# Sadam's Hanging....



## slim6y (Jan 4, 2007)

I was just logging into my Email at Yahoo! and they had a news report about the guy who recorded Sadam's hanging on his mobile phone. Anyhow, the guy who did it has been arrested but not before he released the video.

I am not linking to where it is - I am sure you will all find it easily enough if you want to.

I just wanted to add one person's post to this event and get people's opinions if they want to share. 

I myself have almost no opinion because I don't understand all the facts, but this comment made me think.

The comment is as follows:

Who should be hanged first?
1. Bush? People Murdered by him: Millions
2. Blair? People Murdered by him: Thousands
3. Saddam? People Murdered by him: 113 Kurdish 

The posters' name is AndreasLoizou - but I won't link to the page as it is where the video is and I believe we have under 18s here. Plus I have been desensitised by American TV. 

I look forward to hearing some comments - bear this in mind when you do - we have American, British and possibley Middle Eastern readers - so it would be advisable to have a go at the idea and not any of the three nations mentioned.

With that in mind... go for it.


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## Lucas (Jan 4, 2007)

I thank religion


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## IsK67 (Jan 4, 2007)

slim6y said:


> 3. Saddam? People Murdered by him: 113 Kurdish



What about all the others. His genocidal acts went on for years. What he got hung for was just one of the charges against him.

IsK


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## IsK67 (Jan 4, 2007)

Lucas said:


> From Signature - I'd like to thank religion. Its been the cause for racial and cultural intolerance, violence, hatred and war for a millennia. Its also given meglomaniac americans something to do too.
> THANKS RELIGION.



Just Americans?

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

Haha, Saddam killed heaps more people. If you don't know anything about it then don't talk about it


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## Retic (Jan 4, 2007)

I'm just dissappointed that Little Johnny doesn't get a mention, he is George Dubya's lapdog after all.
I think to say that Saddam murdered 113 Kurds is absolutely absurd, his murdering went on for many years and easily amounted to many 1000's.


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

Well, he can't get a mention, Aussies aren't killing anyone. Last time I looked not one Aussie had been killed in Iraq.


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## Retic (Jan 4, 2007)

I'm not quite sure why Americans get singled out here.


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## IsK67 (Jan 4, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Well, he can't get a mention, Aussies aren't killing anyone. Last time I looked not one Aussie had been killed in Iraq.




Look again.

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

:/


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> Look again.
> 
> IsK



Okay, I haven't looked in a while. How many?


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## slim6y (Jan 4, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Haha, Saddam killed heaps more people. If you don't know anything about it then don't talk about it



Thanks for that  

I know sadam killed more than 113 people - I am also very aware that this is only one charge... But I like the way some people think...  that's why i put it here...


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## slim6y (Jan 4, 2007)

The same poster (that I put up above) also wrote this propagander... 

IRAQ: When U.S embargo Iraq for 15 years more than 1.500.000 kids died because they didn't had medicine. YUGOSLAVIA: 150000 died from uranium bombs & still dying. AFGANISTAN: The search for Bin laden or uranium? 250000 people died from the bombings. U.S: 911 Conspiracy, more than 2500 people died. Many other countries suffered from U.S with estimate more than 20000000 deaths since their creation on July 4 1776, imagine that they exist only for 231 years & they kill 30 x more people than HITLER 

Can anyone confirm the truth or fictional content in this?


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

slim6y said:


> Thanks for that
> 
> I know sadam killed more than 113 people - I am also very aware that this is only one charge... But I like the way some people think...  that's why i put it here...



Fair enough, but genocide in some countries gets the death penalty. Just how it works  And Saddam, like Pol Pot, Hilter, Stalin or Pinochet had no regrets.


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## slim6y (Jan 4, 2007)

Oh, and also following that post are several "glad to be american" threads.. haha... I can't post them they contain too much swearing


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

Well the people like that are yobbos.


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## FAY (Jan 4, 2007)

Saddam had his two sons in law executed!


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

GARTHNFAY said:


> Saddam had his two sons in law executed!



They probably weren't related to his daughters :lol:


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## Lucas (Jan 4, 2007)

No, not just americans ISK67.

I just find it strange that the american armed forces and those who direct them never have to held accoundable for their actions. Why is this? They can invade countries on a whim, have over 250,000 troops posted around the world(unwelcome), take what they want when they want it and never get seriously questioned.

As for Mr Howard, he is nothing but a Puppet. He is a disgusting little man hardly worthy of a mention.


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

Come on, what other country has a President or Prime Minister that looks like one of their own native creatures?

Howard, the koala, is someone we should all be proud of.


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## Retic (Jan 4, 2007)

I agree, if we didn't have Little Johnny we would have to find someone else to laugh at.


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## IsK67 (Jan 4, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Okay, I haven't looked in a while. How many?



http://www.icasualties.org/oif/Civ.aspx
Specifically http://www.icasualties.org/oif/Civ.aspx

Plus you could count Paul Pardoel. Even though it wasn't combat.

As for Australians Killing them there is no official who killed who figure. But I do know that our guys don't have rubber bullets.

Here is the seldom mentioned side of it as well. http://www.iraqbodycount.net/

IsK


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## IsK67 (Jan 4, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Howard, the koala, is someone we should all be proud of.



The only similarity between John Howard as Prime Minister and Koalas is they are both endangered species. 

IsK


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## coatesy (Jan 4, 2007)

little Johny might be a puppet to the us but you also have to look at it from a different side that would you rather have a good alliance with them if it comes time that we need their help, or would you rather have them on the other side against us...
The australian defence force isnt big enough to defend the whole country, we may just need some help of our own one day......

just my 2 cents


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> The only similarity between John Howard as Prime Minister and Koalas is they are both endangered species.
> 
> IsK



You don't think they look similar?


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> http://www.icasualties.org/oif/Civ.aspx
> Specifically http://www.icasualties.org/oif/Civ.aspx
> 
> Plus you could count Paul Pardoel. Even though it wasn't combat.
> ...



Okay, I had a look 

13-Aug-2006Hadaway, JonAustralianIED - Roadside bombGermanySecurity ContractorArmorGroup

That's in erm.. Germany :/


08-Jun-2006Schulz, WayneAustralianIED - Roadside bombBaghdad (north of)Security GuardArmourGroup20-Apr-2005

Ahmelman, ChrisAustralianSmall arms fireBaghdad AirportSecurity ContractorEdinburgh Risk Inc

So, there's two. Big deal, what's the road toll in NSW in one day? I'm thinking it would be bigger. Haha, and more Australians are killed by sharks in Australia than bombs in Iraq. Looks like they wouldn't be much safer here


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## Miffy (Jan 4, 2007)

Should the world have just sat on its hands and watched Iraq invade kuwait and force its dictatorship on its people?

Should the world have just sat on its hands while the teliban in Afghanistan aided Osama bin Laden in plotting major terroist attacks and forced its way of living apon the people of Afghanistan?

Should we all just sit on our hands and watch major terrisom events such as Sept 11 and the bali bombings unfold?

Should the world have just sat on its hands when Germany tried to invade and take over much of europe? Gassing millions because they happened to be jewish?

It wasn't just the USA who helped stop all this from happening, it was the majority western countries, united together. Whilst the USA is the country with the most troops and the major player, I am thankful they did what they did, and stopped the above things mentioned from happening.

You can't just expect things to change in Iraq and Afghanistan overnight. But hopefully now with a free government over time the life for millions living in these countries will be improved. Look at Germany now, its slightly different place to that of the 1940's.

And anyone who says the amount of lives lost would have been far less, had these regimes of Sadam Hussain, Osama bin Laden and Hitler been able to continue for decades I think is living in the land of fairies. 

There is a list of countries involved in the war in Iraq. its a world effort.

United States: 250,000 invasion--145,000 current (10/06) 
United Kingdom: 45,000 invasion--7,200 current (9/06) 
South Korea: 3,300 invasion--2,600 PLANNED (12/06) 
Poland: 194 invasion--2,500 peak 
Australia: 2,000 invasion--1,400 current (11/06) 
Romania: 865 troops 
Denmark: 422 deployed 7/03--545 current (12/06) 
Georgia: 500 invasion--300 current (8/06) 
El Salvador: 380 troops 
Czech Republic: 300 troops 
Azerbaijan: 150 troops 
Latvia: 136 troops (deployed 4/04) 
Mongolia: 131 --100 current (1/07) 
Albania: 120 troops 
Slovakia: 103 current (9/06) 
Lithuania: 50 troops 
Armenia: 46 troops 
Bosnia and Herzegovina: 36 troops 
Estonia: 35 troops 
Macedonia: 33 troops 
Kazakhstan: 29 troops 
Moldova: 24 invasion--12 current (9/06) 
Canada: undisclosed number of JTF2 operators 
Italy: 1,800 troops (deployed 7/03 - withdrawn 11/06) 
Ukraine: 1,650 troops (deployed 8/03 - withdrawn 12/05) 
Netherlands : 1,345 troops (deployed 7/03 - withdrawn 3/05) 
Spain : 1,300 troops (withdrawn 4/04) 
Japan: 600 troops (deployed 1/04 - withdrawn 7/06) 
Bulgaria : 462 troops (withdrawn 4/06) 
Thailand: 423 troops (withdrawn 8/04) 
Honduras: 368 troops (withdrawn 5/04) 
Dominican Republic: 302 troops (withdrawn 5/04) 
Hungary: 300 troops (withdrawn 3/05) 
Nicaragua: 230 troops (withdrawn 2/04) 
Singapore: 192 troops (withdrawn 3/05) 
Norway: 150 troopss (withdrawn 10/05) 
Portugal: 128 troops (withdrawn 2/05) 
New Zealand: 61 troops (deployed 9/03 - withdrawn 9/04) 
Philippines: 51 troops (deployed 7/03 - withdrawn 7/04) 
Tonga: 45 troops (deployed 7/04 - withdrawn 12/04) 
Iceland: 2 troops (withdrawal date unknown)


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

Kuwait is the most awesome country, they give you $12,000 to get married, there's no taxes, everyone is rich and happy and the women don't work..

but.. as everything has to have a downside.. you have to marry your first cousin.


