# Greens for 2.8k



## junglepython2 (Nov 5, 2008)

Latest add on Herptrader has GTP's at 2.8k non-feeding. Now who said prices wouldn't drop


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## horsesrule (Nov 5, 2008)

Anyone that would pay that for a non eating animal is a clown. 

I wouldnt pay $500 for one that wasnt eating.


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## junglepython2 (Nov 5, 2008)

Well im sure there are plenty of clowns around then! $1000 extra just for an animal that is feeding is a lot.


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## Camo (Nov 5, 2008)

Thats pretty cheap and if you are an experienced feeder i dont think you would have a problem getting them to feed. Very good price. They are dropping a fair bit in price.


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## Camo (Nov 5, 2008)

junglepython2 said:


> Well im sure there are plenty of clown around then! $1000 extra just for an animal that is feeding is a lot.


Yes i am sure plenty of people will snap them up wether they are feeding or not.


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## whiteyluvsrum (Nov 5, 2008)

depends if you can get them to feed. someone will snap em up, get them to feed and when there good sell em for double.


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## horsesrule (Nov 5, 2008)

Some will also most certainly die!


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## whiteyluvsrum (Nov 5, 2008)

i wouldn't say certainly, higher chance than feeders. they could all survive, pythons can live a long time without eating.


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## Camo (Nov 5, 2008)

horsesrule said:


> Some will also most certainly die!


I would not say certainly either. There is a chance they will all feed and grow steadily like they should. Just because they are non feeders now does not mean they are destined for death.


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## Radar (Nov 5, 2008)

Yeah they can be finicky, but if you're gonna be shelling out 2.8k for a python, I'd imagine you've had a little bit of experiance with getting snakes to feed.....its not exactly the sort of thing you'd go for as a first purchase.


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## moosenoose (Nov 5, 2008)

junglepython2 said:


> Latest add on Herptrader has GTP's at 2.8k non-feeding. Now who said prices wouldn't drop




It's genuinely all they are worth. Friends don't sell GTP's to friends for those ridiculous sums of money. I could think of far better things to throw that sort of money at, than one of the most lifeless of all pythons. Buy yourself a green rubber snake and stick it on a branch...sit back and enjoy :lol: Even at $2.8k it doesn't give me a tingling feeling below the belt hehe


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## Jason (Nov 5, 2008)

good price but its only VERY early in the season i think they'll be cheaper then that feeding in a few months. way to many being bred this season. ick a few up next year for 2K each i think.


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## whiteyluvsrum (Nov 5, 2008)

there worth as much as someone is willing to pay for.


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## Camo (Nov 5, 2008)

moosenoose said:


> It's genuinely all they are worth. Friends don't sell GTP's to friends for those ridiculous sums of money. I could think of far better things to throw that sort of money at, than one of the most lifeless of all pythons. Buy yourself a green rubber snake and stick it on a branch...sit back and enjoy :lol: Even at $2.8k it doesn't give me a tingling feeling below the belt hehe


I like that green rubber snake idea. Yeah they dont seem like one of the most active pythons.


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## BlindSnake (Nov 6, 2008)

horsesrule said:


> Anyone that would pay that for a non eating animal is a clown.
> 
> I wouldnt pay $500 for one that wasnt eating.


 
$500? REALLY?? If that is the case, I propose that it is YOU, who is infact the clown!!

Iv paid not too much less than that for a speccy (but not feeding) GTS!!!

Its called an investment.. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it dosnt.
How many ppl paid really high prices for GTPs that went on to die of prolapse or other probs??

Bet they wish they only spent $500, or even 2.8


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## Vixen (Nov 6, 2008)

I wouldn't buy one until I found out ALOT more about them going for that price, I don't particulary care about the price they are anyway, just makes them that much more special when you can finally afford one.


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## redcentrerodents (Nov 6, 2008)

*GTP's*

if anyone here wants some advice, 

find out when they hatched?

how many in the clutch?

how many survived?

if any have eaten yet?

have the one offered for sale even been offered food yet?

if so what type?

i mean, just because they are cheap, does not mean there is any problem with them.

could be, the breeder has alot and wants to ACTUALLY SELL ALL of them before all the GTP buyers have shelled out more, from others.

i beleive that come march / april, most breeders will negotiate a sale at these rates, even lower for numbers.

