# Cane toad scientific name?



## Renenet (Dec 25, 2011)

Hi, 

I've been learning about the cane toad in the last few days, seeing as they've just started popping out of their hidey holes for the wet season and I'm getting a few big ones on my deck on on the lawn.

What is the current scientific name for the cane toad? I've been going on Bufo marinus, but I quote the following from the Shine Lab's site: 

"A careful reader will notice something very peculiar about the scientific name of the cane toad, as used in our papers - sometimes we call the toads _Bufo marinus_, and sometimes _Chaunus marinus_. Why did this happen? Every species has a latin name that gives its genus and species, because common names are often ambiguous. The latin name is supposed to be better because it doesn't change in different places or at different times...but things don't always work out so neatly! Cane toads have been called "_Bufo marinus_" for a long time, and that's what we called them in our early papers. But recently some American workers suggested that the toads really belonged in a different genus (_Chaunus_), based on molecular evidence (DNA sequences). It sounded very convincing, so we started calling the toads _Chaunus marinus_ (and so did a lot of other people). But then another molecular-biology group questioned the first group's conclusions, and suggested yet another name (_Rhinella marinus_), so the changing name of the cane toad is due to our increasing understanding of its evolutionary relationships."

Shine Lab - Shine Lab - The University of Sydney

Can anyone clarify what the current accepted name is? 

Thanks,
Renenet


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## Retic (Dec 25, 2011)

It really is extremely hard to keep on top of taxonomy to be honest, I will continue to refer to them as B.marinus.


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## Snake Catcher Victoria (Dec 25, 2011)

Im like a dinosaur when it comes to taxonomical latin names, 
I must catch up one day, but our cane toads will always be bufo to me i think.


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## eipper (Dec 25, 2011)

The current name is Rhinella marina


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## dihsmaj (Dec 25, 2011)

It is a member of the subgenus _Rhinella_ of the genus Bufo


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## Retic (Dec 25, 2011)

I let all these changes wash over me to be honest. The Reticulated Python will always be Python reticulatus and the same with most others.


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## SammySnakes (Dec 25, 2011)

A paper published only a few days back found that Rhinella marina is nested within the genus Incillus so the genus may change again.

Saying that, I think I'll continue referring to them as Bufo's, the same way I still call a Morelia viridis a chondro.


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## Leasdraco (Dec 25, 2011)

We know them as honourary golf balls...


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## Renenet (Dec 25, 2011)

Haha, Leasdraco. As funny as it is to think about whacking them with a nine iron or taking them out with a shotgun, I can't bring myself to be nasty to them. I do wish I had something bigger than a bar fridge, however, because I'd be euthanasing toads if I did.



SammySnakes said:


> A paper published only a few days back found that Rhinella marina is nested within the genus Incillus so the genus may change again.



Damn that. On the grounds that the landscape keeps shifting, I'm going to continue to call them Bufo marinus until there's some certainty.


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## GeckPhotographer (Dec 25, 2011)

Currently they are _Rhinella marina_ as has been indicated. (The marinus/marina changes based on the gender of the generic name). 

Of course they could change again and I am often happy to call things by old names untill there is certainty in the new ones.


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## eipper (Dec 29, 2011)

Rhinella is pretty well accepted at the moment

As for the paper re Incilius.....the conclusion excluded them from Incilius.

Cheers,
Scott


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## Fantazmic (Dec 29, 2011)

HI Renenet

Are they as awful as I think they probably would be.......im from Melbourne/sydney and I actually dont think Ive ever seen one in the flesh.......I tell myself I'd prolly dislike them like rats and mice (I have no problems feeding frozen ones to my snakes). Or are they sort of cute and endearing and you start thinking about how it isnt their fault they are here......or are you thinking about huane euthanasia...........

Elizabeth


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## Renenet (Dec 29, 2011)

Elizabeth, 

Definitely humane euthanasia. It isn't their fault they are here, but that doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy about them. I've read too many stories of native animals being fatally poisoned from eating them. It doesn't help that they're horribly ugly.