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## Hickson (Jan 4, 2007)

Iceland has an army? And they sent 2 troops to fight in the desert?

Wow

Hix


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## gillsy (Jan 4, 2007)

I might get blasted for this however.

I agree with the Iraq and Afgan war. 

I know it was done under false pretences, however I believe for the good of the country in the long run it was worth it.

I feel sorry for the families that have lost fathers and sons, however it isn't compulsary to sign up to the military. They knew what they were getting into. 

Anyway, lets remember the soldiers that have been sent there, they are doing the best they can.


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## Mayo (Jan 4, 2007)

Well said Miffy, I think most people need to take a closer look at what's going on before they pass judgement. Just because people don't have a clue doesn't mean they won't make silly comments


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## Mayo (Jan 4, 2007)

Amen to that Gillsy


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## turtle (Jan 4, 2007)

Im just disappointed they didnt kill him nice and slow and extremely disappointed they didnt cut his head off afterwards and kick it around like a soccer ball. They should of just kept running over his legs with a car over and over again:lol: 
If you wanna good laugh just google saddam hanging cellphone


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

Hanging is a pretty brutal form of death.


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## turtle (Jan 4, 2007)

Sorry i was a bit harsh


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## IsK67 (Jan 4, 2007)

OIL

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

We pay them really well for their oil, always have. Why do people say this is about fricken oil? If it was about oil then we wouldn't pay so bloody much for it.


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## IsK67 (Jan 4, 2007)

thenothing said:


> We pay them really well for their oil, always have. Why do people say this is about fricken oil? If it was about oil then we wouldn't pay so bloody much for it.



LMAO.

Anyway. I'm out.

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

Come on, 70 bucks a barrel. They don't have to charge their people taxes because they're making so much.

I'm out too, no point arguing about this


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## Hetty (Jan 4, 2007)

And it's not funny. If you can't prove a point don't try and make one in the first place.

Yes, am out now


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## slim6y (Jan 4, 2007)

You know in Iraq and places like that you can buy petrol for 4 cents a litre... Imagine if you took in your Coles servo saver fuel vouchers


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## FAY (Jan 4, 2007)

Lucas said:


> No, not just americans ISK67.
> 
> I just find it strange that the american armed forces and those who direct them never have to held accoundable for their actions. Why is this? They can invade countries on a whim, have over 250,000 troops posted around the world(unwelcome), take what they want when they want it and never get seriously questioned.
> 
> As for Mr Howard, he is nothing but a Puppet. He is a disgusting little man hardly worthy of a mention.



It is funny though how everyones seems to whinge and whine about Howard and Bush.....yet they still keep getting voted in!!


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## FAY (Jan 4, 2007)

turtle said:


> Sorry i was a bit harsh



We wouldn't even know the half of what he has done to his own people............I am certainly not sorry that he got hung even though that was TOO good for him after all the atrocities that he has done. Most evil rulers don't get their true justice!!


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## PilbaraPythons (Jan 4, 2007)

Here is a interesting site thats shows the controversial clip
http://www.liveleak.com/


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## PilbaraPythons (Jan 4, 2007)

I was listening to a very intersting interview with a retired journalist on the ABC last night who witnessed the last hanging execution in Australia. He was criticised by the hangman because the reporting of the event the next morning was viewed by the hangman as an unfair assessment of his skills. He considered himself a skilled tradesman as he had been a hangman all over the world including the nazi war trials and had never had any complaints.
The journalist said that he was amazed how this guy blurred 4 actions into about one second.
He jerked the rope tight around the neck as he pulled the hood down while immediately leaping to the side and at the seemingly at the same moment pulled the lever.


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## slim6y (Jan 4, 2007)

PilbaraPythons said:


> Here is a interesting site thats shows the controversial clip
> http://www.liveleak.com/



Didn't watch your one.. i watched a better one... omg.. i'm starting a new thread on that one...


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## Miffy (Jan 4, 2007)

People also quickly forget that the USA is also by far the country that donates the most foreign aid to people who need it most in countries with economical hardship or who have faced natural disasters. Guess which country recieves the most foreign aid? Iraq. 3244 million US.

http://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Debt/USAid.asp

Net ODA in 2005 as US dollar amounts (millions)

USA 27,457 
Japan 13,101 
UK 10,754 
France 10,059 
Germany 9,915 
Netherlands 5,131 
Italy 5,053 
Canada 3,731 
Sweden 3,280 
Spain 3,123 
Norway 2,775 
Denmark 2,107 
Belgium 1,975 
Switzerland 1,771 
Australia 1,666 
Austria 1,552 
Finland 897 
Ireland 692 
Greece 535 
Portugal 367 
New Zealand 274 
Luxembourg 264


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## IsK67 (Jan 4, 2007)

Miffy said:


> People also quickly forget that the USA is also by far the country that donates the most foreign aid to people who need it most in countries with economical hardship or who have faced natural disasters. Guess which country recieves the most foreign aid? Iraq. 3244 million US.
> 
> http://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Debt/USAid.asp



Now pull up the per capita figures.

It's a different story.

IsK


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## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*True Words*



Buddha said:


> I think the world is a very disturbed, corrupt and disgusting place, and we will never know what really goes on in the world….



These are probably the fairest words siad in this whole thread.

Death by hanging, electrocution or firing squad etc is no way to die. Happy and old is the only way to die.

What Saddam did was in comprehensible. His lawlessness and dictatorship style was totally unjust and not RIGHT. Keep him in jail for the rest of his life is fine but execution IMO is no the way to go. He is now a martyr and more trouble will result in such a big way.


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## Earthling (Jan 4, 2007)

I think the world is a fantastic, beautiful, energetic bundle of joy.....its humans that try to make it all [deleted] up.


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## JandC_Reptiles (Jan 4, 2007)

I have a belly button


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## coatesy (Jan 4, 2007)

Gillsy thank you. The military people who are over there are every day people with girlfriend's wive's kids family & friends. It is just their line of work that has put them in this situation. As the partner of a navy Man it is a HUGE worry that he will be sent away to fight this (or any) war. Army personell have it much worse.

I too DO NOT agree with this war but can anyone really say why it is happening? Some people say 911 but is that just America's excuse? My mother always said two wrongs do not make a right!

As for my partner's earlier comment on our defence force not having the power and we may need America one day. I agree. The entire Australian Military is LESS than the American police force. Imagine if we did not join forces? 


ISK67 i too do not fully understand any of the politics behind this war. All i know is that if this turns into World War 3 am alone.

To wish for worl peace is unrealistic but we can wish for peace in our own hearts - hopefully one day the world will see eye to eye, if not (like mum used to say) If you can't say something nice - Don't say anything at all


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## dragons75 (Jan 4, 2007)

http://www.glumbert.com/media/roleplay 

check this out well worth it and no it isnt the hanging footage


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## coatesy (Jan 4, 2007)

Jand_C - say something constructive - or dont say it at all


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## cris (Jan 4, 2007)

Earthling said:


> I think the world is a fantastic, beautiful, energetic bundle of joy.....its humans that try to make it all [deleted] up.



Not really its humans who want it to be like some hippy fairyland where everthing is good and happy and nothing suffers, it isnt going to happen ever. 

Saddam was a great leader for many ppl and a great man in many ppls eyes, but now he has found where he belongs.


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## Earthling (Jan 4, 2007)

dragons75 that s a really funny clip...........

Fear.....Fear that we MIGHT get invaded ONEDAY in the FUTURE................after all what about those Muslims over the water? 
Just because johnnys a puppet and goes "yes sir no sir three bags full sir" doesnt mean US will help us. the US is overstretched to the max in Iraq and everwhere else. Wheres the troops and air power going to come from that they send us? and why help us? just because we say right on georgee porgy and send a token force of a few thousand?
Theres other countries that would support us better. 
Plus the countries ditrectly around us that could attack us wouldnt stand a chance.

JC.......Lint.


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## leighroyaus (Jan 4, 2007)

I feel as if saddam was just a scape goat for americas quest for more oil and george bush seniors personal little war.

Why doesnt america do somethign about the tyrants of somali and other wartorn countries?
Why dont they step up to south korea or china bout there WOMD?
Because they aer pussys and they have no chance to win nor is there oil there. 

I see george bush as a war criminal myself and would gladly liek to see him hung.
All those lives lost in iraq for what? the countrie is worse off now then it was when it was under saddams rule. There was no WOMD. even saddams trial was botched.

I personally cannot wait for the day china steps up and puts america back in there place.


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## cris (Jan 4, 2007)

As far as i know the Australian involvement in iraq has been very effective and i think there has been nothing at all done wrong by our military or politicians on this matter.

Where are these allies you talk of earthing? is NZ going to send around an inflatable boat with a machinegun on it? :lol:

Anyone with much knowledge on the subject would know we are screwed without the americans, no other country can provide any substaintial support with the possible exception of some european countries(UK etc.) if they arnt busy themselves.