DO YOUR HOMEWORK FIRST, YOU MAY GET SOME GOOD ANIMALS.


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## horsesrule (Nov 6, 2008)

BlindSnake said:


> $500? REALLY?? If that is the case, I propose that it is YOU, who is infact the clown!!


 
Yet another example of personal insults. Well done.

Mods please remove.


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## BenReyn (Nov 6, 2008)

Geese, I hope the prices drop. I don't think there are any more attractive snakes on the aussie market compared to the GTP. Shame $2800 is considered cheap for these guys tho!


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## Retic (Nov 6, 2008)

I must admit even I didn't think they would drop that quickly but given the numbers being bred at the moment it was inevitable really. 
These animals come from a VERY well respected breeder.


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## Colin (Nov 6, 2008)

horsesrule said:


> Anyone that would pay that for a non eating animal is a clown.
> 
> I wouldnt pay $500 for one that wasnt eating.



I'll take half a dozen non feeding GTP's for $500 each thanks very much 

anyone? $500 GTP breeders PM me PLEEEEASEEEEE!!!!!


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## CodeRed (Nov 6, 2008)

Jason said:


> good price but its only VERY early in the season i think they'll be cheaper then that feeding in a few months. way to many being bred this season. ick a few up next year for 2K each i think.


 

yeah I reckon a lot of people are sitting back and waiting (hoping) that the price will drop towards the end of the season. I see no point to rush, there are heaps available.


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## trader (Nov 6, 2008)

boa said:


> . These animals come from a VERY well respected breeder.


 
 well said boa!


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## junglepython2 (Nov 6, 2008)

Jason said:


> good price but its only VERY early in the season i think they'll be cheaper then that feeding in a few months. way to many being bred this season. ick a few up next year for 2K each i think.


 
I agree, it wasn't long ago that anyone who said they will be under 4-5 grand in the next few years got flamed.


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## Retic (Nov 6, 2008)

And that Greens would hold their value longer than albino Darwins


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## Colin (Nov 6, 2008)

boa said:


> And that Greens would hold their value longer than albino Darwins



:lol: ha ha who said that? was it you Ash?


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## solar 17 (Nov 6, 2008)

*Gtp's 2800*

HORSESRULE... [ Anyone that would pay that for a non eating animal is a clown. 

I wouldnt pay $500 for one that wasnt eating. ] l personally feel everybody should be able to make a hobby / commercial decision without being villified on the internet and once again l personally believe something is worth what you will pay for it....cheers solar 17 [baden]


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## Retic (Nov 6, 2008)

No, definitely not, I said the exact opposite. 



Colin said:


> :lol: ha ha who said that? was it you Ash?


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## MrSpike (Nov 6, 2008)

Personally, I find it a shame they are starting to get so cheap. To me, they are one of the ultimate Australian Pythons and I would prefer to see them up around the 7K-8K mark still, and yes.. I would pay much more then that for a chondro. The same with any snake really, I prefer to see them towards the higher end of their market value simply because I think if they get too cheap the market for them will be stuffed. I hate to see any common python with a market value under $150, but thats just me. Hopefully some people will keep the prices up....

But in saying this, it is the persons decision to sell their snakes however cheap they want to.


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## dodgie (Nov 6, 2008)

horsesrule said:


> Anyone that would pay that for a non eating animal is a clown.
> 
> I wouldnt pay $500 for one that wasnt eating.



Thats just funny.:lol:


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## Emzie (Nov 6, 2008)

Hmm I sooo could but I think ill wait a little bit longer


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## herpkeeper (Nov 6, 2008)

MrSpike, yes it is a shame to see these animals just plummet so quickly in value, but when you have NON comercial breeders pumping out as much as they can breed with no reguard for the future of the hobby only their wallets and in some cases their ego's, than prices are sure to drop dramatically & will continue doing so until they bring in new laws to govern the amount of animals that "private" breeders are allowed to produce.


