Banning Snakes in the USA - Next Australia?

[Colin]

Is the NRKA a non-profit organisation? Who are the representatives of the NRKA and wich states do they represent?

Jamie (pythoninfinite) would be the best person to answer these questions nicole, but I would assume its a non profit organisation and being National would represent all australian states and territories. cheers

 

[CarpetPythons.com.au]

Thanks Colin. I would also consider that to be the most appropriate way to tackle this issue. I still cant imagine that it would happen here, we just dont have man killer pythons. If this association is indeed looking after the interests of the reptile keepers community then I will back it 100%. I would just like to know who has been elected to this advisory commitee.

 

[Colin]

Thanks Colin. I would also consider that to be the most appropriate way to tackle this issue. I still cant imagine that it would happen here, we just dont have man killer pythons. If this association is indeed looking after the interests of the reptile keepers community then I will back it 100%. I would just like to know who has been elected to this advisory commitee.

I dont anticipate anything similar to the USA with the "killer pythons" but the hobby has its opponents in organisations like PETA etc that may lobby against the hobby at some stage. To avoid problems in the future it would help if reptiles keepers were organised into a co-hesive national group before any thing like this ever happens.. and theres other issues that a national body could address such as maybe uniform state legislation for reptiles instead of the system we have now etc.. It can only be in our best interest I think to have a national body and voice especially since the hobby is expanding at an increasing rate in these past few years.

I'd like to know whose on the committe etc myself and Im sure Jamie will fill us in soon.

 

[Doc]

It gives me great heart to come back from working and check the progress of this thread - to see the thinking of the majority of you, the understanding by many of the true threat we are under and the support for a national body. Jamie we can't make it happen too quickly.

Recently I had a conversation with a senior bureaucrat that told me of the increasing pressure to stop the keeping of all wildlife and how a member of one of the animal liberationist groups was boasting that within 2-4 years the practice will be stopped.

Here is the latest comment I received from the USA ...

"This has been an stunning turn of events. Sorry I couldn't give you more time to react and for the forum members to react, but this was purposely orchestrated to be sudden so that we could not properly react. The lack of integrity on the part of the legislators has been astounding.

I'll do my best to keep you posted."

Having had many years working with Governments across a range of industries I can confirm that this is a common strategy in Australia. This is not paranoia as many of you know (especially the old-timers like me). We need to organise ourselves and overcome our differences for the good of the hobby as a whole. And the sooner the better ...

 

[tooninoz]

I had a brief chat with Jamie about this some months back and was left feeling that this is crucial for not just the hobby, but for herpetology itself. An organisation that isn't seen purely as one thats fighting for our 'right' to keep/breed reptiles, but to lobby Govt on issues related. It also shows some of the animal rights groups (and they aren't all two-headed monsters) that we are serious.

An informed and determined collective will always defeat reactionary groups that have a single agenda.

I know of a couple of people that are a part of this and there's a wealth of experience with both reptiles and working in advisory positions etc. If we all can get behind it, put egos/differences aside and work cohesively, there's no reason this won't work.

 

[Daz_McC]

Some of the posts on this thread really are the worst kind of baseless scare-mongering. I may not have the insider knowledge that some of the people here have but I can see that reptile keeping is exploding in popularity. The number of expos is a good example of that. If extreme animal liberationist have taken over government and are hell bent on wiping out the hobby they are doing a REALLY bad job of it.

Now I think that a national reptile keepers group is a great idea. It will help to spead up the mainstreamification (my own word) of the hobby and hopefully lobby for some badly needed consistency between the states. But if people are involved because they are worried about some phantom threat from animal libers my advice is to have a warm cup of milo and get over yourself.

 

[Kurto]

Some of the posts on this thread really are the worst kind of baseless scare-mongering. I may not have the insider knowledge that some of the people here have but I can see that reptile keeping is exploding in popularity. The number of expos is a good example of that. If extreme animal liberationist have taken over government and are hell bent on wiping out the hobby they are doing a REALLY bad job of it.

Now I think that a national reptile keepers group is a great idea. It will help to spead up the mainstreamification (my own word) of the hobby and hopefully lobby for some badly needed consistency between the states. But if people are involved because they are worried about some phantom threat from animal libers my advice is to have a warm cup of milo and get over yourself.

I think you need to re-read what has been written through out this thread. Some of the contributors do actually have a good basis to make such comments..... The threat is real..............

