quoth, that would be trite


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## warren63 (Oct 30, 2007)

A friend in the country used to say a 22-250 took good care of them LOL !!!


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## Jen (Oct 30, 2007)

poisoned eggs works a treat on crows


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## Jozz (Oct 30, 2007)

warren63 said:


> A friend in the country used to say a 22-250 took good care of them LOL !!!


 
Yeah, that'd be my caresheet!

Sorry - I am a lover of all animals, but once you've seen 20+ new born lambs lying in a paddock with no tails, and crows pecking out their eyes while they're still alive, there's not much love left for foxes or crows!


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## caustichumor (Oct 30, 2007)

Any animal hated so much is a born survivor, I love their tenacity and intelligence. they would definitely make a great captive animal,


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## scorps (Oct 30, 2007)

i like carawongs prefer magpies more though


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

Its name is Tookie


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## caustichumor (Oct 30, 2007)

how can anyone hate that?


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## waruikazi (Oct 30, 2007)

Awwww

I love Tookie. :lol:


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

I think the ravens attack only sick lambs and they also eat the placentas at birthing tim.
Im quite sure a healthy lamb is well protected by its mother and ,if they actually kill a lamb, (wivestales) they are probably doing it a favour.
In the bush they perform a service by eating carrion, and taking sick and injured animals out as well.
In captivity they are like a dog and need to be treated and trained differently to parrots and raptors because they are so much more intelligent.
Kill your ferals but leave the native ravens alone.
No animal lover would lay poisoned eggs out for our native animals to eat.
Grr
Baz


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## nuthn2do (Oct 30, 2007)

caustichumor said:


> Any animal hated so much is a born survivor, I love their tenacity and intelligence. they would definitely make a great captive animal,


They follow dogs around in places like Alaska and eat anything they leave behind, including the *****. No better survivor i know of


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## Radar (Oct 30, 2007)

Just a warning: If its sitting on your shoulder, be careful, they have a natural curiosity that comes with their intellegence, and love shiny/reflective things.....including eyes....and they like to peck....you could easily lose an eye.
I love the ravens and crows as pets, they are truely characters, and the sort of pet you can have free flying in your neighbourhood if you bond and train it right...and if you trust your neighbours not to shoot it or stick it in a cage.


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## Oskorei (Oct 30, 2007)

i want two of these buggers would name them Hugin and Munin


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## koubee (Oct 30, 2007)

Tookie is so so cute, Baz.
Where did you come across him?


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

Thanks rednut, ill keep the sunnies handy then huh. 

The reactions from people who i tell about it is usually revoltion and horror stemming from ignorance 
and old fasioned ideas.

I deal with these reactions daily from people... ,but they are reacting to snakes.
Its funny to see a raven (not a crow) can invoke the same sort of reactions from people who love snakes.


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## Oskorei (Oct 30, 2007)

i got told that its illegal to keep them in NSW (emailed the nation parks about it months ago)

only reason i dont have 1... or 2


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## caustichumor (Oct 30, 2007)

It's sad hey, kill it first ask questions later, you would expect more from a group of people who care about (certain species) of native wildlife! tsk tsk


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## Jen (Oct 30, 2007)

Ravens are native? I did not know that. we put out poisoned eggs in our empty nest boxes, the only animals that go for them are crows, which are a massive pest. Tookie is a honey, good luck


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

Hey Liz, he was bought in the other day by a person who had found it in their yard.
The parents of the raven were not around (so im told) and they own cats and dogs.They had no idea what to do with it and my bird lady has her hands full with a couple of tawny frogmouth youngsters
and she couldnt take it, so she asked me to.
....So i said ill take it in, but its like having a human baby.


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## mummydolittle (Oct 30, 2007)

Tookie is so cute.

Goodluck and I hope he proves to everyone that he has a reason to live.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

Yeh jen,ravens are native to australia and the more there are the less dead animals sit and rot..
Wholesale killing of these birds would only have a negative affect on the environment.
also currawongs magpies and lacie monitors will eat the poisoned eggs,to name a few.
The house crow from india is a pest and can be culled at will.
They are the only member of the raven/crow family recognised as a feral.


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## waruikazi (Oct 30, 2007)

How do you tell the difference between the native species and the introduced ones?


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## Radar (Oct 30, 2007)

Take a look at the feathers around the face and under the throat, and the call is different. You'll never see them in the territory, Waruikazi, as far as I know they are only in victoria and WA.


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## nuthn2do (Oct 30, 2007)

waruikazi said:


> How do you tell the difference between the native species and the introduced ones?


Very difficult to tell any of the raven/crows apart, there's about 5 or 6 in Oz and all look much the same


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## Jen (Oct 30, 2007)

no, the magpies, currawongs and lacies do not get OUR eggs, we make sure of it to the extent of watching the enclosure. I didn't know they were natives, but i have always been aware of the difference between ravens and crows, for one thing i cannot stand crows but i like ravens - they seem 'cleaner'


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

House crows are duller,greyer sort of,,and they are smaller to, but it is very hard to tell the difference for a layman and even more experienced.
There are 6 species of crows and ravens in aussie ,including the 1 pest one, and they all are similar.