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## Jason (Nov 6, 2008)

they had to drop. the market isnt saturated yet but with the number that was bred this season compared to the number of prospective buyers, there are just to many. i agree its a shame they are dropping because they are amazing pythons but it will always happen to ANY class two animal that is desirable.... woma's, RSP's, GTP's. i think people will be blown away with the crazy prices some womas MAY sell for this season. there are so many around and again while they are popular and desired ther is likely to many for the market. until these animalsare dropped to class one the numbers being bred will drop substantially. If NPWS actually want these pythons to be kept in good numbers to help their endagered status they NEED to drop them. I for one am likely to hold back all my womas in the hpe they are dropped at the end of next year, ill sell them as yearling pairs that will be ready to breed to class 1 keepers. as for albino's i hopw they stay up but i think people overlook the impact the crazy number of hets are going to have on the market, why breeders are trying to pump out lots of hets amazes me!!! i think in a few seasons albinos may be alittle harder to sell cause everyone will have hets and just wait to breed there own.


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## Kersten (Nov 6, 2008)

If someone started posting about how their newly purchased non feeding hatchling had died when they couldn't get it to feed there'd be a rush of people posting to say how irresponsible the breeder had been to sell non feeding snakes.

Surely whether the snake is a coastal or a cheap GTP the premise is the same? Am I oversimplifying?

That being said, if you're willing to shell out for a non-feeding snake and you know enough to be aware of the risk involved. I'd just be a bit worried for those who are a little more cashed up and a little less exprienced or knowledgeable about GTPs.


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## herpkeeper (Nov 6, 2008)

Kersten, isn't Micheal Jackson well respected ???


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## Emzie (Nov 6, 2008)

I think when the prices drop less people are going to be interested in them anyway

The fact they are so expensive is why most people won’t one, people are attracted to expensive things


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## Kersten (Nov 6, 2008)

I don't know herpkeeper.....would he really be by now? :lol: I withdrew the question though, as it doesn't matter.


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## Sturdy (Nov 6, 2008)

personlly GTP's are a handful to keep from what ive heard around. 

the prolapse is what concerns me..... however is it logical that a prolapse can be avoided by feeding smaller food items?

there's a discussion topic.


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## vitticep (Nov 6, 2008)

What VERY respected breeders sells non-feeders?

I think the GTP pricing for non-feeders is panniky first time breeders,
They have tried - cant get them feeding - looking for a mug to buy them,

How old are they? - If I was to buy non-feeders I would want them pre-shed.
Not after some hack has 'had a go' at it,


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## Emzie (Nov 6, 2008)

They way I read it was that there not refusing feed its just as soon as they have there fist shed there up for sale, you could get one that feeds and always will feed.


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## herpkeeper (Nov 6, 2008)

sturdy, GTP's are not a handfull to keep, they just require a bit more attention to detail & although they are not as active as some other pythons, it basically boils down to individual preference to what you want to keep, i myself find them a very rewarding species


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## Jason (Nov 6, 2008)

GTP's are not that hard to keep, feeding small prey items is imo some what responsible for prolapse. giving a hatchling pinkies for the first 6 months of there lives (as many first timers do) doesnt supply the animal with much calcium, which means not as good muscle tone or development. i reckon a couple of pinkies to get them started then straight onto fuzzies. hair and nails for a little roughidge as well as bone etc for more calcium etc, the overall nutritional value of a fuzzy is WAY better then a pinkie. once on fuzzies if you want to keep to small food items just stick with a fzzie every 10 days for the first 6-8 months. If you talk to keepers and breeders in the states they will tell you that alot of the greens are overfed and fat! i have been told that alot of them like to breed girls at 800g - 1000g, anymuch bigger is overweight in there opinion. i know a coulple of guys with 18month old GTP's that are already 4 feet long and just about readt to breed. 
Dont get me wrong they arent as simple as a coastal but with abit of reading etc they arent hard to keep.


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## viridis (Nov 6, 2008)

Fisrt post in about 12 months so here go's

Why is it such an issue with the prices that I am selling my Chondro's for? These come from some of the calmest lines available , which after many clutches are 100% prolapse free. I have Green Pythons from 4 different lines and continue to produce healthy hatchlings with no dramas.

There are many keepers on this forum that have purchased Green Pythons from me in the past who will all reccomend animals from me.

The price seems to be a touchy subject to those who have lashed out and ''invested' in Green Pythons in the past and are yet to breed them and make a ''profit'' from their animals

All animals can be sold either unfeeding straight after their first shed which is no more then two weeks old or buy feeding animals which have had multiple un assisted feeds and a minimum of two sloughs.

