Pygmy stimson's python

[nathancl]

lol yet you have said all thread that they are mossman stimmies and you whole heartedly beleive that because thats what your told yet now you say you cant be sure unless you caught them yourself

loser lol

 

[cairnscarpets]

there are hundreds of them from mt molloy to mt carbine and up to bob's lookout, on any warm night you can find them on the road soaking up the heat from the bitumin, one of the easiest pythons to find in nort qld, for me anyway. dont know why they cost so much it's not like there rare.

 

[ihaveherps]

This is a moot thread for me, as I have no vested interest what so ever, but here goes my few cents into the thread....

I can easily understand where Andy is coming from, taking the word of the seller as to the locale of the animals... not degrading anyones opinions put forward in the thread (alot of which I agree with and/or have some information on the line similar), but its a tall order for someone to definitively change the locale on advice of people on a forum. We have all seen animals questioned on here daily, with all kinds of people throwing their 2 cents in, and if these animals had their locales changed on forum members whims, then the whole idea of locale animals would become a joke.

That being said, in this case I think these animals are mis-represented, not on the basis of anything written in this thread, more my understanding of this line (though Bob has some rather compelling points with his micro-habitats and distribution)... though that is not to say I believe Andy is in any way trying to be under-handed either, he is just passing on the info as he believes it was to him.

I dont know, to me locale info is paramount , and if it isnt concrete, undisputable, I personally would rather it not given. Slacker raised the point of a possible locale natural intergrade, which I find as interesting as any sub-specifically pure locale animal, the locale being the key..... Taxonomy is a fickle science, fluid and forever changing, though the members of a particular locale population, would rarely, if ever, be split into seperate subspecies, and at worst be grouped as a transitional form or natural intergrade.

Anyway Andy, all this crap slinging boils down to what part of the amateur herp market you are aiming these stimmys at.... if its the average Joe then your sweet.... if its the locale collectors, then I suggest you try dig up as much info as you can on this line, and set the recrord as straight as you possibly can, otherwise this ambiguity takes the gloss off their appeal.

 

[herpkeeper]

there are hundreds of them from mt molloy to mt carbine and up to bob's lookout, on any warm night you can find them on the road soaking up the heat from the bitumin, one of the easiest pythons to find in nort qld, for me anyway. dont know why they cost so much it's not like there rare.

photos to back this up ?

& Andy, I've racked up over 200,000km's herping in North QLD in the last 3 years and I've never seen a Stimson east of the divide...

cheers HK.

 

[JasonL]

photos to back this up ?

& Andy, I've racked up over 200,000km's herping in North QLD in the last 3 years and I've never seen a Stimson east of the divide...

cheers HK.

Maybe thats cause you can tell the difference between stimmos and spotteds

 

[herpkeeper]

PICS ?

 

[Boney]

i know michael has the gps co-ordinents for this local so why would i back down . ill just take his word for now . untill proven otherwise which has not been done here . im the only one that has provided a name no -one has even bothered to put up any other pics . .

there will be no name changes over this thread thats for sure . like has been said every local is going to be questioned at some time like ive said people have challenged that they are even stims ,intergrades, macs , or i just dont feed them making them smaller. ive had them for years not like alot of people who care to comment .

at the end of the day BOB has stuck his neck out over 24,000 metres . we have found maccies at the bottom of the KELVIN mountains but we call them tamworth macs . port mac carpets are more common around wauchope ,kempsey... big deal . who can be bothered to go out of there way to say. look mate i dont think your python is found at a certain local you said.. i think it was found up the road next to someones letter box . but infact the person that has challenged you cant prove it either way but to only talk about what tree the python likes to sleep in . and let everyone know about his vast travels

 

[bigguy]

First of all I will state I never origional attacked Andies local for the Pygmy Stimo's as I have just read. It was No-two that I replied too. Andy attack my thread , which by the way I have shown was accurate and I proved it.

Andy gave us the name of his supplyer of the pygmys so I did my homework. As Michael never caught them, and was actually the 3rd person to own them HOW can he varify their collection location as it is only hearsay. He can not, just as Andy can not either being the 4th owner and again reciting hearsay.

So who can actually varify their true local. One answer, the persons who collected them. I have spoken to one of them who told me exactly were he collected them, and was informed the others were collected at the same spot by the same herper who took him there. You can not get much more accurate info then that.

For legal reasons I can not name the persons who collected them as under Qld law they could be prosercuted if this thread was seen by officals. However, if Andy wishes to know the name give me a ring and I will let you know. I will even give you his phone number so you Andy can talk to him. And you do know him.

For all those who think the disatance between Mt Carbine and Mossman is close enough they may have moved there, get in a car and drive up there. They are two totally different environments. One of the main reasons for sub species is environmental barriers such as can be seen here. Stimsons love dry regions and the rainforests from below Mt Carbine to the coast is the barrier, not to mention the massive mountain range dropping down to the coast

RSP's live in rainforests and are not found even 2 klms from the coast in the Kimberlys. GTP live at Iron Range in the rainforest, yet 30 klms away is dry forest, and guess what, no GTP's. Its the same with the Stimson's. 30klms of rainforests is a barrier they do not cross. And what about Jungles. Black and Whites live a Julation and Athertons live on the Atherton ranges. Both are close to Cairns, so why not call them both Cairns jungles. Probably they hav'nt been called that as they arn't found at Cairns.

As for the talk of these being intergrades, not a chance. These are pure Stimsons that are locally specific to the Mt Carbine area and the western slopes and have a dwarf gene. Why are they so expensive. Easy answer. Very few people have them even though they are common where they are found. Just like most over species of pythons were expensive till they became common.

