bearded x water dradon

[shamous1]

Hi Alumba

Hi Matt,

I would like to say that I am sorry that this thread has converted to who knows this and that more. You were after info and people gave it to you freely.

A certain person also stated also talked about contradictions, "Splitmore & nzdragons has given knowledgeable posts & answered your questions. They wont cross breed & chances are if she is gravid she will lay an infertile clutch."
I would have thought that the last sentence was a contradiction. The key word being "CHANCES ARE". Not a definative answer in my book.This is not an attack on Splitmore or nzdragons as I have enjoyed their knowledgeable posts and look forward to more in the future. It is "Just a mere observation".



All I can say and I'll say it again. If in doubt get it to the Vet. If it pre-ovulation egg binding (which can happen regardless) the animal needs attention.


My final say.

 

[alumba]

thanks shamous i will tei the old girl to get it off to a vet

cheers every one

alumba

 

[da_donkey]

I agree with what Jand C has said, and if you look back to the first page at what i posted "false pregnancy" that would be the most obvious answer

If the two species in question were going to 'hybridize" im sure we would have seen it before now.

and now this thread has gone 3 pages long full of crap.


JMO


Peace out, Donk.

 

[shamous1]

We are all experts after the event.

 

[JandC_Reptiles]

How is that a contradiction? Its a fact they will not x breed & it is also a fact that if she is gravid it would be a false pregnancy and the clutch would be infertile (not sure if you know about the birds & the bees but obviously if there is no male to fertilise the female than the clutch of eggs will be infertile)

When I said "CHANCES ARE" it was to imply that NOBODY KNOWS FOR SURE if his dragon is gravid because the animal is not infront of us. There is no contradiction in that sentence at all, try to re-read it. If we had the dragon in our hands & could palpate it for eggs etc we would be able to give a deffinate answer, but we do not have contact with the animal so how can we possibly predict with certainty? We can only go by what the original poster has relayed to us in their message & that is they think it may be gravid. Therefore my statement remains "IF it is gravid it would be a false pregnancy & the eggs would be infertile". 100% correct advice given by several members, why you choose my post as an example is beyond me.

You are clutching at straws in trying to make me look like some sort of villian here. Get over your personal beef & take my post for exactly what it was a bit of advice & an observation of posts. And now you resort to calling us "experts after the event" for giving sound advice? Just because you failed to give the correct info dosn't mean you need to feel any guilt and get defensive & aggressive towards us.

EDIT: No need to turn this into an argument, you have said your say & I have said mine, advice has been given & all is good for the poster.

 

[shamous1]

Arguement

Not turning it into an argument by any means. Why would you think that?
You are obviously very informed when it comes to herps and I look forward to hearing more from you and learning more from you in the future J & C.

If you think I'm being sarcastic I'm not.

 

[Deano]

Hi Alumba, going by the first pic the water dragon defiantly looks male not female! Male water dragons have bright red under there chest and in that first pic you can see a red tinge on the side, I could be wrong but more pics of the chest would help because none of my females had red on them. If it was a female and gravid you should see bumps on the side of the stomach indicating eggs, to me that dragon looks blotted and will defiantly have to go to the vet. I use to have a few of these guys and to my knowledge the males have red on there chest not females and when my females were pregnant the side of there belly’s were more bumpy than a smooth blotted look.

 

[Tsidasa]

I feel annoyed that i read this whole thread haha, what can i say it suckered me in. Good luck with the EWD Alumba, hope it's nothing serious!

 

[Gecko_ProCs]

Im agreeing with Deano it looks like a male to me..
but could be wrong either way good luck with everything and i hope you dont destroy the eggs if it is female and pregger's

Cam...

