Help join the protest against the new OEH laws for reptile keeping in NSW

[Jungletrans]

I Am happy that racks will be banned :]

 

[Pythoninfinite]

I Am happy that racks will be banned :]

Well, hopefully you will be saddened again in the knowledge that racks won't actually be fully banned, even though bureaucrats find them distasteful.

Snakes love nothing better than having a full belly and curling up somewhere tight, secure and warm... in many, if not most cases, racks fit the bill perfectly. Anthropomorphic thinking does a disservice to reptiles and serious, knowledgeable keepers everywhere.

But like some others who have contributed to this thread in support of this imposition, you miss the point of objection totally.

Jamie

 

[wokka]

I Am happy that racks will be banned :]

I dont think racks will be banned.By my reading requirements for cages or racks are the same.

 

[Jungletrans]

I'm still happy ;]

 

[Pythoninfinite]

I'm still happy ;]

Lovely... that's the way it should be!

J

 

[zulu]

I would like to include part of an email that Macarthur Herp members received to further convince people of what is really going on. This info was dated 27th of June.
_________________________
For those of you who missed our meeting last Friday night, we had a very interesting chat by guest speaker Darren Earnshaw his husbandry and breeding of various Tiliqua species.
Darren was also accompanied by reknown keeper Bob Withey who spoke to us regarding the Code of Practice (Minimum Cage Sizes).

As promised to those at the meeting, I have attached a copy of the letter Bob has urged us all to sign and forward to the Minister for the Environment. The copy I have attached is in a format whereby you can edit to insert your name and address, and make any changes you feel appropriate.

Please remember, whilst these cage sizes may have no effect on you at this time, there is no guarantee this is true for the future.

As stated on Friday night, the Reptile Societies during consultation were initially advised the cage sizes would be GUIDELINES NOT ENFORCEABLE LAWS!

Macarthur Herpetological Committee members were NEVER included in the discussions and have had no input. This is YOUR opportunity to have a say in this matter.

If the laws are deemed enforceable, where does it stop? Do they get to control your collection further in the future?

I therefore URGE you all to alter the letter to suit your opinions and send your letter as soon as possible. Feel free to have every adult you know wade in on this on your (our) behalf.

Kind Regards,

Rhonda Glover
President
Macarthur Herpetological Society Inc.
___________________________
whether people think this COD is ok atm, this does not mean the Govt will stop. They have only put up these enforcable laws in order to pick on the minority that is reptile owners and because this was brought in early in the morning, forced in without consult right after the reptiles being allowed to be sold in pet stores was brought in late night the day before, it was rushed in without any consideration or consult. Why not pick on bird, amphibian and mammal owners as well, because they won't, they are just using us as a target and those who don't support a protest are pretty much giving up and being an obediant little zombie of society. Rhonda is right, where are they going to stop. They will not unless we stand up for our right to have reptiles as pets.

Didnt you have Peter Johnston on the consultative committee ? I think whats done is done now, they onley wanted to look like they had some consultation at the beginning.
They had everything prepared long before anyway by the NPWS consultant, DECC whatever they are these days has always been difficult to deal with, you will get no where they have a plan and they will stick to it.
Thats government ,we sell coal to china by the shipful so they can burn it for cheap electricity , government is crazy.

 

[=bECS=]

Word on the street is that if a reptile vet deems your enclosure sizes suitable housing for your animals it overrides the COP. Anyone else heard this?

 

[Lawra]

It says that in the preface of the document released.

 

[=bECS=]

Just a reptile vet or any vet? Because if that's all it takes, then we are all pretty much sweet

 

[Lawra]

Haha it only says vet in the doc from memory

 

[GeckoJosh]

Correct me if I am wrong but I thought according to the COP a vet can only dictate enclosure sizes if its a part of medical treatment, so for example unless your whole collection suddenly came down with RI then a vet has no say.