At night, even if there's only a hint of rain in the air, I get at least three or four sitting out on the lawn. They sometimes come up on the deck and when I chase them off, they only lope away, completely unhurried.

I understand the most humane way to euthanase them is to put them in the fridge until their metabolism slows right down, then transfer to the freezer. The toads around here are lucky I only have a bar fridge.


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## waruikazi (Dec 29, 2011)

Renenet i recon you will find a golf club an awfully humane way of euthing them. Possibly even more so than a drawn out period in the fridge/freezer! My preferred method is to throw them as high as i can in the air. I've never had one suvive after hitting the ground... Or running them over is always fun. If you hit them at the right angle they make a cracking sound like a .22.


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## Renenet (Dec 29, 2011)

waruikazi said:


> Renenet i recon you will find a golf club an awfully humane way of euthing them. Possibly even more so than a drawn out period in the fridge/freezer! My preferred method is to throw them as high as i can in the air. I've never had one suvive after hitting the ground... Or running them over is always fun. If you hit them at the right angle they make a cracking sound like a .22.



Not the way I "hit" golf balls. And my throwing arm is like string.  The neighbours around here certainly do their part to run over the toads - I've seen quite a few flat toads on the road. In leaving them there, though, would you run the risk of scavengers poisoning themselves on the corpses? 

Could you gas the toads with CO2 like we herp keepers do with rodents?


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## waruikazi (Dec 29, 2011)

The only things i've seen eat road kill toads are camp dogs, and i'm not too uspet that they do it to be honest. I suppose you could gas them but it would take a long time compared to mammals. Easiest method by far would be spraying them with detol, they die very quickly that way. Don't think that is sanctioned by the RSPCA though.



Renenet said:


> Not the way I "hit" golf balls. And my throwing arm is like string.  The neighbours around here certainly do their part to run over the toads - I've seen quite a few flat toads on the road. In leaving them there, though, would you run the risk of scavengers poisoning themselves on the corpses?
> 
> Could you gas the toads with CO2 like we herp keepers do with rodents?


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## grimbeny (Dec 29, 2011)

Is it really necessary to kill them?


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## Renenet (Dec 29, 2011)

waruikazi said:


> Easiest method by far would be spraying them with detol, they die very quickly that way. Don't think that is sanctioned by the RSPCA though.



Sounds nasty. There are no good ways to die, I suppose. The fridge still sounds like the better option to me. Maybe that's only because it sounds better and requires the least amount of mess. Probably the best way to kill a lot of toads and cause the least amount of suffering is to find the spawn and destroy it before there are tadpoles. (Is it tadpole for toads?)



grimbeny said:


> Is it really necessary to kill them?



In my opinion, yes, because they have been so detrimental to the Australian ecosystem. I've got nothing against them in their home territory. Presumably there they have natural predators that keep them in check. Here it's a different story. Some animals can tolerate the poison, but not enough of them. Cane toads are too successful as a result.

Ideally you'd have a targeted way to wipe out a lot of them at once, or at least in a short period of time. The CSIRO was looking at modifying a virus to specifically target the toads, but seems to have deemed it unviable for the time being. (CSIRO cane toad research) Assuming such a virus could be engineered, a thorough risk assessment would have to be carried out before it was released to make sure the cure wouldn't be worse than the disease. Not that it would be a complete cure because I don't think we'd ever get rid of them all.

What we have left is the efforts of individuals and toad-busting groups. For some the question then becomes: is it worth killing them? One female toad lays 20 to 30 thousand eggs. Surely it's fruitless? For the Kimberley Toad Busters at least, I think the aim is to keep numbers low until scientists come up with a biological solution. Even though their enthusiasm can't be denied, and the numbers they've "busted are impressive, I don't know if there's anything to suggest they've been successful in that goal.

The Kimberley Toad Busters use CO2 to euthanase large numbers of toads at once.

For some more information about "controlling" cane toads, see (Debunking Cane Toad Control Myths).


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