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## dymback (Jan 4, 2007)

> Who should be hanged first?
> 1. Bush? People Murdered by him: Millions
> 
> 
> ...


 

i didnt kill anyone 
lol


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## Earthling (Jan 4, 2007)

Cris who are we worried about that is going to attack us?
if its some two bit country like which they are all around us we will be fine with our 'small' but highly significant allies. 
However if its China....it will be a World War and everybody will be in it anyways so why suck up to US?


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## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Funny*



dymback said:


> i didnt kill anyone
> lol



What you find funny about MURDER (the death of a human being) I find confusing. Ther is nothing fuuny, NOW, or never will be about Murder. I have seen the footage as I have many death scenes and there is nothing funny about it.


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## cris (Jan 4, 2007)

Earthling said:


> Cris who are we worried about that is going to attack us?
> if its some two bit country like which they are all around us we will be fine with our 'small' but highly significant allies.
> However if its China....it will be a World War and everybody will be in it anyways so why suck up to US?



Ppl are the most likely thing to attack us, most likely driven by religion in the next war rather than politics and racial biggotry as seen in other recent major wars.

Indonesia is one country that may pose a potential threat if we didnt have america we would just be like east timor, ache(spelling) or west papua.

Apart from the Uk what are our other allies worthy of mention?


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## coatesy (Jan 4, 2007)

Leighr33... If china attacks anyone it will be world war 3 and it will be something to forget cos it wont be pretty and millions of lives will be lost....

Earthling... As for other countries attacking us, Indoniesia - being our closest neighbour - has an army AT LEAST twice the size of ours, and you say the measly countries around us wont do us any harm Indonesia has the capability of cripiling us 

Dynback As for your comments - how about you do your research before sprouting off that Sedam has only killed 113 people.

Being a member of the ADF personally i am scared of the possibility of some of our closet neighbours invading as they did in previous times as it would leave Australia in the position of seriously need of the alies that we are backing up in the current wars.


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## Earthling (Jan 4, 2007)

You seriously think Indonesia would attack us???????????
Dont tell me you believe "The Muslims are going to get us!" poooo?
I remember a guy telli ng me that newyears2000. i believed it too...till I decided to find out the truth.
Do some reading on the true Muslim not the radical and you may change your mind.
Unless of course we as Christians upset them....which is certainly possible in our fear.

We are a lot better then east timor or west papua. How can you compare Australia to them? No similairities at all. we have an Army, Airforce, and navy far superiour then both of those countries put together and times by 100.
Have you seen what the Indonesian army/airforce/navy is made up of? How they are armed? the logistics would be not doable on their behalf at the moment. They would need a huge navy and a damn sight bigger Airforce then what they have now.
Far from adequate in fighting us, especially with our supprt from other countries thrown in for good measure.

Countries that would support us? Well as long as we dont [deleted] to many off with our 'supporting role' in Iraq we could get UK, Ireland, New Zealand, Canada, France, Phillipines, South Africa and you could count on a few other European countries and a few smaller one jumping in too.
But seriously if Indo attacked us we could sort the fiasco out ourselves...thats why they wont. They know they are to small in armed power, illequiped and lack discipline.


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## Earthling (Jan 4, 2007)

caotesy when have our neighbours invaded us?


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## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Threat*

Australia's biggest threat is Indonesia. It is the biggest Muslim Country in the world. 

I have many Muslim friends and they have copped an enormous amount of bull over the terrorism threat that exists these days. It is not Muslim people or Arab people etc that kill people.

The politics involved in this this thread are way above any of our heads.


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## richard70au (Jan 4, 2007)

Well said Coatsy, I'm with you, the US is a global police force, they get the job done, and as you said Indonesia would kick us hard if they wanted to. Earthling, Indonesia has a population of over 240Million and is the largest congregation of Muslims in the world and 45% of that are under 30, so do the math, they could be here in no time at all, and when they run out of room on all them islands, where will they go. We spend millions on training and supplying them weapons that they could one day use against us.
I am a proud ex member of our defence force but we couldnt defend our coastline with our troops, hence we have the US for support. We send token troops, (not saying that we do nothing as our men and women are highly trained and skilled) but are there as a good will jesture and the favour will be returned to us if the occasion ever arrises.


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## Earthling (Jan 4, 2007)

If Indonesia is our biggest threat why is our best mate geoge w bush selling them arms and parts again?


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## coatesy (Jan 4, 2007)

(mrs here) In the interest of saving face (and the Pi***d off partner) I would like to say that everyone is entitled to their own opinion, unless you have some sort of education opinion or experience in this field no one has the power to comment!!! Can i ask Earthling Have you experienced any of this first hand or have you just been educated by the media and government? I can assure you that they are not telling you everything. 

If the Australian government has the confidence of the power of the Australian Military why are we supporting a war we are not involved in? Why is the Autralian govenrment advertising for recruits in the Army, Navy and Airforce? Why is the Australian government adverting for recruits at the most popular Car show in the counrty (summernats)?

If you are most confident in the Australian defence force supporting our country in a war with only the support of countries that would rather sit on the fence than by all means be confident. I think most Australians would rather knowing that they have a MAJOR support if the worst was to happen.


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## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Because*



Earthling said:


> If Indonesia is our biggest threat why is our best mate geoge w bush selling them arms and parts again?



Beacuse he can.

When AUstralia had the firearms amnesty several years ago what do you think they did with the weapons?

They sold a great deal to foreign countries. How else do you think they make their money back????

Earthling, I don't always agree with what you say, Sometimes I do but this time you need more info, or should I say more reserch needs to be done.


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## cris (Jan 4, 2007)

shamous1 said:


> Beacuse he can.
> 
> When AUstralia had the firearms amnesty several years ago what do you think they did with the weapons?
> 
> ...



Thats BS mate all the guns were crushed at tax payers(selling medicare maybe?) expense usually paying more than the guns cost. Our governement also decided it would be a bright idea to destroy thousands and thousands of old ex military SLR assault rifles.


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## dymback (Jan 4, 2007)

> What you find funny about MURDER (the death of a human being) I find confusing. Ther is nothing fuuny, NOW, or never will be about Murder. I have seen the footage as I have many death scenes and there is nothing funny about it.


 
i didnt mean to offend anyone 
bloody hell it was a joke settle down i never said that murdering people was funny did i


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## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Death*

Not sure if I have said this, but unless you have ever experienced a family member being murdered and seen it first hand you have no place in commenting about someone being hung.

HAve I seen the footage? Yes. Do I like it? NO.

I used to agree with the death penalty. For a very good reason. I often thought about taken the law into my own hands and I had every opportunity to do so with one of my previous employers.

But I ahd to take the LEAP and get over things. 

Please just remember one thing. The media is one of the most powerfull way of misleading people. What you see or hear is not always the truth.


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## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Think*



dymback said:


> i didnt mean to offend anyone
> bloody hell it was a joke settle down i never said that murdering people was funny did i



Think before you type. I accept your apology


----------



## coatesy (Jan 4, 2007)

personally i can understand most of the politics because i appart of it i see it first hand...

my old man handed guns in in the amnesty and some of them could be used against us so if that is th case then it is not good...

But on the same token i stand firm on what i have said before we would be in the [deleted] if we got invaded without our allies


----------



## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

shamous1 said:


> Think before you type. I accept your apology


\
By the way you did type LOL.


----------



## Reptilian (Jan 4, 2007)

not really gettin involved too much here, but i remember how long it took america to finally help out in WWII...not untill right towards the middle-end, they didnt want nothin to do with it, why would they this time???

Then again, I sure as hell feel alot more comfortable knowing that we have a good chance the US would help us...

Also, im not denying that our defence force is great, but where i live (in Broome) we cant even protect ourselves from illegal fisherman who regularly get with a couple hundred metres off our shorline, in dingy lil wooden planks they call boats!!!


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## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Are you serious*



cris said:


> Thats BS mate all the guns were crushed at tax payers(selling medicare maybe?) expense usually paying more than the guns cost. Our governement also decided it would be a bright idea to destroy thousands and thousands of old ex military SLR assault rifles.




I'm not in the habit of making statements that I can't back up. It is a knwon fact that quite a few of our guns ended up in Pacific Countries.

I have first hand experience of being involved in the amnesty. No more info will be given,.


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## dymback (Jan 4, 2007)

> Think before you type. I accept your apology


 

yeah thats something you have to do before doing anything if you dont think then you wouldnt be able to do anything, lol nothing ment by that 
also i only said i never killed anyone in regards to the


> (blair people murderd by him thousands


 part as thats my name


----------



## cris (Jan 4, 2007)

shamous1 said:


> Not sure if I have said this, but unless you have ever experienced a family member being murdered and seen it first hand you have no place in commenting about someone being hung.



Why would that give someone a more valid opinion, whats the connection between a murder and a hanging execution for someone guilty of genocide?


----------



## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Capital Punishment*

I used to agree with capital punishment.

I had my grandfather murdered by a male cousin back in 1989 in Deer Park Victoria. My granmother died as a result of her injuries a couple of years later.

I used to believe in an eye for an eye but have since differed from my train of thought.

I used to believe in the death penalty. I have since changed my mind.


----------



## dymback (Jan 4, 2007)

well maybe we should see other peoples opinons about the death penalty


----------



## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Media*



cris said:


> Why would that give someone a more valid opinion, whats the connection between a murder and a hanging execution for someone guilty of genocide?