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## JasonL (Oct 30, 2007)

Jen said:


> Ravens are native? I did not know that. we put out poisoned eggs in our empty nest boxes, the only animals that go for them are crows, which are a massive pest. Tookie is a honey, good luck



Crows and Ravens are pretty much the same thing, they are differnet sub species of the genus Corvus. Most of the big black birds you see in eastern Aust and southern WA are Ravens (Corvus coronoides),


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## PhilK (Oct 30, 2007)

Filthy things... Rats with wings... All licey, and hollow-boney and one ovary-y.. Not to mention warm cloaca-y... Yuck. Death to them all!


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## JasonL (Oct 30, 2007)

I like Ravens. I saw one hit a Cormorant like a missle, mid air, they both fell out of the sky and onto the beach, then the Raven dragged to much larger and heavier Cormorant (that now had a broken wing) into the scrub. It was amazing to watch, the Raven was at some speed when it made cotact with the shag. A truely ballsy bird!


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

In England they are used for hunting like falcon.
As a matter of fact, the falconry forums from the uk are full of all sorts of useful interesting info.


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## Wild~Touch (Oct 30, 2007)

Long live Tookie  he is soooo cool


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## raxor (Oct 30, 2007)

...and in regards to the care of a young raven, I'm sure your bird lady would be the best person to speak to.

Common sense, but I would imagine a heat mat overnight is a good idea although it appears to have plumage and being summer it _should_ be fine.

For food, I'd guess some egg and biscuit mix (can you use that on insectivores, I've only ever raised parrots & pigeons?) and some crix mashed in for protein, maybe try offering it some cat biscuits and meat?

If you've got nothing on hand in the meantime maybe some wheat bix, sugar and egg all mashed up would be an idea.

He's very cute and I'm very jealous, I always wanted a raven or a magpie


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## Fennwick (Oct 30, 2007)

im a WIRES member and am looking after a raven at the moment. you can buy some supliment from pets shops called wombaroo insectivore. just mix this with beef mince, and some sort of calcium supliment(even crushed cuttlefish or egg shells will do).


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## cris (Oct 30, 2007)

Looks like a good pet IMO

Very smart birds, definately brighter than alot of ppl i have come across. Smart enough to use tools etc. Although i find the AAAARRKKKKK!!!!!!!! noise a little irritating how cool is that predator noise they make :lol:


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## Jozz (Oct 30, 2007)

ssssnakeman said:


> I think the ravens attack only sick lambs and they also eat the placentas at birthing tim.
> Im quite sure a healthy lamb is well protected by its mother and ,if they actually kill a lamb, (wivestales) they are probably doing it a favour.
> In the bush they perform a service by eating carrion, and taking sick and injured animals out as well.
> In captivity they are like a dog and need to be treated and trained differently to parrots and raptors because they are so much more intelligent.
> ...


 
I know that and agree Baz, and I know how smart they are. They only did it to the lambs that the foxes had thill killed, but I can never get that picture out of my head of seeing them pecking the lambs eyes out while they were still alive! So, i'm just having a rant  It was a horrible sight  too many killed just for the thrill!


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

Raxor, he is very cute and i will try him on the egg mix. I have been using all sorts of offals and meats, breads vegies fruits.
He devours all of it.
We started feeding it with bits of meat dipped in water, for hydration mostly,on the tweezers.
Now, a week later , the bird is feeding well out of a bowl and scarfing up our home made dogfood.
He lives in an open..ish box in a warm room and watches us and everything with intent.
It has also become quite tame a lot quicker than i expected.
I have to more insectavore mix tomorrow..not cheap either.


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## alex_c (Oct 30, 2007)

Jen said:


> no, the magpies, currawongs and lacies do not get OUR eggs, we make sure of it to the extent of watching the enclosure. I didn't know they were natives, but i have always been aware of the difference between ravens and crows, for one thing i cannot stand crows but i like ravens - they seem 'cleaner'


and what happens if a lacie eats the poisoned raven?


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## alex_c (Oct 30, 2007)

ive actually been considering getting a new bird to hand rear where would i legally obtain a raven chick?


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## Khagan (Oct 30, 2007)

So do you get to keep this cool lil guy? Or only untill he is strong enough to be released?


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## Veredus (Oct 30, 2007)

warren63 said:


> A friend in the country used to say a 22-250 took good care of them LOL !!!


 
Yeh and a shovel will take good care of a snake aye!

I suppose we could run around squishing corroborree frogs under our boots or pour ****nic in the Mary River yeh? Would be all in good fun.


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## slip_phreak (Oct 30, 2007)

definately a very adaptive animal.. i've seen them flying over driving ranges (the golf variety) , picking up a golf ball then trying to smash them on the roads by dropping them out of trees etc.. thinking that they are eggs.


