Striped Diamond holdbacks

[pugsly]

"roughly diamond-shape blotches over back and flanks"

Common theme isn't it.

Tell me HOW ON EARTH these snakes have diamond shaped blotches...

And Kane, absolutely I would.

 

[scam7278]

my diamond'ish intergrade

 

[pugsly]

Nice.

Maybe Shane (Nighowl) will show you his Port Mac which can EASILY pass off as a pure Diamond. Point being? Intergrades have the HUGE variation, Diamond's dont. THATS WHAT MAKE THEM DIAMONDS! lol

 

[Jonno from ERD]

"roughly diamond-shape blotches over back and flanks"

Common theme isn't it.

Tell me HOW ON EARTH these snakes have diamond shaped blotches...

And Kane, absolutely I would.

Bit of selective reading there, mate. Did you not see how all three descriptions refer to them as being "highly variable"?

Using your method, are hypo or striped Central Carpets hybrids? Swan and Wilson - M.s.bredli is rich orange-red to dark brown with numerous irregular, transversely aligned, dark-edged pale blotches, bands and spots".

 

[pugsly]

I just keep repeating myself..

No there not. Because? They are known for their variability, we all know that Coastals have 500 different variations. We have NOT seen, this at all in Diamonds. There rosettes are small, diamond shaped, yes there is variability of course, but NOTHING like a McDowelli or Bredli or anything else, because that IS the difference, this is what makes them a 'Diamond', the rosettes, the spots, the pattern..

A coastal has huge variation, probably mainly to do with its range, a Diamond does not have this variation (to the extent of a Coastal) in my opinion.

We DONT get hypo Diamonds, so again, how can you compare? We don't get all the variations of the other morelia, which is why I THINK they are so special, and such a beautiful snake.

 

[waruikazi]

Perhaps we are beginning to get that variation .

This is becoming like a peice of paper with turn me over on both sides of it.

 

[Jonno from ERD]

I just keep repeating myself..

No there not. Because? They are known for their variability, we all know that Coastals have 500 different variations. We have NOT seen, this at all in Diamonds. There rosettes are small, diamond shaped, yes there is variability of course, but NOTHING like a McDowelli or Bredli or anything else, because that IS the difference, this is what makes them a 'Diamond', the rosettes, the spots, the pattern..

A coastal has huge variation, probably mainly to do with its range, a Diamond does not have this variation (to the extent of a Coastal) in my opinion.

We DONT get hypo Diamonds, so again, how can you compare? We don't get all the variations of the other morelia, which is why I THINK they are so special, and such a beautiful snake.

So let me get this straight...you select a single phrase out of the published descriptions I posted, using them as evidence that Diamonds will always exhibit a diamond pattern, but when I select a phrase that says M.s.bredli exhibits a specific characteristic that we know isn't always exhibited, it is wrong? Isn't that a bit of a double standard?

 

[MrBredli]

Just curious, would everyone be so quick to condemn these snakes and their breeder if someone like John Weigal or Peter Krauss produced them?

I would question the legitimacy of any hatchlings that did not look anything remotely similar to the parents, especially if they are to be marketed as something new and exciting with an inflated price tag.

I don't know the history on the snakes; only one person does. You have those that believe him and those that don't. The simple fact is, those who don't believe him are not gullible and would like to see more evidence before their mind is swayed (i find it quite amusing that 'the believers' are critizing the 'non-believers' for not believing something without seeing any evidence ). Those who do believe are either very trusting (which is understandable) or very gullible. I for one am not gullible and need to see more evidence before i jump on the band wagon. If it is true then there should be plenty of supporting evidence. But i get the feeling if one were to ask for it to be shown, the response would be "We don't need to prove anything to anyone..." which i think translates to something along the lines of "We don't have any evidence, but someone said it was true so it is."

I think it is quite possible that the snakes pictured could be the parents, but if that is the case i really don't believe the snakes originated from Gosford. If it had been claimed that the parents were caught up the coast i would believe the whole story. Perhaps they did originate from further north, but were claimed to be from Gosford so they could be marketed as genuine high yellow Gosford Diamonds, rather than genuine high yellow Port Macs - a name which would have immediately slashed the value of the hatchlings in half. All would have gone well if the intergrade babies turned out like their Diamond-looking intergrade parents. Of course that is just one possible theory (not an accusation!).

So are the parents pictured 1st generation captive bred - am i right in saying that? What did their siblings look like? Have the 'wild caught' parents bred every year for the past few years? What do all these related snakes look like, and what sort of hatchies have the other F1's been throwing this season. Sorry, but i just find this all way too much to swallow, without seeing a single shread of evidence.

 

[Oldbeard]

aye yi ya aye ya yi ya aye yi ya ya oi ya oi ya

 

[pugsly]

Thanks Mr B..

I am glad I am not the only sane person here...

 

[serpenttongue]

I would like Serp's opinion on this though, if there is ANYONE I would listen to on Diamonds, and pure ones at that, it is him.

Pugs, i agree with everything you have written in this thread. You've put it all into far better words than what i could have.

 

[pugsly]

"but when I select a phrase that says M.s.bredli exhibits a specific characteristic that we know isn't always exhibited, it is wrong? Isn't that a bit of a double standard?"

Because its a HYPO. A known morph of the Bredli. Not a known morph of a Diamond, because there aren't any.

Yes it may have said that in the description sure, but since then there have been several KNOWN morphs of the Bredli, none, of the Diamond.

As Waz said 'maybe' this is the start of one, but I am certainly not convinced at all..

 

[Retic]

I look at it this way, at the end of the day I have some snakes that I like that were bred by a friend I trust 100%, it really doesn't matter what others think although I do welcome everyones input.
To the people who want to be on my waiting list for hatchlings please be patient as they are only coming up to their first birthday

 

[Jungleland]

Thanks Mr B..

I am glad I am not the only sane person here...

So everyone else here is not:shock::shock: WOW

 

[Retic]

Well I can't speak for anyone else but I'm completely sane and so am I.

 

[scam7278]

WOW 15 pages 215 posts of a diamond/intergrade thread and not 1 offer of popcorn??? whats the world coming too?

 

[pugsly]

lol..

Your right Boa, it really doesn't matter what others think. But when you put them up, you knew you would get comment, maybe not 15 pages worth, but you knew there would be discussion. Healthy it has been, but still some people have just proven they really should stay out of these things..

Another note Jonno. Does a striped Bredli, a Hypo Coastal, a spotted woma look like ANY other snake other than its own species? No...

Does a striped 'Diamond' look like another? Hell YES.

 

[Jungleland]

WOW 15 pages 215 posts of a diamond/intergrade thread and not 1 offer of popcorn??? whats the world coming too?

Popcorn is Fattening, I don't want to be called Fat and Insane

 

[Retic]

Pugs, I agree. I had people asking me to post updated photo's. I welcome the debate but at the same time it doesn't alter what I know in my own mind. I do understand your viewpoint and respect it.

 

[Retic]

That's why it's better to be schizophrenic, one can be fat and the other insane, works for me.

Popcorn is Fattening, I don't want to be called Fat and Insane