# What snake is this?



## Ja9_G (Jun 9, 2013)

My niece found this snake on her property in Malanda QLD. Is it a keelback?


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## Venomous_RBB (Jun 9, 2013)

Looks like a Rough Scaled snake, but I cannot tell the difference very well between the Keelback and Rough Scale.
It is certainly a very nice looking snake, I can tell you that much.


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## SouthSydney (Jun 9, 2013)

Its neither a keelback or a Roughie...


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## Trimeresurus (Jun 9, 2013)

Doesn't have the keelback 'smile'

That being said the snake looks in bad condition and may be neither a keelback or rough scaled, I'm not up to scratch enough on my IDs to say for sure, but I suspect it's something else.


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## Bluetongue1 (Jun 10, 2013)

*Shambulah,
*Why say it is not this or not that if you do not provide your reasons? It certainly does not help people to determine if you know what you are talking about. My attitude is if you are unable to give a reason then you probably don’t know. If you are simply unwilling to give your reasons then don’t post, as it a requirement of this forum.


My first impression when I saw the photo was that the snake was dead. I have had a better look at it now and see nothing to change my mind. It looks to me to have been exposed to intense heat and partially cooked, to the point where the scales are starting to lift off the fleshy parts and buckling on top of the skull. But I may be wrong...

It is not a Keelback as it lacks a loreal scale and the jaw line is straight (no ‘smile’ as mentioned by *Triimeresurus*). The arrangement of the scales on the side of the head are consistent with a Rough-scaled Snake and I think heat affected the heads sheilds over the cranium, because they appear a real mess. From what I can see and given a specimen with body scales appearing like that naturally would have to come from overseas and there would still be some unexplained differences, I reckon you have a somewhat mangled Rough-scaled Snake. 

A ventral shot may well have helped.

Blue


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## Ja9_G (Jun 10, 2013)

Thanks  The snake is alive and apparently looks a bit smoother now (its in the grass)...so may have shed??


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## Bluetongue1 (Jun 10, 2013)

Thanks for that. It helps to know I got it wrong. I did consider the possibility of pre-slough but there appeared to be scale damage and lifting of individual scales, which is why I dissmissed that possibility. Either way, it far from normal looking. If your niece could send a photo now, that would be great. 

Sorry I could not be more help.
Blue


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## Bushman (Jun 10, 2013)

It's an elapid in very poor condition.


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## baker (Jun 11, 2013)

I don't personally think that this is a rough scaled snake blue. The head shape is not consistent with a rough scaled snake as well as there is no tapering to a neck that is seen with rough scaled snakes. Also the scales that are running along the jaw seem to pronounced and not consistent with a rough scale to me. 
Personally I see this as a very crappy looking _Pseudonaja textilis. _The head scales, shape as well as how the neck is not tapering towards the head are a lot more consistent with an Eastern brown. Also the body scales are a closer match and from counting the scales that I can make out (only going very loosely off this as they are very dodgy counts). This is only what I could ID from it and could very much be wrong but this is what I think.
Cheers Cameron


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## cathy1986 (Jun 11, 2013)

Ja9_G said:


> Thanks  The snake is alive and apparently looks a bit smoother now (its in the grass)...so may have shed??



Looks like a dry shed where the old skin is just about to come off but dries up and gets stuck if not given moisture it becomes a cocoon and is hard to come off 

Sent from my GT-N8020 using Tapatalk HD


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## RedFox (Jun 11, 2013)

I actually logged on to my computer to get a better look. I believe it appears to be an eastern brown, not a rough scaled. The head is fairly indistinct from the neck area whereas rough scaled snakes have large heads with a distinct neck area as do keelbacks. 

The snake in the picture appears to have a difinite "eyebrow ridge" something roughies do not have. 

With Malanda being mostly agricultural land it is perfect for EB although judging by the condition of this snake it might not agree.


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## moosenoose (Jun 11, 2013)

Looks like a bad attempt at Taxidermy. Is it even alive?


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## brown.snake (Jun 11, 2013)

A pseudonaja textilis it looks like it's been caught in a grass fire


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## CamdeJong (Jun 11, 2013)

I agree baker P. textilis. Don't see any resemblance to Tropidechis in either head or body shape.


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## CamdeJong (Jun 11, 2013)

Also a close look allows an estimate of midbody scales, to me looks like less than 10 from lower flank to spine. P. textilis is 17, T. carinatus is...23?


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## SouthSydney (Jun 11, 2013)

It was obviously P.textilis and not a keelback or Roughie. But nice try anyway Bluetongue1.


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## Dendrobates (Jun 11, 2013)

Shambulah said:


> It was obviously P.textilis and not a keelback or Roughie. But nice try anyway Bluetongue1.



But you haven't given a reason as to why it is a textilis and not a roughie making your educated guess void. 
Just because someone gives a long-winded post making it look like they are right doesn't actually mean that they are right.

It's a very obvious _Pseudonaja textilis... _and because we have to say why... firstly it doesn't look the slightest bit like a Rough-scaled Snake, and secondly I have no idea.. it just looks exactly like an Eastern Brown to anyone that has anything to do with them.


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## Bluetongue1 (Jun 12, 2013)

This is an excellent example of why it is important to provide reasons for a decision. This allows others to consider the validity of the decision made and comment accordingly. It also allows those wishing to learn about reptile ID to learn the basis for making IDs. 

Upon reappraisal I have to agree it is most likely an Eastern Brown, for the reasons given. I was fixated on it possessing keels yet could not work out why they were so abnormal. I put it down to being burnt. A good example of tunnel vision and its shortcomings.

Good on those that have contributed constructively.

NB: The original comment has been edited - after the first paragraph has been rewritten to provide a positive and more appropriate post.

Blue


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## RedFox (Jun 12, 2013)

I prefer when people give reasons for IDs. I'm pretty shocking at identifying reptiles (eastern brown being one of the few I can, as I have seen quite a few of those around) but am trying to learn. I've found some field guides are helpful but this thread as well as a few herping trips show how varied each species can be.


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