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## Veredus (Oct 30, 2007)

Damn word filter...surely that's going too far...

In any case I would love to have a Raven, intelligent and beautiful birds, I guess watching the ones that live around my uni campus will have to suffice for me seeing as they are illegal in this state.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 30, 2007)

> So do you get to keep this cool lil guy? Or only untill he is strong enough to be released?


We are sort of obligated to make it ready to go back to the wild, and i would like to see that happen to.
He might be smart enough to know what side his bread is buttered and decide to hang around..I know hed be welcome here if he does, or she.
Q, how do you sex a raven?


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## SLACkra (Oct 31, 2007)

hey baz, the one way i know how to sex birds when there is not obvious difference in appearance between the sexes to feel around their bum. If the two bones are far apart its a girl, close together its a boy as the females require the extra space so they can lay eggs. Ravens are fantastic animals, I fondly remember watching the bird show at Toronga Zoo and they brought out a raven. It's treat was tied to one end of a length of string and the other to a branch and it was dangling. The raven using its feet and beak pulled the string up and got to its treat. apparently self taught as well. They have also been known to use traffic to crack hard nuts, they drop the nuts on the pedestrian crossings at intersections, wait till the nut gets cracked and then retrieve it when the crossing light is green. 

good luck with tookie, he/she is in good hands,

Andrew


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## RevDaniel (Oct 31, 2007)

I have always wanted a raven as a pet.


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## sydneytradingco (Oct 31, 2007)

SSSSORY sssnakeman but crows do attack lambs and not sick ones! They are a pretty nasty bird! My mate who has sheep shoots them on site. 
Now Ravens they are probably no different but I'll give Tookie the benefit if the doubt.
But are Ravens Australian natives because they are native to Europe - hard to believe they evolved here and there. Add sparrows,blackbirds and crows to that list.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Oct 31, 2007)

> The Native Australian Raven and the Little Raven are widespread throughout Victoria and are present in all farming areas. The closely related Little Crow is uncommon in Victoria and is only found in the north west corner of the State. The Forest Raven is found mainly in coastal areas. All of the ravens and the Little Crow are protected wildlife. While there are undoubtedly instances where ravens do cause substantial losses of livestock, this is the exception, rather than the rule. Detailed studies of lamb predation in Australia have shown that neither disease nor predation is responsible for most of the ten million or so deaths of newborn lambs that occur in Australia each year: most lambs die because they are starving, after the suckling relationship between mother and offspring has been broken or failed to establish. Since starvation of lambs in Australia is usually irreversible, for economic reasons, it is academic whether a predator hastens the inevitable death of such lambs. However, such starvation can be avoided. Correct nutrition of the ewe during pregnancy and the provision of adequate shelter and supervision near lambing time will reduce the number of lambs vulnerable to predation. To achieve these changes, it is necessary to accept that losses due to predation are not as large as they appear to be. The autopsy of dead lambs, the recognition of the wounds found, and the assessment of lamb viability provide logical and convincing evidence.


dse report..
Farmers like to find a scapegoat and the crow, raven and snake have been good for this since biblical times


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## Radar (Oct 31, 2007)

sydneytradingco said:


> 1)-hard to believe they evolved here and there.
> 2)Add sparrows,blackbirds and crows to that list.


 
1) You should study evolution a bit more closesly. 

2) Indigenous Aussies and Indigenous Africans are the same right? Or do they just have the same colour skin?


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## Forensick (Oct 31, 2007)

i always wanted pet raven too....

and always planned on naming it "quoth"


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## moosenoose (Nov 2, 2007)

This is all very interesting reading Baz, as my kids have just brought home a young Magpie from the park 

My first question was, where did it comes from (nest location), were the parents present, can it fly?? blah blah blah No to all questions. So damn it!! Here it is at home. Seems to be feeding and happy and we are trying to keep it warm and quiet. Will post a pic later also.

My success rate with birds is appalling, but I can't just leave it! It'll either be eaten by a cat or die with all the rain about. Doomed either way I reckon - so here I go again, hopefully I can have a win this time.


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## moosenoose (Nov 2, 2007)

There's the little critter:


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## Isis (Nov 2, 2007)

ssssnakeman said:


> I think the ravens attack only sick lambs and they also eat the placentas at birthing tim.
> Im quite sure a healthy lamb is well protected by its mother and ,if they actually kill a lamb, (wivestales) they are probably doing it a favour.
> In the bush they perform a service by eating carrion, and taking sick and injured animals out as well.
> In captivity they are like a dog and need to be treated and trained differently to parrots and raptors because they are so much more intelligent.
> ...



Yes they do clean up the afterbirth and they also do kill the sick lambs...but they also kill plenty of healthy, strong lambs too. A sheep has no way of defending its newborn lamb against crows when there is usually a few of them attacking the lambs eyes and bum...they incapacitate the lamb them go in for the kill...Not nice to see or hear, and can be devastating to farmers.

They are absolute vermin, they also attack young native marsupials as well as reptiles. Not nice animals but very smart.


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## serenaphoenix (Nov 2, 2007)

i can't believe anyone actually suggested murder! you should be ashamed of your selves! I feed them fresh kangaroo meat off the balcony - they're beautiful to watch (and yes - they are the australian native ravens - not the feral crow - and regardless.... tsk tsk tsk.)


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## nuthn2do (Nov 2, 2007)

Isis said:


> Yes they do clean up the afterbirth and they also do kill the sick lambs...but they also kill plenty of healthy, strong lambs too. A sheep has no way of defending its newborn lamb against crows when there is usually a few of them attacking the lambs eyes and bum...they incapacitate the lamb them go in for the kill...Not nice to see or hear, and can be devastating to farmers.
> 
> They are absolute vermin, they also attack young native marsupials as well as reptiles. Not nice animals but very smart.


I'd like to see video footage of a crow taking out a healthy lamb because it doesn't happen on this property.


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## Hickson (Nov 2, 2007)

Isis said:


> Yes they do clean up the afterbirth and they also do kill the sick lambs...but they also kill plenty of healthy, strong lambs too. A sheep has no way of defending its newborn lamb against crows when there is usually a few of them attacking the lambs eyes and bum...they incapacitate the lamb them go in for the kill...Not nice to see or hear, and can be devastating to farmers.
> 
> They are absolute vermin, they also attack young native marsupials as well as reptiles. Not nice animals but very smart.




This is typical of many of the anti-raven posts. The thing I find interesting is that people are deadset against a native bird (shooting or poisoning them) because it attacks the young of an *introduced species*.

And Jen: how do you tell the difference between a raven and a crow? I know animal people in NSW who can't tell the difference between a raven and a chough.



HIx


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 2, 2007)

Very cute moose,Magpies are on the list of animals that can be kept in victoria but ravens dont get a mention.
The only licence i can find for a native raven is a licence for shooting native animals.
Handed out quite freely in south australia to.
Hix, you are right about anti raven posts. I equate it to the 'a good snake is dead snake" mentality 
espoused by people who are scared of them or just plain to lazy to properly research an animal before condemning them.
Ignorance still rules amoung the people and our elected politicians


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## cockney red (Nov 2, 2007)

*Ravens are more inteligent than some of the people who posted in this thread.*


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## Inkslinger (Nov 2, 2007)

Way to go Bazz they are on licence now I am waiting for mine to arrive. The person to speak to would be Matt Borg, or follow the magpie rearing diet.


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## Isis (Nov 2, 2007)

I said they are vermin but I did not say to kill them or to hurt them did I. Also Hix did you read my post properly....they also eat native reptiles ect....


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## Inkslinger (Nov 2, 2007)

moosenoose said:


> This is all very interesting reading Baz, as my kids have just brought home a young Magpie from the park
> 
> My first question was, where did it comes from (nest location), were the parents present, can it fly?? blah blah blah No to all questions. So damn it!! Here it is at home. Seems to be feeding and happy and we are trying to keep it warm and quiet. Will post a pic later also.
> 
> My success rate with birds is appalling, but I can't just leave it! It'll either be eaten by a cat or die with all the rain about. Doomed either way I reckon - so here I go again, hopefully I can have a win this time.



Food for an adult Magpie can include worms, lean mince or kangaroo meat, which can be purchased at pet shops. Crushed quality dog biscuits can be mixed with the meat. Wombaroo Insectivore Rearing mix or Vetafarm InsectaPro should also be mixed with the food, this can be purchased from most veterinary clinics. Do not attempt to feed the bird by hand, as this will stress it more, leave the food in the box and it will eat when it is ready.​ A baby bird can also be fed the same type of food, but be sure that meat is sliced very thinly, or minced. Hold the meat with a pair tweezers, dip into water and hold above the magpies head. It will beg for the food by stretching its head up high, lower the food into it's mouth. If the bird doesn't beg then don't force it to eat. Contact an experienced carer as soon as possible.

Courtesy of FOURTH CROSSING WILDLIFE
​


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## channi (Nov 2, 2007)

You can teach them to talk very well (better than parrots apparently) teach him to say ever more


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## Jackrabbit (Nov 2, 2007)

Did you know the British royal family have a flock of Raven in the tower of London?

the myth goes that they fear if they are let loose the tower will crumble and hence the Royal family will cease to exist.


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## bredli84 (Nov 2, 2007)

i am very disapointed with the close minded attitudes displayed by some of the people on this site. 

Good on ya, ssssnakeman.
Ravens are beautiful and highly inteligent animals, the only birds i would really like to keep.


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## Jozz (Nov 2, 2007)

Isis said:


> Yes they do clean up the afterbirth and they also do kill the sick lambs...but they also kill plenty of healthy, strong lambs too. A sheep has no way of defending its newborn lamb against crows when there is usually a few of them attacking the lambs eyes and bum...they incapacitate the lamb them go in for the kill...Not nice to see or hear, and can be devastating to farmers.
> 
> They are absolute vermin, they also attack young native marsupials as well as reptiles. Not nice animals but very smart.