 

[zulu]

re Banning

Very good discussion,look forward to getting more imformation on the NRKA from jamie,ile probably more than likely be the first president so ide like a look at the house and salary package etc :lol:

 

[AnitaBlake]

I don't really see that a direct link can be drawn from this situation to our own. On one hand, you're talking about a government which has banned keeping several larger species of exotics due to issues caused by these species on the native environment. While on the other, saying that this proves the Australian government will now take this as an excuse to introduce legisltion banning the keeping of any native species. These are two completely different problems.

I do agree completely that representatives of the EPA often display an unecessarily negative view of herp keeping - or keeping any native species - and that this is something we should be concerned about. In the past I have been told, quite bluntly, that if it were up to the EPA and other such agencies, our hobby would be banned; that we should all just be grateful we're allowed to do it at all; and that if we have a problem with any aspect of legislation or the interpretation of legislation by government agenices we should just suck it in or they'll take our toys away. Mind blowing when you consider they'll happily allow us to keep a variety of introduced animals which have caused a pethora of problems for native wildlife. I would think it would be better to ban the keeping of introduced species and allow only native wildlife to be kept. But that's just my opinion, obviously.

With regards to the new American law, I do think it's something that should have happened years ago. While it's clearly a case of shutting the barn door after horses have bolted, there are still a few horses left in that barn. It might not be soon enough to stem the tide of dramas caused by the introduction of these exotic species, but better to at least try and address the problems in some way than just throw collective hands in the air and complain that it's all too hard.

Doc, I'm sorry for your friend, that he won't be able to keep or make money from the animals he loves. That being said, I can't see how his problem will directly affect us here.

Wow, that was a bit of a long one wasn't it? :lol:

A

 

[NickM]

If you guys in OZ think this cant or wont happen to you , you are seriously naive.

We in the US failed to get organized BEFORE this happened and as a result it may well be over for us. If you value your rights the time to get organized is now, before there is a crisis.

I heard all the same stupid statements from people here before this, nobody though the govt, would ever pass something like this, most had the mistaken view that their govt actually thought these things through properly, wich clearly it does not.

Get organized now and you have a chance to stop these sorts of things before they get very far. If you procrastinate like we did you may end up int he same place we are today.

Nick

 

[MikeCurtin]

[/ATTA

 

[MikeCurtin]

If you guys in OZ think this cant or wont happen to you , you are seriously naive.

We in the US failed to get organized BEFORE this happened and as a result it may well be over for us. If you value your rights the time to get organized is now, before there is a crisis.

I heard all the same stupid statements from people here before this, nobody though the govt, would ever pass something like this, most had the mistaken view that their govt actually thought these things through properly, wich clearly it does not.

Get organized now and you have a chance to stop these sorts of things before they get very far. If you procrastinate like we did you may end up int he same place we are today.

Nick

Hey, Nick, I think they have thought about it....they have just decided that their special interest groups are more important than the American people.

 

[elapid@]

wont happen

 

[elapid@]

There are more issues with cane toad and feral cats etc that needs to be sorted out before they could implement the banning of keeping Australian native reptiles, unless we are making any harsh impact on our native wild life from having reptiles in captivity i don't think they would enforce it. in most states we already have restrictions on what we can keep and for good reasons.

 

[MikeCurtin]

wont happen

There are more issues with cane toad and feral cats etc that needs to be sorted out before they could implement the banning of keeping Australian native reptiles, unless we are making any harsh impact on our native wild life from having reptiles in captivity i don't think they would enforce it. in most states we already have restrictions on what we can keep and for good reasons.

Hahahahahaha!!!!!!! You crack me up!!!!!!! This site really needs a "censored" smilie, or something to more accurately convey exactly what it is that I'm feeling right now.

Guess what we have problems with here in the US. Cane toads and feral cats! Guess what are far more widespread than snakes. Cane toads and feral cats! Guess what this bill does NOT affect. CANE TOADS AND FERAL CATS!!!!

Your thought processes are dangerous for the Australian reptile community. Ask me how I know. Never mind....I'll tell you. People over here have been saying for years that it "wont happen". If you think this is about the impact on the environment, you are sadly mistaken....it has very little to do with the actual problem. It is centered around powerful lobbying groups that consist of eco-terrorists funded by good hearted folks who think they are donating money to help poor, cute, neglected cats and dogs. They think wrong!

 

[Snake_Whisperer]

If you guys in OZ think this cant or wont happen to you , you are seriously naive.

We in the US failed to get organized BEFORE this happened and as a result it may well be over for us. If you value your rights the time to get organized is now, before there is a crisis.