The price is what I feel fit for this season and is suited to the number that I have available.

I have bought bought 8 un feeding animals in the past, all of which were successfuly raised with out any major problems. These animals were 12 weeks old and someone else's tricky feeders unlike the animals I am offering for sale which have never been offered food and like stated in the add, sold as soon as they slough for the first time.

Yes , some lines of Green Pythons are tricky to raise but some of the other keepers with the same lines as myself also have 100% problem free hatchlings available at the moment.

Last season I sold feeding animals for $4500 so a price drop of $750 in 12 months hardly seems unfit.

The price may seem cheap to some but I am in the position that I dont need to recoup dollars ect and anyone who thinks that my asking price this year is unreasonable is on drugs.

Like many other keepers, I look at ALL money made from reptiles a bonus and I would keep breeding Green Pythons if they were not worth a cent as they are my favourite reptile in the world.

Regards,

Nick


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## Pineapplekitten (Nov 6, 2008)

well said viridis. i totally agree, i dont see why other people should be so concerned about who sells their pythons cheap or not.


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## jasontttt (Nov 6, 2008)

there is a chrondo for sale onreptiles down under for 2500 and hatchies on another ad for 3000 , prices are coming down !


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## omg_a_gecko (Nov 6, 2008)

....I'll be proactive - at the rate they're dropping in price - I'll take them for free before you would have to pay to give them away, (i'm a good guy like that).


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## jasonryles810 (Nov 6, 2008)

hahah and everyone said i was an idiot with a crystal ball when i said they would be for sale at that price this season....hahahah


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## Sturdy (Nov 6, 2008)

personlly id like a green.... BUT

just heard many many nightmare storys about dodgy wildcaughts/ an husbandy head aches.


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## craftsman (Nov 6, 2008)

There are greens and there are greens.
If the price is all that matters - go for it! 
In two weeks time i will publish (on this forum) data on my new generation of GTPs: 

*egg's* weight: mean, median, mode, range
fertility: %
hatching rate: %
*neonete's* weight: mean, median, mode, range
congetinal defects: %
prolapse history in juveniles: %
prolapse history in parents: %
references from previous buyers

Those of you who appreciate quality over price will have the opportunity to compare with what other breeders produce (if they'll be willing to such details).


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## viridis (Nov 6, 2008)

New generation Greens! Look out are they like the X men or something?


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## TrueBlue (Nov 6, 2008)

jason, sorry mate but i disagree with that.
IMO feeding baby greens large well developed food items, especially to often, will increase the chance of prolapse. Pinkies are easy to digest and pass whereas more developed prey items are harder to digest and pass. this can and does cause prolapse.
Every 10 days when young is, imo, a bit to often as they will spend most of that time doing nothing but digesting food. If feed every 2 weeks or more thou they will have a chance to become active,( well as active as greens can be), which will build muscle tone etc to stop possible prolapse.
Any line of greens can and will prolapse if feed to much to often.


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## viridis (Nov 6, 2008)

I have to agree with Rob. Small regular feeds are the way to go


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## hazzard (Nov 6, 2008)

I rarely post anymore, but craftsman your delivering nothing but a marketing ploy. I for one would by animals from Nick before yourself. He has an established trusted reputation, you are trying to build one on here. Nothing wrong with that however your below statement is misleading at best 

In this particular case the animals are of top quality not inferior as you elude to. 

*"There are greens and there are greens. If the price is all that matters - go for it!"* 

Some people are just prepared to let go animals at a reasonable rate, this particular breeder happens to have a history of that and a good reason for doing it in this case. 

Good luck with your marketing strategy craftsman, but to others these are a steal from this breeder at this price. 

Cheers Hazz


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## craftsman (Nov 6, 2008)

Hazzard, you can buy your animals from whomever you like, that's your privilege. Your accusation is way off the mark! Marketing strategy? Yes! Another of my marketing strategies is that I will not push my babies but keep them till they are 12 months old. Do you have a n issue with that too?

I am not suggesting that other GTPs are inferior, nor am I saying that my snakes are the best breed there is.
I am, however doing my best to produce the best I can and to offer buyers as much information as possible.
Yes, I am building my reputation as I go and knockers like you are not helping.