I am not condoning anything Saddam did. Or should I say we have been told Saddam did via the media. The Iraqi justice system has finished their trial and have acted according to Iraqi law.

We do not have the death penalty here and there for you can't say whether it's right or wrong. My comment was in reference to people who believe that he copped what he deserved.

The only people who can really comment are the people who allegedly suffered at the height of his reign.


----------



## shamous1 (Jan 4, 2007)

*Opinions*



dymback said:


> well maybe we should see other peoples opinons about the death penalty



Maybe you should. I'm not saying mine is right. Mine is just that MY OPINION. Unless you have ahd a family member murdered or someone close murdered you don't fully understand.


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## TOMatoPASTE (Jan 4, 2007)

the death penalty is the most stupid, irresponsible, outdated form of punishment possibly imaginable (barring maybe torture)

it gives a quick and often painless death to someone who might have made either a simple mistake in their life or in saddams case spent an entire adulthood corrupting and destroying a country and its people. we have just given him a quick way out. a couple years locked up and then a minute or less of pain ended it!

not only does death release the criminal from spending the rest of their life going over what they have done and 'rotting in jail' as would be the best way to describe what happens to then psucholigically at least, but it puts all the burden and harship on the family and friends who may well be innocent. it is always the family who have to deal with having a loved one KILLED and dissapear. in prison atleast the family (especially if kids are involved) hav some sort of connection and dont have to deal with the huge trauma of actually having someone die as opposed to being locked up for their actions.

and the worst thing to come out of this if that wasnt enough, saddam, like so many 'evil dictators' before him, has now been emortalised as a hero to some because he has died defending to the end the horrendous crimes against humanity that he committed. he was not crippled of all of his power, he has stood for what he believed in and that legacy will now live on!

and in a smaller scale this is true with all people who are executed

just my 2 cents

oh haha, dymback, perfect timing


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## coatesy (Jan 4, 2007)

i must say slim6y you have put up a great thread hear and i think you can understand where i am comming from after meetins me the other day.....

nice work mate...


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## TOMatoPASTE (Jan 4, 2007)

shamous1 said:


> Maybe you should. I'm not saying mine is right. Mine is just that MY OPINION. Unless you have ahd a family member murdered or someone close murdered you don't fully understand.



not to say that i know the emotional trauma of having a person close to me murdered, which i havnt, and i know what you mean because i have had several close people die and it is something that cant be described but i think oppinions on the death penalty etc can still be formulated on morals and outcomes rather than just the emotional side of it.


----------



## TOMatoPASTE (Jan 4, 2007)

coatesy said:


> i must say slim6y you have put up a great thread hear and i think you can understand where i am comming from after meetins me the other day.....
> 
> nice work mate...



ditto!

its definintely a topic worthy of discussion!!!


----------



## coatesy (Jan 4, 2007)

yes TOMatoPASTE this is verry close to heart being in the defence force..... i think it is verry worth discussion


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## dymback (Jan 5, 2007)

imo it is way out dated and legal system needs to change as no one deserves to die


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## coatesy (Jan 5, 2007)

what no-one deserves to die for performing genacide on thousands?


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## coatesy (Jan 5, 2007)

im out, going to abuse someone too much if i continue on this thread with my being in the defence force and all


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## dymback (Jan 5, 2007)

no the people he killed didnt him on the other hand good riddins no offence


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## richard70au (Jan 5, 2007)

I have seen the Saddam video, but I dont think it is anything like the beheading of Nick Berg. BTW don't watch that one if you have a weak stomach


----------



## JandC_Reptiles (Jan 5, 2007)

coatesy said:


> Jand_C - say something constructive - or dont say it at all



I will say whatever I like (this is the chit chat section). If I want to say I have a belly button so be it. Just because you are a puppet under Johnny Howards strings does not mean we ALL need to hold the same views on the subject as yourself & there is no need to arc up when somebodys opinion differs or when they post off topic. 

As for constructive discussion in a thread about mass destruction & war? Is it even possible?
Ok here is my attempt at adding something constructive to the discussion.
Next election Vote Pauline Hanson let her be your puppet master, hopefully she will get rid of any middle eastern descendants from Australia, then we dont have to fear terroist attacks etc on our land. Clean your own backyard before you worry about whats in Iraqs. It isn't much of a war imo anyway, if it was we would be taking those Iraqi's that are here as POW's (cant wait for WW3 & hope Pauline is in charge then lol)


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## IsK67 (Jan 5, 2007)

JandC I think coatesy said CONstructive not DEstructive.


IsK


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## Earthling (Jan 5, 2007)

coatesy said:


> Being a member of the ADF personally i am scared of the possibility of some of our closet neighbours invading as they did in previous times as it would leave Australia in the position of seriously need of the alies that we are backing up in the current wars.


 
Coatesy when were we invaded in previous times? 

If Indonesia could attack us why havent they already?

Read this recruitment drive. 
http://www.defencejobs.gov.au/default.asp?initMedia=1&media=flash&bounceBack=/default.asp&p=533
People dont want to join so they have to convince them its in their best interests too. Less and less percentage wise want to join. Lifestyle choice. throughout my life the armed forces has continuosly had big recruitment drives. Added with the increase in personal, most armies tend to get bigger not smaller when they are being used.

Shamous1 if you are correct about small arms trading the Australian people should be told more. You should tell us more. Why cant you? You work for the Australian people dont you? To sell our buybak guns to other Countries was not told to the Australian people and is another item to add to the list of JHowards lies. 

As for your answer "Because he can" in regards to bush selling arms and parts again to Indo(after not selling them as of timor), your saying he will sell arms and parts for their F-16 Fighting Falcons and A-4 Skyhawks (most which were grounded as of no parts) because he can make money(millions).........that......."your saying" these weapons and planes will be used in a future war with Australia that the US will have to spend Billions on helping to defend us. 
Does not make economic sense. 
To add if Bush is crazy enough to do that.....perhaps he is crazy enough not to assist us in times of need. Your puting your faith in with a mad man?


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## IsK67 (Jan 5, 2007)

Earthling said:


> Coatesy when were we invaded in previous times?



1788 wasn't it?

But then I suppose it wasn't Australia then.

IsK


----------



## richard70au (Jan 5, 2007)

Earthling, maybe you should check out the stats a little better, just because they are recruiting dosn't mean that people are joining.
I have a mate that has recently discharged from the army and the stats are as of last year.
80 people a month are leaving and 7 people a month join up.
Again, you do the math.
ANd here is a quote from your link 

*Indonesian Air Force (TNI AU)*
Indonesia has used 37 A-4E/TA-4E Skyhawk II by ex Israeli Air Force until 2003. In 2003 replaced by 2 Russian Su-27 SK and 2 Su-30 MK. * The Indonesian Air Force is planning to reactivate the A-4 Skyhawks by buying spare parts, after the U.S ended weapon and spare part sales embargo

Does it not say ex Israeli? and you will find that the manufacturers of the aircraft make the money on sales of spare parts, not the US government.

The point you are missing Earthling is that Indonesia could attack us, just because they havn't dosn't mean they wont.

As stated earlier that the indonesian fisherman get to within a kilometre of our coast near Broome on there dodgy fishing boats.


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## slim6y (Jan 5, 2007)

WOW... Ok.... I go to sleep for a couple of hours and here we go - I like that a lot of people have very strong opinions here - and it's great that people stand by them. I myself have learnt a fair whack from this thread.

I recall in the 1980 with the David Lange government (Labour) in NZ and the removal of the ANZUS treaty. This was one of the biggest moments in the history of NZ - litterally becoming an independant so that the big bullies like the US could no longer boss the little guys around. Oh, NZ paid for it with loss of exports, loss of friendships and most of all, NZs closest neighbour and allie, Australia snobbed her big nose at NZ. 

Australia was the one devestated by the loss of the treaty, not NZ. And that was because of these close nations to Australia that have the ability to threaten. 

NZ said NO to the nuclear powered or nuclear capable warships and declared the country the very first nuclear free country in the world. 

NZs army and defence force is small. A navy consisting of Aussie made frigates, an air force consisting of training fighter jets and a 757. And a ground force that is highly capable, but rather small. Hence why only 60 odd SAS troopers were sent to Iraq. 

NZs forces are just there to serve as peace keepers. 

But why spend millions on defence if you're undefendable?

I believe one political party (not a serious one) said in the event of an imminent invasion we will line our beaches, our shoreline and coastal areas... Not with military, but with our finest beers, wines and spirits. We will party on the beaches and when they arrive, we will offer them our finest brews. No one would attack us then... they'll all be too drunk.

Unfortunately Australia can't share that optimism - what with not having any good beers (haha, just kidding). 

So in summary - i understand why Aussie needs/wants the US. But with many western allies, Australia is likely to be well protected - or at least won't go down without a big fight. 

As far as Sadam's hanging goes - I have never agreed what he did was remotely correct. He was fanatical. It's dangerous for the minorities (or in this case majorities) when someone like this gets in power. It's great to see a democracy begin to form in a country that has never really had freedom. But with this freedom comes responsibility. And I worry that there isn't that responsibility in the country (Iraq).

And the huge division makes them a weak country with the ever increasing chances of a coup (perhaps not as obvious as what goes on in Fiji, but still possible).

I worry that similar circumstances to Afghanistan will occur. Where the US removed one government and elected the Talibhan so as to stop the advancing Russians. They armed the Talibhan and gave them power. With that power came responsibility and eventually they bit the hand that fed them... A crocodile mentality.

I just hope this doesn't happen again.

