The whole point here
@Sdaji and
@Flaviemys purvisi is members of sites like APS and reptile lovers generally should be trying to influence public attitude towards snakes not make excuses for and justify the deliberate killing of protected animals, especially by people of standing in the community. Thylacine were ruthlessly exterminated by farmers and yes while I don't make a big deal about my experience and qualifications here I am not stupid and understand there were probably other factors in play but all the more reason not to exterminate thousands of the vulnerable animals. Millions of Koalas were shot for their skins, was this also justified. People have been prosecuted and convicted for killing crocodiles and the same thing needs to be done with snake killers to change the attitude where they are considered vermin to be eliminated. Supposedly endangered children should be educated from a young age how to behave around snakes rather than fear them.
There weren't just 'other factors at play'. A disease wiped them out. Without any hunting it still would have wiped them out. Without the disease they wouldn't have been wiped out. In this case it wasn't habitat destruction, in the vast majority of extinctions it is not hunting. There are several common causes of extinctions. In this case it was a disease.
And
@Sdaji please quote one example where a horse (or a human) was ever killed by a RBB which was the species I referred to in my post.
I tell you what, if you can find one example where I've claimed that a horse was ever killed by a Red-bellied Black Snake I'll stop considering this challenge of yours to have been a really stupid one.
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Hi Ken, reptile folk like us live in a different world to many other people... primary producers, graziers etc care about a couple of things in life, the price of fuel, the price of feed, the weather and the price of meat. If snakes were declared extinct in Australia tomorrow, how many farmers couldn't care less?? All of them. Australia would just be like New Zealand... no snakes there. If freshwater turtles were declared extinct in Australia tomorrow, myself along with probably 50,000 other people would be devastated, 23 million other people wouldn't even know much less care. You need to realise the fact that people in this field and on forums like this, reptile enthusiasts etc are a minority and we're shrinking in numbers not growing. That's just the way the world has gone. I've given up trying to collaborate with and change people's ways about snakes... 2 people I went to school with still will argue with me until blue in the face that if a snake is on the road you should run over it. People still swerve to deliverately hit turtles... why?? One regular snake shooter I know of admitted to me to shooting turtles in the dams on his property... does it regularly apparently... when I asked why he said because his dams are stocked with yabbies and shrimp and the turtles invade the dams and eat all his yabbies and shrimp so he spends several hours every month sitting on the edge of his dams firing at any turtle that pokes its head up. Now without hard proof this actually occurs, it's just hearsay but why would someone just make that up? I mentioned that simply fencing the stocked Cray dams with a 2 foot high bird, chicken mesh fence or polybelt would prevent any turtles from accessing your dams and his response was "this is more fun." Half a dozen old cockies that go fishing in these parts that catch turtles on their lines think nothing of just whipping the knife out and cutting their heads off... turtles are nothing but a pain in the a*** for old fishos...
I've tried talking to several producers about the reality of snakes and the whole leave them alone and they're no threat to you, they'll avoid a confrontation at all costs but no they don't hear a word of it... regularly hear about their 4-wheeler patrols of the properties to check fences, water troughs, pipes etc and hear of how many snakes were disposed of. They simply do not care what anyone else has to say about it. Education is only as good as those who want to be educated and if the topic at hand matters to them which I can assure you, reptile conservation does not.
500,000 plus head of cattle recently perished in a fortnight in the QLD floods... how many average people on the streets even know or care about that?? Barely anyone... because it doesn't directly affect them... it's a big deal to those producers though... For a decade now Australians have enjoyed $1/litre milk while the dairy industry literally collapsed... no one gave a damn.. didn't affect them.
Works both ways.
You can only try so much before you realise you're just wasting your breath. If you change the laws so people are persecuted for dispatching snakes then that is all you have done, you haven't changed anyone's attitude, you've just made a rule saying penalties will apply if caught doing it... murder is illegal, you can't just go and shoot someone (legally) you don't like... still happens every day in every country. Snakes and other reptiles are going to continue to be dispatched by those who deem it necessary to do so whether we like it or not and the reality is there's not a great deal that can be done about it when it's happening out there in the sticks.
This is refreshingly honest and realistic.
You're right, if snakes went extinct, most of us would be devastated, but the majority of people would celebrate. There would be no rodent plagues, no ecological disaster, only mild changes to the ecosystem, and the only losers would be the snakes themselves and the people like us who love them.
And yep, people still run over snakes (and yes, I've seen people deliberately run over turtles, shingle backs, etc) and think they're doing a good thing. 30 years ago when I was a kid I remember hearing the snake enthusiasts saying some relatively balanced things about snakes, but they were few and far between. 20 years ago it was starting to change, snake enthusiast numbers were growing, the message was getting out there, and a very small but growing number of people started to respect and admire snakes. About 15 years ago it peaked. The snake enthusiasts started to exaggerate the story and a few people started taking them less seriously. 10 years ago snake people were being taken less seriously, the attitude overall of the public was in reversal. 5 years ago social media was in full swing and echo chambers were the big thing. People lived in their own echo chambers, believing their own bullspit, and assuming their own message was becoming more and more mainstream because their own little echo chamber had like-minded people. The vast majority of people were not in their echo chamber, and when they did get a look at it, they laughed at how stupid it was. That pattern has increased and is currently only getting stronger. The echo chambers are getting more absurd, extreme, and isolated. By making themselves more extreme and absurd, they make themselves more isolated and less able to be taken seriously by anyone outside. I love snakes and would never kill one just because it was a snake, but even though I love snakes as much as anyone else on this planet, seeing the nonsense spewed by herpers these days almost makes me want to kill them. If I am totally biased on the snakes' side and even I can't stand how ridiculous it is, imagine how Joe Average who hates snakes will feel! By being dishonest and clearly believe their own ridiculous lies, the herpers destroy their own credibility, which in many cases literally inspires people to kill snakes.
This is all part of an overall picture which has been occurring over the last 10-15 years, not just herp related but in general. I think we can all see that society/culture/rational thinking in general is in serious decline. Herp is just one example of it.
