# Perspex instead of glass?



## wildthings (Jul 21, 2013)

G'day, well I had so much fun doing the last one (enclosure), I'm going to do another one for my two new jungles girls. What I'd to know is, has any one used UV stabilized perspex in place of glass?


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## Rogue5861 (Jul 21, 2013)

wildthings said:


> G'day, well I had so much fun doing the last one (enclosure), I'm going to do another one for my two new jungles girls. What I'd to know is, has any one used UV stabilized perspex in place of glass?



If sliding doors and for a snake I wouldn't recommend it. They will flex the Perspex and escape.


Rick


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## Virides (Jul 21, 2013)

Acrylic is prone to scratching, but if you are careful, you can have the panels forever without a scratch. Depending on the thickness (typically if you are using 4-5mm) the panels can flex when the snake or lizard tries to squeeze through the gap between the two panels where they overlap and escapes can occur.

Acrylic, while cheaper, has its drawbacks and glass while more costly, has its own drawbacks but it's advantages negate the problems of acrylic - much more difficult to scratch and won't flex.

If you get tempered glass, you have the added surface area strength but also the weakness of the edge. If you get foam strips from Clark Rubber that have an adhesive on the back, the impact of the glass edge on the enclosure will help ensure no accidental shattering of the tempered panel.


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## lizardwhisperer (Jul 21, 2013)

Perspex is a very good material for terrariums.


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## wildthings (Jul 21, 2013)

Hmmm had thought about the flex and I'm thinking of a way around it..... was more considering the weight than anything else and of course whether or not it leaches nasty stuff when it's warm, but I wouldn't have thought so, and hadn't thought about scratching it, yes you are right it is very easy to scratch it, oh well, I having to wait for someone to help lift the glass, it's sooo heavy when you had a bad back :/ Thanks guys, for your opinions


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## Lawra (Jul 21, 2013)

Depending on where you live Perspex can be great for temperature control. I have a friend who lives in Sydney and swears by it. 

They're no good for sliding doors though, as stated above. 

I use 5mm up here with a timber frame for a door front, because it was available and easier to use. I've heard it can warp though, just something to think about...


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## Virides (Jul 21, 2013)

wildthings said:


> Hmmm had thought about the flex and I'm thinking of a way around it..... was more considering the weight than anything else and of course whether or not it leaches nasty stuff when it's warm, but I wouldn't have thought so, and hadn't thought about scratching it, yes you are right it is very easy to scratch it, oh well, I having to wait for someone to help lift the glass, it's sooo heavy when you had a bad back :/ Thanks guys, for your opinions



What size is it?

Regardless of size, we have used acrylic on some of our displays for shows and we get the panels routered with 5mm radius corners to act like ski's so that the sharp edges doesn't catch on the track.


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## wildthings (Jul 21, 2013)

Not entirely sure yet, I have two buba's that will need more space that a click clack in a few months. I have a black melamine china cabinet that I want to fit out, have gutted it, now trying to decide exactly how to divide into two, which is the best way to divide it, horizontally or vertically..The interior size is 1000mmH x 680L x 390D


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## jakehendo (Jul 21, 2013)

I'm thinking of using perspex as a door for my incubator i am making, i have three shelves and am thinking of having a soild wood door with perspex inserts where the shelves will be just so i can look in without opening the door. will it hold its heat better then glass inserts? and where do you get perspex?


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## Virides (Jul 21, 2013)

Call me crazy but given that your space doesn't really allow for two jungles to have that vertical space and allow for 2 sets of sliding panels as the width of each division would be about 340mm. How about you have 2 sliding glass panels with the divider falling on the overlap of the two panels. When you want to access one side, the panel is drawn over to the opposing division and vice versa. Glass would work better in this instance as an acrylic piece of 1000mm high will easily flex/bow even if it was 10mm thick.

However you will also have a problem, potentially, with the panels being easily leveraged upon opening. This means that when you slide to open the panel, you will likely make the panel tip and it won't slide level. You can make up for this by having the finger grip for the panel less than 340mm from the bottom.

While you are reading this, I will spend some time doing up some diagrams of what I mean, which should clear this up


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## saintanger (Jul 21, 2013)

these are all perspex doors and work great, as said before they are no good for sliding doors but for doors like this they are great.


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## Virides (Jul 21, 2013)

jakehendo said:


> I'm thinking of using perspex as a door for my incubator i am making, i have three shelves and am thinking of having a soild wood door with perspex inserts where the shelves will be just so i can look in without opening the door. will it hold its heat better then glass inserts? and where do you get perspex?



A common misconception is that "Perspex" is the material, infact the material you are after is Acrylic - perspex is just a brand that has been widely attributed to the name used for acrylic. Acrylic can be sourced through any local sign shop as you are more likely to get a part of a sheet than you are at a distributor who will only sell full sheets (2400 x 1200mm).

If you are concerned about heat loss with glass, go double glazed. All this means is there are two panels of glass divided by an air gap. Go 3mm glass with a gap of 5mm. If you want to go acrylic, then the same principles apply.


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## jakehendo (Jul 21, 2013)

yeah that looks good how did you fix them to the wood?


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## jakehendo (Jul 21, 2013)

oh ok then does acrylic hold its heat well? and if so what thickness do you suggest?


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## saintanger (Jul 21, 2013)

this is how the perspex is held in place, they are screwed on so tight that they don't move at all.


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## wildthings (Jul 21, 2013)

I've been reading up a bit and the acrylic does keep the heat a bit better than glass and Virides I'm not so sure about the size of the cabinet either, but it's an in between small and large, the will be upgraded once they're big enough, so if I split in half horizontally that gives them 68cm x 37.5cm( need something at front so stuff doesn't fall out) of floor space and 45cm of height, is that still too small?


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## Virides (Jul 21, 2013)

Here is your enclosure with what I suggest:






Now for some of that mathsy stuff...





The *pink* line represents the "leverage arc". Suppose the panel caught on the opposing lower corner. The greater the arc from the pivot the greater leverage you have acting on the panel. You want this arc as small as possible.

The *green* line represents the angle of incidence from the point of action (your hand on the finger grip). The steeper the line the better.

The *orange* line helps show the relationship between the pivot and the point of action. The shorter the box the better.

Given this, of these examples, the best positioning for a finger grip on the panel would be Eg. 4. This finger grip's centre would be approximately 300mm from the bottom of the panel.

Coupled with having rounded or de-edged corners of the panels will help ensure no catching occurs. Also when opening a panel practice sliding parallel to the track and ideally slight downward pressure to keep the corner directly below the finger grip in contact with the track. The enclosure should also be place on a table or elevated so that when the finger grip is in its best position, it is also comfortable to grab. It will need to sit on something atleast 900mm high.


Ok so a bit of over-thinking on the way a sliding glass panel opens, but this was everything that I went through when designing our track. Pity it just cost too much to really keep up for sale.


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## SteveNT (Jul 21, 2013)

I gave up on perspex/ acrylic, it just gets too scratched up so in terms of viewing and photography I much prefer glass.


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## Virides (Jul 21, 2013)

jakehendo said:


> oh ok then does acrylic hold its heat well? and if so what thickness do you suggest?



I haven't delved into insulation a great deal, but as far as I understand it, the thicker the better. You are essentially trying to prolong the transferal of heat. It's based on physics and I am not going to even try explaining this one lol...


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## wildthings (Jul 21, 2013)

SteveNT said:


> I gave up on perspex/ acrylic, it just gets too scratched up so in terms of viewing and photography I much prefer glass.


I think at this point with all the info I now have(thanx virides) I'm more inclined to go for glass, I think the acrylic would be really good weight wise but the ease of scratching has put me off, I suppose there is nothing available to protect it with that wouldn't make viewing the snakes difficult, like a light tint?


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## Lawra (Jul 21, 2013)

Depending on where/how you're using it... But I'm not sure how it would get scratched.


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## wildthings (Jul 21, 2013)

Lawra said:


> Depending on where/how you're using it... But I'm not sure how it would get scratched.


you have a very good point lawra, I'm presently scratching my head thinking " What was I thinking"? not sure, anyhow, don't think the snakes would scratch it lol, so how else would it get scratched?


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## Virides (Jul 21, 2013)

wildthings said:


> you have a very good point lawra, I'm presently scratching my head thinking " What was I thinking"? not sure, anyhow, don't think the snakes would scratch it lol, so how else would it get scratched?



Aside from the obvious, like grabbing a compass and scratching graffiti into it, acrylic will scratch from simple dust, harsh cloth materials (jeans), cleaning (if you aren't using a lubricant as in metho or the like). It is not a question of "will it scratch just sitting there?" no... but simply that it is more prone to scratching since the hardness of acrylic is no where near that of glass.


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## justin91 (Jul 21, 2013)

Some very good points been made above.

Personally, I use perspex. In my new previous bearded dragon enclosure, (my own fault) I had some problems with glass. Went got it cut, took home.. Didn't fit my gap. I was not happy. I stuffed up the measurements completely. Rang up, gave em my new correct measurements. Took it home, and dropped a piece.. Was not happy. $80 down the drain so far. So I swore a bit, kicked a few things.. The usual stuff when your extremely angry. So I decided I'd go perspex again. Its been great so far. No flex in it because its not high enough and its 4.5mm thick. Any taller and it would flex.

But perspex is working for me. It might not for you so its entirely up to the situation your in and the design of your enclosure. 

(When I get my monitor I'll be going glass for sure)


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## Rogue5861 (Jul 22, 2013)

justin91 said:


> Some very good points been made above.
> 
> Personally, I use perspex. In my new previous bearded dragon enclosure, (my own fault) I had some problems with glass. Went got it cut, took home.. Didn't fit my gap. I was not happy. I stuffed up the measurements completely. Rang up, gave em my new correct measurements. Took it home, and dropped a piece.. Was not happy. $80 down the drain so far. So I swore a bit, kicked a few things.. The usual stuff when your extremely angry. So I decided I'd go perspex again. Its been great so far. No flex in it because its not high enough and its 4.5mm thick. Any taller and it would flex.
> 
> ...



Does you beardie not scratch at the walls or doors? I know mine does from time to time an glass suited for me, an the fact glass is normally cheaper then acrylic is a bonus.


Rick


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## Lawra (Jul 22, 2013)

Don't use metho or any sort of thinners, it will make Perspex cloudy. Lizards I can understand scratching it but not really snakes.


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## andynic07 (Jul 22, 2013)

This is a previous thread on perspex that will give you some information.

[h=1]Glass or Perspex???[/h]


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## wildthings (Jul 22, 2013)

andynic07 said:


> This is a previous thread on perspex that will give you some information.
> 
> [h=1]Glass or Perspex???[/h]


Thanks andynic07 I did have a look first but obviously missed it, some good info there too, thanks everyone, it sounds like too much hassle to go with acrylic, I'll stick with glass and be patient, and wait for help...shezz thanks again


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## justin91 (Jul 22, 2013)

Rogue5861 said:


> Does you beardie not scratch at the walls or doors? I know mine does from time to time an glass suited for me, an the fact glass is normally cheaper then acrylic is a bonus.
> 
> 
> Rick



Not yet lol. When he wants come out he kinda just leans his head against the door. Perspex was actually cheaper for me. The first bit of glass that didn't fit was $50, they gave me 50% off the second bit which I broke and the perspex was 30.


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