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## viridis (Nov 6, 2008)

craftsman said:


> There are greens and there are greens.
> If the price is all that matters - go for it!
> In two weeks time i will publish (on this forum) data on my new generation of GTPs:
> 
> ...


 
I have not been on APS for about a year so I may be a bit out of touch with the lingo.

What actually makes '' Your New Generation'' Green Pythons?

I would imagine that all of your records are similar to what every other herps records are?

I would love to see pics of the new generation Chondros in mention. Everyone that knows me on a personal level knows how obsessed with Chondros I am so if you have something exceptional going on , fill me in and I will be a buyer

Cheers,

Nick


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## redcentrerodents (Nov 6, 2008)

*GTP's for 2.8K*

Well, VIRIDIS should be congratulated for LISTENING to the MARKET and offering HIS animals for a fair and reasonable price!!!

I bet he sells all his this season, others will try to milk the TOP dollar price and sit on theirs for a long time, probably sell for less than advertised if you enquired seriously.

Like i and many others have posted before, it is always about SUPPLY AND DEMAND, as to what the GOING RATE will be.

As all animals become less exclusive, they become less expensive.(fact)

AND Craftsman, 

If you went down to a Holden dealership or a Ferrari dealership TODAY, they will both drop their price to make the sale.

They listen when the sales slow, move numbers at less Profit.

YOU WILL SEE MORE GTP BREEDER"S doing the same ..... and i don't even own a crystal ball

Native or NON Native, Prices are falling, others have Natives aswell you know.

I reckon we should start a POLL

to see how many people will actually be interested in buying GTP's

and how many can afford to buy GTP's this season.

more animals than sales i bet.

MOST BREEDERS WILL LET YOU BUY GTP'S NOT FEEDING, AT A SAVING.

JUST BECAUSE VIRIDIS IS, DOESN'T MEAN THERE IS ANYTHING WRONG WITH THEM.

*GOOD ON YA VIRIDIS*


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## Retic (Nov 6, 2008)

Nick, as you know I bought one of your greens and it was a magnificent animal and certainly wouldn't hesitate to buy more from you. 
The Greens we will see selling for above 'market price' are the high yellows, Mite phase etc. 
My personal opinion is that their price has been artificially high for awhile, at $3000 for a feeding hatchling any breeder would be making good money if that is the important thing.
Anyone who thinks Greens are difficult to keep is seriously kidding themselves.


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## CodeRed (Nov 6, 2008)

hazzard said:


> I rarely post anymore, but craftsman your delivering nothing but a marketing ploy. I for one would by animals from Nick before yourself. He has an established trusted reputation, you are trying to build one on here. Nothing wrong with that however your below statement is misleading at best
> 
> In this particular case the animals are of top quality not inferior as you elude to.
> 
> ...


 

Well said hazz. I know where my cash _*wont*_ be going


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## slacker (Nov 6, 2008)

boa said:


> Mite phase



If you want "mite phase" animals I'm sure there's a few around here who could give them to you free of charge ;-)


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## craftsman (Nov 6, 2008)

This is amazing! Did I mention my price? Did I argue that GTPs won't drop in price? Did I say that there is something wrong Nick's snakes? I sincerely wish good luck to every breeder and every buyer in their endeavours and won't be envious if they sell all their snakes tomorrow - yes, good on you viridis!

In the past, people wanted to know the size and weight of my eggs/hatchlings. When I asked them what are they going to compared with, there was a long silence. I'll be offering genuine data, which by the way may not represent the heaviest and healthiest lot in all the clutches out there. At least people will be able to see and compare. 

I am going to grow my snakes to yearling age not because I want to "milk top dollar" but because experience tells me that that is what most buyers prefer; advanced, sexed snakes. Sold with 12 months of husbandry records will hopefuly eliminate any arguments that my snakes were neglected or in poor condition should any of them die in their new owner's care. Call it "covering my back" if you like, the way I see it, both parties will benefit.
By the way Mick, I am droping the price too.

Nick, by new generation, I mean this year's hatchlings. The same terminology we use for humans; your father is the old generation, you are the currest one, you kids will be the next generation. No, my "new generation" is nothing out of this world (I wish it was).


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## viridis (Nov 6, 2008)

Not everyones cup of tea but I like them lol. 

I like all greens though even this ugly duckling as the family call her.


