Australian Representative Herp Body

[Pythoninfinite]

I'm not sure where all this talk of courts came from? I thought we were working toward having political representation as a hobby. we might be more successful if instead of trying fight the government in court, where they have pretty much unlimited resources. We instead use political pressure to improve the licensing system. Either way I think we should be trying to start with the small problems and working toward the big ones.

1. 6 month transfer period reduced or removed
2. Caging requirements changed from "rules" to "guide lines only" or removed all together

imports/exports and being able to keep all species in all states are both issues that defiantly need to be fixed. They are very big issues tho that will take a lot of resources to achieve, it might be better if we try to get a few small wins under our belt that way the sceptics that are sitting on the side lines will see that it is working and will start to come on board before we tackle the big issues.

Actually governments don't have unlimited resources when it comes to litigation - they target the money they spend on court matters pretty much according to whether they will win or not (ie, money well spent), and like everybody these days, they have budget limits placed on their activities across all facets of their operations.

As far as equality between all states goes, island communities can (and in Tassie's case, I think should) claim special consideration with regard to the introduction of non-endemic species into their fragile ecosystems. This is my personal opinion of course, but I believe Tasmania should keep the ban on non-endemic reptiles in place, and the needs of a few Tasmanians who want to keep other species should not override the very sound reasons for keeping potentially harmful introductions out. If you want to keep other species, move to a place where you can - I left WA pretty much because of the restrictions in that state.

Changing the enclosure size rules in NSW is not a simple matter - they are now enshrined in law, and it is highly unlikely the Government will be compelled to revisit the matter anytime soon. I suspect that NSW has germinated a cancerous growth around this matter and it is likely to be looked at seriously by most jurisdictions in the country sometime soon. Given the response in NSW from keepers, I doubt that any consultation will take place before imposition of similar legislation elsewhere. But now is the time to lobby your state representatives on both sides, because Abbott has successfully destabilised even the state Liberal Governments, and they won't be looking too flash when it comes to reelection (yay!!!).

Champagne, sorry to do this (it's not personal !) but the word is "definitely," not "defiantly," which means something totally different.

- - - Updated - - -

G'day guys, for what it's worth I'd just like to say a big thank you to those that are giving their time to further our hobby/passion.
You definitely have my support and respect.
Communication is one of my many weak points (just ask wifey) so I'm not much good to you guys in the front line unfortunately. But it does seem clear to me that simply communicating this idea to the average herper is step number one in gaining support from them. Maybe that is one area where us average joes can help. As mentioned via herp clubs, notices in pet shops, person to person etc.
Maybe there needs to be a web site we can point people at that displays the goals and benefits?

Thanks for your support Steve! Have you filled in that drain across your driveway yet ?

Jamie

 

[Wing_Nut]

After a similar suggestion that the Animal rights organisations where looking closely at keeping and racing of pigeons in WA, the state pigeon federation took the proactive step of writing our own code of practice and having it endorsed by the authorities. To give our code of practice the punch it required, it was reviewed by veterinary practitioners as part of the process. In this way, we circumvented overzealous animal rights organisations attempts to adversely affect our hobby, and have had relative peace since. The remainder of the states adopted a very similar code of practice and also avoided the same. My suggestion would be that a national body write something similar for the remainder of the states local representative bodies to adopt and limit the fallout. The cost associated with producing such a document was low, it did not require a great deal of time, and I would suppose that the representative body that already convened in NSW would already have all the information required. With very little effort the code of practice was adopted by the state regulators with very positive support.

 

[Slickturtle]

Hi Pythoninfinite

Re: "As far as equality between all states goes, island communities can (and in Tassie's case, I think should) claim special consideration with regard to the introduction of non-endemic species into their fragile ecosystems. This is my personal opinion of course, but I believe Tasmania should keep the ban on non-endemic reptiles in place, and the needs of a few Tasmanians who want to keep other species should not override the very sound reasons for keeping potentially harmful introductions out. If you want to keep other species, move to a place where you can - I left WA pretty much because of the restrictions in that state."

