reptile sale slump???

[HOM3L3SS]

lol is a freckled bredli just a bredli with spots

 

[The Devil]

Sale slump for average looking animals.

god help this hobby when you can buy a jag for $200..normal carpets
just wont sell..most people just want a colorful pet... that's it...
have you seen the herp classifieds lately? jags for $1000.

The so called "jags" on RDU for $1000 were not called jags for a reason.
The reason, they were NOT jags, just jungles with good stripes and hence they were called RPM's.
I saw some pics of the little ones and 1 of the parents the other day.

 

[kupper]

sales have definantly slowed , but my industry has slowed rediculously as well

i am pretty sure it has something to do with people spending too much during the christmas , New year period

 

[spongebob]

So Australia is seeing the same dynamic that played out in Europe and the USA in the 90's.....a shift whereby the sellers start to equal the buyers so everyone gets fussy. I foresee the sale of much breeding stock in the coming months.....

Just look at what's going on overseas -a standard leopard gecko is almost the same cost as a feeder fish, whereas the top end colour morphs still attract interest.

It's time to get serious about breeding, and time to "to separate the wheat from the chaff" if you want to move herps. But of course you could still treat it as a hobby and just enjoy them!

 

[dottyback]

In my opinion its simply 'the supply is outweighing the demand' Boyds Forest Dragons is a great example; There are plenty of breeders pumping them out, as they are on a higher class licence around the country there is only a small supply for them hence bringing down the price.

Also people are unrealistic with their prices, 1 month old Children’s pythons trying to be sold privately for $250...

I do agree though that there are not as many ‘new comers’ to the hobby like years gone past.

 

[BARRAMUNDI]

I have been trying to sell standard animals recently with little or no luck, I have had the best interest in these sales from friends of friends who are new to the hobby. However I have also been selling more unusual animals with better patterns and colours and to date all animals advertised have been sold in minimal time and with little fuss.

From my recent experiences the market is calling for unusaul looking specimens, morphs etc etc

 

[pythonmum]

I'm with smudge and Pilbara - build up the market by educating people. I'm a teacher and work my classroom snake into presentations as much as possible. I can assure you that there are plenty of young folks getting interested in the hobby - both male and female. They like the idea of a low-maintenance pet that you can interact with when you want and ignore when you want (aside from basic hygeine and feeding, of course). I've been approached by students wanting to buy snakes, so I refer them to the major websites including APS.

 

[longqi]

We are finally reaching a point where supply exceeds demand

This is wonderful for buyers as our reptiles have always been grossly over valued
eg GTPs $10,000 while better GTPs in the USA were $500

Now we are reaching the point where reptiles can become household pets instead of being objects of awe left mouldering in a cage because they are too valuable to let anyone touch

 

[AUSGECKO]

It would be interesting to find out from Slateman or Administrator what the sale of APS subscriptions and general hits on the site have been like in the last 12 months compared to previous years. I know that the retail sale of all reptile related products has dramatically suffered this season and i have been told by various wholesalers of these products that N.S.W has been hit hardest, but it seems to be the case with all pet products.

 

[yommy]

All good points raised guy and girls. I can only see the current situation as a positive.
As for all those who have gotten into the hobby to get the quick and big $$$$ may now need to reassess their motives, where as those who selectively breed just to cover expenses and possible better aquistions will be able to ride the current situation out.

Fortuneatly depending on which way you view it, for me the wife isn't the biggest fan of reptiles (no one is perfect i guess ) but she put a limit on my numbers, so in turn i've have gone the better top end species. So for me having a quality over quanity collection i can get by regardless whether i am breeding or not and at the end of the day its all about the reptiles not the quick $$$$$.

jmo

 

[Bushfire]

One common trend Ive seen in the past has been when certain species / normal colour types hits a certain point in terms of pricing and availability, the breeders stop breeding them till there is more demand, they figure its not worth their effort putting pairs together as they dont want to be stuck with offspring. Now either the demand will never again be there or it will be, once people dry up the supply the demand returns. The race this creates is will there be enough demand there for the breeders to kick start their programs again before existing breeding stocks and existing genetic diversity become too old to breed and thus lost? Of course not every single breeder will stop breeding so there will be still some sort of supply but the masses will stop producing them.

So will the current market and pricing follow this back and fore approach as its done in the past here in Australia? Or are we seeing the very start of a new era where in the future next to no interest will be shown in the common / normal type looking representatives of that species so demand will always be low, similar to USA (Im dangerous assuming here but I personally cant see that there will ever be a growing interest in the normal wild type looking Ball Python).