I heard all the same stupid statements from people here before this, nobody though the govt, would ever pass something like this, most had the mistaken view that their govt actually thought these things through properly, wich clearly it does not.

Get organized now and you have a chance to stop these sorts of things before they get very far. If you procrastinate like we did you may end up int he same place we are today.

Nick

I think naive is being generous Nick but it will suit in this instance. This discussion has nothing to do with scare-mongering, the semantics of rights versus priveledge, or the formation of a political party whose platform is reptile keeping. It does illustrate though, that it can happen. Knee jerk reactions are the norm in in the world of politics, just look at the situation recently in Queensland. The former premier jumped on an idiotic idea to put a dam in an area completely unsuitable to take one (from an environmental standpoint). A decision based on a hunch and a dollop of questionable science to satisfy a small section of voters.

All it would take in Australia is for one person to come up short when dealing with a cranky scrubbie and you could almost guarantee all of our snake keeping days would be numbered. What arguement would they use to justify it? "Just look at the states, when they have killer pythons, they ban them!" Not to mention using the already low opinion of the general public has of snakes to further that agenda.

Again, a national organisation would go a long way to protecting our rights (priveldege if it makes you feel better to use that word) to have this hobby. Being pro-active, getting prepared for the future, this is just common sense. Anyone who would argue against a national group that could speak on our behalf...why?

One thing I have found to be a fascinating occurence is, argueing vehemently on this site, then meeting your nemesis (used for illustrative purposes) in person. This has happened to me, ended up with a new pal. Joining or forming a herp club in your area, chatting with other such groups, this seems to me to be the way to do your bit in your part of the world. It's a great way to meet people with similar interests, hang out, and get off the bloody computer.

It's great to hear that the NRKA has gotten it's ball rolling, I look forward to to hearing more about it, it's aims, the organization, etc. Thanks for popping in to update us a bit Jamie.

 

[Chimera]

Jamie, I think your right in so far as most of the reptile keeping community doesn't realise what it took to get the licensing system in place (particularly in NSW). I don't think the issues of the past should be completely forgotten however there are keepers who bear a grudge against the legislators and a combative approach will not be productive. There were a few people at the combines herp society meeting to discuss caging standards that quite combative with the DECC representative (there were also a number of valid points raised in a polite manner).

We should not consider the formation of a national body to be a first strike or a way for the reptile keeping community to close ranks. It should be formed as an organisation to engage commonwealth legislators on behalf of reptile keepers and facilitate cooporation between state legislators and the local reptile keeping community. This will require the representatives to be level headed and polite with unquestionable integrity. Those I know who are currently involved with the NRKA fit this bill. I look forward to hearing more Jamie.

Damien

 

[MikeCurtin]

Forget about dealing with cranky scrubs for a moment. What happens when officials start finding snakes outside their native range? Who will they blame? Then.....the knee will jerk.

 

[MikeCurtin]

Jamie, I think your right in so far as most of the reptile keeping community doesn't realise what it took to get the licensing system in place (particularly in NSW). I don't think the issues of the past should be completely forgotten however there are keepers who bear a grudge against the legislators and a combative approach will not be productive. There were a few people at the combines herp society meeting to discuss caging standards that quite combative with the DECC representative (there were also a number of valid points raised in a polite manner).

We should not consider the formation of a national body to be a first strike or a way for the reptile keeping community to close ranks. It should be formed as an organisation to engage commonwealth legislators on behalf of reptile keepers and facilitate cooporation between state legislators and the local reptile keeping community. This will require the representatives to be level headed and polite with unquestionable integrity. Those I know who are currently involved with the NRKA fit this bill. I look forward to hearing more Jamie.

Damien

Well said, Damien.

 

[moosenoose]

I feel genuinely sorry for these breeders in the States, but this issue seriously has NOTHING to do with us! Some of you should be in the ballooning industry because the amount of hot air being blasted around in this thread is nothing short of astounding! What part of "giant exotic snakes" being the KEY problem here don't you guys understand?? The noise being made this is understandably due to people potentially losing their livelihoods! Of course that'll drum up stories of hellfire and brimstone! But if you remove yourself from the emotion, and with some of you being too close to people "sadly" going down with a sinking ship, the threat here ISN'T happening!

Let's say I'm wrong though, let's see some "written" proof that animal activists are trying to derail the Australian herp community? So far I've seen guns compared to snakes, now anacondas compared to scrubbies. As they say in the movies "show me the money!"