Bloody Disgusting

[JasonL]

You're right Jas i forgot that their is an infinite ammount of money and time to spend on animal captures. I'm totally stoked that you managed to overlook my two other points and chose to hone in on one, possibly the weakest reason, to make a strawman.

The quicker the capture, in majority of cases, the safer for all involved. Do you disagree?

I "honed" in on that point as thats all it really comes down to. I agree that re releasing gators is a waste of time in the majority of cases, it's pretty pointless taking gators out of the man made canals and ponds and putting them back into the everglades that are full of them already, I personally think the removal of these animals shouldn't be contracted out to money making cowboys.
As for snake release, it totally depends on the species and the amount of available suitable habitat within the release site, whch boils down largely to the knowledge of the person who is releasing it, I think it's a load of BS on so many levels to think the majority won't survive.

 

[JasonL]

Here's a thought how about getting more educated (at school may be) and learn to live with the animals that surround you. It disgusts me that people are so friggin ignorant to the fact that we as humans are not the most important animal on this planet

Lewy

Well thats the thing Lewy, but the further people become dis associated with nature, the less they care, many of these gators being caught and euthed are only reasonably small animals, that have eaten someones dog. People can't get it into their heads that an animal that is potentially dangerous should be allowed to live near humans, even if the people choose to live in the middle of their habitat. It's a bit like people wanting to build their houses right next to the bush, but want it cleared in case of a fire...

 

[Lewy]

I see your point waruikazi regarding the faster the termination (if that is the best option) the better and no I was not aware of the damage sustained to the crocs from the traps. On saying that though these guys were really glorifying the whole act and both of them spent a very long time slowly realing in the croc and wearing him out until they could drag it to the shore and then lock it up for a drive somewhere else for euthanasia. That method certainly does not seem efficient (and still down right cruel for any animal to be dragged in by a body part - in the little one's case it was his foot). Perhaps they could shoot them. If it stays still enough for them to hook it then surely they could shoot it.

Sue

 

[JasonL]

That reminds me of the doco where a true monster gator was trapped ( those hooks only work for the tiddlers ) and bought to the surface between the two trappers boats, a guy on one boat shot it in the head but part of the bullet ricocheted into a poor bloke in the other boat.. all caught on film.. he went to hospital but was OK...

 

[redbellybite]

I dont know about your area gordo, but here in southern Vic, the releases
are quite successful.
I have kept tabs on released animals from my surrounding areas and a few have
come through the catch and release fine.
The secret is to release as close the the capture spot as possible and as soon as possible after capture.
I reckon you gotta give them more credit. Their survival instincts are strong and i cant see why you say they "generally" die.
Like I said, in Darwin, it may be different ballgame because they are further from the top
of the food chain than here.

I reckon you have to give some of us relocators more credit to Gordo ....I dont go and catch then dump the snake anywhere ...I have to find a suitable habitat that will have a water course and enough shelter away from the public....as Baz says ..it may be different up the top end but I have plenty of bushland and fortunantly water courses ,so its not that hard to find a healthy suitable place to relocate my snakes....and as Baz said to ,.I dont think they are that fragile either ...I understand what you were saying about the gator and croc situation...but doesnt mean I like it :evil:

 

[Naja_nivea]

"The majority of snakes dont relocate well". Are there lots of good scientific papers backing this up? Is this the "majority" of species or individuals of all species? Are the snakes released into ideal habitat? Are the natural levels of mortality taken into account? Are these studies extensive and numerous or just some half assed PhD thesis? If there is something to this statement you repeated several times in 1 thread i would be interested to read about it 1st hand.

I think you have a good points Sue, rather than injure and stress the animals out then kill them why not shoot them? Maybe a time and money issue, ie rather than stalk the alligator they just fish for it to save time and money at the expense of the animals.

What do they expect when they move into swamps full of alligators. They drain wetlands and destroy the habitat to build houses, but keep some waterways for their boats. I suggest relocating the people that moved into the swamps, although the majority of oap's dont relocate well when released into remote desert habitat. Or maybe just get some hill billies to harpoon them, then shoot them to save time and money? :lol: :shock:

 

[Vixen]

It disgusts me that people are so friggin ignorant to the fact that we as humans are not the most important animal on this planet

Lewy

Well said and totally agree.

 

[waruikazi]

"The majority of snakes dont relocate well". Are there lots of good scientific papers backing this up? Is this the "majority" of species or individuals of all species? Are the snakes released into ideal habitat? Are the natural levels of mortality taken into account? Are these studies extensive and numerous or just some half assed PhD thesis? If there is something to this statement you repeated several times in 1 thread i would be interested to read about it 1st hand.

I think you have a good points Sue, rather than injure and stress the animals out then kill them why not shoot them? Maybe a time and money issue, ie rather than stalk the alligator they just fish for it to save time and money at the expense of the animals.

What do they expect when they move into swamps full of alligators. They drain wetlands and destroy the habitat to build houses, but keep some waterways for their boats. I suggest relocating the people that moved into the swamps, although the majority of oap's dont relocate well when released into remote desert habitat. Or maybe just get some hill billies to harpoon them, then shoot them to save time and money? :lol: :shock:

Look mate i don't know why you've got all hot under the collar about this claim i have made and i can't answer all your questions. I don't know if there are lots of 'good scientific papers' on this topic, i haven't looked for them. I can direct you to a case study if you like, PM me if you are interested. I can't speak for others but all of the snakes i release go into an area with three of the main habitat types of my area nearby. I have no idea what the natural death rate of reptiles is. I'm sure if there are scientific papers on this topic that they will be peer reviewed before they are published but you would have to check that for yourself when or if you find any.


There is alot to my statement mate you if you weren't so emotionally charged about it you may be able to see it. It is not just my opinion, i first learnt about the survival rates from people i consider to be well respected herpers with many years of experience. I have had experiences that provide evidence to back this claim.

The survival rate and success of any relocation is not as high as people like to beleive. If you disagree with me that is fine but just because you don't like what i say doesn't mean it is wrong.

 

[BJC-787]

did they say the hook was sharp.
in usa they use blunted hooks and cast it over the gator and real it in and it catches the aligator and they can real it in on the hook, i have seen it done on a 9ft aligator, because of the tough skin on the aligator it does not hurt the aligator,
it is also the law in usa that any aligator over 4ft is to be humainly killed because of there homing instinct it will come back to the same spot.

 

[Beardieboy]

I believe it's illegal in Florida to re-release captured gators that are over a length limit, something about really strong homing instincts and danger to people yada yada. So unless they can find a sanctuary for them in captivity they are bound by law to kill them. They remove a lot of gators from human areas, so it is no surprise that lots get killed. I blame the people who feed them in the first place, then they lose their fear of people and have to be removed because they pose a threat.

Doesn't make the capture methods ok but it's not the cowboys' fault they have to kill them.

 

[redbellybite]

"cowboys" are a term used when the people are putting on a 'HERO' show and not giving two hoots about the animals welfare ....their lack of compasion and respect for the animal is terrible ...and that is what pee's alot of us off ..not the fact that the animal has to be euth'd .