 
Exactly. If you guys had seen what I saw them doing that morning to those lambs - I was traumitised by it. At the end of the day, if I found, or was given a baby crow, I would do what I could to give it a good life. I raised a SPARROW when I was younger! He was the best!!! So don't get up me  Like I said, I was just having a rant!


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## JasonL (Nov 2, 2007)

Isis said:


> I said they are vermin but I did not say to kill them or to hurt them did I. Also Hix did you read my post properly....they also eat native reptiles ect....



So do Kookaburras and all other predatory birds....so what if they eat reptiles, thats nature.


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## WombleHerp (Nov 2, 2007)

i want a raven 

i actually brought home a fledgling pee wee a few nights ago to care for a few days till it was ready to release.
i brought it home and put it in some towels in a 'pet pack'. anyways i fed it just before i went to bed, (bits of small cut up soft fruit) which i was recommended.. then i woke up early to give him another feed and the poor thing was dead  (i now think i should have stayed with my original idea of tiny bits of minced kanga or other meat with a bit of wombaroo mix on it...) they are insectivorous right? and fruit i think... anyways i feel sorry for the poor thing.. i think it actually died of stress, because of the car trip home. it was shaken and didnt look very happy when i got it home. next time ill be more prepared i guess. anyways thats my bird story! (not to hijack thread, but if there is anything i did wrong please tell me so i can learn from my mistakes..)


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## WombleHerp (Nov 2, 2007)

bump

ill make it a new thread if nobody wants to read this one.. i'd really like to start caring for birds so feedback please! thanks

xx Nat


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## SLACkra (Nov 2, 2007)

Maybe its just me, but just want to say in reality when you find an injured wild animal you should not take it in and care for it yourself. Calling up wires etc would be the best as they are far more experience in the matter so the animal would have a far greater chance of survival and eventual release back into the wild under their professional care. 

Moose how old was the chick? If it was able to move around and the parents were nearby probably would have been best to leave it. I know of a couple species of native bird whos fledglings spend a bit of time on the ground and short trees etc, I myself ocationally find small fledgling red wattle birds during the breeding season on the ground. When left to their own devices their parents feed them and they climb up into a tree and finish developing.

Andrew


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## Hickson (Nov 2, 2007)

ssssnakeman said:


> Hix, you are right about anti raven posts. I equate it to the 'a good snake is dead snake" mentality
> espoused by people who are scared of them or just plain to lazy to properly research an animal before condemning them.



I was equating the "lets kill them, they kill lambs" statement to the popular "lets kill crocs, they invade our beaches and rivers" cry of the Qld pollies.



Isis said:


> Also Hix did you read my post properly....they also eat native reptiles ect....


I did read your post, and ignored that statement as pointless. Native reptiles eat native reptiles too, as do a variety of other native birds and mammals, which Jason pointed out.



SLACkra said:


> If it was able to move around and the parents were nearby probably would have been best to leave it.



If the parents were around, I suspect Moose's kids would have holes in the back of their heads - maggies are vicious in the breeding season!

Also calling WIRES for anything common often means a veeeery long wait. I find it easier to take orphans straight to the local vet and leave it there - by law, they have to help any injured native wildlife, and they can't charge you for it. UNless you want to take it home and look after it yourself, in which case take your Amex Gold card.



Hix


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## Moreliaman (Nov 3, 2007)

Nice ssssnakeman, Wouldnt mind one myself.....I asked a few people i know that keep wild birds, some say they make good pets and some say the opposite. 
Try one or two of the links below, hope they help.

Raven info sheet

Raven info sheet 2

Raising corvids


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 3, 2007)

The people who found this bird rang wildline and they were given my number, among others because they know we have a shelter.
They told me that the bird was alone and no parents were in sight,only cats and dogs.
That is why its here,i want to see it go back to wild and that is what we are aiming for.
Its up to the raven if it hangs around after we perform the soft release, 
once it is old enough.Since it was found less than 1/2 a k from here, we may be able to try release into one of our trees in the backyerd.
This way we can monitor his progress and keep him comparativly safe.
That is so cool inkslinger that they can kept be on licence..I have looked for a link to this information and rung dse a few time with no result.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 3, 2007)

Thanks moreliaman, this is what i needed.


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## Inkslinger (Nov 3, 2007)

Keep the pics coming my girlfriends bonded so closely with her (she was the only one feeding and nurturing it ) she had to drive it off in the end as it would attck any family member that came with in 6ft of her!! Still comes to the hose on occasion to say hellow though


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 3, 2007)

I took him out the front for some fresh air when i got home from work,he loved that i think.
He attacked his reflection in the back window of the ute and in the puddle on the tarp.
Pretty soon we had adult ravens visiting to see the youngster.
He seemed to be a bit afraid of the large birds so we took him back inside.