 

[alumba]

Hi Alumba, going by the first pic the water dragon defiantly looks male not female! Male water dragons have bright red under there chest and in that first pic you can see a red tinge on the side, I could be wrong but more pics of the chest would help because none of my females had red on them. If it was a female and gravid you should see bumps on the side of the stomach indicating eggs, to me that dragon looks blotted and will defiantly have to go to the vet. I use to have a few of these guys and to my knowledge the males have red on there chest not females and when my females were pregnant the side of there belly’s were more bumpy than a smooth blotted look.

yes I used to have that belief but I have seen some females with red chests not as red as the male by all means but red that is why it is hard to tell the sex by looking at there chest especially when juves to young adults I find the most accurate way but not 100% is there size of there crest males have the larger crest on the back of there necks and females have a smaller one in height and length of spikes dont quote me on that it is just how i have been taught

but again i thank all of u for your replys

Cheers Matt

 

[cris]

I think it looks like a female.

 

[Deano]

Hi Matt, what happened with the water dragon, how did you go with the vet? Was it pregnant or not? I think all the people that tried to help you out would be curious to know what happened, thanks mate…………

 

[troynlesa]

Hear me out on this one!

What an interesting thread! I will offer my opinion and please dont anyone take this personally. After breeding dogs for many years and being a lover of all things genetic, i think the fact that any species(or breeds as dogs would have it) left together to interbreed without knowing all the information and side-effects regarding it, is completely irresponsible. I know cross breeds(or hybrids in this case) may look wonderful and maybe even make for great pets, Alumba please dont take this as a personal dig at u. The fact that cross breeding goes on just sickens me.
Are our beautiful native reptiles not good enough to look at and interact with in their native form? What would happen if some of these species became endangered and as keepers we were asked by relevant authorities to participate in breeding-for-release programs, How could we explain our actions to them?
This is probably a reason why in WA it has taken so long for us to be able to keep herps as pets, and in all reality CALM would probably revolke a licence if they knew cross breeding even took place. After all they do advize that we keep species separate.
I know we worry about the health and well being of our animals in general, but people, please also protect their genes, after all, once they're gone, they're gone.

Enough said i'll get off my soapbox now

Troy

 

[alumba]

troy i agree with u 100% if u take a look at some of the other threads on this topic u would c how much i am against it. but these animals belong to my mum, they are family pets and they where never intended to be bred.

DEANO i have not spoken to the old girl yet but as soon as I know something, I will post it on this thread.

Cheers Alumba

 

[adbacus]

The fact that cross breeding goes on just sickens me.

Troy

Troy, tell us how you really feel. Just kidding.

But on the same note, how do you feel of the naturally occuring intergrades out there. Morelia species can have naturally occurring intergrades i.e. with DP's in the same locality with other Carpets?

 

[troynlesa]

Hey! Its the same as the footy trip, what happens on the footy trip stays there. Yes i do know this happens in the wild, and yes i know Alumba was merely stating an accidental. Just thought it was a great opportunity to get everyone aware of what they keep and its significance to our great nation, the land of the lizards. As i said previously, there was no malice AT ALL in my last post, i want everyone to be aware of this.

Hey Accidents happen, thats why we're called amatuers

Happy herping guys

Troy

 

[alumba]

This debate on cross breading has been going on for yonks and i don’t think it will end any time soon un fortunately cross breading is only going to get more popular. The problem with us humans is that we get bored quickly we always want something bigger, better and fancier, curiosity will always get the better of us, and people will continue to cross bread animals to try and create that perfect animal. Me, im happy with what we have I love our natural accruing fauna, I like it just the way it is. That’s not to say im not curious, like a lot of people out there to see what one can create by crossing two different species, I just don’t believe it is right and I will stand by that. It dose not mean I condemn those that do, do it, every one is entitled to practice what they believe provided it does not break any laws. So as far as this debate goes, I will be happy not to see it pop up in any threads any time soon!

I wish every one the best and I hope to talk to u all soon

Cheers Matt

 

[W.T.BUY]

keep the eggs.

and if they hatch u will become famous

LOL

 

[shamous1]

Hey Accidents happen, thats why we're called amatuers

I did'nt know we were all amateurs :shock:

I have never heard of that term being used before in reference to herps.:|

 

[alumba]

The hobbyist is some times referred to as amateur herpetologist I think, it means we don’t have any degrees in herpetology or zoology