Herping Darwin, November 2010

[SperO]

awesome I live in the NT your photos are amazing. For herpes lovers the NT is one of the best places to be!!

There is a really good spot for file snakes near Gunn Point, occasional water python to. I often come across around 10 in the same area. However in the wet they tend to migrate away

 

[DanTheMan]

Yea A. hawkei is quite old but not recognized in some field guides, I do have one that includes them but I believe the distribution map is incorrect.
I am still not sure on all of this so I cant really say anything, will have to wait. It's not official yet, just like the A. antarcticus in the Dajarra area are apparently not common adders at all, but more closely related to A. rugosa (not to be confused with A. rugosus in PNG) but as said, yet to be described properly.
Just fixed a few typos too sorry guys, Gehyra nana is not a Northern Spotted Delma! But a Northern Spotted Dtella

 

[waruikazi]

Yea A. hawkei is quite old but not recognized in some field guides, I do have one that includes them but I believe the distribution map is incorrect.
I am still not sure on all of this so I cant really say anything, will have to wait. It's not official yet, just like the A. antarcticus in the Dajarra area are apparently not common adders at all, but more closely related to A. rugosa (not to be confused with A. rugosus in PNG) but as said, yet to be described properly.
Just fixed a few typos too sorry guys, Gehyra nana is not a Northern Spotted Delma! But a Northern Spotted Dtella

Stupid latin names confusing things! If you find out any more info let us know, I enjoy these kinds of threads.

 

[AUSHERP]

It is interesting to see species forming on paper.... it seems every time I post a scientific name it gets questioned. species are constantly changing genus, forming their own and dividing, it certainly keeps us latin lovers on our toes

 

[DanTheMan]

It is interesting to see species forming on paper.... it seems every time I post a scientific name it gets questioned. species are constantly changing genus, forming their own and dividing, it certainly keeps us latin lovers on our toes

It does! And I love it, although some see it as nit picking, I love to see the differences within a species. Plus it boosts my species count! Which is not looking that great at the moment, although considering everything I have photographed was pretty much all in the last 12 months, not too bad I guess. It's currently at around 220 photographed, but like 38 of those are frogs. But almost 50 snake species. And no cheating... ah I mean trapping, was invlolved!

 

[dylan-rocks]

that would of been amazing, thanks for sharing

 

[AUSHERP]

ha! yeah thats what I mean,you're only as up to date as your field guide!!

 

[tropicbreeze]

And the problem is that field guides are just about out of date as soon as they roll off the printing presses. The never ending Wars of the Splitters and Lumpers.

 

[DanTheMan]

Exactly, just like the latest "Complete Guide" edition, plenty in there that isn't valid anymore and it only came out at the end of last year.

 

[AUSHERP]

It is hard to stay on top, even regular checks online @ museums, forums and universities, some are sitting unpublished waiting for "official" description, and then theres the guys that tell you something moved when really it didn't they just think it should!

 

[DanTheMan]

I think it will be a while before we can be on top of it all, once everyone has split every reptile into it's own genus maybe?

 

[AUSHERP]

That right, how many features need to be different to form a new genus? ssp are easy ie; locality, colour, size whatever, but a whole split Genus! thats something else.....

Why are humans split into races not ssp?

 

[DanTheMan]

Exactly, if these people could they would split humans into various species. Whether this would be correct, I am not one to comment. But are these different species or even 'sub-species' within which ever genera, simply a variation within a species that has a colour difference due to it's location? Such as any Morelai spilota, with the dark colouration of Diamonds in the south where it is cooler, then take on a lighter patterning as you head north into a warmer climate. Sub-species, or natural selection? And the in-between of this transition often referred to as an intergrade? Or sub-species of Monitors such as V. gouldii, with V. g flavirufus based on it's habitat... Maybe I'm ******** and this is necessary, I really don't care, just putting my thoughts out there, not saying it isn't valid, just questioning it. Does it need to be given it's own name because of this? I believe we should lump every skink into one species. There is a small few that are cool, but I cannot discriminate. Therefore they are all boring and look the same. They are all Garden Skinks.

 

[Rattler]

Kewl. Australia has a beautiful and vast variety of fauna/flora. Great photgraphy. Praise to the one who created all of these things for us to enjoy!

 

[Deano]

Beautiful photos, love the shot of the Arafura file snake…

 

[viridis]

The thing that winds me up is Antaresia from Burke and Wills roadhouse / Normanton / Georgetown / Mt Suprise ECT. You can find three different animals in a few hundred kms stretch.

They can all have different patterning, different colouration and different scale counts yet can be found next to each other. The A. stimsoni / childreni / maculosa species is terribly mixed up in N.W QLD and no taxonomist seems to care. They are happy splitting a species because of a few scalation differences yet the biggest muddled family is there asking for an expert to give their opinions :0

 

[waruikazi]

The thing that winds me up is Antaresia from Burke and Wills roadhouse / Normanton / Georgetown / Mt Suprise ECT. You can find three different animals in a few hundred kms stretch.

They can all have different patterning, different colouration and different scale counts yet can be found next to each other. The A. stimsoni / childreni / maculosa species is terribly mixed up in N.W QLD and no taxonomist seems to care. They are happy splitting a species because of a few scalation differences yet the biggest muddled family is there asking for an expert to give their opinions :0

Similar story here in the stone country of Arnhem Land. We have 2 phases of childrens, one from the escarpment and one from the scrub/lowlands. Very different looking animals, their bone structure appears different, different colour/patterns, different habitat etc etc. They were sequenced and apparently are identical.

 

[viridis]

Yes that sounds correct Gordo,

Antaresia would have to be the most mudled genus in Australian snakes I reckon!

 

[waruikazi]

Yes that sounds correct Gordo,

Antaresia would have to be the most mudled genus in Australian snakes I reckon!

I recon Acanthophis is pretty high up there lol!

 

[Jonno from ERD]

I am told that there is no longer A. praelongus in the NT, only northern Qld. Adders around the Adelaide River bridge are A. hawkei or Food Plains Adders, and those found in higher areas are A. rugosa or Hill Adders, still waiting for a bit of clarification on that so might not be 100% accurate.

Kind of. They haven't been formally separated from A.praelongus though. Fry et al. have done some preliminary research which indicates that they are separate species, as well as suggesting what would be the correct new latin names for them - but until they are formally described, they are still A.praelongus.