# Olive python feeding question.



## Primo (Oct 29, 2014)

I have not been able to find much info on this subject but I read the Mark O'shea book BOAS AND PYTHONS OF THE WORLD 

In the book he mentions the scrub python having a potential predator, and that predator was said to be the Olive Python. I don't think I have seen much other info on the subject of olive pythons regularly eating other snakes, but maybe you guys know since you are closer to them than us staties. He also mentioned the same behavior was exhibited by the Papuan Olive though I know it is a different species.

Is there any truth that olives will take on scrubs for a meal? Just how big a role do other snakes play in the diet of olive pythons if any?

Thanks for any info.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 29, 2014)

I've Seen a photo of a captive olive eating a captive bredli, both my olive pythons show a lot of interest in the scent of my other pythons and a wild olive I handled in the NT regurgitated a northern blue-tongue lizard.

Id say in certain areas reptiles make up a decent portion of an olives diet.


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## Primo (Oct 29, 2014)

Very interesting info, and I'd say that would make these snakes the "king" of snakes in most instances sans the king cobra which specializes in eating other snakes.

I have seen the photo set of an olive taking a croc, but have yet to see one feeding on another large python.

Thanks for posting up, as i've always wondered about this.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 29, 2014)

We actually have quite a few snake eating snakes , woma's, bhp's, and mulga's to name a few. Some even cannibalise.


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## Planky (Oct 29, 2014)

Not my picture but this was posted on this forum a while ago 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Primo (Oct 29, 2014)

Great photo, and I've seen this one too. Is that a carpet on the wrong end of things there?

Would you guys say in general, the olives are thicker than the scrubs, sort of in the like of the anaconda being thicker and heavier than the reticulated python, but not as long?

I know in the above mentioned book, a rough scaled python was rescued from an olive.

You Aussies have the toughest snakes on the planet IMO.

Is there anybody here that has compared the Papuan Olives with the Australian Olives, similarities differences? 

I think if these guys were semi arboreal they'd be my favorite snake hands down.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 29, 2014)

Primo said:


> Great photo, and I've seen this one too. Is that a carpet on the wrong end of things there?
> 
> *Think its a scrub and a water python*
> 
> ...



*There partially arboreal they can be found high up in gorges so the term would be saxicoline.*


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## Primo (Oct 29, 2014)

I'm glad I asked these questions here. You've been quite helpful!

Thank you.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 29, 2014)

Primo said:


> I'm glad I asked these questions here. You've been quite helpful!
> 
> Thank you.



anytime mate , a lot of valuable information on this forum , cheers


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## Planky (Oct 29, 2014)

Correct I remember it being a scrub and water python


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 29, 2014)

On another note it was thought that bhp's and woma's had evolved anti-venom like properties in there blood to prevent them dying from bites when engaging venomous snakes, a recent photo of a woma being consumed by a mulga snake disputes this claim. I'm pretty sure the mulga is immune to other venomous snakes but may be wrong.


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## Primo (Oct 29, 2014)

Dr-Zoidberg said:


> On another note it was thought that bhp's and woma's had evolved anti-venom like properties in there blood to prevent them dying from bites when engaging venomous snakes, a recent photo of a woma being consumed by a mulga snake disputes this claim. I'm pretty sure the mulga is immune to other venomous snakes but may be wrong.




I'm not at all familiar with this species. Not to get off topic, but I'd like to hear more. Here in the States or largest "snake eater" is the Eastern King snake. There is another formidable snake eater from South America called the Mussurana Clelia Clelia and this snake packs a punch with a mild venom but it is also a constrictor.

I'd like to hear more about the mulga.

I believe our Eastern Kings reach 7 feet or 82cm?? The Mussurana is pretty large and thick as well.

Still,,,, If the Olives take Srubbies, they are pretty damn impressive in my opinion.

At one point after reading the O'shea book, I was convinced Olive pythons were the top dog in the snake world.

Obviously immunities to venom probably only apply to species specific predation but I'd be curious if a very, very hungry olive would be a match for a king cobra. Reticulated pythons usually don't do well against those cobras, but they are also not know for eating other snakes.

Keep the banter coming, I'm somewhat shocked that scrubs, olives and womas aren't really recognized often here. Although I'm rather proud to have a coastal X mutt in my collection. We have carpets here, but other Aussie pythons are not as prevalent. 

You guys have all the cool stuff. But I know you'd love boa constrictors. The big Peruvian females can go 11 feet and 80 pounds. 

Even still I see my carpet is faster and more active than my boa.


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## Planky (Oct 29, 2014)

You always want what u can't have


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 29, 2014)

The mulga snake often incorrectly called "the king brown snake" (it's actually related to black snakes eg, red bellied black) is our second biggest venomous snake at 3.3 metres long. It pretty much only eats reptiles and frogs but is known to consume mammals, birds and eggs. The larger individuals are getting scarce these days thanks to the old cane toad. It's immune to venom of other mulga's aswell as the western brown snake, and possibly more. I spent a fair amount of time last year searching for large mulga's without success .

to be honest I have no interest in keeping over seas species, although I'm intregued by a few. 