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## Inkslinger (Nov 3, 2007)

He/she is beautiful love that awkward stage


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## Hickson (Nov 3, 2007)

Sorry Baz, but in that first photo, it looks like something out of a Pixar animated movie!!!



Hix


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 4, 2007)

heres a couple more pics
the visitor


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## Jozz (Nov 4, 2007)

Hix said:


> Sorry Baz, but in that first photo, it looks like something out of a Pixar animated movie!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Hix


 
Thats exactly what I thought!!! That is sooo cute


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## WombleHerp (Nov 4, 2007)

it is sooooo damn cute!!!!


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## nuthn2do (Nov 4, 2007)

ssssnakeman said:


> heres a couple more pics
> the visitor


Need to be careful there mate, before you know it you'll have no eyes and getting your bum hole eaten out


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## Jen (Nov 4, 2007)

Hix said:


> This is typical of many of the anti-raven posts. The thing I find interesting is that people are deadset against a native bird (shooting or poisoning them) because it attacks the young of an *introduced species*.
> 
> And Jen: how do you tell the difference between a raven and a crow? I know animal people in NSW who can't tell the difference between a raven and a chough.
> 
> ...



As far as i know, there are no ravens where i live, but there are crows aplenty, however if it is in the chicken run killing our chicks, then it dies. Sounds harsh, but there it is. A chough has several areas of white on its body, and the ones in our area are a very social bird, they are also smaller than the crows.


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## Jozz (Nov 4, 2007)

That first photo really is hilarious!


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## nuthn2do (Nov 4, 2007)

Jen said:


> As far as i know, there are no ravens where i live, but there are crows aplenty, however if it is in the chicken run killing our chicks,


You would also kill a snake or lacie doing the same then?


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## Matty007 (Nov 4, 2007)

Have not got time to read through all the posts but can you actually buy Ravens on lisence as a pet ??? Matty


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## Jen (Nov 4, 2007)

nuthn2do said:


> You would also kill a snake or lacie doing the same then?



please read my original post


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## Inkslinger (Nov 4, 2007)

Matty007 said:


> Have not got time to read through all the posts but can you actually buy Ravens on lisence as a pet ??? Matty



Here is the catch 22 they are only new on license in Vic but you have to buy a captive bred one so how does one do that if they have only just come on license?:shock:


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## nuthn2do (Nov 4, 2007)

Jen said:


> please read my original post


The poisoned egg one?


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## Jen (Nov 4, 2007)

nuthn2do said:


> The poisoned egg one?



Whoops, my bad, no the one where i say that we watch the enclosure to keep other animals away - not feasable all the time, but done if poisoned eggs are there, and, though i know i will probably cop it for saying this, this is the same as putting rat poison out, tho at least we are responsible about it


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## Matty007 (Nov 4, 2007)

Thats how ya get the ball rolling INK . its all a big joke , permits for this and fees for that. They dont give a rats **** about the animals , it just keeps people employed and helps the economy. Me thinks anyway :x Matt


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 4, 2007)

In Victoria, as part of the carers contract, we are obligated to either release the native animal,roo, raven or koala or whatever.
If this cant be done for some reason we then have to euthanise the animal. Its the law people.

In South Australia the laws are the other way around, in that you must keep the animal or euthanise it...In s.a release is illegal..
.I like s.a laws better on this issue because many animals that are healthy get put down in victoria simply for the sake of the red tape.


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## Matty007 (Nov 4, 2007)

Its off its head :evil: We say its Black and they'll say its white. Its not Grey , its all about useing ya head. " They " cant seem to do that. Not promoting it but no wonder people do the wrong thing. Matt


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## Hickson (Nov 5, 2007)

Jen said:


> As far as i know, there are no ravens where i live, but there are crows aplenty,



Betcha their all ravens.



Hix


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## nuthn2do (Nov 5, 2007)

Here's a csiro study on ravens, crows and lambs. 
http://www.tiny.cc/dqdRN


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 6, 2007)

Thats a great link, thanks for that.
Heres a couple more pics of Tookie.The release is going to be happiest and the saddest time i think, but im looking forward to seeing him fly with his own kind.


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## cris (Nov 6, 2007)

Nice, are you teaching it to steal money Baz? :lol:


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## Naxx (Nov 6, 2007)

we have ravens in australia? i havent seen a single one around, i know there are heaps of crows (which are NOT ravens) ravens are bigger and way smarter and cooler. We have heaps of them in canada, crows fly south for the winters, ravens tough it out. They are an awsome bird, u can teach them to talk too if u get their tongue split up the middle like a snake for some reason.


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## Hickson (Nov 6, 2007)

Adelaide has two species of ravens and one species of crow.



Hix


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## ozianimals (Nov 6, 2007)

Jen said:


> Ravens are native? I did not know that. we put out poisoned eggs in our empty nest boxes, the only animals that go for them are crows, which are a massive pest. Tookie is a honey, good luck


These are also native birds and should not be killed.


