Rock Python

[Elapidae1]

I find conservation efforts interesting, and although I would hate to see the Oenpelli become extinct or any animal become extinct for that matter, I sometimes think to myself isn't extinction just part of nature taking it's course? Some will argue no that man is interfering with nature, but are we? Or a we just behaving as nature intended? like humans, and if we are, then aren't these extinctions just the natural progression of life on earth.

 

[Waterrat]

steve, we do kind of stay in the way of natural processes. That is undeniable. Should we just let things go, then the first step should be close down all government wildlife agencies because they would be redundant. Kind if ironic, isn't it?

 

[Elapidae1]

That's my point, as humans acting the way we naturally do, are we standing in the way of natural processes or merely part of them ? I certainly don't think we should just let things go, as that would not be natural human behavior. It is in our nature not only to destroy but also to build and preserve. Anything that is lost or gained in the process is simply the work of nature.

 

[Pythoninfinite]

That's my point, as humans acting the way we naturally do, are we standing in the way of natural processes or merely part of them ? I certainly don't think we should just let things go, as that would not be natural human behavior. It is in our nature not only to destroy but also to build and preserve. Anything that is lost or gained in the process is simply the work of nature.

That's a cop-out if ever there was one...

Jamie.

 

[Elapidae1]

How so, it's merely a theoretical observation

 

[Guest]

hahaha I dont care anymore so we should all not care and I wont feel so bad :lol:

 

[Elapidae1]

Extinctions have been part of life since before man, though nowhere near at the rate we are currently seeing, it has always been a fact of nature ,why is it any different now?

 

[Darlyn]

So who has the captive Oenpellis?

 

[Slickturtle]

Who is this Darlyn who brought the conversation back onto topic?!! We were having a great time 'out there' not talking about the topic! Well, to answer your question - I think the Territory Wildlife Park still has one. But no breeding prospects there.

Slick

So who has the captive Oenpellis?

 

[Slickturtle]

Extinctions have been part of life since before man, though nowhere near at the rate we are currently seeing, it has always been a fact of nature ,why is it any different now?

Hey Pythoninfinite, I think Steve is right up to a point . But the trouble is that when you start thinking about the big philosophical questions, things can easily get bogged down.

Hey Steve - I wonder if we could look at your view from this point of view: we humans are so clever that we have put ourselves in reverse evolution i.e. the opposite to survival of the fittest. This is because we are coming up with all sorts of cures and vaccines for common human conditions which used to kill us. Now we can live through what used to be fatal conditions and breed - thereby passing on an inheritable weakness to our children and then they to theirs etc. Therefore I would argue that if we can play God with our own survival prospects, why should we deny other animals on this planet the same gift of our genius. Would you be Humanistically selfish and let them slide into oblivion whilst you rush off to the Doctor to get some life saving procedure or medicine for yourself?

Geees that hurt!!!

Keep up the wide thinking Steve, it tests us all.

Slick

 

[Jonno from ERD]

Slick,

I've always had this slightly cynical opinion that I've kept to myself for obvious reasons...but when the miracle "cure for cancer" is discovered, we're all stuffed. As much as people dying sucks, it's kind of necessary for the rest of us to survive.

Back on track though, apparently there was a collection permit issued to a private individual for 6 Oenpelli Pythons a little while ago. Anybody know any more?

 

[kkjkdt1]

Hey Pythoninfinite, I think Steve is right up to a point . But the trouble is that when you start thinking about the big philosophical questions, things can easily get bogged down.

Hey Steve - I wonder if we could look at your view from this point of view: we humans are so clever that we have put ourselves in reverse evolution i.e. the opposite to survival of the fittest. This is because we are coming up with all sorts of cures and vaccines for common human conditions which used to kill us. Now we can live through what used to be fatal conditions and breed - thereby passing on an inheritable weakness to our children and then they to theirs etc. Therefore I would argue that if we can play God with our own survival prospects, why should we deny other animals on this planet the same gift of our genius. Would you be Humanistically selfish and let them slide into oblivion whilst you rush off to the Doctor to get some life saving procedure or medicine for yourself?

Geees that hurt!!!

Keep up the wide thinking Steve, it tests us all.

Slick

I think steve has a good point - until i read this.
now im confussed - o well more jack daniels for me.