Olives have always been a favourite of mine there's just something about them,
im looking into obtaining the pilbara sub-species, they are one impressive snake reaching 6.5 metres in length.

its unfortunate that you can't keep many of our species, and that the ones you's have left are out bred with other sub-species.


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## arevenant (Oct 29, 2014)

There is a very small area of cross population(north western part of FNQ) So whilst not impossible I"d say its an extreme rarity.
More chance of a Water Python going a scrubbie considering it's diet and distribution. (As above)


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 29, 2014)

arevenant said:


> There is a very small area of cross population(north western part of FNQ) So whilst not impossible I"d say its an extreme rarity.
> More chance of a Water Python going a scrubbie considering it's diet and distribution. (As above)



I guess it comes down to the population densities of each species, it may only be a thousand or so sqaure kms that there distribution overlaps but if they encounter each other regularly I'd say it'd be a lot less rare, with the scrub preferring mamals and birds, the olive's would either compete directly for such prey or consume more reptiles.


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## Primo (Oct 29, 2014)

Again, excellent info! I'm pretty sure we can get Olives here, but I'm not sure of the lines/purity. 

I didn't realize the mulga was a hot. That would be your king cobra equivalent there I'd venture to guess.

Damn that cane toad! Is there anything that stops it?

I believe a I saw a program that dealt with eradicating them, and there was some success with keeping the juveniles down, but I can't remember what or how it was being done.

I think a 6.5M olive would be a sight to behold, wow!


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 29, 2014)

Primo said:


> Again, excellent info! I'm pretty sure we can get Olives here, but I'm not sure of the lines/purity.
> 
> I didn't realize the mulga was a hot. That would be your king cobra equivalent there I'd venture to guess.
> 
> ...


my thoughts exactly!


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## Primo (Oct 29, 2014)

My memory is a bit fuzzy, but I think the program had mentioned most strategies were failing but this was showing promise. http://www.smh.com.au/environment/c...ds-own-toxin-against-them-20120613-209pf.html

I wish I could remember the program, I thought maybe NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC, but I'm not really certain.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 30, 2014)

Primo said:


> My memory is a bit fuzzy, but I think the program had mentioned most strategies were failing but this was showing promise. http://www.smh.com.au/environment/c...ds-own-toxin-against-them-20120613-209pf.html
> 
> I wish I could remember the program, I thought maybe NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC, but I'm not really certain.



Interesting read, theirs another study being conducted in Western Australia, where they're exposing wild goannas to toads to turn them off the taste so they don't see them as a prey item. 

http://www.sciencewa.net.au/topics/...y-goannas-trained-in-cane-toad-taste-aversion

the story also mentions olive pythons eating the goannas they're studying.


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## GBWhite (Oct 30, 2014)

Hi,

There are those species as mentioned - Mulgas and Cobras etc; that are specialist snake feeders but I think you'll find that as a rule most species of snakes (including pythons) are opportunistic feeders and wouldn't hesitate to eat anything they consider viable and of a suitable size.

I remember a few years back when a group from SA University in conjunction with Steve Irwins, Australia Zoo released some Womas in an area in an attempt to repopulate and they were all eaten by Mulgas within a couple of weeks.

It doesn't surprise me one bit that monitors used in the Cane Toad study in WA became snake snacks. I've attached a couple of pics that have been around for a while of a Blackheaded knocking down a good sized Panoptes.


http://s251.photobucket.com/user/mandrakis/media/pic14989.jpg.html?sort=3&o=8

http://s251.photobucket.com/user/mandrakis/media/pic09503.jpg.html?sort=3&o=9

http://s251.photobucket.com/user/mandrakis/media/pic28009.jpg.html?sort=3&o=12

George.

ps; The photo in the earlier post depicts a Water Python overpowering a juvenile Scrubby.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 30, 2014)

GBWhite said:


> Hi,
> 
> There are those species as mentioned - Mulgas and Cobras etc; that are specialist snake feeders but I think you'll find that as a rule most species of snakes (including pythons) are opportunistic feeders and wouldn't hesitate to eat anything they consider viable and of a suitable size.
> 
> ...


 
I agree 100% that snakes are opportunistic predators, my brother conducted a study with some colleagues on flat back turtles on peak island, they found a spotted python with what they believed to be a hatchling flat back turtle inside it's stomach. Also during a wind storm a paper plate holding there chicken thigh dinners fell on the ground and a piece was taken and eaten by another spotted python. I want to conduct my own study on whether or not wild snakes will scavenge when the opportunity arrives.