Wow thats abit heavy to pounder in one night lol.

 

[markars]

I know that the retail sale of all reptile related products has dramatically suffered this season and i have been told by various wholesalers of these products that N.S.W has been hit hardest, but it seems to be the case with all pet products.

Thats because for too long anything reptile related has been an excuse to gouge, rape and burn the consumer!

The last few years have seen the popularity of the alternatives ( click clacks, electrical wholesalers for heating gear and globes and internet sales from overseas) grow and hence people stop the purchase of these items. The retailers and manufactures only have them selves to blame, If the prices (mark ups) of these items were not so high in the first place, people would not have to look for home made or cheaper alternatives.

I personally have been buying from overseas for the last ten years and even when the aussie dollar was a pittance i still saved 50 percent compared to what was on offer in the local markets.

The of over supply of reptiles will see the prices undergo a long overdue "correction". A correction to what they should have always been. The sharp spike in reptile popularity bought about by the introduction of a licencing system in nsw brought a huge jump in prices and this has never been corrected, For too long the "bread and butter species: ( common locals and easily kept and bred) have been charged to people at atrocious prices which in turn has encouraged everey man and his dog to get into breeding and keeping as a business! ( i know drug dealers who look at us in envy lol ).

If the prices of the beginner animals had remained or resettled back to their proper prices earlier perhaps the popularity amoungst new people would have grown and we would have seen a better expansion and cross over to main steam. parent has a choice of pet for their child : a kitten for thirty dollars or spend 500 dollars for a costal and set up- what are they going to take!

Reptiles seem to be the only commodity that the price increased once it came off the black market! Before the amnesty carpets were 80-100 dollars, olives and waters were 200, blueys were 20 ewd were 10!- All were captive bred not wc. I got a black head for 750 when there were only a few people who could breed them.

seems that the dream run is over- make em cheap and sell more.

sorry for the rant.

 

[bk201]

alot of breeders can only blame themselves like cmon breeding 200-400 beardies each per year what do you expect...and imagine in a few years every beardy will be closely related in someway with big breeders flooding the market.

 

[yommy]

On a side note it would be interesting to hear how the Industry leaders/breeeders like SXR, URS and Snake Ranch are going and if it is effecting them as well as these groups have massive collections to maintain, may be some good bargain coming up in the next season or so. Shame i am at my number limit - damn wife

Could be a good topic to cover in one of our two reptile magazine. 'Reptiles the future???'

 

[Jungle_Freak]

A good time to start this thread Yommy ,
Sales have slowed to a trickle for most people as far as i can tell.
And the reason for this ? I believe is because of the recession and also because the market is flooded with all species .
If you are producing something new or different ? in colours or patterns then your market is still out there although people are just not willing to pay the big money for reptiles as once was the case, unless its a spectacular reptile.
my 2 cents
cheers
Roger

 

[Simon_Archibald]

So will the current market and pricing follow this back and fore approach as its done in the past here in Australia? Or are we seeing the very start of a new era where in the future next to no interest will be shown in the common / normal type looking representatives of that species so demand will always be low, similar to USA (Im dangerous assuming here but I personally cant see that there will ever be a growing interest in the normal wild type looking Ball Python).

I do think this is happening already and its a big shame. The obsession that people have with breeding colour morphs, designer this and that just doesn't sit well with me at all. People compare the selective breeding of reptiles with similar practices for dogs/cats etc, but I cannot make that comparison. The difference to me lies in the fact that the species we are breeding are still all out there amongst the wild yonder. Natural colour variations serving a purpose for any particular species. You only have to look at the terrible looking GTPs that are being bred in USA and the bastardisation of species like the Ball Python to know what greed can do to people. Furthermore, breeders simply make up the names to the "morphs" they create, all in the interest of selling more to gullible keepers.

Not enough keepers in Australia have realised what a fantastic oppourtunity the WA licensing system has given us over the past few years. Here you have a system where registered takers are able to collect specimens of many species from the wild, record their location and other relevant data, then introduce these animals into the private market for breeding purposes. This allows breeding of locality-pure animals, bred in captivity as they would likely in the wild. Of all the "Tully", "Proserpine" Jungles, "Tanami" Womas, etc, can you guarantee this locality or are breeders simply naming these animals based on a colouration similarity with an animal they think came from that region.