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## No-two (Nov 6, 2008)

I quiet like the "mite phase" Every animal on your site is impressive Nick, bar that one  Sorry.


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## herpkeeper (Nov 6, 2008)

i would hardly call that an ugly duckling Nick !


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## Retic (Nov 6, 2008)

Now Nick...THAT is a Green


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## viridis (Nov 6, 2008)

She also bred this year Ash and I am hanging onto a few of those to replace breeders down the track. Glad you like her Mark


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## Sturdy (Nov 6, 2008)

i also like her too shes quite stunning.


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## Colin (Nov 6, 2008)

I like those "ugly duckling" greens Nick


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## junglepython2 (Nov 6, 2008)

herpkeeper said:


> MrSpike, yes it is a shame to see these animals just plummet so quickly in value, but when you have NON comercial breeders pumping out as much as they can breed with no reguard for the future of the hobby only their wallets and in some cases their ego's, than prices are sure to drop dramatically & will continue doing so until they bring in new laws to govern the amount of animals that "private" breeders are allowed to produce.


 

What's wrong with NON-commericial breeders pumping out animals? I think you will find it's the commercial breeders who are more interested in lining there wallets. I don't see a problem with prices falling and letting the average keeper enjoy these animals. Why should it be reserved only for the elite keepers?

I think what Nick has done is fantastic.


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## shaggymelb (Nov 6, 2008)

well...if I was looking for a GTP I woul;d be far more worried about outlaying $2-3000 than the 7000 I've seen them advertised for elsewhere.
Just imagine how long this thread would be if you offered them for $500 viridis!


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## shaggymelb (Nov 6, 2008)

oops...I mean less worried...I shouldnt post after night shift...hehehe


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## cruester (Nov 6, 2008)

It's about time the price of exotics dropped


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## herpkeeper (Nov 6, 2008)

JP2, No there's nothing wrong with greedy people saturating the market is there? and the forums filling up with, my chondro won't eat, my chondro is sick, my chondros blowing bubbles, please help me with my cheap impulse purchase ect ect. the new bearded dragon LOL
& by the way, Nick knows i wasn't having a shot at him ! are you one of these who are producing more than the market demand ? if not, don't take offence !


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## Brent (Nov 6, 2008)

*GTP selling price who knows?*

What I want too see is quality GTPand good quality (pythons) being bred in Australia in the future sell for areasonable prices to keep this market healthy. I believe that breeders who produce GTP will always have a market. I do not think that they are difficult to keep as I have seen some in captivity and as a breeder and keeper of other pythons I believe that they do not require too much effort , as always just do the research on GTP requirements. I would expect that people with experience with feeding and raising non feeding pythons/hatchies like BHP would not hesitate to purchase at this price.They are offered non- feeding I understand just after first shed that is fine. What I do not want to see is the market reach saturation point with too many pythons are being bred and not enough buyers available as other have stated what then? Maybe some control by EPA who knows? but all States differ in legislation.
I think that the price is a reasonable price on offer in todays market and when a breeder produces unusual quality or higher quality GTP then they will advise us. I would like evidence and data to back up statemants as well. When we can see different quality GTP then I would pay a higher price for a GTP. People have stated that they have purchased from this seller and are pleased with the quality produced ,that is enough for me to follow up on if need be. We all know that there is no price control, it is a free fair trading market place as others stated.
I find it interesting just watching the prices of all pythons on offer and looking at quality in relation to prices this just makes the hobby more interesting for me anyway.
Just my opinion on this continuing interesting subject the *GTP! and price!


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## amazonian (Nov 6, 2008)

Personally I would prefer to pay extra for a well established advanced hatchling with complete record data.
Provided everything was as it should be (no prolapse, good sheds, fed small prey at longer intervals etc) then I would be more confident in the animal being an easy member to establish in my care with little to no future issues. You also have less time to wait for colour change, less time to wait to sex them & gentle handling (cage cleaning, medical etc) is less of a problem then with a hatchy. Prolapse is also more a concern in hatchlings while they are still in that fragile state. Not saying it is void in adults, but more care is usually needed with Hatchies IMO.

