Rabbit Interest
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stockeh
Very Well-Known Member
dont be afraid of change mate... i agree that feeding a whole rabbit is a good thing... but if the snake isnt big enough to take it then these sausages are a great alternative.
Compare the nutritional value of one of these to that of a pinkie and i am sure that you will agree that it is a good product, especially in that important growth stage.
Compare the nutritional value of one of these to that of a pinkie and i am sure that you will agree that it is a good product, especially in that important growth stage.
Stevethepom
Well-Known Member
Personally i would love to try the sausage as a single food source for my snakes as where i live its impossible to get rats and mice in bulk.
But as far as the argument about them being unatural for the snakes, what part of keeping them in captivity is concidered wild, where in the wild would a snakes environment be encased in wood and glass, where would snakes be tamed by humans and picked up at least once a day, fed on lovely pre-killed and slightly warmed food, the size chosen specifically for what we consider they can eat comfortably etc,
But, the argument as to the content of rabbit inards/bones/hair etc in each sausage is something that would definatley vary from sausage to sausage, what if a pinkie sized sausage contained nothing but bone or hair? etc....it would be impossible to tell, but on the whole i would still try it, but can see peoples apprehension towards trying them.
Cheers
Steve
But as far as the argument about them being unatural for the snakes, what part of keeping them in captivity is concidered wild, where in the wild would a snakes environment be encased in wood and glass, where would snakes be tamed by humans and picked up at least once a day, fed on lovely pre-killed and slightly warmed food, the size chosen specifically for what we consider they can eat comfortably etc,
But, the argument as to the content of rabbit inards/bones/hair etc in each sausage is something that would definatley vary from sausage to sausage, what if a pinkie sized sausage contained nothing but bone or hair? etc....it would be impossible to tell, but on the whole i would still try it, but can see peoples apprehension towards trying them.
Cheers
Steve
Love to see the arguments start rolling, some things people say dont even make scence. Being a sausage, I would say (and personally working with meat myself) that everything would be minced together very well, and since a number of whole rabbits are entered into the mincing machine, the end result will be a thick past of meat that contains on average, the same proportions of each ingredient entered (lungs, liver, heart, fat, meat, bone. therefor, each sausage will contain equal amounts of each organ as the rabbits put in the machine did, just either a bigger or a smaller version depending on the size of the sausage. So at the end of the day, it will be IDENTICAL to a small rabbit, just without the gut.. like has been said before. someone also mentioned that a sausage doesnt provide enough "mental stimulation" to a snake.... no comment!!!!!!! no reaserch to date has proven that snakes need mental stimulation, and infact most good books you read will tell you that snakes DONT need mental stimulation. They dont need to have fun, or to have personal interaction, they dont feel emotions etc... stop comparing a snake with a brain the size of a 5 cent coin to a dog or a human.
Next point is that "price shouldnt be an issue"... well unfortunantly it is with nearly all people, otherwise we would all have our carpets pythons in 20ft x 20ft enclosures with real trees and perfect conditions... in some areas, rats and mice are VERY expencive, and besids this fact, there is no reason why this rabbit sausage is not every bit as good nutritionally to the snake as a rat or mice... think out side the square.
I bet you that a good tin of dog food is better for your dog than what they eat naturally in the wild.. its called science, progression, and research.
Some people are just trying so hard to stay in the stone ages with our snake keeping hobby.... I hope these people dont use any modern chemicals or medicines for there snakes such as worming solutions, mite prevention or treatments, because they wouldnt get them in the wild either..... you would be contradicting your own beliefs.
craig
Next point is that "price shouldnt be an issue"... well unfortunantly it is with nearly all people, otherwise we would all have our carpets pythons in 20ft x 20ft enclosures with real trees and perfect conditions... in some areas, rats and mice are VERY expencive, and besids this fact, there is no reason why this rabbit sausage is not every bit as good nutritionally to the snake as a rat or mice... think out side the square.
