Newly conned parents! New Bearded Dragon and enclosure woes!

[BigPOPPA]

Hi everyone,
I am a new dragon owner and need some advice on heating our dragon's enclosure. I will warn you guys though, its a bit of a long story, lol. If you guys wanna skip down straight to the questions, I've marked the end of the story bout me and the mrs being conned by the kids, with underscores like this.

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I'm father to 2 cheeky teens who have gone behind mine and the mrs back, applied for a reptile license, and brought home a baby bearded dragon.
The mrs was very against the whole idea as our son wanted a python a first, and when I came home today and discovered the lizard they were hiding in their closet, I knew the mrs would be furious.

On the phone, after the wife had her temper tantrum, she said they couldn't keep it, and to pack everything up because it was all going back.
Anyways, when she got home, she fell in love with the dragon, lol, so we have decided to keep it
I cant believe the cheeky buggers got away with it. But I have to admit, it is a cute little critter.

Anyways, I have spent most of the afternoon researching proper care for the dragon. I'm proud of the boy since it seems he did a fair bit of research himself already, but it seems someone has taken advantage of his keeness and naivity(spelling???) and has misled my son a little bit regarding the enclosure.


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He was promised a professional enclosure that was ready to go, just add lizard. But unfortunately, there are many gaps in the woodwork which I will need to fix up when I have the time. More importantly, the temps are all wrong in there and there was no thermostat included.

Anyways, I plan to order a habistat switching thermostat from the herp shop, but probably wont recieve it till wednesday at the earliest.

Any tips for keeping the temps down? I was pleased at first when the temps read 42 & 28, but unfortunately they kept rising.The basking globe we have is a 100watt, and after a while the basking spot is reaching temps of up to 55 degrees!!!!

At the moment, I have been acting as the thermostat, turning it off when it reaches 44, and back on when it drops to 38 (thank god for the alarms on this cheap digital thermometer, lol). Obviously, I cant do that everyday, so I'm recording the times after every flick of the switch, and plan to program a timer to do it for the next 2 or 3 days till we can get our thermostat. I know it will probably be off depending on the weather here tomorrow, but I guess that is better than having it a 55 degrees the whole time.

I plan to get a lower wattage bulb tomorrow morning, as the one that came with the enclosure is obviously too strong. Any recomendations on what size to get, based on the temp readings we are getting? If it helps, our enclosure size is 80cm by 35cm by 40cm.

Also, if you have any other tips to help with climate control, or know of a place in Sydney that stocks the habistat thermostats like they have on the herp shop website, I'd love to hear about it.

Thanking you guys in advance
Joe

btw, sorry for the long as post, lol, didn't think it would be so long as I didnt realise the volume of what I wanted to say

 

[Lollypop]

lol, love the story!
Yeah, 100W is overkill for that size.
In order to experiment, just duck off to Bunnings or some such & get a 60W and a 75W spotlight bulb & experiment with which one gives u the temps u need - I'd start with the 60W.
What kind of ventillation has the enclosure got in the line of airvents, as this also has a lot to do with what wattage is good (+ it's healthier for the beardie in the long run to get fresh air thru)?
Good luck!

 

[BigPOPPA]

lol, love the story!
Yeah, 100W is overkill for that size.
In order to experiment, just duck off to Bunnings or some such & get a 60W and a 75W spotlight bulb & experiment with which one gives u the temps u need - I'd start with the 60W.
What kind of ventillation has the enclosure got in the line of airvents, as this also has a lot to do with what wattage is good (+ it's healthier for the beardie in the long run to get fresh air thru)?
Good luck!

Its got 5 small round vents all together. 3 on one side, 2 on the other.

Do you know the pricing difference between the spotlights and the basking globes?

cheers, joe

 

[hissnbits]

It is a bit of experimenting with the heat, and is tricky without a thermostat. Without knowing exactly how the enclosure is set up, heights etc I would be moving towards as much ventilation as possible. That way it is easier for too much heat to escape, depending on design, and as you are trying for thermal gradient. Another thing you may be able to do is to elevate the basking spot maybe. This may increase the thermal gradient?

