Illegal Aussie Herps in Saudi Arabia

[Lawra]

[MENTION=12687]n3xia[/MENTION] are you talking about that Langawi dude? Can't remember correct spelling atm but I follow him on Instagram, he has a pretty epic collection.

 

[n3xia]

I am just gobsmacked by this thread. The OP asked for some advice and before you know it people are passing judgement and telling him

Her*
But thanks for the CITES suggestion, I will look into that.

[MENTION=12687]n3xia[/MENTION] are you talking about that Langawi dude? Can't remember correct spelling atm but I follow him on Instagram, he has a pretty epic collection.

No, I mean the Saudi guy I linked to in my OP... I think his username is Mr_mohannad.

To those still speculating about whether the animals were obtained legally or not, remember he admitted they were all illegal, and then removed evidence of the admission. And no, I don't see why anyone - even in Saudi Arabia - would lie about that.

If you translate the Arabic comments you will see the guy discussing prices and even past buyers giving updates on how their animal is going. His photos also indicate a high turnover of all manner of exotic and rare/endangered animals from all over the world and what appears to be a pet store in the background of some shots.

 

[R.Pilgrim]

Hahaha I love how the answer to combating illegal trade and animal cruelty is to tighten export security. The only reason this crap exists is because there is an illegal black market fuelled by a high demand created by these restrictions. People involved in this activity only care about profit not animal welfare. If exports were legal the trade would be over taken by enthusiasts who care about these animals wanting to expand collections over seas. which may actually have s positive consivational effect on some species.

 

[n3xia]

Hahaha I love how the answer to combating illegal trade and animal cruelty is to tighten export security. The only reason this crap exists is because there is an illegal black market fuelled by a high demand created by these restrictions. People involved in this activity only care about profit not animal welfare. If exports were legal the trade would be over taken by enthusiasts who care about these animals wanting to expand collections over seas. which may actually have s positive consivational effect on some species.

Enthusiasts... in Saudi Arabia/the middle east? This guy is a self-proclaimed 'reptile lover' and look what he's done. We've already discussed the cultural differences with animal welfare in that part of the world, too. There's enough Australians who can play a part in conserving native species without risking them becoming an invasive species overseas.

 

[Bluetongue1]

My apologies n3xia, I don’t tend to pay a lot of attention to the details in the heading, just what is written in each post and maybe the author. My oafish error. I assure you that your femineity remains unquestioned and
unblemished.

Blue

 

[Rlpreston]

Enthusiasts... in Saudi Arabia/the middle east? This guy is a self-proclaimed 'reptile lover' and look what he's done. We've already discussed the cultural differences with animal welfare in that part of the world, too. There's enough Australians who can play a part in conserving native species without risking them becoming an invasive species overseas.

I can see that you are very passionate about animal welfare issues, as am I and most users of this forum as I have seen it. You should be commended for that and if there is some kind of animal rights issue here then you should pursue action if you so wish.

I will add though, I am a human rights lover also. Your racist inference by that last post that there is no possibility that anyone from the Middle East/Saudia Arabia could care for animals/reptiles as an enthusiast does nothing to help your cause.

Do you care about these particular animals so much, or just that an Arab person has them?

 

[n3xia]

My apologies n3xia, I don’t tend to pay a lot of attention to the details in the heading, just what is written in each post and maybe the author. My oafish error. I assure you that your femineity remains unquestioned and
unblemished.

You could always use a gender-neutral term if you can't be bothered checking.

I can see that you are very passionate about animal welfare issues, as am I and most users of this forum as I have seen it. You should be commended for that and if there is some kind of animal rights issue here then you should pursue action if you so wish.

It's more animal welfare, but anyway...

I will add though, I am a human rights lover also. Your racist inference by that last post that there is no possibility that anyone from the Middle East/Saudia Arabia could care for animals/reptiles as an enthusiast does nothing to help your cause.

Do you care about these particular animals so much, or just that an Arab person has them?

I think my reasons for reporting this issue have been made quite clear throughout this thread: illegal exporting/importing of Australian animals and the welfare of those animals.

My post was not to say there aren't any enthusiasts in SA, but that if this is the standard for a 'reptile lover' (out of all the comments I translated, not one person mentioned the welfare of the animals) then what could we expect from an 'enthusiast'?

 

[treeofgreen]

That's a pretty big and probably unfair generalisation. I'm aware that stuff goes on there, but I don't think an average Saudi would appreciate you describing them as such.

It's their law. So completely fair since we are talking about the authorities who enforce such retarded laws.

 

[Senator358]

People kill elephants and giraffes in Africa...just saying.

 

[marcus0002]

People kill elephants and giraffes in Africa...just saying.

A lot of a time especially with elephnats the one shot has become a danger to people, no different from shooting problem crocs here, main difference instead of the government paying someone to shoot it, someone pays the government to shoot it.

You can't just go there and shoot one willy nilly.

 

[Trimeresurus]

A lot of a time especially with elephnats the one shot has become a danger to people, no different from shooting problem crocs here, main difference instead of the government paying someone to shoot it, someone pays the government to shoot it.

You can't just go there and shoot one willy nilly.

Illegal ivory trade?

 

[thomasssss]

the only problem i can see here is that his got australian reptiles oveseas , they look like their cared for reasonably well and then theres the fact that he is still in touch with previous customers , doesnt sound like someone who doesnt care about their animals welfare

this to me looks like a case of " i cant have your reptiles so why should they be allowed ours "

 

[Bluetongue1]

You could always use a gender-neutral term if you can't be bothered checking.