I remember in the early 90s after Desert Storm I asked a friend why they just don't assassinate Sadam... his reply was, it's better the devil you know than the one you don't.

Well, now he's gone, and since 9/11 this world really has become a different place. But too me, it hasn't improved, just got more scared!


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## cris (Jan 5, 2007)

Yeah but you see no one could be bothered invadiding NZ it would be more effort than its worth :lol:

Its true america once supported both saddam and the taliban but that was only because they were basically fighting for them(agaist iran and russia respectively). Also in the first part of the gulf war america started a revolt against saddam but then politics got in the way and they left them to be slaughtered.

The only country to invades us so far has been japan to my knowledge and they only got a few troops and a couple subs into our land/waters and obviously the bombing of darwin.

9/11 will be nothing after the first nuclear attack, my guess would be it will be some time till it happens, but i cant see how it wont happen.


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## IsK67 (Jan 5, 2007)

cris said:


> 9/11 will be nothing after the first nuclear attack, /quote]
> 
> You mean the third don't you?
> 
> IsK


----------



## cris (Jan 5, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> cris said:
> 
> 
> > 9/11 will be nothing after the first nuclear attack, /quote]
> ...


----------



## Miffy (Jan 5, 2007)

> Coatesy when were we invaded in previous times?



During World War II, the Japanese flew sixty-four raids on Darwin and thirty-three raids on other targets in Northern Australia. 

The first raid on 19 February 1942 until the last on 12 November 1943.

Dont people even know about Australian history these days ?


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## salebrosus (Jan 5, 2007)

Miffy said:


> During World War II, the Japanese flew sixty-four raids on Darwin and thirty-three raids on other targets in Northern Australia.
> 
> The first raid on 19 February 1942 until the last on 12 November 1943.
> 
> Dont people even know about Australian history these days ?



NOPE!!!!!!!!!!! We a re politcially correct country so we learn about the history of every other country other than our own.

This Saddam thing is something none of us are going to agree on. I think we should just stick to talking about anything else like mullets from alienpunk or anything and everything else other than crap like this. Reptiles perhaps?

Simone.


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## rodentrancher (Jan 5, 2007)

"Dont people even know about Australian history these days ?"

Do Australian Schools even teach Australian history these days??? Makes you wonder doesn't it? Cheers Cheryl.


----------



## lacemonitor (Jan 5, 2007)

rodentrancher said:


> "Dont people even know about Australian history these days ?"
> 
> Do Australian Schools even teach Australian history these days??? Makes you wonder doesn't it? Cheers Cheryl.



does make u wonder, that yes schoolies arent taught about australian history , i only know about our (australian) history due to a tafe teacher which taught us both australian politics and asia pacific history. 

i doubt it though that they will be teaching it anytime soon due to the fact that they now have to reteach the whole planetry system but that's another story... 

goin back to the topic i cant believe this sadam thread is still going (especially on a reptile forum) and i agree with johnbowe that we need to talk about anything else bar this ....


----------



## salebrosus (Jan 5, 2007)

rodentrancher said:


> "Dont people even know about Australian history these days ?"
> 
> Do Australian Schools even teach Australian history these days??? Makes you wonder doesn't it? Cheers Cheryl.




Cheryl, you would be hard pressed trying to find anyone knowing about Aussie History. I learnt a little in primary school and some at a private school i went to up to Year 10. When i went to another school we did an archaeological dig near the Harbour Bridge where the the scientist working with us asked who Beenelong was. I was the only one who knew out of a class 20 and more recently while sitting in a class my lecturer asked the theatre of 150 what the Eureka Stockade was. Only two of us knew. Makes me appreciate my schooling a little more.

Simone.


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## turtle (Jan 5, 2007)

Suffer for him being hung. I dont think its funny but i think he should never of been hung but cut up in little pieces then fed to some hungry dogs. He got a easy death if you ask me and should of at least been smashed the [deleted] out of first. Anyway he's dead now so im happy along with millions of other people 

Peace


----------



## GAZ-ROBOT (Jan 5, 2007)

shamous1 said:


> Death by hanging, electrocution or firing squad etc is no way to die. Happy and old is the only way to die.
> 
> What Saddam did was in comprehensible. His lawlessness and dictatorship style was totally unjust and not RIGHT. Keep him in jail for the rest of his life is fine but execution IMO is no the way to go. He is now a martyr and more trouble will result in such a big way.



100% agree with shamous1......


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## slim6y (Jan 5, 2007)

turtle said:


> Suffer for him being hung. I dont think its funny but i think he should never of been hung but cut up in little pieces then fed to some hungry dogs. He got a easy death if you ask me and should of at least been smashed the ***c out of first. Anyway he's dead now so im happy along with millions of other people
> 
> Peace



Sounds a little like a witch hunt to me... I know what you mean, but being joyous over Sadam's death? Don't you think that's a little over the top? 

I, like any Miss Universe would like to see world peace. But peace doesn't start with killing (or does it?).

I wonder though, if Sadam was jailed would he be like Manson and have celebrity status? Manson gets more fan mail than many rock bands. He has proposals for marriage and everything. I don't get it... I thought females looked for a secure partner... hmmm... 

I am interested now to see what happens to the minority that Sadam lead. Will they start an uprising? Surely there were more than the few commanders and generals that Sadam lead? 

No one deserves to die, and eye for an eye doesn't work (always). 

For example, one of the sickest murders that ever took place last year was those poor school girls in the armish community in America. It was an absolute horrible thing to happen. But watching a news broadcast, even though those Armish people were devestated by their losses, they chose forgiveness. 

To be honest, I don't know how they could. It doesn't seem right. But several other people interviewed, who were not Armish or religious who had lost loved ones to murderers, also stated that forgiveness has given them the chance to continue living. 

It doesn't mean the people are set free to roam the streets, those sort of people don't understand forgiveness. I just couldn't beleive that even in the eyes of tragedy, people dound forgiveness.

It even sounds like tripe to me. I don't know how I would cope - it would eat away at me thinking that someone could do this... But I don't know if retribution works either.

But I do know a whole lot of nothing about something... 

I guess the world won't ever see the way that those Armish people portrayed, it just doesn't seem natural.


----------



## IsK67 (Jan 5, 2007)

Would you like a hand getting down? I don't want you to slip of that box.


IsK


----------



## slim6y (Jan 5, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> Would you like a hand getting down? I don't want you to slip of that box.
> 
> 
> IsK



Would you like a soft landing for that pedestall I had you on that you're now falling off of 

These soap boxes are awfully slippery... Someone should do a health and safety check of these!


----------



## richard70au (Jan 5, 2007)

Does anyone know how much it cost to keep one person in goal per year?

Imagine how over crowded prisons would be if they didnt have the death sentence in the states and othe countries.


----------



## mrmikk (Jan 5, 2007)

slim6y said:


> I was just logging into my Email at Yahoo! and they had a news report about the guy who recorded Sadam's hanging on his mobile phone. Anyhow, the guy who did it has been arrested but not before he released the video.
> 
> I am not linking to where it is - I am sure you will all find it easily enough if you want to.
> 
> ...


 

I agree with you in part, yes Bush and Blair have blood on their hands also, although I think Saddam is responsible for the deaths of more than 113 Kurds.

The ironic thing is who supported Saddam, who made him into what he was, where did he get the military backing to invade Iran?? No takers?...The U.S. that's where. As soon as he got off the leash the U.S. wanted his scalp.

Who made the Taliban into the political force they are, including Osama, who funded them to fight the Russians when they invaded Afghanistan?? You got it, the U.S., again when they got off the leash, the U.S. wants their scalp.

Don't get me wrong here, I don't support terrorism and am not reallt anti-U.S.A., however, let's look at all the facts and all of a sudden the U.S. has largely funded these monsters to become what they are/were.

Everybody should be allowed to live in peace, believe whatever religion they choose and do whatever they like as long as it doesn't hurt, impact or negatively affect someone else. Utopian view? Yes, But that is the basic premise that would allow us all to live in peace, sadly though it will never happen unless there is a major catastrophe that unites mankind as a whole.

Phew, heavy stuff..... I need a lie down.

Mikk


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## mrmikk (Jan 5, 2007)

richard70au said:


> Does anyone know how much it cost to keep one person in goal per year?
> 
> Imagine how over crowded prisons would be if they didnt have the death sentence in the states and othe countries.


 
It costs about $AUD55,000 p.a. to keep a prisoner in a maximum security facility in Australia.

Mikk


----------



## mrmikk (Jan 5, 2007)

rodentrancher said:


> "Dont people even know about Australian history these days ?"
> 
> Do Australian Schools even teach Australian history these days??? Makes you wonder doesn't it? Cheers Cheryl.


 

There is always a political reason why history is not accuraely taught to children, largely because it doesn't suit the political climate at the time.

Did you know that Asians (China) see WWII starting when Japan invaded China in the early thirties, not when Germany invaded Poland, as we see WWII commencing with. Japan orchestrated a brutal and barbaric invasion of China at this time and slaughtered a countless number of Chinese civilians. A Japanese newspaper at the time ran a daily column on two Japanese generals quoting how many Chinese decapatations they had accumulated, like a sports report.

How does this relate to accuracy in historical teachings?? Japan has only recently began to discuss in its Japanese history teachings their invasion of China, albeit a very sanitised account. Today's Japanese youth would have no idea of the atrocities carried out against their neighbour by the forefathers. God help the Japanese when China becomes a super power! LOL

Mikk


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## shamous1 (Jan 5, 2007)

mrmikk said:


> It costs about $AUD55,000 p.a. to keep a prisoner in a maximum security facility in Australia.
> 
> Mikk



Actually it costs approx $62,500 in a max security in Vic. So mrmik is pretty much on the ball.

