blue tounge lizard breeding

[Jay84]

Just a question..... are their progeny fertile? or sterile mules?

 

[Chrisreptile]

QLD 92 Restriction on breeding etc. hybrids of protected animals
(1) A person must not—
(a) knowingly breed a hybrid or mutation of a protected
animal; or

Does this mean that in QLD, a person cannot breed Albino Darwin Carpet Pythons?
As Albinisn is a genetic mutation, do these guys fall under the category mutation?

 

[peterjohnson64]

Sorry but IMHO putting two different species of blueys together in a pit is just like putting a coastal and a diamond together in an aviary. They WILL breed. Therefore it is intentional. If however, you think it isn't and then they do then maybe that first time it wasn't. But from then on it is.

And if they do cross breed please make sure that you stress what they are when selling them. The are not Eastern Blue Tongues and they are not Blotched Blue Tongues. They are hybrids.

 

[princessparrot]

I have never seen nor heard about an Eastern blue tongue cross shingleback. I was under the impression that shinglebacks were fussy breeders and only breed with unrelated individuals of their own species?

I have two shinglebacks and an eastern blue tongue living together and the male has been going for the female for a few years now but she's shown no interest and now I think he's moved to my bluetongue cos they've been showing interest and sexual/mating behaviour towards each other... Not sure what will have or if it will work out but anyway....

 

[KingsReptiles]

to answer your original question, yes. Tiliqua species can interbreed, mainly the most common crossbreeds in captivity is Eastern x Blotched, ive heard of Eastern x Shingleback, and other crossbreeds could probably be done, personally i prefer pure bred animals, and in some states it is illegal to crossbreed, NSW and VIC allow it, not sure about other states

 

[GBWhite]

to answer your original question, yes. Tiliqua species can interbreed, ive heard of Eastern x Shingleback,

I very much doubt that this has any credibility.

 

[kankryb]

Scincoides x rugosa do interbreed
nigrolutea x rugosa do interbreed
it has been note by Longley (1941,1944) and mertens(1950)and others. Here in Denmark, 10 years ago, someone had fertile offspring form aspera x chimaerea so All tiliqua can breed if you put them together

I just had a look in a aussie book, A guide to Australian skinks in captivity by Dr. Danny Brown and on page 179 he has a bit on hybridisation in the wild and captivity

 

[KingsReptiles]

I very much doubt that this has any credibility.

Oh ok then

 

[Kruz.S]

Hi I am thinking about breeding some blue tongues and was wondering if you could give me some tips and can blue tongues be differant ages to breed or not
[doublepost=1516314026,1516313502][/doublepost]Hi all will blue tongues breed if they are differant ages

 

[Scutellatus]

Hi I am thinking about breeding some blue tongues and was wondering if you could give me some tips and can blue tongues be differant ages to breed or not
[doublepost=1516314026,1516313502][/doublepost]Hi all will blue tongues breed if they are differant ages

Yes Blue Tongues will breed at different ages, as long as they are sexually mature.

 

[NGold]

it is possible, it also regularly happens, especially over seas.

it isn't recommended on an over-all ethical level, hence why its illegal.

How is it not ethical?

 

[nuttylizardguy]

How is it not ethical?

Likely because it produces hybids who have severe birth defects and are prone to short lives of poor quality and because it will cause issues amongst wild pure breed populations if the hybrid escapes or is released to the wild.

Only reason I see for doing this is $ the hybrid can attract because they are "unigue / rare", and there are money hungry breeders who don't really care if the animals produced are healthy or if they have birth defects or inherent health issues.

 

[Sdaji]

Likely because it produces hybids who have severe birth defects and are prone to short lives of poor quality and because it will cause issues amongst wild pure breed populations if the hybrid escapes or is released to the wild.

Only reason I see for doing this is $ the hybrid can attract because they are "unigue / rare", and there are money hungry breeders who don't really care if the animals produced are healthy or if they have birth defects or inherent health issues.

The hybrids don't have severe birth defects. Or any birth defects. Hybrids often live longer than their pure counterparts because of hybrid vigour.

Hybrids pose no more risk than pure animals escaping outside their range. Especially in the case of blue-tongueds, the risk is negligible. Wild hybrids occur naturally from time to time (I've personally seen wild hybrid Tiliqua nigrolutea x T. scincoides) and despite being strong animals, the hybrids don't have good reproductive success, so are far as population dynamics are concerned are pretty much irrelevant. The largest genetic risk to wild populations is pure animals of different populations of the same species escaping. If a Melbourne blue-tongued lizard gets out up north and breeds with the locals, it doesn't matter how pure a Melbourne one it was, all its babies are going to be hybrids, and those hybrids will likely have high reproductive success, as opposed to something like a Melbourne scincoides x WA occipitalis getting out up north.

Which species/subspecies of Tiliqua to you have reason to believe will have large risk of birth defects, and what evidence do you have for it?
[doublepost=1542344338,1542343786][/doublepost]

I very much doubt that this has any credibility.

I've seen this hybrid, it has been done. Seems like the lack of credibility is with you. You should learn more about things before commenting on them in this way.
[doublepost=1542344440][/doublepost]

Does this mean that in QLD, a person cannot breed Albino Darwin Carpet Pythons?
As Albinisn is a genetic mutation, do these guys fall under the category mutation?

According to the law, yes. I remember when the law was introduced, it caused a bit of a stir, but a decade later no one has been pulled up on it. They know the explosive can of worms it would open and don't want to go there.

 

[cris]

According to the law, yes. I remember when the law was introduced, it caused a bit of a stir, but a decade later no one has been pulled up on it. They know the explosive can of worms it would open and don't want to go there.

They are changing the law to allow deleterious mutations and hybrids to be legal. They are also adding in a thing where you have to pay extra to be treated as a criminal.

Hybrids also are subject to outbreeding depression. Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what yer gerna gyet.

 

[nuttylizardguy]

Which species/subspecies of Tiliqua to you have reason to believe will have large risk of birth defects, and what evidence do you have for it?
[doublepost=1542344338,1542343786][/doublepost]

I've seen this hybrid, it has been done. Seems like the lack of credibility is with you. You should learn more about things before commenting on them in this way.
[doublepost=1542344440][/doublepost]

According to the law, yes. I remember when the law was introduced, it caused a bit of a stir, but a decade later no one has been pulled up on it. They know the explosive can of worms it would open and don't want to go there.

Is there a vested interest on your behalf ?

Personally , I would rather have pure breds and have no interest in hybrids or rare morphs.

 

[Sdaji]

They are changing the law to allow deleterious mutations and hybrids to be legal. They are also adding in a thing where you have to pay extra to be treated as a criminal.

Hybrids also are subject to outbreeding depression. Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what yer gerna gyet.

Hybrid vigour is the rule, outbreeding depression is the rare exception, except for reproductive ability, which isn't a welfare issue.

The actual namesake example, the mule, demonstrates the point. They're pretty much always infertile (outbreeding depression), but are stronger than either of the parents (hybrid vigour). The inability to have offspring is not a welfare issue, the animals are strong and happy, they just can't reproduce (they can still have sex and enjoy it though!). In the context of release issues, this is another benefit.
[doublepost=1542378271,1542378143][/doublepost]

Is there a vested interest on your behalf ?

Only in opinions and information being shared and expressed being based on facts, evidence and logic rather than pushing narratives based on what people desire to be true rather than what is. This is a rare motive, but it is mine. I understand it is difficult for most people to get their heads around this concept.

Personally , I would rather have pure breds and have no interest in hybrids or rare morphs.

Your personal preference is completely irrelevant, as is mine.