I agree Jamie, after getting stonewalled with DEC for a couple of years, WAHS went down the lobbying route and have been able to slowly bring about change to the WA system. Our recent meeting had DPaW officers requesting we discuss issues with them first and give them the opportunity to resolve the issues rather than approach the minister. But the reality is to get a national group up and running you need to a committed group (10+ years), with set goals and you need to have a thick skin as there is plenty out there who'll tell how thing should be done or how better a job they would do after all the work is done or claim the glory after the event, but ask them for effort during the process and the silence is only broken by the lame excuses.
Its a pity the national group didn't get off the ground as every state is looking to "review" the wildlife laws with a view to standardise the laws. DPaW is looking at minimum cage sizes in WA and is in the process of looking to replacing the Wildlife Conservation Regs with the to be announced Biodiversity Conservation Bill. From what I have read it will effect the non R&A keepers more than us as the system looks to be based on the R&A system.
Interesting thread, for a change..
I'll echo Shamat's post and I'm sure most members here would.
Here's my 2c anyways:
1. If we think as a hobby that things will change by putting up a thread on a forum frequented by as little as 50 people a day (despite the silly stats of '300 members online' you may see..) then we have already shot ourselves in the foot.
2. Less than 1% of herpers frequent these online forums and even less are members of a LOCAL herp society let alone a national one.
3. As has been mentioned several times, everyone has an agenda. Everyone is also an expert, who knows better. Well, you don't. Those who tried to negotiate years ago with NPWS could not have had more experience, or the thoughts, goals and concerns of the average keeper more in their minds when they went through that and yet the brick wall stayed up.
4. Those who speak of Court challenges have NO idea of what's involved in that, High Court challenge !? For starters it's about $1,000,000 for the high Court fee, let alone the fact that if a Reptile Import case ever came across the bench it would be used as toilet paper.
5. Change takes years, and by the time it happens, the reptile scene would have changed that much that the change you all want will probably be redundant. I stepped away from the hobby for 3 years after having a child and can honestly say the change has been incredible, and not for the better of the hobby, the laws or the most important part of our hobby, the Herps themselves.
So, what to do?
For starters:
1. Support those who have your interests at heart (maybe not ALL of them, but the majority anyways). Once some form of draft is written about what the hobby is not happy with, you need support from the masses before any politics are involved. Law reform comes with changing community values. If as a community we want things done, INVOLVE the community. Not 20 members off a forum not known for appreciating some of its most experienced members. Start with reptile retail outlets, herp societies, equipment sellers and let them know what your plan is.. The more people you get to support it the better.
2. Go and join a local herp society and tell all your reptile buddies to do the same
3. Those who tried originally should try again, I know Jamie well and have met Gavin a number of times and no one is more passionate about reptiles. But they need your support, not 5minute experts who keep a carpet python telling them they don't know what they are doing..
4. How many herp keepers are solicitors? Put your hand up for some volunteer work and work with those who need it.
5. Less talk, more action. Most people do the right thing and as Jamie mentioned its the 1-2 % of cowboys who set us all back. The reptile industry has the potential to be big business and with that we neglect the animals, and every time we do this we give more and more material for the anti's to jump up and down about.
Anyways thats probably more like 5c worth.. Sorry..
I have to completely agree, I have nothing to add but I feel I need to show my support, as red fox said as a young keeper I have the most to gain out of this.I like don't have anything to really add to this thread but I think it is an excellent idea and would support it. The chances of massive restrictions being placed on the hobby in the distant and not so distant future which would be detrimental to my enjoyment or the possibility of keeping these wonderful animals is fairly high, if we continue the way we are. At the moment, any voice, even if I don't agree with all their decisions, I would see as beneficial to the hobby as a whole, even if it does take many years to become large and powerful enough to have any political sway. As a young keeper ( I'm 20 y.o), I feel my age group has the most to gain long term from an established representative body. I hope to still be able to own and enjoy my herps in 40+ yrs time.
Interesting thread, for a change..
I'll echo Shamat's post and I'm sure most members here would.
Here's my 2c anyways:
1. If we think as a hobby that things will change by putting up a thread on a forum frequented by as little as 50 people a day (despite the silly stats of '300 members online' you may see..) then we have already shot ourselves in the foot.
2. Less than 1% of herpers frequent these online forums and even less are members of a LOCAL herp society let alone a national one.
3. As has been mentioned several times, everyone has an agenda. Everyone is also an expert, who knows better. Well, you don't. Those who tried to negotiate years ago with NPWS could not have had more experience, or the thoughts, goals and concerns of the average keeper more in their minds when they went through that and yet the brick wall stayed up.
4. Those who speak of Court challenges have NO idea of what's involved in that, High Court challenge !? For starters it's about $1,000,000 for the high Court fee, let alone the fact that if a Reptile Import case ever came across the bench it would be used as toilet paper.
5. Change takes years, and by the time it happens, the reptile scene would have changed that much that the change you all want will probably be redundant. I stepped away from the hobby for 3 years after having a child and can honestly say the change has been incredible, and not for the better of the hobby, the laws or the most important part of our hobby, the Herps themselves.
So, what to do?
For starters:
1. Support those who have your interests at heart (maybe not ALL of them, but the majority anyways). Once some form of draft is written about what the hobby is not happy with, you need support from the masses before any politics are involved. Law reform comes with changing community values. If as a community we want things done, INVOLVE the community. Not 20 members off a forum not known for appreciating some of its most experienced members. Start with reptile retail outlets, herp societies, equipment sellers and let them know what your plan is.. The more people you get to support it the better.
2. Go and join a local herp society and tell all your reptile buddies to do the same
3. Those who tried originally should try again, I know Jamie well and have met Gavin a number of times and no one is more passionate about reptiles. But they need your support, not 5minute experts who keep a carpet python telling them they don't know what they are doing..
4. How many herp keepers are solicitors? Put your hand up for some volunteer work and work with those who need it.
5. Less talk, more action. Most people do the right thing and as Jamie mentioned its the 1-2 % of cowboys who set us all back. The reptile industry has the potential to be big business and with that we neglect the animals, and every time we do this we give more and more material for the anti's to jump up and down about.
Anyways thats probably more like 5c worth.. Sorry..
Enter your email address to join: