# You can now apply for a NSW licence on-line



## DEC (Mar 3, 2011)

DECCW would like to announce that you can now submit an application for a class 1 Native Animal Keepers’ Licence or Import/Export Licence online at NSW Government Licensing Service.


You can also renew all classes of your AKL licence online at NSW Government Licensing Service. To renew your licence on-line you will need to have lodged your fauna record book and be in receipt of a renewal number which will be sent to you by Wildlife Licensing and Management Unit as part of the renewal reminder process.


Once received, your application will be processed and a licence sent to you in the post.


There is a discount on fees for people who use the online facility. 



Please email [email protected] if you have any problems with this service.


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## Peterwookie (Mar 3, 2011)

At what stage will the Record Books be in place on the Computer ?? will the DECC be entering all of the records from the last Keepers Book or will the licence holder have to add everthing them selves into the system


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## dickyknee (Mar 3, 2011)

Looks great , but I am trying to do a permit right now , adding the species code for my selected species does not work .... not off to a good start for me


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## Colin (Mar 3, 2011)

From recent personal communication I think the E-Book reptile keepers books are supposed to be online and ready for us to lodged in April. 

dicky.. I applied and lodged one this morning without any problems at all. I received the confirmation email with a PDF of the application after completion.


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## dickyknee (Mar 3, 2011)

I was hoping to do the same Colin , just wont take the species code for some reason.


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## Colin (Mar 3, 2011)

see the opening DECC post brett.. email them the problem your having and hopefully it will be resolved quickly.


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## hugsta (Mar 3, 2011)

dickyknee said:


> I was hoping to do the same Colin , just wont take the species code for some reason.


 
I assume you have double checked your species code on the DECCW website, I noticed recently a few had changed. Especially since I had not checked them in years.


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## zulu (Mar 3, 2011)

Colin said:


> From recent personal communication I think the E-Book reptile keepers books are supposed to be online and ready for us to lodged in April.
> 
> dicky.. I applied and lodged one this morning without any problems at all. I received the confirmation email with a PDF of the application after completion.


 
Hi colin, the magic question, "did you or did you not get the import export numbers" without that i might as well fax the application. 
It is possible that DECC is onley publicly servicing their own bank balance? 
They put price up by 10 bucks then offer me discount :lol: 
The DECC is a crazy "my people love me" loony Gaddafi Duck of the desert .


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## dickyknee (Mar 3, 2011)

Colin said:


> see the opening DECC post brett.. email them the problem your having and hopefully it will be resolved quickly.


 
All ready done , waiting on reply .



hugsta said:


> I assume you have double checked your species code on the DECCW website, I noticed recently a few had changed. Especially since I had not checked them in years.


 
Sure did , the code has not changed.

Logged out and back in , problem solved.


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## Bushman (Mar 3, 2011)

This is welcome news. Thanks DEC.


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## FAY (Mar 3, 2011)

Like I said, I will believe it when I see it.......about time I must say.

What we need now is a licence that is a credit card style (like drivers licence) that DOES NOT have you address on it. 
I will probably be pushing up daisies before that happens.


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## dickyknee (Mar 3, 2011)

This is what I got back , along with a PDF of the application receipt , so we still have to wait up to 14 days for the export number , then we still need to fill out the form and mail it back ... It's a good start though.

*Thank you. We have received your application.

Please allow fourteen (14) working days for the processing of your application.

When issued your licence will be mailed to you at your nominated postal address.

Please complete your import/export return sheet and send it to the relevant authority within 48 hours of purchase or disposal of your fauna.

A maximum penalty of $3,300 applies for supplying a false statement or providing misleading information in an application for a licence or certificate by an applicant.

Thank you for using the NSW Government Licensing Service.*


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## CodeRed (Mar 3, 2011)

FAY said:


> What we need now is a licence that is a credit card style (like drivers licence) that DOES NOT have you address on it.
> I will probably be pushing up daisies before that happens.



great idea Fay !!!


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## silverback (Mar 3, 2011)

nsw government were patting themselves on the back late last century about having achieved this Globalisation

call me a cynic but this is what the government agreed to achieve in 1999

*Extend range of services available on ServiceNSW:* Agencies will build on ServiceNSW as the common service point to government information and services by extending the range of available services, including interactive transactions. New on-line services nominated for implementation by agencies and through community consultation include: 

licences, registrations and applications
is it just a coincidence that there is an election in nsw in 16 days time and labor has no chance of retaining government. maybe some clerks want to make it look like they have done something in the last 12+ years.


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## FAY (Mar 3, 2011)

dickyknee said:


> This is what I got back , along with a PDF of the application receipt , so we still have to wait up to 14 days for the export number , then we still need to fill out the form and mail it back ... It's a good start though.
> 
> *Thank you. We have received your application.
> 
> ...




SO, the ONLY advantage is that you don't have to buy a stamp.........geebus progress is really moving along now....


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## dickyknee (Mar 3, 2011)

I normally fax mine Fay , so no stamp , I did save $3.00 doing it online though , so I am not complaining


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## zulu (Mar 3, 2011)

dickyknee said:


> This is what I got back , along with a PDF of the application receipt , so we still have to wait up to 14 days for the export number , then we still need to fill out the form and mail it back ... It's a good start though.
> 
> *Thank you. We have received your application.
> 
> ...


 
Yes they have done absoloutely squatt,wait 14 days is just an insult for what they charge!



dickyknee said:


> I normally fax mine Fay , so no stamp , I did save $3.00 doing it online though , so I am not complaining


 
Jees,they got you, have they taught you to roll over,fetch the stick,play dead :lol:


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## Psilo (Mar 3, 2011)

silverback said:


> is it just a coincidence that there is an election in nsw in 16 days time and labor has no chance of retaining government. maybe some clerks want to make it look like they have done something in the last 12+ years.



this


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## Grunter023 (Mar 3, 2011)

An improvement on the wait time for a import/export would be better. 2 weeks or longer is rediculous,especially when Victoria can get their's back in a few hours or a day after applying by fax. I avoid dealing with permits like the plague for this and other reasons.


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## onthillside (Mar 3, 2011)

I just applied for a new licence as I am moving from QLD to NSW. I found the process to be very easy and painless. Great work guys.

T


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## Ramsayi (Mar 3, 2011)

Unbelievable.The import/export side if things has done nothing except save someone at the department having to do paperwork(you are in effect doing it for them).
I guess this means if successful they can sack someone else provided there is anyone left there.What is the point of having a system where you "do it yourself" but still having to wait for the paperwork to be posted out weeks later?Another example of how totally useless DECC are when it comes to pet reptiles.To the rocket scientist who came up with this take a bow buddy!


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## Waterrat (Mar 3, 2011)

onthillside said:


> I just applied for a new licence as I am moving from QLD to NSW. T



You will regret your move. 

Seriously, look at the bigger picture; Qld and SA don't have any silly import/export permits and the systems in those states are working like a clock. This "improvement" obviously cost a lot of money; there is no guarantee that it will work and no benefit to you guys. 
Push for radical changes, not pissy improvements.


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## Pythoninfinite (Mar 3, 2011)

You are right Michael. This is window dressing. They must eventually get around to acknowledging that the licensing of captive bred common species is a totally pointless exercise, and devoid of any 'conservation' merit. The notion of tracking every captive bred reptile, from birth to death, across all state borders and all owners, is an absolute nonsense. What purpose does the collection and maintenance of all that information serve?

It interests me that DECCW watches the discussions here, and uses the forums when they feel they have an announcement which makes them look good. But, invite them to debate serious issues such as the Code of Practice and we are met with silence. And there are never names attached to the departmental offerings.

Moving the department into the electronic age should streamline the entire licensing system, but this is a joke. The whole thing could be done just as we do car licensing online, it could be immediate...