 

[wokka]

Correct me if I am wrong but I thought a vet can only dictate enclosure sizes if its a part of medical treatment, so unless your whole collection suddenly came down with RI then a vet has no say.

Vets should be involved in prevention not just treatment and part of that may be recommendations on husbandry practices or cage sizes which may differ to the COP.

 

[Pythoninfinite]

Dr Glenn Shea, a member of the committee, and who did a huge amount of work on enclosure sizes for the committee, and was absolutely opposed to mandating a set of sizes, is an academic veterinarian at Sydney Uni, and a world renowned herpetologist.

Jamie

 

[GeckoJosh]

Vets should be involved in prevention not just treatment and part of that may be recommendations on husbandry practices or cage sizes which may differ to the COP.

Yes I agree that is how it should be but does the COP allow a vet to stipulate cage sizes for a collection indefinitely to prevent health issues?

 

[wokka]

Yes I agree that is how it should be but does the COP allow a vet to stipulate cage sizes for a collection indefinitely to prevent health issues?

I am not a monitor keeper but there seems to be agreement amongst those who are that cage sizes in the COP are over the top. From my reading of the COP ,a signed statement from a vet, (preferably one who was the monitor collection consultant), confirming that the cages currently used are of satisfactory size, would over ride any requirement re cage sizes in the COP.At this point none of the COP has been tested in law so no precidence exists.-I doubt that it ever will. I believe there are over 20,000 licenced keepers in NSW. How many legal cases do you know of involving licensed keepers over say the last ten years? Why would they bother? Just do the right thing and NPWS will leave you alone.

 

[SpilotaFreak78]

This has been passed onto me by the writer of the letter I posted online. Anyone who wishes to contact Robyn Parker MP directly and voice their concerns are welcome to do so with this number 02 92284497. We really do need more people to get behind this and support the protest against the COP.

 

[Skippii]

This is the first I'm hearing of all this... Are there any updates? I suppose it's probably too late for anything to be done at this point. Disappointing, and quite frankly outrageous, that the voices of worldwide respected herp keepers have been completely ignored..

Guess I'll be dumping the TV cabinet I was converting :| very frustrating. As far as I knew, it was large enough to comfortably house my water python. It's got enough length, got some climbing height (since she loves to climb), and I was under the impression that the depth was sufficient.. But apparently not according to the new regulations. It'll likely be just under 20% of Sierra's adult length (assuming she reaches similar length to her parents). Bah, it's such a beautiful cabinet as well, quite disappointing.

 

[wokka]

As per post #95 a vet could verify that the cage is adequate with perhaps a photo and some measurements. I doubt that the snake will know anything about the COP or care either way.

 

[meako]

No.....It applies now to all reptiles you have in your possession now or at the time of inspection, and any enclosure they are housed within regardless of when it was made or when the animal was purchased, with (from memory) a 12 month 'warning' period before penalty enforcement occurs.

It might pay a lot of people to actually read them......

http://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/resources/wildlifelicences/20130185ReptileCode.pdf

With this in mind the inspections will probably be as efficiently performed as the emails that are never answered. Its the government.
Pardon my ignorance but what has driven this "initiative" ?

I checked the link and within five seconds found this clause that pretty much wipes out private reptile keeping by most people-
An enclosure must be designed and/or positioned so as to prevent the
reptile from coming into physical
contact with wild animals, pests,
domestic pets, and unauthorised persons.

why? because unauthorised persons are not known for their adherence to departmental regulations now are they?

who will be policing any of it anyway?/ unless you're doing something terribly wrong this seems like typical **** covering by bean counters in govt jobs.

 

[Newhere]

Who came up with the cage sizes anyway? Like who advised the government on what they should be?

I think its a bit over the top considering the people that neglect their animals are not going to care at all and this wont stop them.

How often do you guys get inspections down there? And how are they going to visit every reptile keeper in the state and measure their enclosures? Lol the government cracks me up sometimes they have no idea.