 

[scam7278]

this is the problem i have with local specific animals.....the locality of these snakes have been thrown around on this thread and how common they are in the area aswell as the high price of of these stimmies.Whats stopping people now heading out to mt carbine and poaching the hell out of the area?.... and please dont say licenceing will stop them because you know it wont. If you want loc al specific animals why not keep it between buyer and seller rather than posting locations on a public forum?

 

[Boney]

you are 100% right Hobbs . why the hell would you give out the the excact spot on local for a high priced animal if any . i already new my friend was told the co-ordinates to this location . mossman was close enough for me to tell people . but for some reason people have to make themselves look good by proving them wrong . darwin carpets are called darwins but i bet they arent all found drinking at the local pub in darwin but found more then 50 kms away or hell further . but thats good enough .. i also sort of new who michael got them off . i also still believe they are not confined to a invisible line defined by habitat. also if they are or arnt intergrades i would like to know how you can or cant prove it . personal opinions dont wash for me . they could even be a seperate species might call them this time banded depresed head macstimsons :lol: serious but ,the thing i dont get is why try take the gloss off someones animals just to prove a point . and how come BOB dont have any since he has found so many . why are they still so rare ? if everyone KnoWs so much how come my animals are the only ones in this thread about pygmy stims someONE pleaSE Put some more pics up of these stims from around this area .

 

[slacker]

As for the talk of these being intergrades, not a chance. These are pure Stimsons that are locally specific to the Mt Carbine area and the western slopes and have a dwarf gene.

I'm not sure if that was directed at me, but since I did mention some locality specific possible intergrades that I have, earlier in this thread, I would like to clarify that I have no reason to believe these "pygmy stimsoni" are in any way similar and it was not my intention to imply anything of the sort.

 

[herpkeeper]

.Whats stopping people now heading out to mt carbine and poaching the hell out of the area?.... ?

watch how many of these things start popping up over the next 2 season's now that people know exactly where to look for them :lol:

 

[ad]

Here is one of mine from Mt Carbine, not a great example but I find they wash out as adults anyway, there are ones with a yellow colouration, this is what needs developing in this line,
The hatchlings look great, but.

 

[nathancl]

antaresia, just because a person has found so many of these animals in the wild what makes you think they should have some ? if that was the case my collection would be huge and full of lots of weird and wonderfuls.

also with the locality, you where happy to ssay they where found in mossman without the thought of poaching in the mossman area as soon as someone says mt carbine its not ok because the area will be poached ? do you not think if people wanted to find them and you where saying they are from mossman they would go there?

 

[JasonL]

Thanks for clearing the locale up on those Bob, I highly doubted they would of come from MG, and wondered if they were just some hybrid thing someone had created, a dodgy locale gives an animal no credit, and puts a taint over the whole thing. They are for certain an interesting Antaresia, and well worth looking at getting if your into the little pythons..... Here's a pic of my Claytons Pygmy Banded Stimmie , it will have to do for now.....
I don't think it's a Mt Carbine or MG locale though :lol:

 

[bigguy]

At one point in time I had over 100 pairs of antaresia, which covered all 4 species and most colour variations found around Australia, including the pygmy stimsons. Even did lectures in herp societies about the different types long before they were even seperated by the scientists.

i decided long ago to only specialise in Blond Macs as these were my favourites, and I got rid of all the others. Just too much to look after.

Gosford has some great Diamonds and everyone knows, but come here and try to find them in the wild. Many have tried and failed. The exact roads the pygmies are found on was not given, just the town. Going there without local knowledge or knowing the time of year they are found likewise could be a waste of time. And what about the expence and time to travel to far North Queenland to catch these snakes. It would be far cheaper just to buy captive bred, parasite and stress free specimens from the breeders.

You can use the argument that they will now be poached from the wild in large numbers, but this could apply to any python species. The locations are known, yet breeders still seem to sell their animals. I literally know hundreds of herpers that know the true location of these pygmy pythons. Even many people on this thread knew where they are from, and still not many are in collections. Sort of mutes your arguements, doesn't it.

 

[Boney]

im not saying anything to you mate .you got nothing to add to this thread that is constructive .

what ive said from the start ..they where sold to me as mossman and will stay that way . crap i know they whent found in the main street waiting for a bus . my friend knows the excact spot . and mossman he felt is close enough . he said to leave it as that . to avoid certain outcomes . ect like hobbo said . my only problem here is people like bob feel they need to put themselves out there to look better then the average person . telling them they are wrong . which has not been proven here and i can assure you all my line is found within a reasonable distance from mossman . in our opinion ...
just as close to mossman as mount carbine so i guess he has picked the name over mount carbine . sorry he didnt run the name past the internet experts first .

and thanks AD for your pic ... not a good example but as you said and my adults have not washed out but they do change colour.

THE END.. NOTHING MORE TO ADD CLOSE THE THREAD NOW . NOTHING HAS CHANGED SINCE PAGE 2

 

[scorps]

Just for the record (coming from someone who is in mossyman at least once a fortnight) North queensland is full of a wide range of habitats, just drive the kuranda range if you dont belive me, one minute your in the city, then up the range straight into rainforest, (the range is 20km long) as soon as you hit the top of the range drive another 10km and your in bush, a 30km drive in FNQ is a big distance.

 

[herpkeeper]

I don't think that Bob or anyone else is trying to big note themselves by telling the true locality of these animals. If you are selling something as a locale specific, than it should come from that area.
you are the one misleading people by saying that these animals come from Mossman when they don't . & seeing how antaresia are your thing, then you should know you do not find Stimmies east of the divide, certainly not in the rain forest......

 

[shamous1]

but she's bad tempered and head that's ugly as sin.

HAHA.....lucky I read on. I thought you were talking about my sister.:lol:

Nice animals. Has anyone got pics of them when they are older. Would be good to see the pattern.