People like Dave of Pilbara Pythons and Gary of West Aussie Reptiles are a wealth of information and can provide us with animals of known locality when many others are just speculating. This oppourtunity could one day prove very valuable should native populations continue to be decimated.

 

[Wild~Touch]

The obsession that people have with breeding colour morphs, designer this and that ...???

May I ask what do they do with the "offcuts"

My guess is flood the market with the leftovers that don't meet the requirements of "special"

Cheers
Sandee

 

[CodeRed]

I feel sorry for all those who have bought up big in the last few years in the hope of making a living out of it. If you want to make money, breed rodents. The demand for them must be skyrocketing.

 

[James_Scott]

All I can say is marketing. We need to follow the Americans and come up with better names for our morphs. Good on Jason for using the term "Jellybean" for his patternless Levis. Using terms like RD just confuses the public and we need to simplify it to increase interest. One only has to see the interest in the overseas market with ball pythons and leapard geckos. Sure this is a huge amount of variety there but if they just called them albino, Reduced Pattern, hypo etc do you think they would be as popular as they are now.
We really need to market our lines and come up with some creative names to build interest.
As a bonus if you are the first to breed a particular morph and publicise the fact then you should get to name it. Names like firefly, black demon, I don't care what it is but give the hobby some flair!
There are so many secret projects out there that need to become public to expand interest in the hobby. Contact our excellent reptile magazines and get some published! You will be doing yourself and the hobby a favour.
There are always people that prefer the standard classical forms and if we can spread the hobby out through clever marketing and artwork then these will sell as a biproduct.
Good luck to all of the breeders out there, I know its tough so maybe its time to change tact.

 

[beatlloydy]

Thats because for too long anything reptile related has been an excuse to gouge, rape and burn the consumer!

The last few years have seen the popularity of the alternatives ( click clacks, electrical wholesalers for heating gear and globes and internet sales from overseas) grow and hence people stop the purchase of these items. The retailers and manufactures only have them selves to blame, If the prices (mark ups) of these items were not so high in the first place, people would not have to look for home made or cheaper alternatives.

I personally have been buying from overseas for the last ten years and even when the aussie dollar was a pittance i still saved 50 percent compared to what was on offer in the local markets.

The of over supply of reptiles will see the prices undergo a long overdue "correction". A correction to what they should have always been. The sharp spike in reptile popularity bought about by the introduction of a licencing system in nsw brought a huge jump in prices and this has never been corrected, For too long the "bread and butter species: ( common locals and easily kept and bred) have been charged to people at atrocious prices which in turn has encouraged everey man and his dog to get into breeding and keeping as a business! ( i know drug dealers who look at us in envy lol ).

If the prices of the beginner animals had remained or resettled back to their proper prices earlier perhaps the popularity amoungst new people would have grown and we would have seen a better expansion and cross over to main steam. parent has a choice of pet for their child : a kitten for thirty dollars or spend 500 dollars for a costal and set up- what are they going to take!

Reptiles seem to be the only commodity that the price increased once it came off the black market! Before the amnesty carpets were 80-100 dollars, olives and waters were 200, blueys were 20 ewd were 10!- All were captive bred not wc. I got a black head for 750 when there were only a few people who could breed them.

seems that the dream run is over- make em cheap and sell more.

sorry for the rant.

Your comments about the price of goods at retail store level versus what we can get overseas including shipping are spot on...and not limited to reptiles...I have the same issue with bicycles and guitars....now the retailers will say..."we have overheads such as rent etc etc"....however, this should only justify a 10-15% markup..whereas in many cases the markup is more than 50% and in some cases more than 100%.

I for one will buy from a retail store versus internet if the price difference is no more than 15%...any more and I will look after #1 (me)...too bad if the stores are doing it tough...they need to revamp themselves and perhaps have a cheaper online presence or offer in store incentives..e.g free servicing of equipment in first 12-24 months, in store warranties etc.

As to species slowing down perhaps it is a cycle...for those trying to offload perhaps try a little later when there is less on the market...when the market is flooded (Dec to March) then there will be lots of reps not sold...to the sellers...try and treat all buyers with respect...I know tyre kickers are sometimes a waste but I for one will try and get a feel for the seller and if the "vibe" is not there I wont deal with them..if that makes me a tyre kicker the so be it...I am not going to deal with rude or shady sellers...It doesnt take long to answer and email or a phone or put up a few pictures...buyers have a right to see the parents and siblings pics if they ask for them...if you put them in the ad in the first place perhaps this will stop 99% of the questions.