Bottom line, I would rather a 10 month old that has never prolapsed and has not missed a meal over a new born that has never fed & has no history about it (especially if the non feeding breeder is a first timer or dosn't have the past GTP breeding experience to reference his stock from other keepers/buyers of previous clutches)


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## ihaveherps (Nov 6, 2008)

Missed this post last night, so I will throw my 2 cents in now. Any controversy over these animals is totally crap. Having dealt with Nick, I without hesitation back animals from his collection 100%, his greens includued. He has priced his animals as he sees fit, and has allowed people who back their husbandry the option of taking on animals at a discounted price, this isnt as unusual a practice as it seems. I cant knock the bloke, his animals, actually, cant talk of either highly enough. I am pretty sure theres not many out there who have dealt with him, know him, that feel any different than I do. If these animals interest you at these prices, I cannot think of any reason not to snap them up.


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## amazonian (Nov 6, 2008)

Just to clear up incase my intentions were misconstrued, I was not making my post in regards to Nicks pricing. I think it's great he is making GTP keeping an option for those that could not afford the higher outlay.

My post was more so to do with those knocking Craftsman's preference to sell older animals.
I simply stated my own personal opinion as to which I would prefer and hopefully this pointed out that perhaps Craftsman isn't selling older animals just to make more money, but maybe he has the best interest of the new keeper in mind and wants to garuntee they will recieve an established feeder with no past issues etc.

End of the day it comes down to personal choice, IF I could not afford to purchase yearlings then hell yeah I would jump at Nicks offer. But as I do have the money I can afford to be more anal about my selection.


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## Lewy (Nov 6, 2008)

*A friend of mine has just got a pair of GTP of craftsman and i can tell u they are 2nd to non they are absolutely beautiful Genuine Australian GTP *

*I have found that a lot of the cheaper lines are not the Australian line but the Papua* *New Guinea line*

*I'm not saying that this is what is happening here *

*That's my 2 bob worth*

*Lewy*


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## Ramsayi (Nov 6, 2008)

Lewy said:


> *A friend of mine has just got a pair of GTP of craftsman and i can tell u they are 2nd to non they are absolutely beautiful Genuine australian GTP *
> 
> *I have found that a lot of the cheaper lines are not the australian line but the Papua* *New Guinea line*
> 
> ...



Hey Lewy,
What is the history of the greens your friend got that guarantees them as 100% aussie?

Nick,
Good on you for putting some up under the usual market value.

Everyone else keep in mind that just because one breeder decides to sell a few animals a fair bit cheaper than they usually go for doesn't necessarily mean that its going to set the market rate.


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## herpkeeper (Nov 6, 2008)

so lewy, what you are saying is non native are inferior ??? and you base this on ???


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## whiteyluvsrum (Nov 6, 2008)

gee, this thread has taken off like wild fire!


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## Lewy (Nov 6, 2008)

herpkeeper said:


> so lewy, what you are saying is non native are inferior ??? and you base this on ???


 

Why is it that people go jumping to conclusion on this site??

I never said that at all, All i am saying is that not all sellers sell Australian GTPs (nothing wrong with that)

Its no different than say BHPs, People will pay more for different lines of them it doesn't make them less of a snake just a difrent line


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## TrueBlue (Nov 6, 2008)

boa, sorry but i disagree on the mite fase being more expensive. Most people i know that keep greens or are looking to buy them dont like or wont mite fase greens, simple as that. So imo they will probally sell for less than other forms of greens.
The pure aussie greens and the more pretty forms of greens will pull the bigger money imo, not ugly mite fase greens.


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## Retic (Nov 6, 2008)

The overwhelming majority of Greens sold here AREN'T native, I'm not the worlds number 1 fan of Greens but I personally wouldn't pay extra for local animals, I have friends that have bought them and paid a premium for them and that is perfectly fine as it is their money. Look at some of the animals in Greg Maxwells book, they are the ones I like. 



Lewy said:


> I never said that at all, All i am saying is that not all sellers sell Australian GTPs (nothing wrong with that)


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## viridis (Nov 6, 2008)

Native Aussie Green Pythons are spectacular. There is not doubt about it, infact I think a nice Merauke is hard to beat.


Like all reptiles, locale is often highly desireable but I am focusing more towards the morph side of things in GTP's, hence the reasoning for the lines that I purchased initialy.

I know Craftsmans GTP's are Top Notch so to speak and when I buy Pure Aussies I will look into his animals.