Although I totally agree with you in principle re the environmental sanctity of islands, there is one important aspect here concerning Tassie. It is cold there. I would argue that herp keepers should be allowed to keep any sensible tropical reptile. I.E. How long would a GT Python last if it escaped in Hobart? It reminds me of the illogical laws in Sweden (or is it Finland?) where people are not permitted any reptiles much - not even north African Leopard Geckoes. I guess that the authorities are worried that the geckos might escape and establish themselves in the crevasses in the glaciers - from which they will leap out and attack people! LOL.

 

[fishead]

Gday Jamie, long time no see hey. Yeah driveway is sorted, wifey did a great job there haha.
Drop in if you're ever coming past mate.

 

[Waterrat]

Hi Jamie and Greg, during my recent visit to Tassie, I learned that significant changes re- importation of "some" mainland reptiles are imminent. I just hope they don't allow importation of Red-bellied black snakes. Cheers M

 

[Slickturtle]

Hi Jamie and Greg, during my recent visit to Tassie, I learned that significant changes re- importation of "some" mainland reptiles are imminent. I just hope they don't allow importation of Red-bellied black snakes. Cheers M

Hi Mike

Years ago a biologist in Darwin once said that R B Blacksnakes could take off like a plague if they got loose up here. I wonder how they get on with toads. I know they co-habit with toads in your area. Interesting thought.

GLM

 

[Waterrat]

Greg, I wondered why there are no RBBSs in Tas while roaming the country side there looking for snakes. I then had discussions with Rick Shine and others and expressed some ideas in a paragraph in the next issue of Scale & Tails (due out this week). Let me know what you think of it.

cheers
M

 

[Pythoninfinite]

RBBs have been tried in Darwin on at least several occasions, but they, like Diamond Pythons, don't do well in the climate. I saw Gow and a couple of his mates working with them for a while, but I believe they didn't last more than a couple of years.

Jamie

 

[ShaunMorelia]

Something that is being done now and we really need something in place to counter anything that would be detrimental to our hobby arising from this kind of thing.

The quote below is from another Australian Reptile Forum...

Hi everyone,

My name is Tiffani Howell and I am postdoc working with A/Prof Pauleen Bennett at La Trobe University in Melbourne. We received funding from the Victorian Bureau of Animal Welfare to run a survey asking owners of lizards, snakes, turtles, and frogs (not technically reptiles, I know!) about the various ways they meet the needs of their pets.

This is the first study of its kind, and we'll use the information gained from the survey to develop educational campaigns aimed at improving pet reptile/amphibian welfare. I'd really appreciate it if you'd be willing to participate, and let us know how you keep your pets. All data will remain completely anonymous.

We need reptile/amphibian owners who are at least 10 years old; anyone under 18 will need to get permission from a parent or guardian. If you're willing to help us out, please follow this link:

**removed link**

Also, if anyone has any questions or comments, or would like to be kept informed of the results, please email me at **removed email**

Feel free to share the link around with anyone else in the herp community. We are based in Australia but are recruiting worldwide.
Thanks very much in advance.

This is a prime example of why we need a united national body.

Thanks
Shaun.

 

[champagne]

Pet lovers push snake imports as pressure grows to ease rules on non-venomous reptiles | The Mercury

 

[ShaunMorelia]

Some of those comments are ridiculous!

 

[notechistiger]

I also have nothing constructive to add other than my full support of this. Let's get this off the ground!

 

[insitu]

RBBs have been tried in Darwin on at least several occasions, but they, like Diamond Pythons, don't do well in the climate. I saw Gow and a couple of his mates working with them for a while, but I believe they didn't last more than a couple of years.

Jamie

tropical species in cold climates require heating, cold climate species in tropical climates require cooling, its a no brainer really. there are many cooling systems available for many different applications just generally most keepers arent interested in spending the money or changing their ways from a wooden box with a heat light, kinda sad the way we still all follow the same old school methods of housing our animals

this hobby disregarding needs for ease of cleaning and cheaper power bills leaves ourselves open to be picked apart by surveys and studies etc as posted above, just look at the stink people put up over the caging requirements recently brought in to NSW which weren't unreasonable at all

 

[Slickturtle]

tropical species in cold climates require heating, cold climate species in tropical climates require cooling, its a no brainer really. there are many cooling systems available for many different applications just generally most keepers arent interested in spending the money or changing their ways from a wooden box with a heat light, kinda sad the way we still all follow the same old school methods of housing our animals

