# Changing rat bedding



## mathal (Feb 5, 2012)

Hi all,

I have started breeding rats, and they have all given birth a few days ago and I was wondering about changing the bedding. Some sites say not to change it while the pups are still young, some say it's ok to change it...

What do people here do? Is it ok to remove the mother, gently pick up the pups, change the bedding, replace the pups and mother??

Thanks in advance.


----------



## JS974 (Feb 5, 2012)

I change mine all the time and never have an issue, I try not to change the bedding on the day they've had the pups themselves when they are first time mums.


----------



## Jay84 (Feb 5, 2012)

I have never had any issues with cleaning my rats out after they have given birth.

I have even taken the mother and babies out of the big group tub and placed them in a smaller tub and i've not lost any.


----------



## mathal (Feb 5, 2012)

Thanks all!! I'll give it a go.


----------



## Jay84 (Feb 5, 2012)

Rats are usually very good mothers.


----------



## -Katana- (Feb 5, 2012)

I'd just be careful about putting your hand in a tub with a rat mother with pups.

Some are very protective and some will bite and trust me it hurts 100 times worse than a python bite.


----------



## JAS101 (Feb 5, 2012)

-Katana- said:


> I'd just be careful about putting your hand in a tub with a rat mother with pups.
> 
> Some are very protective and some will bite and trust me it hurts 100 times worse than a python bite.


sure duz , that why i now wear a thick welders glove [ same type as i use for the lace monitor] . as i have had a rat bite through a leather riggers glove .


----------



## phantomreptiles (Feb 5, 2012)

I have only ever had one female bite, she was culled......


----------



## bowdnboy (Feb 5, 2012)

There pretty resilient little suckers..lol

my kidds are always taking pinkies out and nursing them (no matter how many times Ive told them not too), and the mothers take them straight back when put back in.

if youve got only 1 or 2 mums to be in a tub, (depending on the size of course), they should only need to be cleaned once a week anyway. U should be able to time it so that you have fresh bedding in their when she has them, allowing at least a few days after birth before the next clean. 
Ive found that over time and breeding out the biters, now mine rarely bite. Although my 8 yr old recently showed me on her finger that there is always an exception to the rule lol.


----------



## kr0nick (Feb 5, 2012)

I change my bedding either 1-2 days and I have changed the bedding on the days the pups were born. The only thing is watch that no pups are still attached to the after birth


----------



## JAS101 (Feb 5, 2012)

phantomreptiles said:


> I have only ever had one female bite, she was culled......


yeah this one rat was dispatched of straight after it happend  and her babys were put into the other tubs with mothers with no issues.


----------



## solar 17 (Feb 5, 2012)

Well l have a slightly different take, over the years l have found those "over protective" mothers to be great mums, l just give them a bit more repect and work with and around them...
....solar 17 (baden) :shock:


----------



## -Katana- (Feb 5, 2012)

solar 17 said:


> Well l have a slightly different take, over the years l have found those "over protective" mothers to be great mums, l just give them a bit more repect and work with and around them...
> ....solar 17 (baden) :shock:



I'm the same, Baden.
Some of my best producers are the biters. So long as she keeps producing and brings good sized litters to weaning then I'll keep her alive.

Production outweighs temperament issues any day.


----------



## goyathlay2 (Feb 5, 2012)

I change our bedding quite regularly and i have had no problems they are pretty hardy and very good mums


----------



## Rattler (Feb 5, 2012)

mathal said:


> Is it ok to remove the mother, gently pick up the pups, change the bedding, replace the pups and mother??


Sure it is. They just re-nest soon enough and i am sure they enjoy the clean conditions.


----------



## kr0nick (Feb 5, 2012)

Rattler said:


> Sure it is. They just re-nest soon enough and i am sure they enjoy the clean conditions.



Lol definate mate when ever I clean mine and refeed after work they are always happier by nightfall, I took my mother rats babies away 2 weeks after their eyes opened to see if they were weened and she was in the worst sooking mood I have seen lol and as soon as I put her babies back with her she was fine.
Sorry for the hijack does anyone know when rats can be weaned from their mother.


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 5, 2012)

kr0nick said:


> Lol definate mate when ever I clean mine and refeed after work they are always happier by nightfall, I took my mother rats babies away 2 weeks after their eyes opened to see if they were weened and she was in the worst sooking mood I have seen lol and as soon as I put her babies back with her she was fine.
> Sorry for the hijack does anyone know when rats can be weaned from their mother.



If you mean taken from the mother once there weaned it's around 4 weeks.


----------



## kr0nick (Feb 5, 2012)

Hey thanks aussie just what I was after
But they can all drink freely and eat by themselves so I thought A few weeks should be alright :S


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 5, 2012)

kr0nick said:


> Hey thanks aussie just what I was after
> But they can all drink freely and eat by themselves so I thought A few weeks should be alright :S



No worries, if there eating and drinking they should be fine.


----------



## wokka (Feb 5, 2012)

Aussie-Pride said:


> If you mean taken from the mother once there weaned it's around 4 weeks.