I would rather watch someone suffer in a cell for the rest of their lives than have them executed.

Like I have stated. I ahd a cousin murder my grandfather and my grandmother died (from her injuries) 2 years later. At first I wanted him DEAD. After her got out of jail I caught up with him by accident and I asked him why he did what he did. He said "Why Not?".

With that I nearly killed him. Unfortunately for him (and me) I was understaking the duties of my former job. I had him pinned down on a concrete floor and was about to pummel him into oblivion (spelling?).

Then I thought why should I stoop to the level that he did. I would then be no better than him.

I used to believe in an EYE FOR AN EYE. I think I have changed my mind. Don't get me wrong. If someone hurt my wife or kids then I would tend to it the tilt.

This is a great thread and it gets people thinking. There are many criminals in this world. Most of them leaders of the modern world, leaders of business etc etc etc. Every situation is different .

People need to sit back and fully understand what the meaning of death by firing squad, death by electrocution, death by gas chamber and death by hanging really means.

Anyway. This topic is too close to hoke for me. Thanks for everyones input. Whether right or wrong. That is waht free speach is all about.

Take care all.

Shane


----------



## rodentrancher (Jan 5, 2007)

johnbowemonie said:


> Cheryl, you would be hard pressed trying to find anyone knowing about Aussie History. I learnt a little in primary school and some at a private school i went to up to Year 10. When i went to another school we did an archaeological dig near the Harbour Bridge where the the scientist working with us asked who Beenelong was. I was the only one who knew out of a class 20 and more recently while sitting in a class my lecturer asked the theatre of 150 what the Eureka Stockade was. Only two of us knew. Makes me appreciate my schooling a little more.
> 
> Simone.



I think that it is shocking that our very interesting Aussie History is not being taught in schools these days. I used to love my Aussie History classes. We learnt all about Australian Trade Unionism, Poets and Writers like Banjo Patterson and Henry Lawson, Bushrangers and the Eureka Stockade, the first Australians, the Aboroginals and just so much other stuff to mention. I think its a great pity the kids of today are not being taught all of this stuff. Cheers Cheryl


----------



## Hetty (Jan 5, 2007)

whiteyluvsrum said:


> if you think its so safe, why dont you join up and go over with em.
> i know i dont walk around australia in flakies and helmets carrying weapons and riding in amoured vehcles.



It is safe, but that doesn't mean it's something I'd like to do. Just because eating mushrooms is safe doesn't mean I'll eat them.

Besides, I am *way* too smart for the army.


----------



## Earthling (Jan 5, 2007)

Miffy said:


> During World War II, the Japanese flew sixty-four raids on Darwin and thirty-three raids on other targets in Northern Australia.
> 
> The first raid on 19 February 1942 until the last on 12 November 1943.
> 
> ...


----------



## cris (Jan 5, 2007)

thenothing said:


> It is safe, but that doesn't mean it's something I'd like to do. Just because eating mushrooms is safe doesn't mean I'll eat them.
> 
> Besides, I am *way* too smart for the army.



LOL to smart for the army:lol: Yep someone saying that sure is smart 



Earthling said:


> Whitey luvs rum said "fact- indonesia is a threat!"
> Firstly how big a threat? Secondly how would they invade us and are they currently capable? Also would they be willing to take the repurcusions of such an invasion of our shores? Convince me that we are in possible trouble from them and rescue me from this possible delusion please?



we have US back up they wouldnt even think about it.


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## Hetty (Jan 5, 2007)

People who don't make it in to uni join the army. Just how it goes.


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## Earthling (Jan 5, 2007)

Sorry should have added without US support on our side to ad a bit of spice. 
I was refering to the mid part of this thread. 
After all, if we didnt support the US in its wars as much as we currently do people argued that the US would not assist us in times of need(invasion). we dont haver to go as far as gutsy NZ did but just use our right to choose when to fight, thats all. However if this was reality and the US said no to assistance would we be worse off? Would we suffer from invasion and lose our country?


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## cris (Jan 5, 2007)

thenothing said:


> People who don't make it in to uni join the army. Just how it goes.



Not really mate, saying stuff like that makes you look dumber than any one in the army. Going to Uni doiesnt make you smart, i go to uni its full of dumbas nerds who just study heaps or are doing easy degrees. There are normal ppl like me there too :lol: 

I bet there are thousands of ppl in the army far smarter than you.


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## Hetty (Jan 5, 2007)

Oh come off it. The army practically askes for stupid people.

"Hey, dumbass, come join the army, you won't get $40k a year for anything else"


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## cris (Jan 5, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Oh come off it. The army practically askes for stupid people.
> 
> "Hey, dumbass, come join the army, you won't get $40k a year for anything else"



I suggest you say that to a soldiers face unless you are a pussy.


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## FAY (Jan 5, 2007)

shamous1 said:


> Think before you type. I accept your apology



They said Blair killed so many people!

Dymback name is Blair.....


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## FAY (Jan 5, 2007)

No country has to attack Australia!!
They come here and take over legally!! hehe


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## mitchdiamond (Jan 5, 2007)

The Nothing, your quotes regarding dumb people in the army are unfounded and unjustified.
Having worked with unemployed people for the past 10 years, I can certainly tell you that "going into the army" is not an easy way out. The defence force does not just take any body, they are extremely selective, and why shouldn't they be, they are asking these people to stand up for the rest of us. There are physical and psychological testings and successful recruits, I believe, can select specific positions. Also, through the defence force in Canberra you can gain a degree at the same time. 
I think if somebody wants to make a blanket statement like that they should do a little more research and think twice. JMO


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## richard70au (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Oh come off it. The army practically askes for stupid people.
> 
> "Hey, dumbass, come join the army, you won't get $40k a year for anything else"


 
The nothing, you should really think about what you say before you open your mouth.

My son went to join the Army, they knocked him back because he hadn't completed year 10.

Obviously shows how easy they will just take any idiot of the street.

Maybe you are a disgruntled reject just wanting to bag out people with military experience, I think there are to many of us on here to allow you to do that.,


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## IsK67 (Jan 6, 2007)

rodentrancher said:


> the first Australians, the Aboroginals



That's redundant isn't it?

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

cris said:


> I suggest you say that to a soldiers face unless you are a pussy.



Haha, if he hit me he'd be a worthless woman basher.


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## salebrosus (Jan 6, 2007)

rodentrancher said:


> I think that it is shocking that our very interesting Aussie History is not being taught in schools these days. I used to love my Aussie History classes. We learnt all about Australian Trade Unionism, Poets and Writers like Banjo Patterson and Henry Lawson, Bushrangers and the Eureka Stockade, the first Australians, the Aboroginals and just so much other stuff to mention. I think its a great pity the kids of today are not being taught all of this stuff. Cheers Cheryl



I couldn't agree more Cheryl. In primary school we learnt about Hamilton and Hume and Burke and Wills etc. It was all extremely interesting but obviously not to the Board of Education or the people they're trying not to offend.

Simone.


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## slim6y (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Haha, if he hit me he'd be a worthless woman basher.



Now there's a whole new thread 

Still, even I was rather suprised at your 'dumb' military people comments... Each to their own I guess 

To be honest I thought you had to be joking - actually, i still kinda hope you were...

It's like rugby players - are they all dumb too?

Ironically 80% of one All Black team had degrees, and two of those had honours degrees (but you're right they werre probably all arts degrees, so they must be dumb!)

Well - I think that's also a new thread so to end it...

The person with the engineering degree asks "How does it work?"

The person with the science degree asks "Why does it work?"

The person with the business degree asks "How much does it cost?"

The person with the arts degree asks "Would you like fries with that?"


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## cris (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Haha, if he hit me he'd be a worthless woman basher.



 didnt know you were a chick, there are still plenty of chicks in the army who would beat you for saying that


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

cris said:


> didnt know you were a chick, there are still plenty of chicks in the army who would beat you for saying that



Yeah, we call them 'scrags'


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

slim6y said:


> Now there's a whole new thread
> 
> Still, even I was rather suprised at your 'dumb' military people comments... Each to their own I guess
> 
> ...



Yeah, I still was kind of joking


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## slim6y (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Yeah, I still was kind of joking



*phew* 

Gets difficult to tell online... even when you read between the lines, there's often only white space!


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

slim6y said:


> *phew*
> 
> Gets difficult to tell online... even when you read between the lines, there's often only white space!



Yeah. Still, there are a lot of people joining the army because they don't get good marks at school (I've seen ads in the paper to encourage people to join for that reason), but I guess those people are smart in other ways. Like, shooting targets, and uhm.. building stuff.


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## Mayo (Jan 6, 2007)

Have worked for a few people with degree's and think they are all that. In truth they didn't have a clue what they were doing. I would rather work for someone who learnt their trade from the ground up than some uni dumb *****, and I have a uni degree. Am working on my post grade degree in ecology and conservation, and work for the army. I have a good education and good mark's, but joined the army as a mean's of earning money while I study. I no a lot of people who have degree's in the army and a few that have masters, and many others are studying whilst working for there country.


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## krusty (Jan 6, 2007)

i think they should have put it on the TV LIVE.


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## slim6y (Jan 6, 2007)

krusty said:


> i think they should have put it on the TV LIVE.



