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So people where complaining the enclosures were to big, when it apparently was going to be enforced and now they are complaining it's to small when it may just be a guideline? :?

And just to add to this, this is a ( proposed? )MINIMUM size. You can always have a bigger enclosure but if those proposed/ discussed enclosure sizes mentioned earlier on in the thread are passed through you can't go back.

I'd also like ti thanks Jamie and the rest of the crew for taking time out of thier own busy schedule to help DEcc "see the light".
 
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thanks jamie and I can see now why your concerned and hope you guys on the committee can sort through this situation and get a good result for us all..

after hearing what you have to say on this public opinion situation.. Im changing my original (probably naive at the time when Im usually very cynical) position on thinking it was a good thing to believing its a absolutely bad idea with these anonymous replies to the DECC.

for example whats to stop people with an agenda from bombarding the DECC with their recomendations, and influencing the actual reptile keepers suggestions by corupting it to their viewpoint? maybe this is what they have in mind?

I hope the committee can get these anonymous public opinion recomendations stopped and have no bearing or influence whatsoever... If they want public opinion I for one would be prepared to put my name and licence number on a reply and think the only people qualified and entitled to actually return a response to this questionaire are licenced NSW reptile keepers. and even thats still a worry.. but better than anonymous replies..

good luck with it all mate..

and as I have said previously in earlier posts in this thread..
thanks again to all the committee for the hard work you guys have done on our behalf.. cheers
 
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Thanks guys. As has been stated, the suggested sizes were MINIMUM, there is absolutely no reason why you could not go larger, in fact most probably would. The fact that big breeders might choose smaller enclosures for whatever reason, is largely irrelevant to the welfare debate. Breeders necessarily need healthy animals year after year, and in most cases, good health = good mangement. Snakes (especially pythons) are sedentary, lazy animals with very economical energy needs - they don't move much if they don't have to. If they are clean, healthy and breed well, then management is probably good, even if they are in smallish enclosures.

I have pointed out in an email that the nature of the document distributed by DVD will allow the reults to be skewed by any person or group to produce a bias favourable to the desired outcome. That may be the intention.

Ahh, the things one has to do on one's birthday!

Jamie.
 
Of all places for the form to be posted out of the blue, it's here :lol:
What was the point of the expert panel again?
 
I have pointed out in an email that the nature of the document distributed by DVD will allow the reults to be skewed by any person or group to produce a bias favourable to the desired outcome. That may be the intention.

Ahh, the things one has to do on one's birthday!

Jamie.

but I explained that point more eloquently I thought anyway :rolleyes:

I was going to post on here and elsewhere it was your birthday Jamie :D
but thought it would embarass you too much if people knew you were older than Methuselah :lol:
Happy Birthday (again) mate :D
 
One of the main problems in seeking public feedback is that the public generally haven't got a clue about what is good for reptiles. Public perception is often that the bigger the better, but most keepers know that too big can be equally as bad as too small.
It appears that the public feedback form asks for no qualifaication of the respondent and so may well be filled out by those with no knowledge of reptile husbandry.
 
Thanks guys. As has been stated, the suggested sizes were MINIMUM, there is absolutely no reason why you could not go larger, in fact most probably would. The fact that big breeders might choose smaller enclosures for whatever reason, is largely irrelevant to the welfare debate. Breeders necessarily need healthy animals year after year, and in most cases, good health = good mangement. Snakes (especially pythons) are sedentary, lazy animals with very economical energy needs - they don't move much if they don't have to. If they are clean, healthy and breed well, then management is probably good, even if they are in smallish enclosures.

I have pointed out in an email that the nature of the document distributed by DVD will allow the reults to be skewed by any person or group to produce a bias favourable to the desired outcome. That may be the intention.

Ahh, the things one has to do on one's birthday!

Jamie.

Happy B'day.
Share the same day with my wife........
 
I understand what MINIMUM means.............
IMO, the minimum sizes given are still to small.
The unfortunate side of this is that alot of breeders will use the minimum sizes stated, and be able to because its approved by DECC - simple as that.
 
I don't think the changes will go ahead though, there's too much opposition from keepers.

Yeah... I don't remember asking for speeding tickets, increased rego costs or the GST... Think a few more people than the combined force of the Australian reptile keeper community might have had a few complaints about those things...

Pretty sure they'll do whatever the hell they want...
 
DECC representatives will be at next Tuesday night's SOFAR meeting, to discuss the Draft Code of Practice for Private Reptile Keeping.
 
DECC are supposed to have the Draft Code available at this meeting. Visitors welcome!
 
A draft is now available for public comment. I dont know where you get it but DECC bought it to the SOFAR meeting.
 
A draft is now available for public comment. I dont know where you get it but DECC bought it to the SOFAR meeting.

I think you mean the one a page or two back?? Is that the one? The sizes proposed are resonable and a good start to work with if so.

Thanks
 
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