Nick


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## craftsman (Nov 6, 2008)

...... and I would never say myself that natives are the best, prettiest or healthiest. They are what they are, some like them, some don't. 
As for the money side of things, I had a grand idea to breed native GTPs as a joint venture with the QPWS. Have they had a bit more vision and real perception of what contributes to conservation of species, I would have been able to offer you natives @$2,000.- today. My 37 page proposal submitted in 2002 included research, conservation and commercial components (obviously - I was to bankroll the program) but the "commercial" bit lead to the ultimate rejection by the Deaprtment. I can't and don't want to go to more details but because my proposed program didn't eventuate, I had to find another way (a very expensive one) to get to where I am now, hence my prices....

By the way, I am now acquiring a few spectacular non-natives ... something for the future, so if you think I am hooked on natives and dislike others - you are wrong!

Thanks to those who supported me and my long-term goal.

Michael


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## Jason (Nov 6, 2008)

some of the exotic lines are mind blowing as are the natives. i must admit im not a huge fan of mite phase but i do believe designers are the future. high yellows, hig contrasts, blues etc are stunning. But i will definately get a pair of aussies in the near future.


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## CHONDROS (Nov 6, 2008)

ones like this will sell for higher prices she has just layed her eggs


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## viridis (Nov 6, 2008)

Just stunning CHONDROS!


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## Southside Morelia (Nov 6, 2008)

junglepython2 said:


> What's wrong with NON-commericial breeders pumping out animals? I think you will find it's the commercial breeders who are more interested in lining there wallets. I don't see a problem with prices falling and letting the average keeper enjoy these animals. Why should it be reserved only for the elite keepers?
> 
> _*I think what Nick has done is fantastic.*_


 My sentiments exactly...


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## Retic (Nov 6, 2008)

I agree, that snake is stunning.


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## Lewy (Nov 6, 2008)

CHONDROS said:


> ones like this will sell for higher prices she has just layed her eggs


 

That's a bloody good looking GTP

Lewy


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## Southside Morelia (Nov 6, 2008)

Ramsayi said:


> Hey Lewy,
> 
> Nick,
> Good on you for putting some up under the usual market value.
> ...



Unfortunately it usually does...eventually. Although i'm all for it, bring it on, as i'm skint from last seasons purchases and I want a pair now!!! lol

But I also like how NIck has offered feeding as well as non, good work man!


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## Jungle_Freak (Nov 6, 2008)

For many many years the GTP breeders have asked high prices for this beautiful species .
Its great that they are coming down to a more reasonable price for more people to enjoy .
good stuff Nick.
About time too.

Roger


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## patience (Nov 6, 2008)

seems cheap and if you have the experience with tricky feeders may just work out!


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## herpkeeper (Nov 6, 2008)

i suppose there is an upside to the decrease in their market value, they won't be such a lucrative animal for scumbags to smuggle anymore & that's got to be a positive ???


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## junglepython2 (Nov 6, 2008)

herpkeeper said:


> JP2, No there's nothing wrong with greedy people saturating the market is there? and the forums filling up with, my chondro won't eat, my chondro is sick, my chondros blowing bubbles, please help me with my cheap impulse purchase ect ect. the new bearded dragon LOL
> & by the way, Nick knows i wasn't having a shot at him ! are you one of these who are producing more than the market demand ? if not, don't take offence !


 

Hahaha, please tell me what's the difference between 'greedy' people saturating the market compared to commercial breeders saturating the market.?

All those problems you have stated are generally due to inexperienced keepers and nothing to do with who bred the animal. Sure there are shonky breeders out there but usually there post sales support is excellent. And don't worry I didn't take offence


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## wokka (Nov 6, 2008)

All those problems you have stated are generally due to inexperienced keepers and nothing to do with who bred the animal. Sure there are shonky breeders out there but usually there post sales support is excellent. And don't worry I didn't take offence[/QUOTE]

The difference is that most breeder, including Nick I am sure, will only sell non feeding animals to experienced keepers. It is the desperate sellers and smugglers who sell to anyone at any price causing the dissappoinment with new keepers. There is no doubt from my experience in getting 1000s of hatchlings feeding that Greens followed closely by Bhps and RSPs offer the biggest challenge which may lead to the ultimate dissappointment.


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