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## ozianimals (Nov 6, 2007)

ssssnakeman said:


> In Victoria, as part of the carers contract, we are obligated to either release the native animal,roo, raven or koala or whatever.
> If this cant be done for some reason we then have to euthanise the animal. Its the law people.
> 
> In South Australia the laws are the other way around, in that you must keep the animal or euthanise it...In s.a release is illegal..
> .I like s.a laws better on this issue because many animals that are healthy get put down in victoria simply for the sake of the red tape.


The laws are the same here in NSW. The registered carers need to release the animals or euthanise the animals. Unless they are registered through NSW NPWS as an educational animal and the organisation can only have a certain amount of educational animals on their permit, so a lot of healthy unreleasable animals die after a carer has spent a lot of time caring and nursing it back to health.................:evil:


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## Kenshin (Nov 7, 2007)

iv imprinted(hand reared) both crows and ravens and they in my opinion are pretty good pets fed them on a variety of meats when they first come to you smash them with kangaroo meat nothing pics conditon up in predatory birds faster (raptors inculded)


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## nuthn2do (Nov 7, 2007)

Kenshin said:


> iv imprinted(hand reared) both crows and ravens and they in my opinion are pretty good pets fed them on a variety of meats when they first come to you smash them with kangaroo meat nothing pics conditon up in predatory birds faster (raptors inculded)


Roo is very lean for raptors and carnivores, cheap fatty beef mince and supplement is better.


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## waruikazi (Nov 7, 2007)

I've just started using roo mince mixed with insectivore mix for tawny's and kookaburras, I think it should go pretty well. Will let you all know.


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## falcon69 (Nov 7, 2007)

hey guys..always read whats in the roo mince especially if its from the supermarket..brands like vip etc and make it doesnt have too much preservites in it..im pretty sure its sulphite that does the damage..it depeltes the animals body in vitamins and makes them anemic and can cause death..so always watch that and add vitmins..


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## moosenoose (Nov 7, 2007)

I ended up contacting Healsville Sanctuary this morning who in turn put me in touch with a local native bird carer. I had to go away with the young magpie on holidays over the weekend and figured if I could have gotten it older etc I'd have some dramas on my hands with trying to organise the time to care for it - then even if it got to a good age and able for release I've got no idea about imprinting etc etc and the bird would be taken out by a cat or perhaps killed by other birds. I'm gonna miss the little thing, they are very cute, but I'm glad it's been cared for someone who really knows what they are doing.

Surely I've had my first win with a damned bird!! :lol: They always die on me usually, but I'm stoked this one looked stronger and happier than when my kids first found it


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## Hickson (Nov 8, 2007)

moosenoose said:


> I ended up contacting Healsville Sanctuary this morning who in turn put me in touch with a local native bird carer. I had to go away with the young magpie on holidays over the weekend and figured if I could have gotten it older etc I'd have some dramas on my hands with trying to organise the time to care for it



You can't fool us Moose - you palmed it off because you got sick of the meaty smell of it pooping all the time!



Hix


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## Pandora (Nov 8, 2007)

Baz, 

Try these numbers:

Victoria Help for Wildlife 0417 380 687 

Victoria Wildlife Victoria 03 9663 9311 

Healesville Healesville Sanctuary 03 5957 2800


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 8, 2007)

Thanks pandora, i spoke to healsville on the 1st day,
wildlife victoria actually sent the raven to me as they have me on the books as a carer.
I have all the info i need for now though.
Thanks to all who replied.
Baz


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 23, 2007)

Some more pics, cant wait to release this guy..I have introduced him to our local mob of ravens and they seem to be getting to like him.
Tookie trying to fly






Meeting the locals




A local raven




Getting his big feathers


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## moosenoose (Nov 23, 2007)

That is excellent Bazz, good on ya - the birdie is looking great


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## Whisper2 (Nov 23, 2007)

awwww he is so cute! you have done well with him, hope the release works and he is greatful!


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## Inkslinger (Nov 23, 2007)

Way to go Bazz looking good


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## Inkslinger (Nov 23, 2007)

nuthn2do said:


> Roo is very lean for raptors and carnivores, cheap fatty beef mince and supplement is better.



This is so wrong!! they need protein not fat observe them at a road kill they eat the offal first then the meat not the fat!!!


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## nuthn2do (Nov 23, 2007)

This is not road kill it's replacement feeding. Kangaroo meat alone is less than 2% fat, standard beef mince is around the 7-10% mark. Normal prey for a raptor/carnivore is around 18% fat. 
Its not Jenny Craig, animals actually need this to survive.


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## Inkslinger (Nov 23, 2007)

nuthn2do said:


> This is not road kill it's replacement feeding. Kangaroo meat alone is less than 2% fat, standard beef mince is around the 7-10% mark. Normal prey for a raptor/carnivore is around 18% fat.
> Its not Jenny Craig, animals actually need this to survive.