I bet you that a good tin of dog food is better for your dog than what they eat naturally in the wild.. its called science, progression, and research.
Some people are just trying so hard to stay in the stone ages with our snake keeping hobby.... I hope these people dont use any modern chemicals or medicines for there snakes such as worming solutions, mite prevention or treatments, because they wouldnt get them in the wild either..... you would be contradicting your own beliefs.
craig
Not to get too grusome (!) but it occurs to me that if the rabbits are chopped up and well mixed before they are minced, then you should get a fairly consistent mix.
However, if the process is done according to my limited experience of mincing (meat, not la de da! - beat you to it, Africa!) when the animal is fed into the mincer, it's minced as it progresses through the machine. Therefore, if the head was fed in first, the first batch of mince would be ears, the next head and brains, and so on. [this is getting disgusting!]
If the mince was re-mixed after initial production and before being introduced to the sausage skin, then yes, it would be fair to say that the mince contains an equal proportion of all the component parts.
Phew! Ok.... think I'll go and have lunch now [now, where's that upchuck smilie?.......]
:? :shock:
However, if the process is done according to my limited experience of mincing (meat, not la de da! - beat you to it, Africa!) when the animal is fed into the mincer, it's minced as it progresses through the machine. Therefore, if the head was fed in first, the first batch of mince would be ears, the next head and brains, and so on. [this is getting disgusting!]
If the mince was re-mixed after initial production and before being introduced to the sausage skin, then yes, it would be fair to say that the mince contains an equal proportion of all the component parts.
Phew! Ok.... think I'll go and have lunch now [now, where's that upchuck smilie?.......]
:? :shock:
stockeh
Very Well-Known Member
the seccond mincing (mixing) occurs prior to the skins being filled it is actually done by the skining machine to ensure a complete blend of meatstuffs, it is compulsory as the blend of foodstufs in each sausage must be comparable.
snakehunter
Well-Known Member
just a thought, you say that they are better nutritionally, but how many childrens pythons would eat a rabbit in the wild? Small species would not naturally prey on rabbits and seem to be doing quite well on rodents in the bush
stockeh
Very Well-Known Member
that is true snake hunter...... but i am willing to bet that if they could fit them in they would.... and with this option they can get all of the nutritional value of a rabbit in a snack size
and as craig has stated captive reptiles arnt the same as wild ones... if we can give a better nutritional option then they would find in the wild then i believe it is our duty to do so.
When it all comes down to it the care of the animal in question should be the first thought in our mind when we are considering anything to do with their health and well being...
this includes food and if this sausage is the option that provides the best for my snakes then it is the option that i will use, for me thats the bottom line the care of my snakes
and as craig has stated captive reptiles arnt the same as wild ones... if we can give a better nutritional option then they would find in the wild then i believe it is our duty to do so.
When it all comes down to it the care of the animal in question should be the first thought in our mind when we are considering anything to do with their health and well being...
this includes food and if this sausage is the option that provides the best for my snakes then it is the option that i will use, for me thats the bottom line the care of my snakes
Greebo
Snakologist
When you say they are identical to feeding a full rabbit, I disagree.
As they are already minced, they would have to be digested faster than a whole rabbit which would have to be broken down first.
I have been interested in the idea of sausages since I saw a zoo feeding a similar product to their Cobras.
As they are already minced, they would have to be digested faster than a whole rabbit which would have to be broken down first.
I have been interested in the idea of sausages since I saw a zoo feeding a similar product to their Cobras.