Hi Insitu

While you are perfectly correct in the general sense - things are not always that clear cut in detail. RBB Snks are found in the Cairns area - and that is definitely tropical. But Cairns is cooler than Darwin. But so is the whole of coastal north east Arnhemland around Nhulunbuy. I reckon that RBB Snks sourced fro the Cairns area would have a very good change of thriving in the wild at Nhulunbuy - unless there is some other negative element other than temperature. Mike C would know how far RBB Snks extend west from Cairns. It gets hotter the further you go. How far do black snakes penetrate into the hotter inland zones? Where did G Gow source his black snakes? - not from Cairns would be my bet.

Apologies - this is nothing to do with the topic of the thread.

 

[insitu]

id hazzard a guess the land barrier is what has stopped them reaching NT, its a lot of unfavorable habitat with a lot of mulgas between, now the toads have slowed up the top enders they might have a fairly good run at populating the area if they were to be released/escape from captivity as im sure when conditions are too hot they would be more than able to find refuge underground and in the wetlands, my post was more in regards to the survey posted above though as we leave ourselves wide open to criticism from the way we manage our animals, i just used jamies captive red bellies post as an example

 

[Slickturtle]

Hi all; Greg Miles here:
Just adding to what Gavin said in his post # 75 on this thread. As you know, our small group of activists have had a go at 'sniffing the air' to see if the time is right to kick off a national body. Unfortunately not everything fell into place and our efforts have not quite had the reach that we hoped for. But we have made enough noise - I think - to lure the right people out of their terrariums and snake rooms to join with us in becoming a bigger force of organisers/kick starters. Although there have been plenty of messages of support, there has only been a couple of people who put their hands up and offered to help carry the workload.

Gavin and his small group of helpers cannot do it alone. E.G. Gavin and I both live in Darwin. You probably could not choose a worse city from which to try to kick-start a national reptile association. The nucleus needs to be somewhere down the eastern seaboard where contact and collaboration is more realistic. In addition, Gavin is a very busy person and has a limited amount of free time. He and I have not lost our enthusiasm for this project and remain super keen for it to happen, and we want to be involved. But we had hoped by this stage the right people would have appeared in response to our earlier ‘push’. Ideally if we could get just one or two people in each capital city, they could join in with us in developing this worthwhile thing further. Ideally these people will have some experience behind them and a bit of spare time.

We are still working on this as time allows. So please be patient and watch this space!!

Cheers

Greg

 

[wokka]

Is it considerred a bad thing if RBB were able to survive in Darwin?

 

[insitu]

in the wild it wouldnt be ideal, a native species introduced into an area its not endemic too is still classed as an introduced species

 

[cement]

They seem to go allright up on the Atherton. Cool up on the mountains though.
A friend also keeps them outdoors on the coast, near Proserpine. Gets cool there at night though too.

 

[shamat]

Hi all; Greg Miles here:
Just adding to what Gavin said in his post # 75 on this thread. As you know, our small group of activists have had a go at 'sniffing the air' to see if the time is right to kick off a national body. Unfortunately not everything fell into place and our efforts have not quite had the reach that we hoped for. But we have made enough noise - I think - to lure the right people out of their terrariums and snake rooms to join with us in becoming a bigger force of organisers/kick starters. Although there have been plenty of messages of support, there has only been a couple of people who put their hands up and offered to help carry the workload.

Gavin and his small group of helpers cannot do it alone. E.G. Gavin and I both live in Darwin. You probably could not choose a worse city from which to try to kick-start a national reptile association. The nucleus needs to be somewhere down the eastern seaboard where contact and collaboration is more realistic. In addition, Gavin is a very busy person and has a limited amount of free time. He and I have not lost our enthusiasm for this project and remain super keen for it to happen, and we want to be involved. But we had hoped by this stage the right people would have appeared in response to our earlier ‘push’. Ideally if we could get just one or two people in each capital city, they could join in with us in developing this worthwhile thing further. Ideally these people will have some experience behind them and a bit of spare time.

We are still working on this as time allows. So please be patient and watch this space!!

Cheers

Greg

Count me in. I'm in Western Sydney and have sat on several boards and deal with many gov't departments as part of my job. Happy to try and add any value i can.

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