# The Crest of a Boyds Forest Dragon & its use.



## Southside Morelia (May 28, 2008)

Hey all,
I thought i'd post a couple of pics of my Boyds Forest Dragons having a friendly wrestle.
I don't know if it's been caught on film before as their pretty secretive. Toad and Saz and a few others may have, but I have never seen any!
Now I know what the crest is used for..lol
1st pic-come here, 2nd pic wanna wrestle, 3rd pic got a cigarette!
Cheers
Scott.


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## slacker (May 28, 2008)

Awesome. Congrats


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## mrmikk (May 28, 2008)

Great shots, geez they are nice lizards, they are really growing on me. Starting to see another enclosure being built soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Southside Morelia (May 28, 2008)

-aspidites- said:


> Awesome. Congrats


Congratulate the couple not me..lol
I think it's cool to document the actual copulation of the Boyds, I am researching them in captivity so a bit of a milestone for me actually catching them in the act and on film.
I know you like them too, their a cool herp.
Cheers
Scott.


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## Southside Morelia (May 28, 2008)

mrmikk said:


> Great shots, geez they are nice lizards, they are really growing on me. Starting to see another enclosure being built soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Just wait a bit mrmikk, I may have some for sale! lol


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## slacker (May 28, 2008)

haha. My bad. I retract my previous congratulations and instead offer them, more appropriately, to Mr and Mrs boydii ;-)

I don't think I've seen photos of them mating before either, come to think of it.

Good luck with 'em, Scott... hopefully we'll see you advertising some in the near future ;-)


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## Minka (May 28, 2008)

Congrats Scott, its looking good! Bet your happy  You let me know if you have any luck with them


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## Southside Morelia (May 28, 2008)

Minka said:


> Congrats Scott, its looking good! Bet your happy  You let me know if you have any luck with them


No probs


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## Southside Morelia (May 28, 2008)

-aspidites- said:


> haha. My bad. I retract my previous congratulations and instead offer them, more appropriately, to Mr and Mrs boydii ;-)
> 
> I don't think I've seen photos of them mating before either, come to think of it.
> 
> Good luck with 'em, Scott... hopefully we'll see you advertising some in the near future ;-)


Thanks asp, nice comment! 
It always makes me chuckle when you read the comment "well done", "good work" etc when animals breed. We don't do the work, that's nature and I can't take the credit, although, good husbandry plays a part i guess!
JMO...


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## Tim.Arm (May 28, 2008)

*Congtraz.*


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## Pineapplekitten (May 28, 2008)

hehe thats cool. do you have lots of leaves in your new enclosure over the palm peat? also when you first put the palm peat in it has a strong smell its a weird smell, that wont harm the littlies will it?

they are awsome shots scott..


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## Southside Morelia (May 28, 2008)

juliedamian said:


> hehe thats cool. do you have lots of leaves in your new enclosure over the palm peat? also when you first put the palm peat in it has a strong smell its a weird smell, that wont harm the littlies will it?
> 
> they are awsome shots scott..


Hey Julie,
Just an added extra for the aesthetics, I've found palm peat until it gets pretty old looks a bit alien and un-natural, so adding dead leaves like on the forest floor looks more like the natural habitat. LOL, i'm very anal!
What brand of coir or palm peat are you using? I find it has a neautral/earthy smell and not that strong, I wonder if you are getting the one with the slow release fertiliser in it? That's the type you DON'T want as it feeds any bacteria from droppings etc.
Cheers
Scott.


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## Pineapplekitten (May 28, 2008)

ooohhh i'll have to check that. im not sure, what is a good brand to use? the guy said it is fertiliser free but i'll make sure.

thanks


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## Southside Morelia (May 28, 2008)

To be honest, I don't know the brand, it's the only coir block I have seen being sold, so I would assume you have the same brand...
Although in "that" brand, there are 2 types and one of them DOES contain a slow release fertiliser. When I go up the road in the next day or so, i'll suss it out and let you know. If it doesn't smell organic or palmy...lol, if you know that smell, I reckon it's the one with fertiliser.
Cheers
Scott.


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## mias (May 28, 2008)

real cool do they get freindly like some of the lizards are they hard to care for now ive seen them close up thinking about them .thanks for posting them now i want some


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## Southside Morelia (May 28, 2008)

My male is real friendly! I can pat him under his dewlap and he seems to enjoy it or at least tolerate it.
I often feed them by hand and they never run away, although the girl is more timid.
I'm looking forward to having a colony so I can see the hierarchy and interaction there.


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## FNQ_Snake (May 28, 2008)

Nice job mate. Great capture.


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## david63 (May 29, 2008)

Do you get dominance issues or are they only together during the mating season?

Cheers
dave


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## Southside Morelia (May 29, 2008)

david63 said:


> Do you get dominance issues or are they only together during the mating season?
> 
> Cheers
> dave


 Hey Dave, 
These guys have been together all their lives (now 18ish months old) and to be honest have had no issues with dominance over one another...except when feeding, the male is alot more aggressive towards his food and wants to eat first. Other than this, they have lived an unbelievably peaceful lives together. I have heard that males in cohabitation do show this trait though.
Cheers
scott


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## congo_python (May 29, 2008)

good work scotty well done mate. 

Congo


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## Southside Morelia (May 29, 2008)

congo_python said:


> good work scotty well done mate.
> 
> Congo



Cheers Kurt, now get back to work lol...


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## slacker (May 29, 2008)

Not to contradict Scott, but I believe (based on my very limited experience with boydii), that dominance can be an issue, even in young, sexually immature, boydii. I'm definitely not saying always, as it seems to be an exception rather than the rule, but it's a possibility.

I would suggest that anyone planning on getting more than one of these take into account the possibility that they may need to be housed separately, as mine currently are.

Also note that mine have been separated for some time, due to dominating behaviour from one of the two. It is possible that had I left them together, they would have sorted it out themselves and then continued on in peaceful co-habitation, but I chose to separate immediately to prevent any issues.

As for handling, I very much consider mine to be "look but don't touch animals," more so than most of the other reptiles I keep. One of mine I could possibly get accustomed to handling, if I was so inclined, the other is very skittish and I believe any regular, non-essential handling would be to her detriment. It's probably an individual thing though.


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## david63 (May 29, 2008)

That was my concern Aspidites, I've been doing some reaserch in preparation to buying a pair & with my other Dragons I've always had to separate them.

Dave


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## callith (May 29, 2008)

very cool


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## Chris1 (May 29, 2008)

awesome pics!

thanks!


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## Southside Morelia (May 29, 2008)

Yeah I agree asp, that's why i'm looking forward to having a colony to experience what you have witnessed and see if it is purely sexually related or what...My bet's still on 2 males....
Maybe asp, you just have an "A" hole Boydii, there are humans like that, why not animals...lol
Your saga's been going on for what seems like ages, how old are they now?
Cheers
scott.


-aspidites- said:


> Not to contradict Scott, but I believe (based on my very limited experience with boydii), that dominance can be an issue, even in young, sexually immature, boydii. I'm definitely not saying always, as it seems to be an exception rather than the rule, but it's a possibility.
> 
> I would suggest that anyone planning on getting more than one of these take into account the possibility that they may need to be housed separately, as mine currently are.
> 
> ...


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## slacker (May 29, 2008)

It's certainly interesting, that's for sure. Finding out exactly what sex these guys are could offer an explanation for it, but that's some time off yet.

I got these guys about 4.5 months ago and off the top of my head I think they were 2-3 months old when I got them... or was it 3-4? Somewhere around there anyway. So they're approximately 6.5 - 8.5 months old now.

It's been a long time since I attempted to reintroduce them. I pretty much gave up on the idea, because every time I tried, the same things would eventually happen. Sometimes it took a few hours, sometimes it was immediate, but there was always conflict. I've probably posted this in other threads, but some of the behaviour noted was:

- "Aggressor" performing jerky, "violent" head-bobbing
- "Aggressor" gaping
- "Aggressor" chasing the other
- "Aggressor" licking the other
- "Aggressor" attempting to bite the other (I distracted it as it went in for the bite, and immediately separated them)

At this stage, I have no intention of attempting a reintroduction in the near future. The submissive one has ceased eating voluntarily of late (while the aggressor is still powering down food and they're both kept in EXACTLY the same setup) and is being assist-fed at this point. I'll only even consider attempting to reintroduce them after the submissive one is eating voluntarily and has been for some time.

I'm very keen to find out what sex they are, because, as you suggest, it could be indicative of two males... although the age at which this was noted makes that seem a little odd; certainly still a possibility that it is gender related though.

That leads me to a question... I have heard rumour that there is some sexual dimorphism in boydii and that they can be sexed visually as they near maturity. I've been unable to find out any specifics, other than their vents are supposedly of a different shape. Everything else I've heard indicates that there is no sexual dimorphism. Have you heard anything concrete about this, Scott?

Cheers,
Lee


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## Southside Morelia (May 29, 2008)

I guess Lee, when you look at the pics there is definitely some sexual dimorphism there, you can clearly see the difference... When I picked these 2 from a tub full of them at 3 months old, I actually had an educated guess based on my experience with [FONT=arial,sans-serif][SIZE=-1]*Hypsilurus spinipes *and luckily my choice was good.
I'll be interested to note the obsevations on a larger scale and see if I just fluked this choice. lol 
Cheers
Scott
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## Southside Morelia (Jul 10, 2008)

Update...
Here's a result of the action previously documented. A small clutch of 3 eggs laid on 29.6.08.
I week later, the boy's back on the job...no time for rest for the girl hey!!!
And all you mums at home think you have it bad, imagine being a lizard! lol


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## Pineapplekitten (Jul 10, 2008)

oh that is sooo awsome.. what a champ!!


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## Southside Morelia (Jul 10, 2008)

juliedamian said:


> oh that is sooo awsome.. what a champ!!



LOL, depends on your point of view I guess! 

Thanks Julie...


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## congo_python (Jul 10, 2008)

Well done nice work Scotty !

Congo


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## Snakeaddict (Jul 10, 2008)

good luck man


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## richardsc (Jul 11, 2008)

awsome mate,good luck with the eggs,must be cool being aqble to keep them,hope the are added to the vic licencing schedules down the track,fingers crossed with your eggs and hopefully the follow up clutches


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## Jungle_Freak (Jul 11, 2008)

Congrats mate,
you have good timing ,catching them mating and now the female laying,
keep them pics coming

cheers
Roger


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