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## Primo (Oct 30, 2014)

Dr-Zoidberg said:


> I agree 100% that snakes are opportunistic predators, my brother conducted a study with some colleagues on flat back turtles on peak island, they found a spotted python with what they believed to be a hatchling flat back turtle inside it's stomach. Also during a wind storm a paper plate holding there chicken thigh dinners fell on the ground and a piece was taken and eaten by another spotted python. I want to conduct my own study on whether or not wild snakes will scavenge when the opportunity arrives.



I know some people here have fed their boa constrictors chicken parts, and I recall there have been reports of carrion being eaten though not regularly.


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## GBWhite (Oct 30, 2014)

I know of a few people over here that feed their pythons chicken parts when rodents are a bit hard to come by. I've got a mate with some absolutely huge NT Mulgas that he feeds chicken parts and sausages when he can't get rats.

Also heard about Keelbacks and Bed Belly Black Snakes scrapping dead Cane Toads off the road and eating them. The Keelbacks were actually doing this while live toads and native frogs were hopping about.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 30, 2014)

It's stories such as those that sparked my interest, there is virtually nothing written about the subject in any texts I've read .


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## GBWhite (Oct 30, 2014)

There is either a paper or an article about the Keelbacks, not sure which but remember reading it a couple of years back. Think I read something about RRB's eating both live and dead toads but can't remember where or when I read it.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Oct 31, 2014)

GBWhite said:


> There is either a paper or an article about the Keelbacks, not sure which but remember reading it a couple of years back. Think I read something about RRB's eating both live and dead toads but can't remember where or when I read it.



There's a trial being conducted in Guam, where they're air dropping baited mice over the jungles in an attempt to slow down the damage brown tree snakes are causing to the native wildlife. The baited mice are attached to a makeshift "parachute" that's designed to become entangled high in the canopy to ensure they're only consumed by the brown tree snake and not the many monitor lizards that reside there. I'm sure many monitors (mainly juveniles) will become collateral damage.

there's also a paper on cotton mouths taking carrion (even skellital remains of fish) in Florida I think it was.


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## Joshm (Nov 1, 2014)

Very interesting info guys!

Primo, I do believe the eastern indigo would be the largest down there when it comes to snake eaters.


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## GBWhite (Nov 1, 2014)

Sorry if we're going a bit off topic Primo but seeing as how there's been the post about Brown Trees on Guam, rather than start a new thread I thought I'd whack this up here for anyone that may be interested. I found it on the net when I was reading about the control method using laced mice.

http://www.invasivespeciesinfo.gov/animals/bts.shtml

It'll be interesting to see what effect the control method using the mice laced with Tylenol will have. They've been a really bad problem on Guam for years. I remember reading about their effect on the native birds back in the mid 1990's. Seems they don't know if they got there on defence force ships or cargo ships or if they're originally from Australia, New Guinea or Indonesia. 

About 10 years or so ago I was talking to a guy who had a job patrolling the fence line at the airport to try and stop them from getting on flights to Hawaii. He was saying they are worried about them reaching there and having the same thing happen with their birds and other wildlife.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Nov 2, 2014)

Here's a pic of an olive python eating a bredli's python.

http://i.imgur.com/rAzKm2F.jpg

Found it on google images.


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## Primo (Nov 2, 2014)

Joshm said:


> Very interesting info guys!
> 
> Primo, I do believe the eastern indigo would be the largest down there when it comes to snake eaters.



Mussurana Clelia Clelia is a South American snake eater that is quite large it's rear fanged, has mild venom that is not lethal to humans usually, but it is to other snakes, and it's also a constrictor so it packs a double punch. 

The Indigo, has a fixed, powerful jaw and it bites and thrashes is prey.

The Eastern King is also very large so we have a few big ones in the Americas.

The Olive seems to be one of the largest anywhere sans the king cobra.


Good thread going here with a lot of various info packed in to this.


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## Dr-Zoidberg (Nov 5, 2014)

GBWhite said:


> http://www.invasivespeciesinfo.gov/animals/bts.shtml
> 
> It'll be interesting to see what effect the control method using the mice laced with Tylenol will have. They've been a really bad problem on Guam for years. I remember reading about their effect on the native birds back in the mid 1990's. Seems they don't know if they got there on defence force ships or cargo ships or if they're originally from Australia, New Guinea or Indonesia.
> 
> About 10 years or so ago I was talking to a guy who had a job patrolling the fence line at the airport to try and stop them from getting on flights to Hawaii. He was saying they are worried about them reaching there and having the same thing happen with their birds and other wildlife.



Thanks for posting that link, I wasn't aware that the brown trees had been in Guam for over fifty years. It's no wonder that so many endemic species have dissapered from the island. According to Wikipedia, there are 40% more spiders on Guam, than neighbouring islands due to the loss or reduction of the birds that ate them.


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