Or 'dead' as it were - There's plenty of footage of the clip I was talking about - you'll find it rather easily if it amuses you.


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

whiteyluvsrum said:


> you have it very wrong my friend! there is lots of smart people in the army, probably smarter than you. i have alot of friends in the infantry (dumb grunts, you like to call) that have been to uni and have degrees and are getting degrees through the army which they pay for them to do.
> you may be abit shocked, but people join for other reasons like serving there country. they dont join because they have nothing else, i have lots of work mates that are tradesmen who were getting payed alot more than what the army are paying them.
> so are you calling all the anzacs and all members of the army that have died for our country dumb?
> even if they are "dumb", they are serving alot more honorable job and help protect the country that you live in today. there maybe no direct threat to australia today, but when it comes. i bet you wont be winging about "dumb grunts".
> you should be a shamed of that comment you made!



Oh gosh, ever heard of a joke? Read my other post.


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## Miffy (Jan 6, 2007)

> Yeah. Still, there are a lot of people joining the army because they don't get good marks at school



How about the ones who go to duntroon, and graduate as captains?

How about the SAS?

They are usually some of Australias elite students.


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

Miffy said:


> How about the ones who go to duntroon, and graduate as captains?
> 
> How about the SAS?
> 
> They are usually some of Australias elite students.



Yeah, I wasn't talking about higher ranking people.


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

whiteyluvsrum said:


> it maybe a "joke" now, but it wasnt when you posted it.
> i see no smilies or lol.
> i think all the defence members on this forum dont take it as a joke!



You're just peeved because you typed all that out


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## IsK67 (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Yeah, I wasn't talking about higher ranking people.



So now it's not a joke again?

I'm confused. 


IsK


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## cris (Jan 6, 2007)

A joke oh i get it you say something that is obviously offensive to some ppl and then after you get them worked up you say you didnt mean it :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol::lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> So now it's not a joke again?
> 
> I'm confused.
> 
> ...



The first couple of things I said were a joke. Then, when everyone decided to be uber-serious, I said, in all seriousness, how I feel about the situation. But yeah, opinions aren't allowed these days, so I guess I should have said nothing at all.

And, just because you want to be serious, koalas aren't endangered.


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## cris (Jan 6, 2007)

very funny


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## reece89 (Jan 6, 2007)

no i havnt seen the video yet but i heard its on the net somewhere

reece


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

cris said:


> A joke oh i get it you say something that is obviously offensive to some ppl and then after you get them worked up you say you didnt mean it :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol::lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:



Just read everything I wrote. My opinion is clear.


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

cris said:


> very funny



Oh, get a life. You're 21, there's no need to be jaded yet.


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## IsK67 (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> The first couple of things I said were a joke. Then, when everyone decided to be uber-serious, I said, in all seriousness, how I feel about the situation. But yeah, opinions aren't allowed these days, so I guess I should have said nothing at all.
> 
> And, just because you want to be serious, koalas aren't endangered.




I only asked a question 

But it doesn't change johnny boys status. 

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> I only asked a question
> 
> But it doesn't change johnny boys status.
> 
> IsK




Nah, bet you the Aussies will vote him in for another round.

Especially since everyone calls Rudd 'the polished turd'


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## IsK67 (Jan 6, 2007)

whiteyluvsrum said:


> im glad women cant join the infantry. yet



I'm not. I think they would be a great asset.

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> I'm not. I think they would be a great asset.
> 
> IsK



I don't think many women would want to. In what way do you think women would be a great asset?


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## IsK67 (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Nah, bet you the Aussies will vote him in for another round.
> 
> Especially since everyone calls Rudd 'the polished turd'




OOPS! My mistake. I didn't realise you were in touch with everyone 

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> OOPS! My mistake. I didn't realise you were in touch with everyone
> 
> IsK



Yeah, I'm Wonder Woman after all 

But in all seriousness, you think Rudd will win?


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## shamous1 (Jan 6, 2007)

*Defence Forces*

I still don't agree with the death penalty and having family members murdered leaves me thinking should the eye for an eye belief come true. :? 

I do however stand behind every member of our defence force, no matter what position or rank they hold. I will even encourage my kids to join the defence force. They can get an education. Get a paid apprenticeship far above the pay rate of the mormal. Food, room etc etc etc.

I can't think of anything better. Whether we agree with what has happened we still should back our forces, as it is their job and they are instructed to do what they are asked.


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## IsK67 (Jan 6, 2007)

shamous1 said:


> I still don't agree with the death penalty and having family members murdered leaves me thinking should the eye for an eye belief come true. :?



I think there is no place for the Death Penalty within our judicial system. There are far too many flaws that would leave to grave errors being made. Well... more so than are currently made.

However I do believe that justice was served in this particular case.

IsK


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## cris (Jan 6, 2007)

whiteyluvsrum said:


> your intitled to your opinion nothing, but im entitled to mine.
> cant i express my view?



No you are to dumb mate


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

cris said:


> No you are to dumb mate



:lol: 

Of course you are entitled to your own opinion, and I am too, but not on this forum it seems.


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## IsK67 (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> :lol:
> 
> Of course you are entitled to your own opinion, and I am too, but not on this forum it seems.



Of course you are. But stand by it and perhaps even justify it if confronted. Don't turn around and say it was a joke well after the fact and then say it again after that.

BTW. I have something for you.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Koalas+endangered+species&meta=&btnG=Google+Search

IsK


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> Of course you are. But stand by it and perhaps even justify it if confronted. Don't turn around and say it was a joke well after the fact and then say it again after that.
> 
> BTW. I have something for you.
> http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Koalas+endangered+species&meta=&btnG=Google+Search
> ...


 

The first thing I said *was* a joke. The whole 'I'm way too smart for the army' thing. I never thought that.

I later said my real opinion.

And..! With the koalas, I don't agree, that's propaganda. There are so many in some areas that they're eating all the food and if not moved or culled, they will become endangered. Wikipedia has good stats on these things http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koala , 30,000 animals is not endangered.


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## craig.a.c (Jan 6, 2007)

shamous1 said:


> Actually it costs approx $62,500 in a max security in Vic. So mrmik is pretty much on the ball.
> 
> I would rather watch someone suffer in a cell for the rest of their lives than have them executed.
> Shane




And you want to pay your taxes to keep that scum alive, with a roof over their heads and free meals. I sure as hell would like to see my tax money spent on better things. Bring in the death penalty. It is our money feeding Ivan Malat and Martin Bryant. Kill the scum I say.


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## cris (Jan 6, 2007)

craig.a.c said:


> And you want to pay your taxes to keep that scum alive, with a roof over their heads and free meals. I sure as hell would like to see my tax money spent on better things. Bring in the death penalty. It is our money feeding Ivan Malat and Martin Bryant. Kill the scum I say.



I was goin to say something like that but ill let you get flamed instead


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## craig.a.c (Jan 6, 2007)

cris said:


> I was goin to say something like that but ill let you get flamed instead



Bring on the flames then. BRING BACK THE DEATH PENALTY. Like I said I don't want my taxes keeping the [deleted] alive.


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

craig.a.c said:


> Bring on the flames then. BRING BACK THE DEATH PENALTY. Like I said I don't want my taxes keeping the [deleted] alive.



:lol: Under the right circumstances I think it's fine. When there are enough witness to a sufficent crime (say, multiple murders) so that it's not 'beyond all reasonable doubt' but definite.


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## snakereef (Jan 6, 2007)

Hearing about Saddams death was almost as good as hearing that Leonard Fraser died of a heart attack whilst serving time in prison.For any one not familiar with this man,he was responsible for the brutal murder and rape of a little school girl in Rockhampton a few years back.He also murdered several other women in the area and maybe many more that have not been accounted for yet.The death penalty for these mongrels is the ONLY option.


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## Oxyuranus microlepid (Jan 6, 2007)

wow, alot of contreversy, 

very long, interesting subject


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## craig.a.c (Jan 6, 2007)

snakereef said:


> Hearing about Saddams death was almost as good as hearing that Leonard Fraser died of a heart attack whilst serving time in prison.For any one not familiar with this man,he was responsible for the brutal murder and rape of a little school girl in Rockhampton a few years back.He also murdered several other women in the area and maybe many more that have not been accounted for yet.The death penalty for these mongrels is the ONLY option.




I agree. Why should WE pay thousands of dollars a year to keep rapists, pedaphiles and murders alive? It disgusts me. Anyone that molests, rapes or murders a person does not deserve to live. KILL 'EM ALL....


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

craig.a.c said:


> I agree. Why should WE pay thousands of dollars a year to keep rapists, pedaphiles and murders alive? It disgusts me. Anyone that molests, rapes or murders a person does not deserve to live. KILL 'EM ALL....



If someone murders one person, and is murdered in turn then there's no point. The executioner is just as bad as the murderer. And sex crimes should be sorted with chemical carstration rather than death (in my opinion).


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## snakereef (Jan 6, 2007)

Wonder how different you would feel if this young girl had have been your own daughter?.What this piece of low life did to this child is beyond any ones comprehension,
The details of this case and the events that took place were made public and this story really tore into the heart of the local community. I have had my say and I will now leave it at that but on a final note ....To die of natural causes was too easy a way out for this evil man he should have had the same treatment as Saddam........Scott


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## richard70au (Jan 6, 2007)

thenothing said:


> Nah, bet you the Aussies will vote him in for another round.
> 
> Especially since everyone calls Rudd 'the polished turd'


 
So nothing are you not an Aussie?


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## Hetty (Jan 6, 2007)

richard70au said:


> So nothing are you not an Aussie?