Paddy
Not so new Member
Sausages
hey there matt,
sounds like a great idea, i have used a similar thing back in ireland for feeding snakes and lizards.
put a post up here when you have your prices etc. sorted out as it sounds like plenty of people are interested and that definitely includes me.
they may or may not be brilliant as an exclusive food source but even if you use them every second feed or something it has to be good! how someone with 40 snakes doesn't see price as a major issue is beyond me.
a number of people have mentioned availablility of rats in outer areas of some states, well this has to help here too. and the fact that they can be added to lizards feed also makes them an attractive option.
go with it matt and let us know when you are ready to go.
all this talk of sausages is making me hungry, gotta go find food, mmm....
hey there matt,
sounds like a great idea, i have used a similar thing back in ireland for feeding snakes and lizards.
put a post up here when you have your prices etc. sorted out as it sounds like plenty of people are interested and that definitely includes me.
they may or may not be brilliant as an exclusive food source but even if you use them every second feed or something it has to be good! how someone with 40 snakes doesn't see price as a major issue is beyond me.
a number of people have mentioned availablility of rats in outer areas of some states, well this has to help here too. and the fact that they can be added to lizards feed also makes them an attractive option.
go with it matt and let us know when you are ready to go.
all this talk of sausages is making me hungry, gotta go find food, mmm....
Price is not an issue when any of my animals are involed, i don't think it should be with anyone, but theres nothing wrong with saving money.
Besides i don't pay for any of it, my snakes do.
I've recently got onto a new rodents supplier who prices are lower than i have ever seen.
My snakes have always been happy with there diet, but i'll let you know when they start dying. :roll:
Besides i don't pay for any of it, my snakes do.
I've recently got onto a new rodents supplier who prices are lower than i have ever seen.
My snakes have always been happy with there diet, but i'll let you know when they start dying. :roll:
do you have branches in your enclosures? if they dont need mental stimulation then why not just have a globe for heat, some newspaper on the floor and 3 cardboard boxes - one in the warm end, one in the cool and one inbetween. i dunno if thats silly but i think they do need stimulation to a degree.
im sure thats correct but you dont KNOW its identical like when you see a whole prey item infront of your eyes.
lol a vet will tell you not to compare a dog to a human :wink: now whats that big word again? :?
sorry to pick on your post craig but i couldnt help it lol :wink:
no reaserch to date has proven that snakes need mental stimulation, and infact most good books you read will tell you that snakes DONT need mental stimulation. They dont need to have fun, or to have personal interaction, they dont feel emotions etc...
some things people say dont even make scence
When it all comes down to it the care of the animal in question should be the first thought in our mind when we are considering anything to do with their health and well being...
Im glad im not one of craig23's pets!
some things people say dont even make scence
When it all comes down to it the care of the animal in question should be the first thought in our mind when we are considering anything to do with their health and well being...
Im glad im not one of craig23's pets!
What happens when you add new brenches to your snakes enclosure?
They start showing interest they, check it out, they use it.
So if they don't need mental stimulation then do what Zoe said, keep them in an empty box with a heat light and tube feed them.
Anything that encourages activity, interest, movement is a good thing and i think that ALL captive animals need it.
Snakes may not be smart but they are such great animals they deserve to be keep in the best possible way and by us keeping them they have no choice in what happens.
I think it's just sad that someone wouldn't want their animals to enjoy life, which they can if we allow them to.
They start showing interest they, check it out, they use it.
So if they don't need mental stimulation then do what Zoe said, keep them in an empty box with a heat light and tube feed them.
Anything that encourages activity, interest, movement is a good thing and i think that ALL captive animals need it.
Snakes may not be smart but they are such great animals they deserve to be keep in the best possible way and by us keeping them they have no choice in what happens.
I think it's just sad that someone wouldn't want their animals to enjoy life, which they can if we allow them to.
zoe, are you thinking of "anthropmorphism" likening animal behaviour to human emotional expression. dont beleive it, any animal deserves as good a life as possible. why deny an animal what you expect yourself, basic rights. as for the bunny snags ,its a bit weird. nutritionally ok maybe but lacking not only the stimulation of the kill (as with frozen rats) but also the muscular work required to swallow a complete animal, maybe the "right" smell/ taste stimulation too. variety is the spice of life dad says, why not for animals too. monkeys kept in isolation experiments go mad. p.s. ive been taking my snake outside to experience wind,occasional rain, new smells, tree climbing etc, he dosent thank me but he dosent complain either. lol
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