 

[Slickturtle]

A good read about Oenpelli Pythons

Hi all

Since there seems to be a hunger out there to learn more about these mystical snakes I offer you and article written in June last year by a mate of mine who lives in Darwin.

If you read this you will know as much as anyone about this critter.

I have never uploaded a text file before so it will be interesting to see how it goes.

Cheers

Slick

 

[Elapidae1]

Thanks.
Keep in mind we can only play God, we can't actually be god, therefore it is not within in our power to reverse it, the fact that man has been able to come up with cures and vaccines etc is purely a consequence of natural progression and our natural inclination to discover and move forward to invent and create and our naive perception that we have the ability to control everything (play god). I believe that everything on earth as it is now and in the next hundred years is nothing more than natural progression, we cant control nature because we are not above or better than it just part of it.

Personally it is my nature to want to preserve the Oenpelli python, however I'm not entirely sure it's for the sake of the python itself, but for the personal satisfaction of seeing it.
When I go fishing in the same area I have done since I was a kid, I always leave saddened that their are fewer and fewer to be caught, I don't really care for the fish, just for the future generations that won't have the same satisfaction I did from catching them.
What truly motivates man to want to conserve? I think it is to satisfy himself, the fish and the python don't care,when they are gone they will be gone it makes no difference to them only to us because we have failed at being God

 

[PhilK]

I've always had this slightly cynical opinion that I've kept to myself for obvious reasons...but when the miracle "cure for cancer" is discovered, we're all stuffed. As much as people dying sucks, it's kind of necessary for the rest of us to survive.

If I could use Godwin's Law.. this is the same theory the Nazis had. Hitler had plenty of disabled/diseased people murdered to promote advantageous evolution and the breeding of better lines (much the same as you would cull bulls with deformities etc). His theory is sound but it certainly isn't very moral is it?

Godwin's law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Elapidae1]

Thanks for the story Slick, a very good read, though I have always found Aboriginal names very hard reading

 

[Pythoninfinite]

Steve, in the purest sense, I understand what you are saying. However, humanity is accelerating extinctions (and as a consequence, accelerating it's own demise) because of its overblown sense of self-importance. We have moved well beyond reasonable, balanced and sustainable participation in the world biota and are turning the world's lands and seas into deserts.

Richard Ross, one of the first to write a book on python husbandry, and a pediatrician professionally, suggested that the huge improvements in pediatric medicine in the last hundred years basically writes a death warrant for thousands of species. Obviously it is not politically correct to say this is a bad thing, (who would want to compromise the health of their child if means can be found to avoid disease or death?) but the inevitable consequence is that the earth is becoming a monoculture. He has a photo of a huge fire burning in the Brazilian rainforest, and describes it, sadly, as a 'biological funeral pyre' - the same things are happening here in Australia.

You mention god several times in you post Steve - I don't believe in 'god', so I won't sit back and see what we humans are doing without at least commenting that, with our vast intellect and perceptive abilities, it is our responsibility and within our control to do something about it. I can't handball the problem to some 'higher authority" and say that what is happening is what was meant to be. The introduction of Cane Toads into Oz is not something I will ever accept as a 'natural progression into extinction' for Australian fauna.

Jamie

 

[Elapidae1]

I can't accept that Cane toads in Oz are anything but a natural progression into extinction for Australian fauna, as they were introduced as a direct result of mans natural desire to improve on something he had already started.
I agree that humanity is accelerating extinctions, My argument is, that it's a result of natural human behavior and therefore only natural that some creatures will meet their demise by our actions. Sad as it is.
I am certainly not suggesting we just sit back and let it happen, but we do have to accept that sometimes and probably more often than not, once an animals demise has begun, despite the best efforts of conservationists, nature will take it's course.
I am all for conservation by the way and people such as yourself that are doing their part for conservation are helping maintain natures balance through your natural desire to preserve that which you deem important to yourself and to our future generations.

 

[Pythoninfinite]

I'll ponder this for a while today - have to do a bit of work! Back later...

J

 

[Waterrat]

Steve, in your fist sentence, you're saying that the introduction of cane toads was human desire to improve ... in other words - interference with ecology. Then you go on saying it's in human nature to do such things resulting in natural extinctions. I don't see anything natural in any of it.
We, humans are nothing more than advanced vertebrates (unless god comes into the argument) sharing the planet with the rest of "us". Our ability to think put us on the top of the heap - the very heap we are very good at eroding.