I am Australian, I was referring to other 'Aussies', my bet is that the koala will stay PM for a while.


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## salebrosus (Jan 7, 2007)

thenothing said:


> If someone murders one person, and is murdered in turn then there's no point. The executioner is just as bad as the murderer. And sex crimes should be sorted with chemical carstration rather than death (in my opinion).



You can't tell me that Anita Cobby's killers or Janine Baldings killers dont deserve the death penalty for what they did. What about Ebony Simpson, the little girl who was molested then thrown into a dam to drown pleading for her life only to have her killer join the search party trying to find her. What if Ebony Simpson was your daughter? One of the men involved in Janine Balding's murder got released on parole only to try abduting another woman from Sutherland station- the same place where they grabbed Janine only 2 days after being released. Scum like this should not be allowed to go on take up taxpayers money when we have spastics on parole boards that allow filth like this to be released.
I can tell you right now if any of these girls were my daughters i would not rest until i put a bullet between the eyes of the people who did this. I'm all for the death penalty.

Simone.


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## Hetty (Jan 7, 2007)

johnbowemonie said:


> You can't tell me that Anita Cobby's killers or Janine Baldings killers dont deserve the death penalty for what they did. What about Ebony Simpson, the little girl who was molested then thrown into a dam to drown pleading for her life only to have her killer join the search party trying to find her. What if Ebony Simpson was your daughter? One of the men involved in Janine Balding's murder got released on parole only to try abduting another woman from Sutherland station- the same place where they grabbed Janine only 2 days after being released. Scum like this should not be allowed to go on take up taxpayers money when we have spastics on parole boards that allow filth like this to be released.
> I can tell you right now if any of these girls were my daughters i would not rest until i put a bullet between the eyes of the people who did this. I'm all for the death penalty.
> 
> Simone.



I don't know about every case, but Gandhi was right when he said 'an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind'. Mulitple murders, fine. Danger to society after one murder, keep them locked up because the executioner would be doing the exact same thing as the murderer. Besides, people who use cruelty in murder are often sociopaths or have some sort of other mental illness. I'm not saying release them for that reason, obviously the have to be kept away from society to protect society, but I know I wouldn't want my daughter killed if she killed another person because she had no idea what she was doing, or, she was sociopathic and couldn't have any sense of feelings about the situation.


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## cris (Jan 7, 2007)

It would be pretty simple really if you dont want to get executed dont kill anyone, if you kill someone it is taken that you want to be executed, simple.


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## Hetty (Jan 7, 2007)

The executioner would have a lot of blood on his hands.


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## cris (Jan 7, 2007)

thenothing said:


> The executioner would have a lot of blood on his hands.



Not if they are mentally suited there job, some ppl would say i have blood on my hands for killing thousands of animals, but i would just think such ppl were idiots and it wouldnt bother me at all.

Hey they could just get some dumbass from the army they are trained to kill ppl for there job


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## Hetty (Jan 7, 2007)

cris said:


> Not if they are mentally suited there job, some ppl would say i have blood on my hands for killing thousands of animals, but i would just think such ppl were idiots and it wouldnt bother me at all.
> 
> Hey they could just get some dumbass from the army they are trained to kill ppl for there job



Who could be "mentally suited" to killing people? Moreso, who could be mentally suited to killing people who didn't know what they were doing because of a mental illness? What about revenge crimes - say someone killed my kid so I went an killed them, should I die because I did what the executioner would do anyway?

I don't have any kids but this seems to be the line people like using here so I'll use it too. I think if I had a kid I'd feel maternal enough towards him/her to want that person to pay for what they did, but under your understanding if I killed them myself I would in turn be killed.


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## mrmikk (Jan 7, 2007)

johnbowemonie said:


> You can't tell me that Anita Cobby's killers or Janine Baldings killers dont deserve the death penalty for what they did. What about Ebony Simpson, the little girl who was molested then thrown into a dam to drown pleading for her life only to have her killer join the search party trying to find her. What if Ebony Simpson was your daughter? One of the men involved in Janine Balding's murder got released on parole only to try abduting another woman from Sutherland station- the same place where they grabbed Janine only 2 days after being released. Scum like this should not be allowed to go on take up taxpayers money when we have spastics on parole boards that allow filth like this to be released.
> I can tell you right now if any of these girls were my daughters i would not rest until i put a bullet between the eyes of the people who did this. I'm all for the death penalty.
> 
> Simone.


 
I agree with you Simone, and I will go one step further, probably ramping this debate in the process. Non-humans like those responsible for killing Anita Cobby, Janine Balding, Keyra Steinhardt, Ebony Simposn, et al don't deserve death, nor do they deserve a life of comparitive luxury in gaol. They should be inflicted with thew same kind of terrible, torturous pain, humiliation and degradation that they saw fit to inflict upon their victims. Death is too quick and too easy. Think of the last time you had a generaL ANAESTHETIC THat's what death by lethal injection would be like, except you don't wake up, of course.

Anticipating the response just remember the victims didn't ask for this, they were trying to innocently live their lives, the perpetrators however clinically and cold-bloodely set out to commit the vile acts they did, so before you bleeding hearts start whinging and complaining about how you see my proposal as barbaric, think about who takes these situations to the level where this kind of debate is generated. The perpetrator, yes that's right. If you still feel for them, put one of your loved one's names in the place of one of the victims I have named above, do you still feel compassion for these non-humans, if yes, you need to have a good hard look at yourself and start to question your own value systems.

Mikk


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## IsK67 (Jan 7, 2007)

mrmikk said:


> I agree with you Simone, and I will go one step further, probably ramping this debate in the process. Non-humans like those responsible for killing Anita Cobby, Janine Balding, Keyra Steinhardt, Ebony Simposn, et al don't deserve death, nor do they deserve a life of comparitive luxury in gaol. They should be inflicted with thew same kind of terrible, torturous pain, humiliation and degradation that they saw fit to inflict upon their victims. Death is too quick and too easy. Think of the last time you had a generaL ANAESTHETIC THat's what death by lethal injection would be like, except you don't wake up, of course.
> 
> Mikk



Wouldn't that just be lowering yourself to their level?

Caveo anarchy.

IsK


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## mrmikk (Jan 7, 2007)

IsK67 said:


> Wouldn't that just be lowering yourself to their level?
> 
> Caveo anarchy.
> 
> IsK


 
That is one popularly accepted view. 

However, with the rate of crime in society today, ask yourself, has our 'civilised' (I use the term very loosely) society with our rehabilitative approach toward dealing with offenders, made our society a better place to live, has it reduced the incidence of violent crime, has it lessened the incidence of recidivist offenders??? No it has not.

I am fully aware of studies showing that capital punshment does lnot ower the incidence of violent crime and does not allegedly act as a deterrent. However, capital punishment will and does, unequivocally completely eliminate recidivist behaviour (or repeat offenders) where it is used.

In anticipation of the argumet, 'what if the wrong person is killed for a crime?'

Well the chance of that happening in this modern world is virtually non-existent, even so, if capital punishment were re-introduced safe guads against this would be legislated for.

Mikk


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## Mayo (Jan 7, 2007)

My opinion is that for extreamly violent crime the death penalty is the best option. There should be set requirement's that would put a person into a death penalty catagory, and hightened burden of proof required. Touture is going to far, but if they are going to prison for life why should we pay for there retirement. Leathal injection is both quick and relatively painless (medium guage needle). Those convicted will never be released into the community again, what's more humane to keep them in a cell for the rest of there lives or to put them down as we would a dangerous pet dog. A viscious dog is put down why not a violent and dangerous human.


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## TOMatoPASTE (Jan 7, 2007)

i dont know why people are so willing to pay for injections, rope, bullets with their tax to give the most violent criminals a free ticket to a nice long sleep........... i wouild rather pay to let them rot in a jail for the rest of their lives

and on that point, we should get the ones 'deserving' the death penalty, lock them in a large, industrial, monotonous prison in one giant cell with all the torture tools they can dream of. they can then deal out a suitable punishment amongst themselves. 

the death penalty is pointless as stated earlier unless it is necessary to actually contain someone likey of violently attacking again. bring back torture! and no it isnt stooping to their level because it is serving them with an equal punishment for their actions, it is not attacking an innocent underserving of the pain!


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## IsK67 (Jan 7, 2007)

Mikk,

Thanks for your response. Well thought, unemotional and interesting to read.

IsK


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## IsK67 (Jan 7, 2007)

What was that movie called?

IsK



TOMatoPASTE said:


> i dont know why people are so willing to pay for injections, rope, bullets with their tax to give the most violent criminals a free ticket to a nice long sleep........... i wouild rather pay to let them rot in a jail for the rest of their lives
> 
> and on that point, we should get the ones 'deserving' the death penalty, lock them in a large, industrial, monotonous prison in one giant cell with all the torture tools they can dream of. they can then deal out a suitable punishment amongst themselves.
> 
> the death penalty is pointless as stated earlier unless it is necessary to actually contain someone likey of violently attacking again. bring back torture! and no it isnt stooping to their level because it is serving them with an equal punishment for their actions, it is not attacking an innocent underserving of the pain!


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## FAY (Jan 7, 2007)

I agree with the death penalty on one condition.....THAT THERE IS ABSOLUTLEY NO DOUBT that the said person is 110% guilty....I would hate to think how many innocent people have been executed......you can't bring them back if a mistake has been made!!

And if anyone killed my child...I don't care about any law...I would hunt them down and face the consequences!!!!


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