PM me if the you cant get hold of a thermostat quickly.

Cheers

 

[J-A-X]

. . . . .
Do you know the pricing difference between the spotlights and the basking globes?

Spotlights are under $10 depending on the wattage, basking globes can vary in price depending on where you get them, I dont see much change out of $30 most of the time. Just remember that dragons need UV, so if you go for the spotlight you will have to make sure the dragon gets some daylight time outside... ALWAYS supervised of course.

Looks like your going to have your work cut out for you with the surprise addition, have fun.

 

[The_Dreaded_Pets]

at aprox 15" my 60wt tight beam spotlight from woolies ($6 for 2) gives me a stable temp of 44-45 (i have pygmys that need 40-44) by useing the tight beam it only really heats up where it lights up ie directly under the light i think 60wt is max in the tight beam wide beams are higher watage but provide an ambient temp so may be harder to control your cool end depending on your enclosure mine is a fishtank,

you will need a ceramic light fiting for the spotlight and so on as they can melt plastic bunnings also sells spotloght holders made from plastic of some kind that are fine if you know how to wire them up.

for UVB i suggest biteing the bullet and buying a 2nd light ither a fluro style uvb light or a bulb the bulb can be housed in an normal plastic light fiting these cost about $40ea depending where u go ect

reptile heatlamps start at about $15ea depending where u go

beardies like to bask under a vright light so dont bother with heat emiters or infra red globes ect

night time heating isnt needed

 

[AllThingsReptile]

lol, there would have been a flaw to your wife's plan........ you cant get rid of them for 6 months.....legally....:lol:

 

[BigPOPPA]

Just wanted to report back.

Called around to few shops, and of the shops that had thermostats in stock, they only had switching thermostats, no dimming ones which is what we have decided on.

Anyways, went up to coles and grabbed a 2pack of 60watt reflector globes to try out. Results were good.
At the basking spot we are getting readings of 39c. If he decides to climb his branch to get closer to the light, the branch gives a reading of 45c.
Are those ok for the timebeing until we get our thermostat?

Also, our cool side is getting temps of 30 which seems high according to the research we have done. I plan to get some more vents tomorrow and add them to the cage. Is it ok at 30 for the timebeing? or should I be keeping an eye on it and turning the lights off when needed to bring the temps down.

Thanks
Joe

 

[the jungle guy]

i wouldnt bother with dimming thermo stat i get easily a few months out of 1 phillips 3 dollar bulb so is it worth the extra i would only go with dimming if using a more expesnisive bulb like a neodinium

 

[The_Dreaded_Pets]

you will have to be carefull with diming some bulbs like mvb canot be dimmed.
if they are dimed they will not provide the uvb light there ment to and in my experience will turn off all the time even had my dimmer switch start smkeing that is rated at 25wt higher then what i was useing aas jungle guy said i settled for useing 2 bulbs fr simplicity sake a $3 spotlight from woolies and the uvb bulb from petshop ect temps are easily maintained by geting the right spottie and leaveing it on full

 

[melluvssnakes]

I don't use a thermostat at all on my lizard enclosures. Trick is to get the lowest wattage bulb you can that produces the right basking temp, then ventilate the heck out of that enclosure. We keep our beardies very happily this way all year around.

 

[BigPOPPA]

Thanks guys.
It looks like we will also need to get a UV light in our enclosure.
I've had a look at the flouro globes, the flouro tubes and have also seen globes that provide heat and UV in one globe.
What are the differences, and which ones do you guys use?

Also, just wondering if adding the UV light is gonna effect my current temps by much?

 

[Kristy_07]

UV shouldn't affect temps too much. I use a 2' UV tube, and a 70W spotlight for basking with no thermostat. UV tubes needs to be within 30cm of the lizard. Sneaky kids - sounds like they've taken a leaf from my book Good luck! Make the kids do lots of research!

 

[The_Dreaded_Pets]

as said uvb light must be within 30cm for it to work

to answer your question on what the diff is if you look at the day basking lamps they only provide uva (atlest the 1s iv looked at) light u need uva and uvb light if a light provides uvb it will also provide uva little confuseing but hope that helps you

 

[BigPOPPA]

Thanks.
When using the $6 bulbs, how do you know which bulbs have uva? Do they all? Is it marked on the boxes at all?