It is closer to 3 weeks as if the male is left with the mother she will get pregnant straight away and give birth in 22 day, so the first litter have to be independant so as not to take food from the new second letter.


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 5, 2012)

wokka said:


> It is closer to 3 weeks as if the male is left with the mother she will get pregnant straight away and give birth in 22 day, so the first litter have to be independant so as not to take food from the new second letter.



I've been keeping myn with the mother until around the 4 week mark with her having 2 large litters of 14 pups i think the extra week give or take can't be doing any harm and also I'm not in a rush for snake food, once I know they can 100% fend for them selves they get taken from the mother sexed and separated.


----------



## -Katana- (Feb 5, 2012)

That puts too much stress on the doe to produce milk for that many young...the older pups muscle the pinkies off the teats and it slows their growth.

I wean the moment I notice the new litter if she managed to get back into pup post partum. The doe's milk supply is in full flow and the new pinkies have full tight little bellies constantly.

I do a staggered weaning if there isn't a new litter within the 22 days.


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 5, 2012)

-Katana- said:


> That puts too much stress on the doe to produce milk for that many young...the older pups muscle the pinkies off the teats and it slows their growth.
> 
> I wean the moment I notice the new litter if she managed to get back into pup post partum. The doe's milk supply is in full flow and the new pinkies have full tight little bellies constantly.
> 
> I do a staggered weaning if there isn't a new litter within the 22 days.



So i should be taking the pups away earlier? or I should be culling them back to a smaller number? I'm not worried if it takes a bit longer for growth as I'm only feeding 6 snakes and I have two females going at a time and 3 of the 6 are on mice anywayz. 

Also once I know my two female rats are pregnant I remove the males until she gives birth and the litters are weaned and give her a week just to have a brake and so i don't get over run with to many.


----------



## -Katana- (Feb 5, 2012)

I would but I keep the male in with the female constantly. I'm also likely to cull a doe how has a history of not getting in pup post partum.
My tub ratio is 1:1..simply because my females are intolerant of their own kind.
I like to breed large numbers to stock my freezer for summer. I got caught out this season and I ran out, so this winter I'm upping the numbers of breeders so I'm not having to buy rats again. *ouch*


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 5, 2012)

-Katana- said:


> I would but I keep the male in with the female constantly. I'm also likely to cull a doe how has a history of not getting in pup post partum.
> My tub ratio is 1:1..simply because my females are intolerant of their own kind.
> I like to breed large numbers to stock my freezer for summer. I got caught out this season and I ran out, so this winter I'm upping the numbers of breeders so I'm not having to buy rats again. *ouch*



I'm also only using a ratio of 1:1 in each one of my breeding tubs but no constantly keeping the male in the same tub.. I'm only breeding on a very small compared to some of the setups Ive seen some people using on APS with me having only 3 females for breeding and the one male that I won't be killing because my gf picked him out and gave him a name and two separated tubs for each sex,this way if I need food I just grab one out and feed it freshly killed or if i want to swap one the female breeders, though I have now made a Co2 chamber so I will be starting to freeze soon once the rats get to the size I need.

ouch is a bit lite more like a joke, at my local pet shop it's cheaper to by 3 live adult rats then it is to get a bag of 4 dead small rats.


----------



## wokka (Feb 6, 2012)

Aussie-Pride said:


> I've been keeping myn with the mother until around the 4 week mark with her having 2 large litters of 14 pups i think the extra week give or take can't be doing any harm and also I'm not in a rush for snake food, once I know they can 100% fend for them selves they get taken from the mother sexed and separated.


If you do that the older weaned will steal the milk from the pinkies. Like most mammals the first milk contains clostrum which has antibidies to get the pinkies going. It is a waste to give that to weaners. Personally i think it is 'fairer" to give the does a break by not back to back mating but that will increase the number of tubs you need, which isn't that important when you only have a few rats.


----------



## Nezikah (Feb 6, 2012)

Our girls and boys are kept seperately. I have a litter only born last night, another due in the next 2 days with 2 only bred last week and 5 resting. We try to give all our girls a fair rest between breedings. I personally wouldn't want to be pregnant contstantly and I am pretty sure the rats wouldn't either!!


----------



## Aussie-Pride (Feb 6, 2012)

wokka said:


> If you do that the older weaned will steal the milk from the pinkies. Like most mammals the first milk contains clostrum which has antibidies to get the pinkies going. It is a waste to give that to weaners. Personally i think it is 'fairer" to give the does a break by not back to back mating but that will increase the number of tubs you need, which isn't that important when you only have a few rats.



sorry I should have made what I wrote more clearly, one of my female breeders has had 2 litters and both had 14 pups they were not at the same time, once they are weaned and fending for themselves they go into there seperate tubs one being for the males the other females. Once this is all over I give her time to rest and then once i find my popultion of rats is dropping I will put her into my males tub for a week give or take then put her in her own tub. This way I find she isn't going to be constaly pregnant and i don't get over run with rats. It may not be the way all the other rodent breeders do it on APS but I find it works well for me only having a small collection( 6 snakes well seven after the sarvo) and not needing hundreds of rats/mice.


----------

