hibernate or not

[CrazyNut]

Cool I have timers on eveything so that's easy haha (well bar two but I have an extra timer anyway).

 

[Waterrat]

Hi George,
I had similar discussion elsewhere ...... with open end. Do you think brumation / hibernation, or lack of, affects longevity? Physiological time as opposed to real time comes to mind. Tardigrades in resistant stages are switched off, metabolism goes to near 0 and they don't 'age'.
Your thoughts?

cheers Michael

Hi Nobby,

As the vet's profiles at Nicklin Way Vets indicate none appear to actually specialise in reptiles. The extract of the article that you have quoted is taken from the pages of Brisbane Bird and Exotics Veterinary Services and after reading the profiles of the vets there I wouldn't hold much faith in their experience with reptiles either.

Personally I'm not aware of any scientific studies regarding the effects on captive beardeds when deliberately deprived of following their natural cycle to brumate. However I don't see the purpose of preventing them from engaging in a natural event other than for our own personal enjoyment of watching them.

Personally I couldn't care less how you keep your critters but if you can provide me with info on why NOT allowing them to experience brumation is beneficial to them, I'm all ears.

Cheers.

 

[GBWhite]

Hi Michael,

Considering that brumation (whether for a couple of weeks or a couple of months) provides a natural means for the metabolism of reptiles to have a break I'm of the belief that it not only contributes to longevity but the overall health of the animal.

Tardigrades are a rather incredible life form in their own right. Their ability to survive under extreme variations in temperature, radiation levels that would be fatal to nearly all other life forms and the vacuum of space place them in a different field altogether.

All the best,

George.

 

[Snapper]

Thanks for all of the replies, have given me lots of good information. Didn't realise it was a controversial subject, sorry for any tension caused. Will do a little bit more research and then bounce my conclusions of you guys and girls to see if i am on the right track.

Thanks again

 

[Nero Egernia]

Kingofnobbys, the matter shouldn't be if a lack of brumation is detrimental to a Central Bearded Dragon's health, but rather should be why suppress their natural behaviour. Even tropical species that live in a permanently warm environment go through a "shut down" mode during the dry season. Let the lizard be a lizard, they're not like cats and dogs. We owe it to them as dedicated reptile keepers where our sole aim should be their welfare.

 

[kingofnobbys]

Kingofnobbys, the matter shouldn't be if a lack of brumation is detrimental to a Central Bearded Dragon's health, but rather should be why suppress their natural behaviour. Even tropical species that live in a permanently warm environment go through a "shut down" mode during the dry season. Let the lizard be a lizard, they're not like cats and dogs. We owe it to them as dedicated reptile keepers where our sole aim should be their welfare.

All well and good if your lizards / beardies were kept in an uninsulated / unheated room or the garage and exposed to very cold conditions in winter, mine are not, they are housed in family area in my house and never experience temperatures below 22 - 24oC even overnight in the dead of winter. They've never shown any indication of wantimg to go into brumation . The same applies to my skinks (Wriggles lived to ripe old age for a water skink of 7 - 8 years old, she never bromated).

 

[pinefamily]

[MENTION=41275]kingofnobbys[/MENTION], I hope you mean by that your house is climate controlled, not that you give them night time heat.

 

[Snowman]

Hmm learn something new everyday. Will turn down temps this winter, see if I see any change. Wonder if C.fionni life spans are effected by brumation(?) my guy was 8 years old when he passed still two years above average but anyway. Anyone have any papers on this? Be an interesting read.... Not sure if any of those "personal attacks" were directed at me, sorry(?) I wasn't giving advice or anything just sharing my expereince (only making that comment cause someone quoated me and the post was deleted before I could read it :/ ).

It's not about turning down the temps. That is dangerous. It's just reducing the hours the heat is on for.

- - - Updated - - -

Thanks for all of the replies, have given me lots of good information. Didn't realise it was a controversial subject, sorry for any tension caused. Will do a little bit more research and then bounce my conclusions of you guys and girls to see if i am on the right track.

Thanks again

It's not contriversial. Some people just don't have the same experince and education as others. We are all at different stages of learning and we will all keep learning...

 

[GBWhite]

All well and good if your lizards / beardies were kept in an uninsulated / unheated room or the garage and exposed to very cold conditions in winter, mine are not, they are housed in family area in my house and never experience temperatures below 22 - 24oC even overnight in the dead of winter. They've never shown any indication of wantimg to go into brumation . The same applies to my skinks (Wriggles lived to ripe old age for a water skink of 7 - 8 years old, she never bromated).

You must keep yourself isolated from keepers or don't mix with those with a similar interest. There are plenty of keepers out there that have specialised reptile rooms that are maintained at reasonably warm temperatures throughout the cooler months and yet are still able to provide a suitable environment for their critters to experience brumation.

Sounds to me that yours are not afforded the opportunity to display any indication that they want to brumate. Would you recognise the signs anyway? Ambient room temperature does not truly reflect an environment within an enclosure and from previous threads you have indicated that you maintain a constant very warm temperature within the enclosure throughout the year. I also note that you like to disturb them (for play time and treats) at night when they should be afforded the opportunity to sleep.

I believe that it's evident from your posts that you would prefer to keep them awake and active when they should at least be provided the opportunity to chill out. Clearly demonstrates what I was referring to earlier about not letting them brumate or rest for one's own self interests.

Like i said earlier I don't really care how you maintain your critters but these are not husbandry practices that I would readily encourage anyone to implement.

Cheers,

George.

Ps: Pinefamily. I agree that for many reasons it is best to maintain young captive reptiles in a warm environment during the first year of their life however in the wild they are quite capable of undertaking brumation without any adverse affects. Eg; Terrestrial species of both lizards and snakes usually seek refuge underground and arboreal/semi arboreal species often locate themselves in hollow logs, inside trees or even in the roofs of dwellings.

 

[kingofnobbys]

@kingofnobbys, I hope you mean by that your house is climate controlled, not that you give them night time heat.

Yes my house is climate controlled 24/7 and insulated, we rarely turn off the aircon , most the time it doesn't need to work very hard at all.

There is a thermostatically regulated warmed area in each enclosure available o/night. Sometimes they sleep there sometimes they don't.

 

[CrazyNut]

It's not about turning down the temps. That is dangerous. It's just reducing the hours the heat is on for.

- - - Updated - - -



It's not contriversial. Some people just don't have the same experince and education as others. We are all at different stages of learning and we will all keep learning...

upmost respct and curtesy to you mate but if you had read the other comment you would realise I already asked about what to do and got an answer but thanks anyway!

 

[pinefamily]

There is no point in arguing with some people, who seem to take no notice of how to look after reptiles but do whatever they feel is best.

 

[Wally]

There is no point in arguing with some people, who seem to take no notice of how to look after reptiles but do whatever they feel is best.

Reason for being ostracized right there.