 

[The_Dreaded_Pets]

none of them do u need a nd light that provides uvb costs bout 30-40 depending where u go

 

[BigPOPPA]

Aah I see. Thanks

 

[BigPOPPA]

OK guys.
Today I went to the local pet shop and they were nice enough to allow me to exchange our 100w URS basking globe for a 60w.
The globe is much smaller than the 60w reflector lamp I used yesterday and it seems that the temps are a little lower.

Temp is reading at 38c at the basking spot directly under the lamp.
A litte higher up on the branch, the temp reads 45c. Is it ok to leave it like that? Is the lizard smart enough to get higher on the branch when he needs more heat? Come to think of it he spends most his time climbing anyways and only comes to ground level to eat, drink and splash about in his waterbowl, lol

Also, I asked the pet store clerk for a UVB light, and she tells me that these lights have UVA & UVB. According to the box, I can only see a reference to UVA.

Im assuming she was mistaken, but wanted to check first.

Also, how important is UVB for my dragon? Can he do without it? Even for small periods of time? I have read that I can take him outside to get some natural sunlight, but I am worried about him being taken by a bird or lost in the backyard. Also, being very young, it seems to me that going out into the backyard stresses the little dragon. Instead of being hyperactive like he usually is, he clings to my finger for dear life, lol. Also, the weather we've had the last couple of days there is not much sun. Are there still uvb rays when there is no sun? (I think there are as I've been sunburnt on a cloudy day) but I just wanted to check first if it was benificial for the dragon, taking him out on cloudy days when there is not much sun.

btw, wanted to thank everyone thats helped me and my family get a grip on things when it comes to the dragon.

Many thanks
Joe

 

[nudge]

Also, how important is UVB for my dragon? Can he do without it? Even for small periods of time? I have read that I can take him outside to get some natural sunlight, but I am worried about him being taken by a bird or lost in the backyard. Also, being very young, it seems to me that going out into the backyard stresses the little dragon. Instead of being hyperactive like he usually is, he clings to my finger for dear life, lol. Also, the weather we've had the last couple of days there is not much sun. Are there still uvb rays when there is no sun? (I think there are as I've been sunburnt on a cloudy day) but I just wanted to check first if it was benificial for the dragon, taking him out on cloudy days when there is not much sun.

Yes UVB is important for your dragon.
Getting them out in the natural sunlight is great for them as it gives them natural UVA and UVB which is the best thing for them.
As for cloudy days yes the UV is still present. Like you said you have been sunburnt on a cloudy day before.

The best way to get him out into the sun is to go to Big W or Kmart or somewhere like that and get a 40ltr(approx) plastic tub and some flyscreen. Place a rock or a stick or something like that in the tub and also add somewhere for him to get out of the sun like a hide( i have used a cardboard box cut up so it looks like a cave.) also give him some water in there or mist him with a fine water spray every half hour or so if it is a hot day. Then chuck the flyscreen on top of the tub and secure with an occy strap. That will stop any possible birds getting to him and also stop him from escaping. ( This is what i did with my hatchies when i first got them and they are still going strong now.)

Something you should also look at getting very soon is Calcium powder and Multi Vitamin powder to dust the crickets and veges with as they need calcium everyday and multi vitamins at least once a week.

I hope this helps

 

[The_Dreaded_Pets]

as said above uvb is very important and i have looked at the daytime heatlamps you are taalking about and put them off for the fact they only mention uva, if they only mentioned uvb you would be fine as it will also produse uva being the spectrum before it, they will be fine without a uvb light for short term if you take them outside for an hr or so a day use a bird cage if there big enough the cant get out i dont have a uvb light atm and use that i also take my snake out for a play evey few days even tho its not needed.

on pincable i would take the light back asking for a refund as per resurch on the product stats it ONLY provides UVA as stated on the box and will kill your lizzard unless you have UVB aswell

buy a uvb light and just get a spotlight form woolies. you MUST have uvb