There is a significant difference between an accidental oversight and “couldn’t be bothered”. I endeavoured to explain that I do not note gender as I read. The other half of the reason is that I made a mental note to put him/ her but was too focused on writing a response. I am an extremely slow two-finger sight typist. The keyboard is missing two keys and “o” in particular is omitted more often then not. The spacebar would be lucky work once ut of five times and so I often end up with a string of 20 or 30 characters that then has to deciphered into words. Lastly, I was under time pressure but thought it important enough to say something.

Given your stated presumption, my short attempt at an apology clearly fell on deaf ears. Perhaps I should adopt that attitude in future?

 

[Umbral]

It's ok Blue you can call me whatever you like, I don't see it as an insult to be called the opposite sex on a forum. Maybe I'm just funny but I don't see being called the wrong sex, black, white or any nationality as an issue. At the end of the day we are all the same

 

[Pythoninfinite]

The chances of Australian authorities investing time & money in an investigation like this, where there is no actual evidence of wrongdoing (he wasn't CAUGHT smuggling, or the chain of supply can't be followed) is nil. An admission from someone in a country with an historic resistance to outside interference doesn't count as actual evidence. The internet is FULL of people all over the world with Australian animals. By far the majority of them in the common pet trade have been captive bred and available for decades overseas. I would suggest that this guy just says whatever pops into his head at times like this.

Jamie

 

[champagne]

You could always use a gender-neutral term if you can't be bothered checking.

It's more animal welfare, but anyway...

I think my reasons for reporting this issue have been made quite clear throughout this thread: illegal exporting/importing of Australian animals and the welfare of those animals.

My post was not to say there aren't any enthusiasts in SA, but that if this is the standard for a 'reptile lover' (out of all the comments I translated, not one person mentioned the welfare of the animals) then what could we expect from an 'enthusiast'?

You have too much time on your hands, are wasting the time of the already under funded government dept with bs reports and are just quiet rude in general. even after someone apologises for a simple mistake you still have a go at him. :facepalm:

 

[Trimeresurus]

Yes, poor Blue was your only helping hand here to.

 

[n3xia]

the only problem i can see here is that his got australian reptiles oveseas , they look like their cared for reasonably well and then theres the fact that he is still in touch with previous customers , doesnt sound like someone who doesnt care about their animals welfare

this to me looks like a case of " i cant have your reptiles so why should they be allowed ours "

I don't want Middle Eastern reptiles... or any reptiles from overseas, for that matter. As I think I mentioned, I have concerns for the welfare of the animals based on photos he has posted. The 'customers' most likely have a similar level of concern for animal welfare as the seller, so their being in touch is a moot point, really.

There is a significant difference between an accidental oversight and “couldn’t be bothered”. I endeavoured to explain that I do not note gender as I read. The other half of the reason is that I made a mental note to put him/ her but was too focused on writing a response. I am an extremely slow two-finger sight typist. The keyboard is missing two keys and “o” in particular is omitted more often then not. The spacebar would be lucky work once ut of five times and so I often end up with a string of 20 or 30 characters that then has to deciphered into words. Lastly, I was under time pressure but thought it important enough to say something.

Given your stated presumption, my short attempt at an apology clearly fell on deaf ears. Perhaps I should adopt that attitude in future?

All I'm saying is you shouldn't assume anyone's gender. Your lengthy explanation was not necessary, and sounded more like excuses to me. It really ain't that hard to glance at a poster's gender before responding, and if you're gonna blame it on a faulty keyboard then you might be surprised to learn that a new one is a mere $20, or even cheaper/possibly free second hand.

The chances of Australian authorities investing time & money in an investigation like this, where there is no actual evidence of wrongdoing (he wasn't CAUGHT smuggling, or the chain of supply can't be followed) is nil. An admission from someone in a country with an historic resistance to outside interference doesn't count as actual evidence. The internet is FULL of people all over the world with Australian animals. By far the majority of them in the common pet trade have been captive bred and available for decades overseas. I would suggest that this guy just says whatever pops into his head at times like this.

Jamie

Yeah I realised before I reported it that them actually investigating it was a long shot, but if police can arrest people on Facebook statuses about illegal activity then surely his admission would count for some form of evidence. I don't think owning up to illegal activity is something that 'just pops into' an innocent person's head, either.

You have too much time on your hands, are wasting the time of the already under funded government dept with bs reports and are just quiet rude in general. even after someone apologises for a simple mistake you still have a go at him. :facepalm:

I'm sure that Wildlife Trade Compliance is quite capable of effectively prioritising their resources, and I hope that they will do so. Also, I find it interesting that you call me rude, yet your account has been suspended and I'm still here. Hmmm. It it not at all rude, by the way, for me to politely correct someone when they refer to me 'him' instead of 'her', which is exactly what I did.

 

[Bluetongue1]

n3xia,
The reason I apologised is because that is part of my value system. That you responded to my apology with petulance, no doubt emanating from your presumption that I have deliberately been slothful and inconsiderate in using the wrong gender, I felt warranted a fuller explanation on my behalf. For you to again choose to ignore what I have told you and to single out one of many factors to criticise and portray as insubstantial, does not change the fact that the original mistake was an accidental oversight on my behalf and will always remain such. What it is altering is my perception of you as a person.

By the way, if you can tell where I can get a $20 second-hand keyboard for my oldish model ASUS TeK laptop computer, it would be much appreciated. No longer having an income has its limitations.

Blue

 

[Trimeresurus]

This thread:

- "Looks guys morals", people tell you you're an idiot, one person agrees with you, points you in the right direction, you are rude to them.

Point of this thread, to show how thick you are? I can't really work it out yet.