J


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## zulu (Mar 3, 2011)

onthillside said:


> I just applied for a new licence as I am moving from QLD to NSW. I found the process to be very easy and painless. Great work guys.
> 
> T


 
Wait until you have to do some imports or exports and the other guy in Queensland,victoria or South Australia gets there numbers almost straight away for free or a couple of dollars and you have to sit like a shag on a rock waiting.

What they are doing in NSW is stuffing everyone up with their inefficiency,nothing funny about it,they are damd annoying like cockroaches

Cant wait to get rid of this joke of a govenment,should be allot of sackings in the running of some of the departments after the policy makers are bye bye.


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## onthillside (Mar 3, 2011)

WOW thanks for the heads up guys! Looks like i'm for a big shock then when I move. QLD system is great and I hoped NSW would be just as good......looks like I was dreaming ha?

T


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## Bryce (Mar 3, 2011)

Yahoooo! great start it can only get better from here people.


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## Waterrat (Mar 3, 2011)

Bryce said:


> Yahoooo! great start it can only get better from here people.


 

I wouldn't hold my breath Bryce, it took them 12 years to get this bit done -too little, too late, not good enough! Heads will roll when the new Minister steps in.


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## Sock Puppet (Mar 3, 2011)

dickyknee said:


> I normally fax mine Fay , so no stamp





zulu said:


> Jees,they got you, have they taught you to roll over,fetch the stick,play dead :lol:


I've always saved a copy as pdf & emailed it to them with a request to return an email notification it was received (which they do).
I've only once done an import, but same deal, email a pdf then follow up phone calls got me the permit number in less than a week.
All my paperwork has been relatively quick (so far), & record books have been sent back early to avoid the glut of books for those who bother returning them annually. 
Still, this should make things easier, even if it's not going to be cheaper or quicker.


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## spongebob (Mar 3, 2011)

Am I mistaken or have they reduced the time to send in the return. Used to be 7 days but from dickyknees info it looks to be reduced to 48 hours?


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## LiasisKing (Mar 3, 2011)

its works awesomely... saved me about half an hour (printing, filling out, scanning etc.) and it gives you a reciept and a confirmation that they have recieved it (as opposed to assuming via email) 

The major improvement would be to be able to instantly print it off like QLD ... for the money they charge you could expect a lot more !


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## bkevo (Mar 3, 2011)

I was told today for an extra $30, my permit can be completed within 24 hours. They are a joke. $60 for a few numbers and a piece of paper to be looked at.


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## Mr.James (Mar 3, 2011)




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## Pythoninfinite (Mar 3, 2011)

Hey zulu, you're on the money! Crumbs for the grateful peasants - you descibe it beautifully. The only fault in your comment is that it's not the politicians, it's the bureaucrats, and guess who'll still be there after the election? These guys have been entrenched for decades in some cases. You can change a government, but the public service grinds on... If you really want oppression, move to WA...

J


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## hugsta (Mar 3, 2011)

FAY said:


> SO, the ONLY advantage is that you don't have to buy a stamp.........geebus progress is really moving along now....


 
Either that or pay for a fax...lol


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## Waterrat (Mar 3, 2011)

Jamie, ministers are politicians and they CAN remove / transfer undesirable individuals to some darker corners of departments. Just have keep pressing the right buttons.


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## hugsta (Mar 3, 2011)

bkevo said:


> I was told today for an extra $30, my permit can be completed within 24 hours. They are a joke. $60 for a few numbers and a piece of paper to be looked at.


 
They can't even justify the $30 they are charging now, excpet for spending it on trying to destroy the hobby with rediculous cage sizes.


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## dickyknee (Mar 3, 2011)

zulu said:


> Yes they have done absoloutely squatt,wait 14 days is just an insult for what they charge!
> 
> 
> 
> Jees,they got you, have they taught you to roll over,fetch the stick,play dead :lol:


 
I am no bodies lap dog , I made a simple comment that $3.00 off the price was nothing to complain about....


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## Laghairt (Mar 3, 2011)

I don't have a problem paying a license fee for keeping reptiles, I think there are genuinely good reasons for licensing.

On the other hand, the fees they charge for import/export permits are not only unjustified, they are unlawful. I have asked a few environmental lawyers and they have assured me that if the gees were ever legally challenged they would be abolished. The only reason they exist is that they haven't met proper resistance. 

The fees are clearly a cash grab by the DECCW and the problem is that once the department has a profitable fee they will cling to it for dear life. For things to change more of us have to get political. Do not underestimate how much influence letters/phoncalls to your local member and the minister can have. If we annoy them enough they will want to make it go away and they are the ones who can pressure the DECCW. 

I wouldn't bother writing to the DECCW itself as they will ignore it. There is no way they will want the minister to know how many complaints they are getting. It would be good to cc them in on any complaints to your local members though, that will force them to do something.


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## Pythoninfinite (Mar 3, 2011)

> I don't have a problem paying a license fee for keeping reptiles, I think there are genuinely good reasons for licensing.



This is the kind of general statement that stops people from thinking beyond what 'seems' to be the obvious. Are there, in fact, genuinely good reasons for licensing captive-bred Carpet Pythons, Central Bearded Dragons, Green Tree Frogs or any other of the commonly kept herp species? Can you tell me what purpose it serves in conservation, which is the ONLY reason for the existence of NPWS (DECCW). What do they do with the info gained? How does it help the species in its degraded habitat?

All it does is allow the building of an empire, built on a fallacy that it is necessary for conservation.

The entire landscape on which this 'need' was built dates from the 1970s, when reptiles weren't bred in captivity, and it was fashioned to place some controls over the potential for damage to wild populations from a wild catch. For most popular species, this simply doesn't apply anymore. We have to deal with legislation that is now 20 years behind the times, but it is a mammoth task to get bureaucracies to change legislation, when the designers of that legislation still influence the decision making. None of them wanted to allow reptiles to be kept by private individuals in the first place, so they're not going to streamline anything for anyone but themselves.

A so-called 'electronic' system that still relies on paper documents via post is ridiculous in 2011.


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## Waterrat (Mar 3, 2011)

Pythoninfinite said:


> We have to deal with legislation that is now 20 years behind the times, but it is a mammoth task to get bureaucracies to change legislation, when the designers of that legislation still influence the decision making. None of them wanted to allow reptiles to be kept by private individuals in the first place, so they're not going to streamline anything for anyone but themselves.



And these "designers" are still in the Department in active roles. This is what we need to focus on once the Ministry changes hands. The dead wood must go - uncompromisingly, otherwise nothing will ever change. Don't loose the focus people, the opportunity (elections) comes only once in many years.


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## Kurto (Mar 3, 2011)

Is it me or does it seem like the NSW licensing service put pressure on the DECCW to present these permits online? Which in turn is the need for the pointless mandate of minimum enclosure sizing.. To me it doesn't seem like the DECCW is calling the shots in the first place. The are merely trying to enforce 30yr old conservation laws on captive pets..

Congrats on the inept ability to present a form on the internet. Bravo.. Bravo indeed!


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## buck (Mar 3, 2011)

Just filled out an Import application. It seems easy enough to use. They have a survey at the end which was a great way for me to express my bewilderment as to why we still need to wait 14 days and are being charged so much.


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## PSimmo (Mar 3, 2011)

seems easy to use..the test will be how long it actually takes to come back..
And I find it interesting that a government department is using an evaluation version of Tall PDF to output the pdf files.


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## GellyAmbert (Mar 3, 2011)

Pythoninfinite said:


> A so-called 'electronic' system that still relies on paper documents via post is ridiculous in 2011.


 
i couldn't agree more... slightly off topic.. but i've been waiting patiently since the mid 1980's for 2011... we're here now and i still dont have my "hover board"!! according to back to future II we should all have them by now... and clothes that blow dry themselves... flying cars... and this is apparently the best our government departments can offer??

i have a message for the DECC.... WHERE'S MY HOVERBOARD!!!!!!