Didnt say it was Jenny craig how many Raptors birds of prey have you raised and released personally?
Myself I have reared and raised and cared for Hawks, Ravens, Crows, Magpies, Frogmouths and owls, far from having a go at you my only interest is in the welfare of the animals concerned, not the well meaning if often wrong attempts by animal lovers to help often with no sound experience and more than likely only equipped with out of date second hand information that leads to heart break on their part and an unnecessary death on the animals.

I never said that you feed kanagroo meat alone either! http://www.abc.net.au/wa/stories/s1736797.htm
http://www.epa.qld.gov.au/nature_co...life/carers_kit/birds/raising_juvenile_birds/

http://users.zipworld.com.au/~hardpars/faqs.htm
http://www.fourthcrossingwildlife.com/short_term_care_magpies.htm

all interesting and informative reads


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## xycom (Nov 23, 2007)

Baz

He seems to be doing just fine but if you have any questions give Donna (PM sent with number) a call out at Greendale she knows just about everything when it comes to caring for animals. Donna runs the shelter that i'm a carer for.

How would you suggest catching a Raven, I've got one that needs to be caught and taken to a vet. It's got some serious deformaties which need looking at.


Per


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Nov 24, 2007)

If its deformed the vet will put it down.
I cant imagine a normal healthy raven would be very easy to catch but a sick one might take a bait.
Catch it with your standard sherman style trap or box, stick and string bird trap and dispatch it yourself if you dont mind doing it and are confident you can do it quickly.
Or just take it to the vet for a shot.


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## spoonman (Nov 24, 2007)

SLACkra said:


> hey baz, the one way i know how to sex birds when there is not obvious difference in appearance between the sexes to feel around their bum. If the two bones are far apart its a girl, close together its a boy as the females require the extra space so they can lay eggs. Ravens are fantastic animals, I fondly remember watching the bird show at Toronga Zoo and they brought out a raven. It's treat was tied to one end of a length of string and the other to a branch and it was dangling. The raven using its feet and beak pulled the string up and got to its treat. apparently self taught as well. They have also been known to use traffic to crack hard nuts, they drop the nuts on the pedestrian crossings at intersections, wait till the nut gets cracked and then retrieve it when the crossing light is green.
> 
> good luck with tookie, he/she is in good hands,
> 
> Andrew



smart little buggers. how often do you see them on the side of the rd?


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## nuthn2do (Nov 24, 2007)

Inkslinger said:


> Didnt say it was Jenny craig how many Raptors birds of prey have you raised and released personally?
> Myself I have reared and raised and cared for Hawks, Ravens, Crows, Magpies, Frogmouths and owls, far from having a go at you my only interest is in the welfare of the animals


I've raised rehabbed many tawnys, magpies, currawongs, ravens, nightjars, butcher birds, goshawks, boobooks, barn owls, kites, peregrines, nankeens, little eagles and wedge tails. I even have a wedgie pre release aviary about 2k from my homestead, released 3 from there in the last 12 months. So i do have a bit of experience with these animals, simple fact i stated is roo alone is too lean for a captive diet for carnivore/raptor and contains no were near the average dietary intake of a wild bird


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Jan 6, 2008)

Took some video of tookie today.
http://s17.photobucket.com/albums/b55/ssssnakeman/so raven/?action=view&current=MOV00001.flv
It is free to come and go as it pleases during the day but at night it comes back to its cage which keeps it safe from the local cats.
Soon, hopefully, it will join the local ravens which have become quite accepting of him.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Jan 22, 2008)

Some recent pics of the raven that was bought to us..

Hopefully going to join the local crew of ravens that live in the pine trees behind our house.
I doubt it though as they seem like a tightly knit communinity and i think tookie will need to spend time with the larger flocks of birds that are more his own age.


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## Mark Newton (Jan 22, 2008)

Good luck with it....I'm not quite sure how anyone can hate any animal, just doesnt make sense to me. Although I must admit there are some humans that I hate....but non-Homo species...definitely not!

Ravens are incredibly intelligent animals, should make a very entertaining family inclusion.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Apr 28, 2008)

http://s17.photobucket.com/albums/b55/ssssnakeman/Movies/?action=view&current=MOV00019.flv
Some footage taken last month ...He just hangs around the house most of the time now


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## CassM (Sep 2, 2008)

Awww Baz, Tookie is beautiful!!


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Sep 2, 2008)

Tookie is still with us, this morning i heard a fight and went outside and tookie was getting beaten up by one of the older local ravens.
Hes ok but i worry about him now and i hope he will get along with the others one day.






























Tookies dog face, the face he makes when there is a dog around




Cheers


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## Dipcdame (Sep 2, 2008)

that is SOOOO cute!!!!!! You know, there's a legend. The Tower of London is host to a flock of ravens, has been for hundreds of years........it is said that if ever the ravens leave the tower, then England will fall. Tehy live free, are not caged, yet they do stay!!!!!!


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