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## zulu (Mar 3, 2011)

Pythoninfinite said:


> Hey zulu, you're on the money! Crumbs for the grateful peasants - you descibe it beautifully. The only fault in your comment is that it's not the politicians, it's the bureaucrats, and guess who'll still be there after the election? These guys have been entrenched for decades in some cases. You can change a government, but the public service grinds on... If you really want oppression, move to WA...
> 
> J


 
I agree with yourself,Rams and michael with your views on this,i been around for a long time and get sick and tired of this rubbish.


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## hugsta (Mar 4, 2011)

zulu said:


> I agree with yourself,Rams and michael with your views on this,i been around for a long time and get sick and tired of this rubbish.


 
True, and it isn't going to end any time soon unfortunately.


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## Lubke05 (Mar 4, 2011)

Why do these department insist on going backwards?
I got my first license in about 97, walked into the office at hurstville, and pretty sure I walked out with license in hand. I then moved to Qld in 98, did the same up there, walked into the office at Moggil, had my license within a week.
Moved back to Sydney in 2006, now looking at restarting a collection. got a license for my daughter a couple of years ago(which they dont offer anymore), now in the process of getting my own.(she still has hers). called them today to see how the application was progressing, and they told me " it has been entered as received, is now in the que to be processed."
am I missing something? they have entered it in the system as received, now it is in a line to be entered again and processed?


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## FAY (Mar 4, 2011)

I think it is like a lot of businesses, they are too top heavy and to save money they cull the people who actually do the work.
I really feel that this department it just too understaffed. I actually feel sorry for the average worker there.


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## benjamind2010 (Mar 12, 2011)

So, I have a AKL (I purchased this last year), and I want to just submit my record book online, is it possible or do I still have to send in my paper record book?


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## Pythoninfinite (Mar 12, 2011)

Lubke05 said:


> Why do these department insist on going backwards?
> I got my first license in about 97, walked into the office at hurstville, and pretty sure I walked out with license in hand. I then moved to Qld in 98, did the same up there, walked into the office at Moggil, had my license within a week.
> Moved back to Sydney in 2006, now looking at restarting a collection. got a license for my daughter a couple of years ago(which they dont offer anymore), now in the process of getting my own.(she still has hers). called them today to see how the application was progressing, and they told me " it has been entered as received, is now in the que to be processed."
> am I missing something? they have entered it in the system as received, now it is in a line to be entered again and processed?



They haven't yet changed their computers from steam to electricity, when they do that you'll be amazed at the transformation... I think it's planned for sometime around 2025... NOT!

J


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## dickyknee (Mar 16, 2011)

In case any one was wondering I got my permit VIA email today , 13 days after applying .
I used to get it much quicker VIA fax ....


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## zulu (Mar 16, 2011)

dickyknee said:


> In case any one was wondering I got my permit VIA email today , 13 days after applying .
> I used to get it much quicker VIA fax ....


 
PMSL ,yeh they take two weeks by fax and credit card now too.The EPA in QLD takes pity on the NSW effort so they do there bit straight away so you can write the movement numbers down on the NSW side.
They need some young people in the department with fresh ideas and that really know how to use computers.


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## Colin (Mar 16, 2011)

Ive even had situations where they have taken so long to return my permits that the permit dates (one month) have expired!!! so when I got it back it was out of date.. I had to contact them to explain this and get a confirmation email that they had "extended" my permit for an extra week so I could legally send the snakes interstate


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## zulu (Mar 16, 2011)

FAY said:


> I think it is like a lot of businesses, they are too top heavy and to save money they cull the people who actually do the work.
> I really feel that this department it just too understaffed. I actually feel sorry for the average worker there.


 
So your for sacking management,dont you need office staff sacked so that you can replace them ? LOL


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## saximus (Mar 17, 2011)

Does anyone know if the online record books are up yet?


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## Colin (Mar 17, 2011)

saximus said:


> Does anyone know if the online record books are up yet?


 
I dont think so but I was told the E-book should be up and running by April..


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## saximus (Mar 17, 2011)

Ok so if it's not up and running by that time will we be given leniency with the rule that the books must be in by April 30th?


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